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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics >> Mushroom Hunting and Identification

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OfflineCanadianRebel
Curious wanderer
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 19
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
Confusing pann subbs withother pan species
    #3922890 - 03/15/05 10:31 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Hi all, this is my first post. First I'd like to say hello to everyone, and thank you for making newbies feel not so overwhealmed by the wild world of mushrooms...
I have a question...
I live in Southern Ontaio, and the only active species of mushrooms we have(to my knowledge and great dissappointment) is Panaolus subbalteotus(Sp?)Anyways, with basic hunting knowledge i.e: Spore printing and other feild guides, how easy is it to mix up subs with say, pan foens?
The reason I ask, is because last summer think I found some great patches of subs in flower beds, only after people have cut the lawns(decomposed grass lands in beds) but only a few feet away I see random foens scattered about...
The suspected subs grow in small to large clusters, have darker spore prints(jet black, thicker, tougher stems with hollow centers, and sometimes in mature specimens, are almost red wine in colour and have
a white ring around the caps...The caps are somewhat fragile...
Suspected foens(non-active) grow single mushrooms never in beds, always onlawns...They are skinnier, have longer thinner stems and have golden caps that bleach whitish in the sun...
This is alot of info fora first time poster, but I will hopefully be a regular contributer to the shroomery now that I have found such a community...ANY response would be greatly appreciated.


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OfflineCanadianRebel
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Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 19
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species [Re: CanadianRebel]
    #3923094 - 03/15/05 11:03 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Did that come off as just a rant? Sorry it might take a while to adjust to this new site...


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OfflineMitchnast
Trial by Madness
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Registered: 10/28/99
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Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species [Re: CanadianRebel]
    #3923341 - 03/15/05 11:47 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)


/im drunk and stoned.


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OfflineElectric305
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Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species [Re: Mitchnast]
    #3923585 - 03/16/05 12:40 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

People are gonna have a hard time knowing what your asking...are you wanting to cross breed mushrooms?its not possible


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OfflineElectric305
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Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species [Re: Electric305]
    #3923594 - 03/16/05 12:41 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Gonna have to go to the library or read some grow teks here or better yet,do both;-)


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Offlineivi
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Registered: 01/30/03
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Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species [Re: CanadianRebel]
    #3923789 - 03/16/05 01:23 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Hello and welcome to the Shroomery, CanadianRebel! :laugh:

Quote:

CanadianRebel said:
how easy is it to mix up subs with say, pan foens?




Have a look at this guide to picking Panaeolus subbalteatus by Gumby


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OfflineCanadianRebel
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Registered: 03/15/05
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Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species [Re: ivi]
    #3924462 - 03/16/05 07:42 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Yep...I'm a NOOB!
Thanks for the link Ivi...
No, I didn't want to"crossbreed" mushrooms!
My question was: "how easy is it to mix up subs with say, pan foens"?

Like I said, I believe I have found some patches in flower beds that have mushrooms growing in clusters, as described above, but then just a few feet away there are other mushrooms, obviously foens by description(common lawn mush)...


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Offlineivi
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Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species [Re: CanadianRebel]
    #3924472 - 03/16/05 07:46 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

You can easily tell Panaeolus subbalteatus from Panaeolina foenisecii by sporeprint colour. Panaeolus subbalteatus drops black spores, but Panaeolina foenisecii - dark brown. There is a nice picture of sporeprint colour comparison on that site by Gumby:



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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species [Re: ivi]
    #3924586 - 03/16/05 09:36 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

And he double posted almost the same info in a second ppost.

Read Close Encouonters of the Panaeolus Kind for a step-by-step id of Panaeolus subbalteatus. They are a manured mushroom copmmon in h rotted hay and haystacks and sometimes in topsoil under mulch, but rare in that way. More common inhaystacks and compost heap and ocassionally in dung.

at riding stables and racetracks.


see http://www.mushroomjohn.com/panaeolussubbalteatus1.htm

mj


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OfflineCanadianRebel
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Registered: 03/15/05
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Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species [Re: mjshroomer]
    #3924773 - 03/16/05 11:04 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Hi MJ, pleased to get a response from such a well respected member...
Sorry for the doubble post, still getting used to message boards, until now I've never even been really big on using the net...

