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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Potential Therapeutic Application of Fungal Filaments in Wound Management
    #3799988 - 02/18/05 08:16 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Long story short: It's about growing liquid culture mycelia, filtering them out, making a paper out of them, boiling it in lye, plasticising it with glycerin, and growing skin grafts on it.


Now that's advanced.

http://fungus.org.uk/nwfg/woundnw.htm



Introduction

The use of fungal materials as styptics in folk medicine has been documented (Baker, 1989; Vaidya & Rabba, 1993) as has the use of mouldy bread, jam, etc. and, more recently, live mycelial pads for the prevention and treatment of wound infections - efficacy apparently being related to antibiotic (patulin rather than penicillin) content (Wainwright, 1989; Wainwright et al., 1992).

With the availability of haemostats (styptics) based on calcium alginate (a seaweed-derived polysaccharide), and the preferred use of systemic rather than local antibiotic therapy, it would appear that there is no place for fungal materials in modern wound management. It may seem curious, therefore, that novel fungal materials with the potential to be used in wound management are currently being developed.

The major components of fungal cell walls are polysaccharides which typically account for 80 - 90% of the dry weight, the remainder consisting of protein and lipids (Bartnicki-Garcia, 1968). Chitin is present in the majority of fungi as one of the skeletal polysaccharides responsible for maintaining the rigidity and shape of the cell wall. It is a b -1,4-linked linear homopolymer of N-acetyl-D-glucosamine similar to cellulose but with an acetamido group rather than an hydroxyl at C-2. Chitin is not the only structural polysaccharide present in fungal cell walls. The alkali-insoluble cell wall residue of ascomycetes and basidiomycetes has been reported to consist of a branched b -1,3- / b -1,6- glucan together with chitin (Rosenberger, 1976). In zygomycetes in particular, the chitin may be partially deacetylated (the fully deacetylated material being known as chitosan). The sugars fucose, galactose, mannose and xylose have been identified as minor components in hydrolysates of cell walls from various fungal species whilst galactosamine has also been identified in the cell walls of several fungi, though usually accounting for only a few percent of the total monomers. Furthermore, the chitin content varies between species and even growth forms (e.g. vegetative mycelium, sporangiophores) and can be greatly influenced by the composition of the growth medium and the conditions of culture.

Chitin is not unique to fungi, also being found in the shells of crustaceans and in the exoskeletons of insects (Austin et al., 1981). Indeed, chitin is currently obtained commercially from crab- and prawn- shells which are waste products of the food industry.

Scientific studies on the use of chitin in wound healing were first reported in the 1970s (Balassa, 1972; Balassa & Prudden, 1978). In rats, the bursting strengths of experimental wounds treated with chitin of crustacean or fungal origin, were found to have increased by up to 60% relative to controls. Since then, further evidence has been obtained to suggest that chitin has wound healing acceleration properties although the mechanism of action is still largely unknown (Olsen et al., 1989).

Filamentous fungi are an attractive source of chitin for medical applications because specific products can be manufactured under standard conditions and the chitin is produced in a fibrous form so that only relatively cheap chemical treatments are required during processing. This article summarises a programme of work carried out at BTTG and the Welsh School of Pharmacy to investigate the potential application of fungal filaments in wound management.

Experimental Materials

At BTTG a range of filamentous materials was prepared containing from about 20% (w/w) up to 90% (w/w) chitin (Table 1). It should be noted that the assay method we used was not able to differentiate chitin and chitosan. The assumption made for the purposes of calculation was, therefore, that only chitin was present. The fungal materials are more appropriately described as containing ?chitin/chitosan?. In addition to mycelia from Fusarium graminearum, Rhizomucor miehei, Rhizopus oryzae and Mucor mucedo, sporangiophores of Phycomyces blakesleeanus and Agaricus bisporus stipe (a waste product from the cultivated mushroom industry) were also included in these investigations. All the products had been treated with 2M NaOH at 100oC for 1 h to remove protein and other alkali-soluble components. Further details about the fungal culture conditions and the preparation of the filamentous materials are given in Chung et al. (1994).

Cell Proliferation Studies

Mammalian cell culture systems were used for evaluating bioactivity. This work was carried out at the Welsh School of Pharmacy where comparative bioassay systems have been developed to assess and compare materials used in wound management (Turner et al., 1989; Schmidt et al., 1989; Schmidt et al., 1993). The objective of these studies was to establish whether any of the fungal materials can affect the rate of proliferation of fibroblasts, the cell type responsible for laying down new (granulation) tissue in a healing wound, and therefore whether the materials had the potential to increase the rate of wound healing. A second objective was to determine whether there is a correlation between the chitin content of the materials and their effects on fibroblast proliferation.

At high concentrations, the purified fungal preparations had anti-proliferant activity. This did not correlate with chitin content and may have been the result of a direct chitosan / plasma membrane interaction (Chung et al., 1993) At lower concentrations, pro-proliferant effects which appeared to correlate with chitin content were observed. These effects were most marked with material derived from sporangiophores of Phycomyces blakesleeanus which had the highest chitin content of all the fungal preparations examined (Tables 1 & 2). Material derived from sporangiophores of P. blakesleeanus or mycelium of Mucor mucedo also exhibited cell attractant and cell binding properties in fibroblast cultures (results not shown), effects that could conceivably assist movement and attachment of fibroblasts in the healing wound. Fibroblasts are responsible for laying down collagen in the wound and hence rebuilding tissue.

