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OfflineSamhainJ
I wanna rock out, in my dreams
Registered: 05/16/04
Posts: 1,002
Loc: USA
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
gun buying legal question
    #3802394 - 02/19/05 04:10 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

hi

i live in a bad area and i have been burglarized several times. i want to purchase a handgun to protect my home. i have been convicted of misdemeanor simple assualt for only pushing somebody. i was wondering if anybody knows if this disqaulifys me from purchasing a handgun. i do not want to try and buy one if i am going to be refused. please PM me if you know the answer to this.


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Offlinecb9fl
Senior ChildMolestationExpert
Registered: 06/12/03
Posts: 3,104
Loc: florida
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: SamhainJ]
    #3802405 - 02/19/05 04:16 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

http://www.nraila.org/GunLaws/Default.aspx

As far as I've heard only a felony prohibits you from purchasing a hand gun.


--------------------
It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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Offlinediscoabe
Stranger

Registered: 03/26/04
Posts: 674
Loc: Nevada
Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: cb9fl]
    #3802526 - 02/19/05 05:13 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

cb is right, it's just felonies. if you're worried, just buy one from a gun show, you can get around those pesky background checks then.


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Invisiblez@z.com
Libertarian
Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 2,876
Loc: ATL
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: discoabe]
    #3802690 - 02/19/05 08:44 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

discoabe said:
cb is right, it's just felonies. if you're worried, just buy one from a gun show, you can get around those pesky background checks then.



They run background checks at gun shows.


--------------------
"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: cb9fl]
    #3803056 - 02/19/05 01:19 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)


As far as I've heard only a felony prohibits you from purchasing a hand gun.

Wrong!

To the original poster...be very very careful.

I had a friend with a misdemeanor on his record.  He ended up doing several weeks in jail for that.  He was a gun enthusiast.  In our state you have to go through a background check whenever you buy a handgun.  He bought several.  He also went through an intensive background check when he got a concealed carry permit.  Every time he went through one of these background checks he told the people, "I have a misdemeanor on my record.  Make sure I am allowed to get this gun or permit."  Every time he passed and he got it.  He did everything he could to obey the law.

One day the ATF breaks down his door, ransacks his house, and hauls him off to prison.  It seems as if there was a recent federal law that says that if you have a crime on your record that has the POSSIBILITY of more than a year in jail, then you cannot own a firearm.  It doesn't matter if you actually did a year in jail, just if the possible maximum sentence for the crime is a year or over. 

For example, let's say that you are in a bar, some asshole punches you, you punch him back, and you both get charged with disorderly conduct.  Let's say the possible maximum sentence for disorderly conduct is 18 months in jail.  The judge actually gives you a $200 fine and 20 hours of community service.  You can never own a firearm again.  I am not shitting you.

The reason the background check did not catch that my friend was not allowed to own guns is because our state gun background check system was not completely updated to check ALL federal laws.  So, my friend unknowingly was breaking some new law he had never heard of, the background check didn't catch it, and the federal government didn't give a shit.

My friend is rotting in a federal prison right now.

God Bless America.  :shake:


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Offlinecb9fl
Senior ChildMolestationExpert
Registered: 06/12/03
Posts: 3,104
Loc: florida
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3803075 - 02/19/05 01:28 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

It seems as if there was a recent federal law that says that if you have a crime on your record that has the POSSIBILITY of more than a year in jail, then you cannot own a firearm.

Do you have a link to that court case?

Also I haven't found a federal statute but every state I've found so far limits jail time for misdemeanors to one year or less.


--------------------
It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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Invisiblelooner2
ABBA fan

Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 3,849
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3803091 - 02/19/05 01:35 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

My friend is rotting in a federal prison right now.

Jesus Christ. Why would ATF go after him? It just doesn't seem logical they would break down the doors of someone who bought a handgun and happened to have a misdemeaner. I mean... lots of people have a misdemeaner and own guns, I'm sure...

Even the fact that it did happen, how could he not have gotten leeway in the courts after laying out his situation? What was his misdemeaner crime? How long is he in the pen for?


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I am in love with Acidic_Sloth



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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: cb9fl]
    #3803106 - 02/19/05 01:44 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)


Do you have a link to that court case?

Where is the site to search federal cases? It occurred in federal court in Erie, PA. at around the Summer of 2003.


