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Invisiblekaiowas
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nothing personal, it's just business
    #4007568 - 04/03/05 04:22 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I'm sure many of you have heard this quote before. how much are people willing to do away with compassion for money and power?

the bottom line is money i guess in the society we have now.

i know this might be better suited for the politics forum but I wanted to know what the poeple on this board think.

what kind of policies would you have in place on the way business is handled?

it goes farther than just two business partners screwing each other over for the bottom dollar.

what about the way the food industry is handled? Many of the products out there are not good for us at all, and yet they are sold to us. one might say thats a person's fault for buying something that isn't good for them, but a lot of the times the cheaper product is the one that isn't the best for you.

have you ever looked at gas. they have the ok stuff, the good stuff, and then the great stuff. the great stuff which is more efficient and causes less pollution is also more expensive. while I do understand that it does cost more for the company to make the better gas, why not just sell the best and forgo the shitty alternatives?

it costs more to feed chickens and cows oats and grains so they would rather feed them their own kind. and then they wonder how mad cow started.

the medical industry sells tons of products which causes more problems then solving. why would I want to take something for a headache if I'm going to get a stroke? ah...cause its cheaply made!

why cut down tons of trees when we have a wonderful source in industrial hemp? hmmm...does it not make sense to NOT cut off our own air supply?

we have all the brains in the world with the greedy people dictating who studies what. sure you can make an engine that goes 100 miles to the gallon, we've had it since the 80s. good luck on getting funding for making such a useful product.

indirectly, business's terrorize and kill humans, animals, plantlife, and the planet itself, but don't take it personally, it's just business.


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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Invisibleflowstone
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Registered: 01/25/05
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Loc: precious
Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: kaiowas]
    #4007591 - 04/03/05 04:32 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

policies



policy: Friends are friends, there is no business of greed involving those trusted and loved.

Quote:

many of the products out there are not good for us at all, and yet they are sold to us.




your examples are true and just scratch the surface of blind sided 'good'. Good causes harm too... but are we not better off with these medicines and 'necessary evils'? Are we not strong with societies iron fist, setting the stage to break away to enlightenment and freedom?


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these long agonizing months without you...have been long and agonizing..
"War Doesn't Decide Who's Right... It Only Decides Who's Left."


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: kaiowas]
    #4007917 - 04/03/05 09:09 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

That is people trying to escape responsibility...
the trent will pass in this century probably


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: kaiowas]
    #4008174 - 04/03/05 12:28 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

what about the way the food industry is handled? Many of the products out there are not good for us at all, and yet they are sold to us. one might say thats a person's fault for buying something that isn't good for them, but a lot of the times the cheaper product is the one that isn't the best for you.



So what? People still make an informed decision to eat there, knowing that it isn't good for them. Not everyone wants to eat tofu and soy beans all the time.

Quote:

have you ever looked at gas. they have the ok stuff, the good stuff, and then the great stuff. the great stuff which is more efficient and causes less pollution is also more expensive. while I do understand that it does cost more for the company to make the better gas, why not just sell the best and forgo the shitty alternatives?



Because some people can't afford to get the good stuff all the time. Thanks to the urban sprawl that's affected so many cities in America, the poor often have the biggest commutes, and if they have to get the most expensive shit there is, that's cutting into what's already just barely enough salary to get by.

Quote:

it costs more to feed chickens and cows oats and grains so they would rather feed them their own kind. and then they wonder how mad cow started.



You can thank our farm subsidies for that. The government basically pays farmers not to grow more than a certain amount of crops in order to keep prices artificially high.

Quote:

the medical industry sells tons of products which causes more problems then solving. why would I want to take something for a headache if I'm going to get a stroke? ah...cause its cheaply made!



No one's twisting your arm here. The law requires them to provide a warning label, and there are plenty of other products you can choose from. Or you can just suck it up and learn to deal with that headache, you pussy.

Quote:

why cut down tons of trees when we have a wonderful source in industrial hemp? hmmm...does it not make sense to NOT cut off our own air supply?



Again, that's government, not business.

