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Invisiblekaiowas
mndfrayze'speppet urme
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Registered: 07/14/03
Posts: 5,498
Loc: oz
if you had a tube in your mouth...
    #3950524 - 03/21/05 08:37 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

keeping you alive for 15 years...

if you were comatose for that long...would you want someone to pull the plug?

when would enough be enough?


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Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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InvisibleCureKat
Stranger
Registered: 09/13/03
Posts: 50
Loc: Pacific NW
Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: kaiowas]
    #3950547 - 03/21/05 08:43 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

I wouldnt want to live like that at all.


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Invisiblequestion_for_joo
i'm left. youall can bite me
Registered: 04/30/03
Posts: 1,591
Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: CureKat]
    #3950553 - 03/21/05 08:45 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

me neither. i would feel sorry for my loved ones who had to see me 'living' in that state with the memory of who I used to be. it's not natural. it's not what god intended.


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youi was a pig informatnt so you can go fuckyoruselfs


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Invisiblekaiowas
mndfrayze'speppet urme
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Registered: 07/14/03
Posts: 5,498
Loc: oz
Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: question_for_joo]
    #3950557 - 03/21/05 08:46 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

would you say then that keeping someone alive like this is more like playing god then letting the person die?


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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InvisibleCureKat
Stranger
Registered: 09/13/03
Posts: 50
Loc: Pacific NW
Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: kaiowas]
    #3950564 - 03/21/05 08:49 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Yes. But then, I think it's kind of cruel to starve her to death.


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Invisiblequestion_for_joo
i'm left. youall can bite me
Registered: 04/30/03
Posts: 1,591
Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: kaiowas]
    #3950596 - 03/21/05 08:58 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

That's a great question, I think I will capitalize my response it's such a good question. 
I think it's a bit of an apples and oranjes question though cause playing god in terms of letting someone die is a different sort of 'playing god' than keeping someone in a coma alive. 
Keeping someone in a coma alive is not natural.  There is no equivalent of that for lizards, or for muskrats, or anywhere in the natural world.  Momma bears do their best to keep their sick baby bear alive, but if the bear is paralyzed and unconscious, that's it, it dies, the momma bear mourns...and life goes on.  This is a sad sad thing, for the husband and the parents, but it's also twisted and it should end.  This is why I hate Christians, because Christians are twisted and unnatural.  Namaste and blessing to you.  :japsmile:


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youi was a pig informatnt so you can go fuckyoruselfs


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OfflineDroz
Love of Life
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Registered: 10/16/00
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Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: question_for_joo]
    #3950669 - 03/21/05 09:20 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

If the christians are unatural, so are the catholics.


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Evolution of Time.


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Invisiblequestion_for_joo
i'm left. youall can bite me
Registered: 04/30/03
Posts: 1,591
Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: Droz]
    #3950713 - 03/21/05 09:31 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

no argument here


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youi was a pig informatnt so you can go fuckyoruselfs


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OfflineDroz
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Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: question_for_joo]
    #3950717 - 03/21/05 09:34 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Let's add the jews in there as well.


--------------------
Evolution of Time.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: kaiowas]
    #3950737 - 03/21/05 09:41 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

I have a problem with the letting die part if that involves starving the person to death. Removing a ventilator is one thing, but inflicting starvation and dehydration on a comotose person is cruel. Even death row inmates get a lethal injection.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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Invisiblequestion_for_joo
i'm left. youall can bite me
Registered: 04/30/03
Posts: 1,591
Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: Droz]
    #3950770 - 03/21/05 09:52 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

I don't see America's jewish community up in arms over a comatose woman being euthanized. Are you an anti-semite or something?


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youi was a pig informatnt so you can go fuckyoruselfs


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Invisiblequestion_for_joo
i'm left. youall can bite me
Registered: 04/30/03
Posts: 1,591
Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3950798 - 03/21/05 09:57 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

I agree with that Hoohoo.  It's just another stupid way that we are putting principle ahead of reality.  People say Euthanasia is immoral.  So instead of ending her life, they're gonna stop giving her what she needs to remain alive.  It's a technical distinction that makes it somehow better for lawyers and baby Jesus I guess.
:usa:


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youi was a pig informatnt so you can go fuckyoruselfs


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 7,469
Loc: Heart of Laughter
Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3950899 - 03/21/05 10:22 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Huehuecoyotl said:
I have a problem with the letting die part if that involves starving the person to death. Removing a ventilator is one thing, but inflicting starvation and dehydration on a comotose person is cruel. Even death row inmates get a lethal injection.