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: looner2]
    #3803121 - 02/19/05 01:51 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)


Why would ATF go after him?

They're assholes.


It just doesn't seem logical they would break down the doors of someone who bought a handgun and happened to have a misdemeaner. I mean... lots of people have a misdemeaner and own guns, I'm sure...

Yep. And they try to bust them too. Another local guy who was in the EXACT same situation got hauled off to prison as well. He had a misdemeanor on his record and passed the background check.


Even the fact that it did happen, how could he not have gotten leeway in the courts after laying out his situation?

He had a federal public defender. I could have done a better job than that idiot. The public defender walked my friend right to prison.


What was his misdemeaner crime?

I think he got caught with a sawed-off shotgun when he was 19. Now before you start going, "Oh! Well that's why he got hauled off!", think about this: He got released after two weeks. His lawyer got it pleaded down to a misdemeanor(I don't know what exactly). He got all of his legal guns returned to him. The authorities told him that his future gun rights would not be infringed upon.


How long is he in the pen for?

He is in prison for 1 and 1/2 years to 2 years.


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OfflineHagbardCeline
Student-Teacher-Student-Teacher
Male User Gallery

Registered: 05/10/03
Posts: 9,805
Loc: Overjoyed, at the bottom ...
Last seen: 39 minutes, 34 seconds
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3805005 - 02/20/05 12:10 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

I had a friend in similar though not so serious situation.

He was convicted of some assault charge for domestic violence. He and women with whom he has a child were living together and got into an argument one night and he tried to leave. He had actually called me to come pick him up. When he went to walk out she tried to stop him by holding onto him and he pushed her off of him. She fell on her ass and nothing more. He never hit her. She called the police and he was arrested. Spent a couple of days in jail. She calmed down and decided not to press charges but the state pursued them anyway. His time served was the only punishement he got.

That was 5 or 6 years ago. He went through a background check to buy a pistol a few months ago and was denied because of that.


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I keep it real because I think it is important that a highly esteemed individual such as myself keep it real lest they experience the dreaded spontaneous non-existance of no longer keeping it real. - Hagbard Celine


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Offlinecb9fl
Senior ChildMolestationExpert
Registered: 06/12/03
Posts: 3,104
Loc: florida
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3805048 - 02/20/05 12:25 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

From the NRA's website.

Quote:

Ineligible Persons

The following classes of people are ineligible to possess, receive, ship, or transport firearms or ammunition:

* Those convicted of crimes punishable by imprisonment for over one year, except state misdemeanors punishable by two years or less.
* Fugitives from justice.
* Unlawful users of certain depressant, narcotic, or stimulant drugs.
* Those adjudicated as mental defectives or incompetents or those committed to any mental institution.
* Illegal aliens.
* Citizens who have renounced their citizenship.
* Those persons dishonorably discharged from the Armed Forces.
* Persons less than 18 years of age for the purchase of a shotgun or rifle.
* Persons less than 21 years of age for the purchase of a firearm that is other than a shotgun or rifle.
* Persons subject to a court order that restrains such persons from harassing, stalking, or threatening an intimate partner.
* Persons convicted in any court of a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence.

Persons under indictment for a crime punishable by imprisonment for more than one year are ineligible to receive, transport, or ship any firearm or ammunition. Under limited conditions, relief from disability may be obtained from the U.S. Secretary of the Treasury, or through a pardon, expungement, restoration of rights, or setting aside of a conviction.




--------------------
It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: cb9fl]
    #3805162 - 02/20/05 12:52 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)


except state misdemeanors punishable by two years or less.

I am not sure which misdemeanor he had on his record.

The fact of the matter is he passed the background checks when he went to go buy his guns. He should not have been allowed to pass the background check if he was not allowed to have guns. What does that tell me? That the background check in my state is not updated to coincide with new federal laws, it doesn't work, and it is innaccurate.

If the background check in my state is that flawed, it makes me scared. Not only is it possible that some dangerous criminals out there legally got ahold of guns, it is also a reality that some oblivious people got them when they really weren't allowed to have them. The background check should serve as a way to keep guns out of the hands of criminals, but it should also serve as a protection to people so they don't unknowingly break the law. My friend had no clue he was in violation of the law when he purchased his guns.

