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Cray
I'm not fat i'mbig bones
Registered: 02/22/05
Posts: 951
Last seen: 5 years, 21 days
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The whole flaming the needle..
#3852074 - 03/01/05 12:52 PM (19 years, 22 days ago) |
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I got a question about that, when inoculation, each time you take it out of each hole in each lid do you have to flame the needle every time? Or can I just wipe it with rubbing alcohol? Also it is best to do this with every hole injection?
Thanks, Cray
Edited by Cray (03/01/05 12:55 PM)
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NeedMoreSleep
OCD = 100%Sterility :-)
Registered: 01/25/05
Posts: 1,210
Loc: One Inch ↑
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: Cray]
#3852138 - 03/01/05 01:04 PM (19 years, 22 days ago) |
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Obviously the safest way would be to flame it and wipe it w/ alcohol before its stuck into any innoc point, same jar or not... Flaming is for sterilizing the inside hollow portion of the needle, alcohol is to sterilize the outside of the needle and to cool it after flaming... With that knowledge, do what you thinks best for your particular situation... GL
-------------------- "Now, we must all fear evil men. But there is another kind of evil, which we must fear most. And that is... the indifference of good men." -Boondock Saints
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Cray
I'm not fat i'mbig bones
Registered: 02/22/05
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: NeedMoreSleep]
#3852172 - 03/01/05 01:12 PM (19 years, 22 days ago) |
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aww I get it! Is it alright just to use a cigerate lighter? Also when I heat it, do I heat it until it get red hot or just heat it up some? After heating it up, just let it cool down? In some instuctions I've read it's said to squrit a little bit out. I'm doing quite a bit of jars so, whats the best way? (12 jars x 4 holes in each jar = 48 holes)
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Hambo
Limey
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: NeedMoreSleep]
#3852177 - 03/01/05 01:12 PM (19 years, 22 days ago) |
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Flaming it red hot will kill everything inside or out instantly think how hot it must be when it glows.. wiping with alcohol should do.. I mean I can't see too many bacterias climbing up the needle point, but its better safe than sorry eh? not much effort. Flaming followed by alcohol will cool the needle also so you can inoculate again without killing any spores passing through. I do this after every 2-3 of jars with 2 innoc points each.
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Cray
I'm not fat i'mbig bones
Registered: 02/22/05
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: Hambo]
#3852215 - 03/01/05 01:22 PM (19 years, 22 days ago) |
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So would it be better to flame the needle every 2-3 jars, but wipe the needle with alcohol everytime you go to inject in each hole?
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NeedMoreSleep
OCD = 100%Sterility :-)
Registered: 01/25/05
Posts: 1,210
Loc: One Inch ↑
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: Hambo]
#3852233 - 03/01/05 01:25 PM (19 years, 22 days ago) |
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Quote:
Hambo said: I mean I can't see too many bacterias climbing up the needle point, but its better safe than sorry eh?
If you're doing PF cakes, you've got a layer of verm on top right? Think about what that layer of verm is for... Its for "catching" contams. Still don't see bacteria gettin in there when you stick it in there each time???? Obviously it should be sterile at the time of inoculation, but the possibility still exists none-the-less... Like you said, better safe than sorry
-------------------- "Now, we must all fear evil men. But there is another kind of evil, which we must fear most. And that is... the indifference of good men." -Boondock Saints
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Cray
I'm not fat i'mbig bones
Registered: 02/22/05
Posts: 951
Last seen: 5 years, 21 days
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: NeedMoreSleep]
#3852243 - 03/01/05 01:28 PM (19 years, 22 days ago) |
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god da*n I'm getting confused now! wtf, so do I flame the needle EACH time and wipe it? Or what do you suggest NeedMoreSleep?
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NeedMoreSleep
OCD = 100%Sterility :-)
Registered: 01/25/05
Posts: 1,210
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: Cray]
#3852256 - 03/01/05 01:30 PM (19 years, 22 days ago) |
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flame it, wipe it, innoc, flame it, wipe it, innoc, lather, rinse, repeat... seriously shortcutting it will only save you like 1 minute for a dozen jars man...
-------------------- "Now, we must all fear evil men. But there is another kind of evil, which we must fear most. And that is... the indifference of good men." -Boondock Saints
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Cray
I'm not fat i'mbig bones
Registered: 02/22/05
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: NeedMoreSleep]
#3852275 - 03/01/05 01:35 PM (19 years, 22 days ago) |
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and do that for each hole?...
Ok think I got it, how long does the jars after steam serilizing take to cool down?