Thats my feeling and I don't even know how sure the docs can be that she can't or wouldn't experience any suffering related to dehydration and starvation on some subtle level. Even if she wouldn't experience any, her parents sure would watching her body dehydrate until her heart gives out.

I think they should jack her up with a massive lethal dose of morphine and send her out flying high :heart:


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Invisibleniteowl
GrandPaw
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Registered: 07/01/03
Posts: 16,291
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Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: Droz]
    #3950928 - 03/21/05 10:31 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Droz said:
If the christians are unatural, so are the catholics.




catholics ARE christian



edit:
A Jewish person would not want their loved ones to suffer in that state. They would let her go to God.

Christians are sadistic and love to see people suffer.


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
waiting
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Registered: 02/01/05
Posts: 4,033
Loc: mountains and lakes
Last seen: 10 years, 1 month
Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: kaiowas]
    #3951003 - 03/21/05 10:51 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

I'd ask for death as soon as the doctors said that things wont change..

If its over, then its over, lets move on, or at least move


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I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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InvisibleSkorpivoMusterion
Livin in theTwilight Zone...
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Registered: 01/30/03
Posts: 9,944
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Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: kaiowas]
    #3951181 - 03/21/05 11:31 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Absolutely not.

If mother nature had it's own way with me, I would've already been "free".

What does that tell you?


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Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.


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OfflineHedgeWych
Seeking

Registered: 03/21/05
Posts: 88
Loc: Pacific North West
Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: kaiowas]
    #3951216 - 03/21/05 11:39 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

My fiance and I have discussed this.  I say let me go.  Though a little extra dmt on the way out would be nice!  :wink:


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InvisibleVvellum
Stranger

Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 10,920
Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3951524 - 03/22/05 12:20 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Huehuecoyotl said:
I have a problem with the letting die part if that involves starving the person to death. Removing a ventilator is one thing, but inflicting starvation and dehydration on a comotose person is cruel. Even death row inmates get a lethal injection.




you should actually read about the situation. the woman cannot feel pain, nor is she even conscious. all movement and sounds she makes are mere instincts. she cannot feel pain, so pulling the feeding tube is perfectly humane. considering that is her only means of surivial, it seems the best way to let her go - just let her body continue on the trajectory it started on 15 years ago. there are many interviews with medical staff or expert doctors who will say this in better language than I can - but basically, only her brain stem is functioning (which allows her to breathe and carry out other physical tasks/instincts) - everything else is dead. the parts of her brain responsible for pain/pleasure and normal consciousness are dead.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Registered: 06/14/04
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Loc: On the Border
Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: Vvellum]
    #3951987 - 03/22/05 02:04 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

I don't care. Starvation and dehydration is a inhuman and undignified death. I have read about the situation and I know the woman is not being kept alive artificially...unless you call food and water artificial means. Euthanasia should be quick and dignified. She is not on a trajectory that removing the tube will complete. Let me starve your ass and deprive you of water and we will watch your "trajectory". That is just piss poor morals.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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Offlinebrowndustin
dustybuddy

Registered: 10/03/03
Posts: 2,957
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
Re: if you had a tube in your mouth... [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3952023 - 03/22/05 02:19 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

I think they should euthanize her rather than let her wither to death, vegetative state or not. Pump her with CNS depressants and it would be much more dignified.

I wouldn't want to be kept alive in that state. The body's merely a vessel for our souls. I wouldn't want to be trapped in a decrepit temple while my soul travel somewhere else. It seems gross in my opinion to support someone fully in a situation where they cannot even say whether or not they want the assistance. Of course this is all highly debateble, these are just my two monnies.


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When the stress burns my brain it's like acid raindrops
maryjane is the only thing that makes the pain stop


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