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OfflineBlue Helix
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Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray
    #3961576 - 03/23/05 09:57 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

My wife and I have both observed that as a bulk cubensis tray fruits and immediately before, it releases something odorless in the air which makes the back of our throat feel dry and constricted. The effect is most acutely felt if one tries to swallow. Trays do this in direct proportion to size and intensity of the flush. Modest flushes as I see most often pictured here, don't do it much. A "home run" tray as I call them, does it the worst.

The effect can be sometimes felt even prior to pinning, and when that happens, it is a sure sign of a great flush to come. More often I feel it during pinning, and it peaks out prior to harvest (for me that's shortly after the veil breaks but before sporulation). It has nothing to do with spores from the fruiting bodies (a) the effect can be felt during pinning and (b) I don't allow my fruits to reach sporulation except for prints. It is made better when I use a high quality HEPA/active carbon filtration unit ($400 Healthmate), but it doesn't go away which leads me to believe it is a gas of some sort.

I once had a tray that fruited out 7 wet pounds in 4 square feet in the first flush. That massive flush created a choking effect so acute that my throat literally felt like cement and I found it difficult to swallow at night. No matter how much water I drank, the effect wouldn't go away. The only solution was to seal off the room that housed the tray and open the windows.

Has anyone else experienced something like this? Has any research been done on it?


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Invisibletahoe
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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: Blue Helix]
    #3961597 - 03/23/05 10:02 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

i was gonna say spores in the air but you said even before then. I gag a little with the smell of psilocybes. it could be that. If i was to stick my nose into a casing full of shrooms my gag reflew kicks in. I think its the correlation between the smell and the taste. the taste makes me gag


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OfflinekronnyQ
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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: tahoe]
    #3961609 - 03/23/05 10:04 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

That does NOT sound healthy man!

What strain are these?


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OfflineBlue Helix
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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: tahoe]
    #3961635 - 03/23/05 10:10 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I don't really smell the mushies all around the room, so I don't think it's a smell issue. I do, though, feel like gagging anytime I smell them. That's their nature it seems.

My wife has never even taken shrooms and she feels the choking too, so I don't think it's a conditioned response either. In fact I didn't believe it was the mushrooms at first at all. I just thought I was sick or something until my wife brought it up. We both would get this "sickness" right at the time of fruiting! Then the correlation dawned on me. Now I practically use the choking sensation in addition to sight to know how well a tray is doing.

One thing that I do differently than a lot of growers is that I introduce a lot of fresh air. Part of that is because otherwise I'll run up to 100% humdity with a bulk tray which is bad. Also fresh air is good for clearing out CO2. When I ran little shoe boxes of shrooms before I used to run with a closed terrarium too and didn't have this choking feeling.


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OfflineBlue Helix
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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: kronnyQ]
    #3961647 - 03/23/05 10:12 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

It's B+ on rye and horse manure, cased with 50/50. Like I said, I use the choking effect to judge how well a tray is doing anymore. If it gets too strong, I close off the room and get out. I know this sounds crazy, but I am surprised no one else has experienced this.


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InvisibleHolydiver
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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: Blue Helix]
    #3961675 - 03/23/05 10:16 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Pretty interesting stuff, Helix. I've never experienced anything like this over the years, and I've stuck my nose in quite a few trays of fresh mushrooms. For me it's that fresh smell when the first flush comes in that really makes everything worthwhile. So yeah, I've huffed a few in my days so to speak. But nothing to report like you describe.

It wouldn't surprise me if there is some metabolic reaction going on here. I view our progress with mushrooms as I do the medical field, and human advancement in it: We think we're far along, but in all actuality we don't know anything yet. So many undiscovered things out there.


--------------------
To find a place to live between the negatives and positives.


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Offlinescatmanrav
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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: Holydiver]
    #3961693 - 03/23/05 10:20 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Its either the mushrooms telling you what they're doing...or..more co2 being released at certain points....I'd guess. Maybe not, but thats what I'd guess..


--------------------
"life is like a drop of rain getting closer and closer to falling into a lake, and then when you hit the lake there is no more rain drop, only the lake."

Growing with bags, start to finish (including my new grain and substrate prep)
Anyone looking to start bulk tubs/mono tubs/shotgun hybrids? Good tubs to use..
How I do grain (old still good tips)
Turn your closet into a fruiting chamber
Casing layer colonization and overlay


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OfflineBlue Helix
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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: Holydiver]
    #3961783 - 03/23/05 10:36 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Oh, I agree: a healthy tray smells very nice and makes it all worth it. But this isn't about a smell. It's a constricting feeling in the throat. Maybe it is something around the tray molding? If that was true, why does it closely follow the fruiting cycle?

I have a tray going now that my wife and I are starting to feel in the back of our throats even before pins (it'll be pinning in the next 48 hours), but the tray looks like it's going to be a home run. That is what made me post about this... a weak drying sensation just now starting in my throat. Already I have the air purifier going and plans to seal off the room when this tray gets in full swing in a few days.


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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: Blue Helix]
    #3961859 - 03/23/05 10:51 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Maybe seen an allergist? That sounds like a reaction. But if your wife gets it too...that's weird. Dunno.


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Offlinefrock
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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: Blue Helix]
    #3961865 - 03/23/05 10:52 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Maybe you are just alergic to something, so whatever it is it doesnt bother most people. Maybe your wife too.


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OfflineBlue Helix
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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: scatmanrav]
    #3961868 - 03/23/05 10:53 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Scatmanrav, you might have said this joking, but your explaination that the mushrooms are telling me what they are doing is as good as any other. It is natural to think along those terms.