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thenewguy05
The Mushroom Man
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: Cray]
#3852279 - 03/01/05 01:35 PM (19 years, 22 days ago) |
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Personaly i just wipe it down as soon as i pop the cap, and if it touches anything i wipe again, and once before i put the needle back. everyone has their own style. do what you think/works best 4 u. As 4 the jars cooling down. MAKE SURE THEY ARE COOL. i just f***ed up my great race between south american and golden teachers by innoculating too early.(I think the center might have been too hot still...I'm Pretty Sure) I waited overnight but I have plastic canning jars. they prolly cool down faster than glass. So i guess i would have to say 12-24 hours. just cool to the touch is the rule of thumb. not much else I can say.
Edited by thenewguy05 (03/01/05 01:47 PM)
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Cray
I'm not fat i'mbig bones
Registered: 02/22/05
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: thenewguy05]
#3852287 - 03/01/05 01:37 PM (19 years, 22 days ago) |
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alright
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XTCollection
Stranger
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: Cray]
#3852383 - 03/01/05 02:04 PM (19 years, 22 days ago) |
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Seriously, flame the syringe only if open and used from a previous batch. If your air has that much bacteria in it, I think its more propable your jars would be contaming.
AFOAF only flames in between batches, alchol wipe in between jars.
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Mages
Spaz
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: XTCollection]
#3854756 - 03/01/05 10:17 PM (19 years, 21 days ago) |
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You can flame the needle with a cigarette lighter (I've done it) but it's a pain in the a**. If you're doing it that way, it probably would be easier to flame every few jars and alcohol-wipe every hole. HOWEVER: With any jar-tek your biggest exposure to contamination comes from the inoculation itself. You'd do better to get some little lamp that will keep burning, so it's easy to flame on each hole. Then, flaming before each insertion of the needle is easy and you don't find yourself taking shortcuts you might regret 2 weeks later.
- Mages
-------------------- - Mages Ignorance killed the cat; curiosity was framed. - C.J. Cherryh
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wds
another brick
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: Mages]
#3855096 - 03/01/05 11:49 PM (19 years, 21 days ago) |
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needmoresleep, whats "OCD"?
-------------------- I wish psychedelic mushrooms were legal, because I would like to indulge in this amazing fruit of the earth. Unfortunately, I can only learn about this interesting hobby, and cultivate legal mushrooms.
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Tomatadunothing
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: wds]
#3855139 - 03/01/05 11:59 PM (19 years, 21 days ago) |
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Obsessive Compulsive Disorder
As far as the syringes go, I heard a good tip recently that I am yet to try, but it sounds pretty good.
Cut up a clean make up sponge into small sections that just barely cover the needle. Make sure the sponge stays soaked up with Iso. when you're noc'ing up jars, and your needle should stay clean with no extra work.
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Hambo
Limey
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: NeedMoreSleep]
#3855413 - 03/02/05 01:10 AM (19 years, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
NeedMoreSleep said:
Quote:
Hambo said: I mean I can't see too many bacterias climbing up the needle point, but its better safe than sorry eh?
If you're doing PF cakes, you've got a layer of verm on top right? Think about what that layer of verm is for... Its for "catching" contams. Still don't see bacteria gettin in there when you stick it in there each time???? Obviously it should be sterile at the time of inoculation, but the possibility still exists none-the-less... Like you said, better safe than sorry
Oops, I forgot about that, I don't put a top layer of dry verm see. I put a tyvek filter and sterile plaster over the hole. Thinking about it, aye I could see it being an issue with the regular PF tek.
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SHiZNO
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Registered: 03/14/03
Posts: 1,467
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: Hambo]
#3855591 - 03/02/05 02:01 AM (19 years, 21 days ago) |
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ill either flame heat the needle or wipe with alcohol, between jars, but not between innoc points
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frock
member
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: SHiZNO]
#3856002 - 03/02/05 06:39 AM (19 years, 21 days ago) |
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I flame every 3 jars and wipe with alcohol between every 2.
I have never had a problem with contams in my jars except 1 time in the last year. It was probably just a bad syringe I made to.
You do not need to wipe between each hole. To me that is overdoing it.
Its really up to you. I usually do like 36 jars at a time, so it would be a pain to wipe between every hole.
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Anno
Experimenter
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: frock]
#3856008 - 03/02/05 06:43 AM (19 years, 21 days ago) |
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>I flame every 3 jars and wipe with alcohol between every 2.
This is a sound way to do it. Flaming after each hole or even after each jar is a waste of time.
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gsmith
reformed lurker
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: Anno]
#3856057 - 03/02/05 07:04 AM (19 years, 21 days ago) |
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anno is right. i've even inoculated a bunch of jars only flaming the needle once before starting and none of them contaminated. as long as the foil stays on the jars before you inject and you don't let the needle touch anything in between jars it should be fine. Unless your air is rife with contaminants, it should be pretty hard for that tiny little needle to pick up a sufficient ammount of particles to cause a problem. IME the source of contamination from inoculation is usually inside the syringe, not from the air.