My friend is rotting in federal prison because the state fucked up.


Edited by RandalFlagg (02/20/05 01:00 AM)


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Invisiblez@z.com
Libertarian
Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 2,876
Loc: ATL
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3805187 - 02/20/05 12:58 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

It is getting to the point where you have to be a model citizen to own a gun. That frightens me a little. Will the wreckless driving charge I got when I was 16 someday prohibit me from buying a gun? I say everyone should be allowed to have a gun and if they are too violent to own a gun they shouldn't ever be allowed on the streets.


--------------------
"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson


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OfflineProsgeopax
Jaded, yethopeful?

Registered: 01/28/05
Posts: 1,258
Loc: Appearing at a mall near ...
Last seen: 10 years, 11 months
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: SamhainJ]
    #3820089 - 02/23/05 12:49 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Check with your local State Attorney General's office for regulations. I would suggest a 12 gauge pump action shotgun as a home defense weapon. No slugs to travel through walls, aiming in an emergence's situation is much easier (more like point and shoot), and merely the sound of chambering a round can be enough to send vermin scurrying away - saving you the round to be used for clay pigeons.


--------------------
Money doesn't grow on trees, but deficits do grow under Bushes.

You can accept, reject, or examine and test any new idea that comes to you. The wise man chooses the third way.
- Tom Willhite

Disclaimer: I reserve the right to change my opinions should I become aware of additional facts, the falsification of information or different perspectives. Articles written by others which I post may not necessarily reflect my opinions in part or in whole, my opinions may be in direct opposition, the topic may be one on which I have yet to formulate an opinion or have doubts about, an article may be posted solely with the intent to stimulate discussion or contemplation.


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InvisibleSoopaX
Criminal DrugAnalyst

Registered: 11/13/04
Posts: 1,690
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3821222 - 02/23/05 09:54 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

If you pass the background check, you are OK. When you pass, the gun store is given a Approval Number that is listed (in PA) in box four of your "Application/Record of Sale". If you have this form then you clearly can show that you were approved. PA doesn't use federal background checks (NCIS), it uses a state police background check. If you pass, then you are OK. The check for a CCW permit is the same thing, it just takes a little bit longer. PA CCW's cost 5$ to apply and 15$ to recieve the permit once you are approved. If you aren't approved, you don't have to pay the 15$. If you pass the check to buy your pistol you should pass the check to have your CCW.

Honestly though, get a shotgun. A .410 shotgun with a barrel weight to keep the barrel down is great. I'm sure that people will say that a 12 gauge has more knockdown power, and thats true. But why do you need all of that power? It reminds me of the hicks around here that hunt whitetail bucks with .45-70's. Why not call in a mortar strike, or napalm the hill that it's on?


--------------------


Jackie Treehorn treats objects like women, man


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: SoopaX]
    #3821833 - 02/23/05 01:10 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)


PA doesn't use federal background checks (NCIS), it uses a state police background check.

So the PA state background check does not check to see if you are compliant with federal law. That is what I always suspected and that is shitty. People like my friend who are ok with state law, but not with federal law will get fucked when they go by a gun.


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InvisibleSoopaX
Criminal DrugAnalyst

Registered: 11/13/04
Posts: 1,690
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3824330 - 02/23/05 10:09 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

They do a federal background check, but the check is done by the state police, rather than NCIS.


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Jackie Treehorn treats objects like women, man


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: SoopaX]
    #3824343 - 02/23/05 10:14 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)


They do a federal background check, but the check is done by the state police, rather than NCIS.

Then why the hell was my friend allowed to buy hanguns and get a concealed carry permit when he wasn't allowed and later got hauled off to prison for all of that?


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InvisibleSoopaX
Criminal DrugAnalyst

Registered: 11/13/04
Posts: 1,690
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3824355 - 02/23/05 10:17 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

<-- Not a lawyer.


--------------------


Jackie Treehorn treats objects like women, man


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: gun buying legal question [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3824432 - 02/23/05 10:35 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Something fucked up somewhere. Given that he bought several handguns and got a concealed carry permit means that whatever errors that happened in the checks......happened REPEATEDLY. That means that there is a serious fuckup somewhere. I really don't think he deserves to be in prison. The background checks should have caught it if he was not allowed to own guns.


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