Anyways, thank you for reminding me about the mulch...
There IS rotted wood/mulch put there by the parks people to reduce weeds, and it is quite possible that there is manure as a fertilizer in the beds...
With my hopefully detailed description, with spore color and habbitat, what else could they be other than panns? This has been a difficult enough journey just reading through the FAQs and other info...
P.S. I mentioned grass clippings from the mower, when it passes by, it shoots dead grass onto the patches wich then decompose into compost?


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Registered: 07/22/99
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Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species [Re: CanadianRebel]
    #3924800 - 03/16/05 11:16 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

The compost i anm referring to is not cut grass but rather straw which is stacked and left to compost. not composting lawn grasses.



mj


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OfflineCanadianRebel
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Registered: 03/15/05
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Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species [Re: mjshroomer]
    #3924863 - 03/16/05 11:46 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

K, thanks for the Info MJ....But with your wisdom, is there any other mushrooms that they could be, other than what I hope they are?
Sometimes mature species can have caps the size of a silver dollar, but most are arouns the size of a quarter...
And they weren't found recently, they were found late spring last year, and flushes get really heavy about 3 days after a good rain..
BTW, I've looked at quite a few pics now of pann subbs, and so far, descriptions match 100% as well as habitat and spore color...
Basically all I'm asking now is that" Do Pann Subbs have look-alikes that grow in same habitat"?


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OfflineMitchnast
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Registered: 10/28/99
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Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species [Re: CanadianRebel]
    #3925130 - 03/16/05 01:22 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

there are several speceis of panaeolus that grow in simmilar habitats and are not active. panaeolus subbaltaetus will sometimes blue at the base, check them all at the white base and if one of a particular morphology blues, it is safe to say all of that kind are active as well, it doesn't nessisarily mean they are pan subbs, as there are some other active pans as well, but chances are thats them


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OfflineCanadianRebel
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Registered: 03/15/05
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Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species [Re: Mitchnast]
    #3926261 - 03/16/05 05:46 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Thanks Mitchnast, I haven't found them this year, I found them last year...
But after a long winter of study and contemplation, I believe I found subbs, but just need reassurance...
I have found other patches in other areas of the same shrooms, Identical, and completely Identifiable from other lawn mushrooms...
These MUST be pann subbs...Although NO bruising occured...But that isn't a common subb trait as we already pointed out...
Anyways, Thanks for being so helpful!!!!


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InvisibleTYL3R
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Registered: 11/19/04
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Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species [Re: CanadianRebel]
    #3927658 - 03/16/05 10:06 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Answer = YES

Read this - http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/3639686#Post3639686

The verdict was Subs. This mixup seems to happen often. :shrug:


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OfflineCanadianRebel
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Registered: 03/15/05
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Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species [Re: TYL3R]
    #3927927 - 03/16/05 10:52 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

THATS WHAT THEY LOOK LIKE!!!!!!!!! EXACTLY! Spore color and everything! See what I mean about bleaching tan color!
Thanx dude!


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You've got your head in the clouds and your world is upside down...


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InvisibleTYL3R
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Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species [Re: CanadianRebel]
    #3928051 - 03/16/05 11:12 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

lol No Prob


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Invisiblespores
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Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species [Re: CanadianRebel]
    #3928357 - 03/17/05 12:41 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

There IS rotted wood/mulch put there by the parks people to reduce weeds




sounds like psathyrella is a good possibility to me. I could see a few species of them being mistaken for pans...

DH


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OfflineAndresko13
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Registered: 03/10/05
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Loc: Toronto, Canada
Last seen: 8 years, 2 months
Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species *DELETED* [Re: spores]
    #3929998 - 03/17/05 12:44 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Post deleted by Andresko13

Reason for deletion: Incriminating



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Offlinefliped
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Registered: 02/26/03
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Re: Confusing pann subbs withother pan species [Re: Andresko13]
    #3930022 - 03/17/05 12:53 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

i would nopt bother asking for any locations on the message boards.


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