Quote:

we have all the brains in the world with the greedy people dictating who studies what. sure you can make an engine that goes 100 miles to the gallon, we've had it since the 80s. good luck on getting funding for making such a useful product.



I'm sorry, but cost-efficiency is a factor businesses need to consider. They can't afford to keep suffering net losses just to try and be socially responsible.

Quote:

indirectly, business's terrorize and kill humans, animals, plantlife, and the planet itself, but don't take it personally, it's just business.



The examples you cited are either cases where people have a choice, or cases of government intervention. I do agree with the sentiment that just because you're a business doesn't absolve you of responsibility for your actions, but I see nothing wrong with offering people options. And we need to be realistic about money here. Don't just roll your eyes at the notion that businesses need to make a profit. That's typical anti-capitalist rhetoric spouted by people with no understanding of business or economics. Profit is necessary to maintain a business. They need to compete in the market, and in order to remain competitive, you need to minimize costs while maximizing efficiency.


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OfflineSmallworlds
Trippin' fool -Merry Prankster

Registered: 03/12/05
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Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: kaiowas]
    #4008193 - 04/03/05 12:37 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

they could at least feed the chickens to the cows and vise versa, keep each species from eating itself. This is another example that the creator has built this place full of consequences for doing nasty shit.


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Through the excercise of patience, one may learn humility..

Smoke plenty of green, and eat fungus!!!!
:peace::heart::slomo::gd_icon::gd_icon::gd_icon::slomo:


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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Registered: 03/15/05
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Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: Smallworlds]
    #4008242 - 04/03/05 01:02 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

what kind of policies would you have in place on the way business is handled?
---------------------------------------------------------------------

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. But fat chance.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineSmallworlds
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Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: Icelander]
    #4008255 - 04/03/05 01:09 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

What policy would I have?

There would be no money, and no value whatsoever would be assigned to materialistic goods.


--------------------
Through the excercise of patience, one may learn humility..

Smoke plenty of green, and eat fungus!!!!
:peace::heart::slomo::gd_icon::gd_icon::gd_icon::slomo:


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: Smallworlds]
    #4008263 - 04/03/05 01:11 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Smallworlds said:
What policy would I have?

There would be no money, and no value whatsoever would be assigned to materialistic goods.



Meanwhile, back in reality...


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OfflineSmallworlds
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Registered: 03/12/05
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Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: Silversoul]
    #4008275 - 04/03/05 01:16 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Reality is defined by the collective conciousness. When enough minds change, so does the perception of reality.

He asked me hypothetically what my policy would be, and I told him.

I never said i thought it would be possible for me to single-handedly overthrow the world monetary systems and implement my choice of policy however.


--------------------
Through the excercise of patience, one may learn humility..

Smoke plenty of green, and eat fungus!!!!
:peace::heart::slomo::gd_icon::gd_icon::gd_icon::slomo:


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OfflineSmallworlds
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Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: Smallworlds]
    #4008288 - 04/03/05 01:21 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Or, in other words, we all see the world with our minds, therefore "reality" is nothing more than an illusion created by the mind.

Example:

The islamic nations of the middle east have an almost polar opposite reality as the western nations do. Each seems right to them, and it makes the other seem evil.


--------------------
Through the excercise of patience, one may learn humility..

Smoke plenty of green, and eat fungus!!!!
:peace::heart::slomo::gd_icon::gd_icon::gd_icon::slomo:


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: Smallworlds]
    #4008311 - 04/03/05 01:27 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Smallworlds said:
Or, in other words, we all see the world with our minds, therefore "reality" is nothing more than an illusion created by the mind.

Example:

The islamic nations of the middle east have an almost polar opposite reality as the western nations do. Each seems right to them, and it makes the other seem evil.



Islamic nations are still subject to the same laws of nature that we are. The idea that you could stop people from assigning value to material objects goes against what it is to be human. It is inevitable that people will value certain things over others.


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OfflineSmallworlds
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Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: Silversoul]
    #4008338 - 04/03/05 01:42 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

there is a BIG difference between the "value" that people place on objects because of the object's actual usefulness to them:

examples:

"I sure do love spinach, it tastes sooo good."
"My laptop is so fucking cool, look how good the graphics are!"
"Have you seen my new car bro, it rides like a dream!"

