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InvisibleMOTH
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Can someone recommend a book on Jung's Archetypes?
    #3851499 - 03/01/05 12:50 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Any book on this you can recommend? Preferably one that isn't full of the author's hot air.


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Can someone recommend a book on Jung's Archetypes? [Re: MOTH]
    #3851530 - 03/01/05 12:57 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Preferably one that isn't full of the author's hot air.

Well, that rules out anything by Jung himself...

(Sorry, I know I'm a mod, but I couldn't resist.)


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Offlinefreddurgan
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Re: Can someone recommend a book on Jung's Archetypes? [Re: Phluck]
    #3851674 - 03/01/05 01:32 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Yeah I'd avoid anything Jungian/Freudian. These guys just made up a theory and then fell completely into the abyss of confirmation bias for the rest of their lives.


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Can someone recommend a book on Jung's Archetypes? [Re: freddurgan]
    #3852107 - 03/01/05 03:00 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Indeed. I have a little more respect for Freud though, but 99% of what he said was likely BS. He did create a new way of thinking about how our minds worked which has probably launched lots of very interesting and important studies about the mind, but much of it was just him talking out his ass.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: Can someone recommend a book on Jung's Archetypes? [Re: MOTH]
    #3852497 - 03/01/05 04:27 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Ego and Archetype: Individuation and the Religious Function of the Psyche by Edward Edinger

By far, the best general text on Jung's theory of archetypes by someone other than Jung. Well-illustrated - older copies have color plates. The late E. Edinger was Dirctor of the C.G. Jung Center of NYC. This book has the best psychological explanation of the Adam and Eve story (for example) that I have ever read. It also describes the very beginning of the mandala-formation using art therapist Rhoda Kellogg's work with very young (no pun intended :smile:) children.


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Edited by MarkostheGnostic (03/01/05 07:30 PM)


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OfflineMAIA
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Re: Can someone recommend a book on Jung's Archetypes? [Re: MOTH]
    #3856787 - 03/02/05 12:52 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

I agree with Markos. That's an excellent book, and i think E.F. Edinger and this book have never received the recognition they deserve.
"The Archetypes and The Collective Unconscious" by C. G. Jung itself would be a good read too, but first read "Ego and Archetype" by Edinger :wink: .

MAIA


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Can someone recommend a book on Jung's Archetypes? [Re: MAIA] * 1
    #3857031 - 03/02/05 01:42 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

i liked man and his symbols
the hot air helps kyoto


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InvisibleMOTH
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Re: Can someone recommend a book on Jung's Archetypes? [Re: freddurgan]
    #3857254 - 03/02/05 02:43 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Thanks for the suggestions!  :heart:

Quote:

freddurgan said:
Yeah I'd avoid anything Jungian/Freudian. These guys just made up a theory and then fell completely into the abyss of confirmation bias for the rest of their lives.




Can you explain what you mean with more clarity?  I don't know much about Jung yet.  Are you saying his theories are baseless?  Or that he came up with this archetype theory and spent the rest of his life trying to prove it?  I first heard about archetypes from Timothy Leary so now I'm interested in learning more.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Can someone recommend a book on Jung's Archetypes? [Re: MOTH]
    #3857294 - 03/02/05 02:55 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

his work is brilliant for the times
freud too was on the edge for his times.

i once had a dictionary of freud
and I would memorize all the meanings of all his words

not the way I think now but useful to taste the flavours of these groundbreaking thinkers.

like I say don't worry about the hot air


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Offlinefreddurgan
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Re: Can someone recommend a book on Jung's Archetypes? [Re: MOTH] * 1
    #3857614 - 03/02/05 04:17 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

What I'm saying is that with a theory like Freud's or Jung's, there is absolutely no basis for objectivity. You can only go with what you "know" or how much you believe in your theory. Nobody can ever -disprove- the archetypes because they are a completely subjective thing. I can't just experiment with the archetypes.

Without an objective backing, you end up just constantly reinforcing what you believe by believing in it over and over. Jung can't ever prove or disprove his theories, and nobody else can either.

Bascially what you said "Or that he came up with this archetype theory and spent the rest of his life trying to prove it..." But he can't, and nobody else can either.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Can someone recommend a book on Jung's Archetypes? [Re: freddurgan]
    #3857774 - 03/02/05 04:54 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

you can work with engrams (brain memory traces) and the most common engram relationships can be called archetypes.

images or concepts that have the most functional commonality with a large class of other images.

In plato, they are ideal and never concrete, in Jung you find strong representations of them in primitive art, but it is really the same.

engrams are also abstract such that they are not real but gleaned from experience and simplified for the purpose of crossreferencing on a neurological level.


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Offlinekotik
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Re: Can someone recommend a book on Jung's Archetypes? [Re: freddurgan]
    #5826923 - 07/06/06 10:31 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

freddurgan said:
Yeah I'd avoid anything Jungian/Freudian. These guys just made up a theory and then fell completely into the abyss of confirmation bias for the rest of their lives.




what sort of theory isn't "just made up?"

their work provided much insight. i could use your same argument against doctors, geologists, etc.


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