I think it is funny that each of the times I've seen Paul Stamets in person he mentions mycelium being like a neural network and often cites cases where hallucinogenics have a "sense of humor" by growing by law enforcement municipalities. I think he believes that mushrooms have a consciousness of sorts as well. I think such a belief would require extrodinary proof for me.


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InvisibleHolydiver
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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: Blue Helix]
    #3961887 - 03/23/05 10:57 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

The mushrooms telling you what they're doing?  I must have missed the boat, please explain. :confused:


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Offlinescatmanrav
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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: Holydiver]
    #3961914 - 03/23/05 11:03 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

It happens when they're about to pin and certain other times...maybe hes picking up their vibes.

I wasnt joking either. :smile:


--------------------
"life is like a drop of rain getting closer and closer to falling into a lake, and then when you hit the lake there is no more rain drop, only the lake."

Growing with bags, start to finish (including my new grain and substrate prep)
Anyone looking to start bulk tubs/mono tubs/shotgun hybrids? Good tubs to use..
How I do grain (old still good tips)
Turn your closet into a fruiting chamber
Casing layer colonization and overlay


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Offlinegoofy98
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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: Blue Helix]
    #3961916 - 03/23/05 11:03 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Any time a person is exposed to an alergen there is a chance that person will have an allergic reaction. Each time they are exposed to it the chances increase. for example.

Dave is not allergic to cats. He decides to get one. after a few months he notices he is now allergic to his cat. This is fairly uncommon with most pet owners but it does happen oftern (alot of pet owners out their).

Pollen has the same effect. Now the amount the chances increases (with each exposer) differ per person. Thats why most people (that have pets) arent dont develope the allergic reaction.

When you decribed the scrathy throat that is a good sign of an allergic reaction. I can also walk into a house and tell if their are cats in the house even though i cant smell them. I insantly get a scratchy throuat and i find it hard to swollow.

Sounds very similar and if you are exposed to ALOT of mushrooms or cat dander in my case your chances of having the reaction increase even more.

Now i cant tell for a fact that you are having an allergic reaction but that does seem like the most plausable explanation.

hope that helps


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Offlinescatmanrav
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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: goofy98]
    #3961930 - 03/23/05 11:05 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Since he has these reactions before the casings pin...while there are no mushrooms or spores...what would the casings be releasing to cause these alergins?

The only things I think casings release at that point are vibes, co2, and myc piss..pretty much...


--------------------
"life is like a drop of rain getting closer and closer to falling into a lake, and then when you hit the lake there is no more rain drop, only the lake."

Growing with bags, start to finish (including my new grain and substrate prep)
Anyone looking to start bulk tubs/mono tubs/shotgun hybrids? Good tubs to use..
How I do grain (old still good tips)
Turn your closet into a fruiting chamber
Casing layer colonization and overlay


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OfflineBlue Helix
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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: goofy98]
    #3961984 - 03/23/05 11:13 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

This is an interesting theory. My wife also has a certain alergic reaction if she cleans too many of them. She says here hands start to itch and she starts to feel something in her throat again. I don't get that feeling. I also eat these things without any trouble. It seems that if I had an allergic reaction in my throat, I'd go crazy if I ate them. Or is it something besides the fruits that I might be allergic to? Maybe something in the moist casing?


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Offlinegoofy98
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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: Blue Helix]
    #3962082 - 03/23/05 11:25 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

If the allergic reaction was like poision ivy if you ate them you would be really sorry. (im very allergic)

Its not the actual alergen that causes the reaction. Its your body try to fight it. Like when i inhale the smell of cut grass. My body just starts leaking tears and mucus and such. Once the pollen is inhaled your body has a set of defensis that trys to fight the alergen. Your body says to your throat. "i detect pollen slow the inhalation of the pollen before it kils me" so my throat constrics and mucus (filter fluid of the nose) kicks in overtime. The body has forgoten that the pollen is not harmful. (very laimens terms i know but this is a message board for growing mushrooms)

But if i touch pollen to my skin it dosent bother me. I can even put a pollen filled flower in my mouth and not have any problems. but one sniff and WHAM.

I actualy know alot about the metabolic process of allergens (im a biochemist).

If you want to learn more just email me at goofly98@yahoo.com and ill be sure to lead you in the right direction to learn.

I guess you could PM me but being new to the board im not real sure how that works.

(smart at some things dumb at others)


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OfflineAnything4Poppies
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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: goofy98]
    #3962125 - 03/23/05 11:31 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

i think the real question here is if you get wet pounds and pounds why your wife hasnt tried it..:eek:.. very accepting wife to allow it to go down if she isnt down?

---A4P


--------------------
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Offlinecsuidae
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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: Blue Helix]
    #3962130 - 03/23/05 11:32 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Very interesting. Get an air sample from the room when its particularly strong and send it to a lab. Basic analysis isn't too expensive and it would be intersting to find out what is causing the effect.


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Offlinegoofy98
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Re: Choking feeling in back of throat from bulk tray [Re: goofy98]
    #3962155 - 03/23/05 11:37 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

i forgot to mention that each person can respond in diffrent ways to the allerge (ie Wife gets itchy hands you dont) For me even petting a cat will make my hands and skin itch (another reaction of the body to remove the allergen). But alot of people only get the itchy throat or watery eyes.

Their is still alot of unkowns about allergic reactions. A

And the most helpful thing i can say is get an antihistamine from the drug store (over the counter will do fine). If you take that and you notice no change then it probly is not an allergic reaction.

Antihistimine is drug used to counteract the physiological effects of histamine production in allergic reactions and colds.

Let me know how it works out for ya


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