...and the "value" associated with GREED, which is assigned to objects:

Examples:

"Well now, that's one bumper spinach crop you got there!"
"I'm gonna want at least $1500 for this laptop."
"My new car cost over $30,000 dude!"

Both are "values", one is the actual value of an item, one is the greedy, monetarally oriented value.

I contend that we as a human race actually need only consider the actual values of things in order to have a more peaceful existance.


--------------------
Through the excercise of patience, one may learn humility..

Smoke plenty of green, and eat fungus!!!!
:peace::heart::slomo::gd_icon::gd_icon::gd_icon::slomo:


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: Smallworlds]
    #4008353 - 04/03/05 01:50 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Please! :rolleyes:

Monetary value is nothing more than a reflection of how highly valued an object is in proportion to the supply of said object.  It's called supply and demand, not greed.


--------------------


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OfflineSmallworlds
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Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: Silversoul]
    #4008366 - 04/03/05 01:56 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Ah but monetary value is something more. It's a whole entire playing field created by the greedy to facillitate greed.


--------------------
Through the excercise of patience, one may learn humility..

Smoke plenty of green, and eat fungus!!!!
:peace::heart::slomo::gd_icon::gd_icon::gd_icon::slomo:


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: Smallworlds]
    #4008381 - 04/03/05 02:01 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Greed this, greed that, blah blah blah blah...

Your use of that word has no meaning other than a knee-jerk reaction to capitalism. Money is simply a means of exchange. It's a sort of middle-man in what would otherwise be direct barter.


--------------------


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OfflineSmallworlds
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Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: Silversoul]
    #4008384 - 04/03/05 02:02 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

But i can certainly understand how it might be difficult for you to imagine this. I hate to bring that darned movie up, but monetary value is part of the matrix that we are living in. The situation I describe does not exist anywhere you look, so it seems unreal to you. However that does not mean that it couldn't exist, and eventually it will exist, I believe.

yes, it's the same idea as in the John Lennon song - imagine.

(See? Didn't he fucking tell you he wasn't the only one?) :lol: :mushroom2:


--------------------
Through the excercise of patience, one may learn humility..

Smoke plenty of green, and eat fungus!!!!
:peace::heart::slomo::gd_icon::gd_icon::gd_icon::slomo:


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: Smallworlds]
    #4008391 - 04/03/05 02:06 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Unless you are against any exchange of goods, then your objections against money have no meaning. Monetary value is exchange value. People exchange their labor for money, and then exchange that money for goods. The amount of money they pay for something is basically how much labor they're willing to expend in exchange for that good.


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OfflineSmallworlds
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Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: Silversoul]
    #4008392 - 04/03/05 02:06 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Paradigm said:
Greed this, greed that, blah blah blah blah...

Your use of that word has no meaning other than a knee-jerk reaction to capitalism. Money is simply a means of exchange. It's a sort of middle-man in what would otherwise be direct barter.




Now you sound like my father. You must have a serious vested interest in the current system.

What I am describing does not include barter either, basically there is no "ownership" of anything, everything is shared because materialistic goods came from the earth, just as we did, and materialistic goods go back into the earth, just like we do.

I am not describing a political system, but a complete lack of politics and it's mechanisms.


--------------------
Through the excercise of patience, one may learn humility..

Smoke plenty of green, and eat fungus!!!!
:peace::heart::slomo::gd_icon::gd_icon::gd_icon::slomo:


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: Smallworlds]
    #4008402 - 04/03/05 02:10 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Material goods are extracted from the earth, but they are then made useful by human labor. People need incentive to use their labor for the benefit of others, so they exchange the products of their labor with others. Unless you're against tool-making, your point doesn't make any sense.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: nothing personal, it's just business [Re: Silversoul]
    #4008420 - 04/03/05 02:20 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Unless you're against tool-making, your point doesn't make any sense.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't get this statement? He didn't say that. It sounds like he just realizes that ownership can breed contention and greed.

I mean he did say that this is just what he would like to see happen. I don't see why theoreticaly humans could not, create, build and prosper with out a capitilist ownership game.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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