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scatmanrav
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: gsmith]
#3856690 - 03/02/05 10:33 AM (19 years, 21 days ago) |
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I Wipe the needle between jars, and the spot I inject and inject through the swab. I do four jars quickly, set the syringe down, and throw on two bandaids cut in half (grain jars, 1 hold each)..flame the needle and go again.
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SoK
pimpin sincebeen pimpinsince beenpimpin since..
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: scatmanrav]
#3857451 - 03/02/05 01:38 PM (19 years, 21 days ago) |
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i do four jars/noc one injection site, never flame, only wipe w/ alcy and spray a good shot of lysol neutrair
i use an internal tyvek filter, and once the hole is punched in it, i just take a coffee filter and rubberband it around the jar, and all done
i use WBS now though (2cc's per 1/2 pint) through one hole, cover w/ the filter and then shake well to move around the spores, GL
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ZeroArmy27
I didn't go to work for a month.
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: SoK]
#3857619 - 03/02/05 02:17 PM (19 years, 21 days ago) |
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well.. this is what has worked out for me- it's the flaming/wiping advice i got when i started.
i flame to begin with. i wipe every 2-3 jars. i use an alcohol wipe or soaked cotton ball to cover the injection site and inject through that with each hole. seems to work just fine.
-------------------- "a monkey would fuck you up if you tried to put it in a autoclave" - Psychoslut "it's not like the admins and mods are a tight-knit group of hippies that spend their life together in a log cabin tie-dying shirts and stringing beads inbetween bonghits." - Wiccan_Seeker
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ATWAR
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: ZeroArmy27]
#3857884 - 03/02/05 03:17 PM (19 years, 21 days ago) |
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I never flame... Ruins the needles IMO... I just wipe with alcohol and it is good to go. I have not flamed a needle in years.
If I ever start to experience higher than normal failure rates, perhaps I will return to this old technique. Although IMO it is unnecessary if the syringes were clean and nothing was stabbed with the needle. This holds true when one makes their own syringes as well. One usually starts out with sterile syringes, and any contaminants are usually introduced during the syringe making process. I would bet 99.99% of the time if contaminants are in the needle, they are in the syringe as well. Flaming would be futile in this situation...
I prefer to recycle things whenever I can. Needles are one thing I do not like to buy. Hence the reason why I do not flame. Most people will say it does not hurt to take the extra precaution, and to an extent this is true. However, heat is bad for healthy spores, and it is very easy to get carried away with that flame. Remember, one end is attached to plastic and will melt and distort...
I say flame once, before you start with a new spore syringe (if you must flame). Then use Isopropyl alcohol wipes between jars.
-------------------- To give is to live...
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scatmanrav
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: ATWAR]
#3858001 - 03/02/05 03:39 PM (19 years, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
ATWAR said: I never flame... Ruins the needles IMO... I just wipe with alcohol and it is good to go. I have not flamed a needle in years.
If I ever start to experience higher than normal failure rates, perhaps I will return to this old technique. Although IMO it is unnecessary if the syringes were clean and nothing was stabbed with the needle. This holds true when one makes their own syringes as well. One usually starts out with sterile syringes, and any contaminants are usually introduced during the syringe making process. I would bet 99.99% of the time if contaminants are in the needle, they are in the syringe as well. Flaming would be futile in this situation...
I prefer to recycle things whenever I can. Needles are one thing I do not like to buy. Hence the reason why I do not flame. Most people will say it does not hurt to take the extra precaution, and to an extent this is true. However, heat is bad for healthy spores, and it is very easy to get carried away with that flame. Remember, one end is attached to plastic and will melt and distort...
I say flame once, before you start with a new spore syringe (if you must flame). Then use Isopropyl alcohol wipes between jars.
Reading this thread was bringing me to these conclusions..not much flaming of the needle going on with some people. I think I will try it out. I definatly will flame once from vendor syringes or recycled needles, but beyond that I dont really think its gonna make a difference.
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Roadkill
Retired Shroomery Mod
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: ATWAR]
#3858055 - 03/02/05 03:48 PM (19 years, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
ATWAR said: I never flame... Ruins the needles IMO... I just wipe with alcohol and it is good to go. I have not flamed a needle in years.
I say flame once, before you start with a new spore syringe (if you must flame). Then use Isopropyl alcohol wipes between jars.
I never flame needles anymore either...I haven't in years. I just wipe the needle with a cotton ball and Isopropyl Alcohol.
-------------------- Laterz, Road Who the hell you callin crazy? You wouldn't know what crazy was if Charles Manson was eating froot loops on your front porch! Brainiac said: PM the names with on there names, that means they have mushrooms for sale.
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XTCollection
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Re: The whole flaming the needle.. [Re: Roadkill]
#3858119 - 03/02/05 04:02 PM (19 years, 21 days ago) |
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And if your that concerned with airborne contams, the rapid tempature changes would cause mass to expel and retract in the needle. On a minute scale, but more of a threat to contams than wiping, I would think.
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