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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons
    #3895419 - 03/10/05 12:07 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

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IDF says players are detached from reality and automatically given a low security clearance
By Hanan Greenberg



Does the Israel Defense Forces believe incoming recruits and soldiers who play Dungeons and Dragons are unfit for elite units? Ynetnews has learned that 18-year-olds who tell recruiters they play the popular fantasy game are automatically given low security clearance.



?They're detached from reality and suscepitble to influence,? the army says.



Fans of the popular role-playing game had spoken of rumors of this strange policy by the IDF, but now the army has confirmed that it has a negative image of teens who play the game and labels them as problematic in regard to their draft status.




So if you like fantasy games, go see the military psychologist.



Dungeons and Dragons (also known as ?D and D?) has been a popular role-playing game for decades and is based on a fantasy world.




One player assumes the role of ?Dungeon Master? which entails directing the game and controlling the labyrinth, while the others select from a large selection of characters that includes warriors, magicians, dwarfs and thieves.



The game focuses on the results of decisions

Dungeons and Dragons players Photo: Ahvah
made by the players as determined by the roll of the dice.



In a more "active" version of the game, players leave the table and go out, dressed as the characters they assume for the game, along with the requisite equipment of swords (not real) to play outside, usually in the forest or woods.




'Simply detached from reality'



Thousands of youth and teens in Israel play "D and D", fighting dragons and demons using their rich imaginations. The game has also increased in popularity due to the "Lord of the Rings" trilogy.




However the IDF does not approve of this unusual hobby and prevents "D and D" players from being considered for sensitive army positions by labeling them with low security clearance.




"We have discovered that some of them are simply detached from reality," a security source told Ynetnews.



Game enthusiasts are aware of their problematic image in the army and prefer to maintain their anonymity. Many of them are from the former Soviet Union where the game is very popular.



In Israel there are thousands of players, between the ages 16 to 35, and include lawyers, high-tech workers and businessmen. Matan, 22, and Igor, a 21-year-old IDF soldier, organize activities for groups of players. Soon hundreds of fans are expected to meet in a forest in the southern part of Israel for a two-day game of pure fantasy.



"It's not a game of winners and losers," Matan says,
"but rather entry into another world with stories and plot changes."



He is aware of the game's problematic reputation, especially in the IDF. The army is not indifferent to the unique hobby and is trying to locate soldiers who in their free time dress up as witches and play in forests.



'The game indicates a weak personality'



A security official tells Ynetnews there are specific criteria for deciding the level of a soldier's security clearance.



"One of the tests we do, either by asking soldiers directly or through information provided us, is to ask whether they take part in the game," he says. "If a soldier answers in the affirmative, he is sent to a professional for an evaluation, usually a psychologist."



More than half of the soldiers sent for evaluation receive low security clearances, thus preventing them from serving in sensitive IDF positions, he says.



Igor says exposing soldiers who play the game could result in the soldiers being sent to a military psychologist or even being kicked out of the army.



"Exposing them could also harm their chances at being accepted to other military courses," he says.



Matan says he has personally met soldiers whose military career was harmed due to their connection to the game. Most soldiers who play Dungeons and Dragons simply do not admit to it while they are in teh army, he says.



Why does the IDF believe the game is so dangerous?



"These people have a tendency to be influenced by external factors which could cloud their judgment, a military official says. "They may be detached from reality or have a weak personality ? elements which lower a person's security clearance, allowing them to serve in the army, but not in sensitive positions."




Unsurprisingly, Igor, Matan and thier friends do not approve of this IDF policy. They say the game is only a colorful, non-violent hobby.



"Many people who play served in the most classified units," David says. "They are intelligent and any attempt to label them as 'weird' is incorrect and unfair."



But in the struggle between the Lord of the Rings and the Minister of Defense, the latter wins, or at least this is the case in the real world of the IDF.


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InvisibleYidakiMan
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #3895429 - 03/10/05 12:11 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Sounds to me like they have a prejudice against nerds.

Young D&D players are no less grounded in reality than young basketball players.


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Offlinelackobreath
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: YidakiMan]
    #3895870 - 03/10/05 01:34 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

I wonder what they think of the people who play games like Halo, doom, and unreal. I bet the recruits are snatching up those gamers, because those are violent first-person games, and D&D is essentially non-violent, fantasy role-playing game...


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OfflineSWEDEN
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: YidakiMan]
    #3895873 - 03/10/05 01:34 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Those IDF idiots won't know what hit them when I sic my 20 HD lammasu on them.


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #3895898 - 03/10/05 01:40 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Those fools are gonna end up fucking with a level 6 mage, and as soon as he gets his manna high enough, they'd better watch their asses.


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OfflineMagillaGorilla
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: SWEDEN]
    #3896023 - 03/10/05 02:04 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Or my 15th level fighter with 14 attacks/round, 17-20 crit, and immunity to non-magical missile weapons..

Argh, I'm a geek...


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OfflineSWEDEN
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: MagillaGorilla]
    #3896036 - 03/10/05 02:06 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

14 attack per round?!?!? what version are you playing?
at level 14 the most attacks you could have as a fighter is 3, unless you are multiclassed as a monk or something.....


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OfflineMagillaGorilla
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: SWEDEN]
    #3896213 - 03/10/05 02:41 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

3rd edition (not 3.5). And my bad, it wasn't 14... It's 7, :blush: I just have very fond memories of him taking down a Pit Fiend, by himself, in two rounds of combat (hence the 14 attacks).
He has two bastard swords that each have the 'speed' ability (among others), and the feats to give him extra attacks with the off-hand..
He also has great cleave, which is another reason I think I was confused.. It has been a while since I ran him, for some obvious reasons.

Terribly sorry I mis-represented his power, and derailed the thread..


... Who says we're detached from reality?


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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: SWEDEN]
    #3896574 - 03/10/05 06:50 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

you guys didn't get laid in High School did you?


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: Innvertigo]
    #3896689 - 03/10/05 09:06 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

These guys are obviously not fit to kill little brown people.


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InvisibleYidakiMan
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #3896900 - 03/10/05 10:58 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

*drowns in nerdspeak*


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OfflineSWEDEN
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: Innvertigo]
    #3896970 - 03/10/05 11:25 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

I lost count sometime during sophomore year.
Chicks here dig the nerds.

Anyways, back on topic, if the Israeli army frowns upon battle strategy, planning, practicing your diplomatic skills (albiet against a mob of 30 orcs) and sneaking past enemy lines to assassinate commanders, then they can keep on frowning. It may be fantasy but at its heart D&D is rooted in reality. If I were a high ranking military man I would seek out nerds who play D&D and promote them. It is a very complicated game after 3 major revisions of the rules and it takes brains to play.


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: Innvertigo]
    #3897244 - 03/10/05 01:08 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)


you guys didn't get laid in High School did you?


I played D & D in high school and I got laid all of the time. Here's a picture of my high school sweetheart.



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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3897257 - 03/10/05 01:13 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

That cheating bitch!


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OfflineSlackerKM
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: Silversoul]
    #3897717 - 03/10/05 02:50 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

I give this thread  :thumbup: :thumbup:


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Offlinestarptv23
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: SlackerKM]
    #3897858 - 03/10/05 03:20 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

where did you hear such a think my husband is from israel and he has never heard of such a silly thing...and everyone that grows up there goes into the army...so he was in the IPA


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OfflineSWEDEN
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: SlackerKM]
    #3897873 - 03/10/05 03:24 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)



Just found this a few days ago. It is complete with rules for different positions and numerous STDs, magical and non!


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: starptv23]
    #3898614 - 03/10/05 06:03 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Did he ever mention playing D&D to his superiors?


Was he given security clearance?


This was apparently a non-public policy that has just recently been made public.


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OfflineIts Pat
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #3898783 - 03/10/05 06:39 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Sounds just like the attack D&D got back in the 80s when kids would commit suicide if their characters died in battle.


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OfflineSWEDEN
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Re: Israeli army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons [Re: Its Pat]
    #3899096 - 03/10/05 07:29 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0046/0046_01.asp

I can't believe this site is for real... but it is. 

Now I'm going to go summon a Baatezu.:devil:


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