In order to explain the pro-proliferant effects of the fungal materials, a mechanism involving auto-oxidatively generated hydrogen peroxide has been proposed (Chung et al., 1993; Schmidt et al., 1994). Auto-oxidation is the process of spontaneous oxidative degradation in air; this process has long been known to lead to hydrogen peroxide formation and requires the presence of traces of transition metal ions (such as iron or copper) to proceed. Hydrogen peroxide acts as a fibroblast cell proliferant at the very low concentrations generated by auto-oxidation of the materials in the culture medium (Burdon et al., 1989; Schmidt et al., 1992). Addition of catalase (an enzyme which specifically destroys hydrogen peroxide) to the culture media completely abolishes the pro-proliferant effects of the fungal materials. It was also found that the hydrogen peroxide generating capacity did not correlate with chitin content in these fungal materials. Our more recent work has demonstrated that hydrogen peroxide generating capacity appears to be a property of chitosan rather than chitin, at least in crustacean-derived materials (Chung et al., 1993).

Fabrication

It is envisaged that two basic types of dressing could be directly manufactured from fungal filaments: an absorbent freeze-dried pad for deeper wounds and a thin wet-laid surface dressing (Hamlyn, 1991). The two types of product could be used in conjunction with other materials to form a multi-layered structure (Sagar et al., 1990).

In comparison with conventional natural fibres, fungal filaments have the advantage that the biomass is available in days rather than months and that different kinds of filamentous structures are available, ranging from straight fibres several centimetres in length (sporangiophores) to branched microscopic filaments (mycelium). Fungal filaments are also hollow leading to the possibility of their development as carriers of micro-encapsulated drugs.

Sporangiophores are only obtained on solid substrates similar to those employed for mushroom cultivation, whereas vegetative mycelium can be produced most economically in a liquid growth medium inside a bioreactor (Fig 1). From a commercial point of view the technology for growing a fungus in a bioreactor is well established. Industrial bioreactors of over 1,000,000 litres in volume are now used for the production of biomass.

After growing a fungus in a bioreactor, the resulting broth contains very fine branched filaments which, after suitable processing, can be fabricated in several different ways. The broth is first passed through a fine mesh filter and the solid material thoroughly washed with water to remove residual medium. Depending on the end-use, alkali treatment can be employed to remove proteins and other impurities and the filaments can be bleached to give a white product. Such bleaching can, however, modify the bioactivity of the material (Schmidt et al., 1994) The treated filaments are again thoroughly washed and finally re-suspended in water.

At this stage the filaments can be wet-laid, either on their own or mixed with conventional fibres such as wood pulp and polyester using normal laboratory paper-making equipment (Fig 2). When mixed with other fibres, the resulting composite mats are coherent but paper-like. On their own, the microfungal filaments are very brittle. However, these can be plasticised (for instance with glycerol) to form flexible, membrane-like materials. Another type of novel material can be made by freeze-drying a thick slurry of the filaments to produce an absorbent pad. In the case of sporangiophores (Fig 3), attempts to spin a yarn from these long straight filaments have, so far, proved unsuccessful because of their brittle nature in the dried state. Sporangiophores suffer from the dual drawback of having both low tensile strength and low breaking extension in comparison with conventional textile fibres (Table 3). Therefore, it has only been possible to fabricate these filaments by the methods already described after they have been cut into suitable short lengths to aid dispersion.

Following alkali treatment and bleaching, highly absorbent products can be made from the sporangiophores. The ultrastructure of these novel fungal products as revealed by the scanning electron microscope is shown in Figs 4 & 5.

Conclusions

The next generation of wound management products are expected to participate ?actively? in the wound healing process by releasing stimulatory molecules to the wound surface (Turner, 1986). These products are being developed, in particular, for the treatment of chronic wounds such as leg ulcers and bed sores which can take many months to heal by traditional means, thereby placing a considerable burden on hospital and nursing resources.

The results of the tissue culture studies reviewed in this article have been encouraging, indicating that fungal filaments exhibit biological activities (cell attractant, cell-binding, and pro-proliferant) of relevance to the wound healing process and that the pro-proliferant activity may be a feature of the chitosan present in the filaments, and more specifically the outcome of hydrogen peroxide generation by auto-oxidation of the fungal filaments. If these fungal materials were developed for use in wound management, it is conceivable that they would promote the growth of fibroblasts into the wound cavity and provide a matrix for their anchorage. This would lead to a more rapid deposition of new collagen and hence granulation tissue.

Acknowledgements

This work was supported by the UK Department of Trade and Industry and a group of industrial co-sponsors. The authors also thank Gladys Hadfield for carrying out the scanning electron microscopy and Sue Ramsbottom for technical assistance.


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Invisiblewhiterasta
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Re: Potential Therapeutic Application of Fungal Filaments in Wound Management [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #3807899 - 02/20/05 07:54 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

One of the folk remedies local to coastal PNW natives is that the mycelium of pleurotus species is a powerful anti-infection agent. A poultice is made from the fully colonized wood(alder) and applied to the wound.The aggresive myc seems to consume the infection and also release an anti-microbial. Most septic wounds treated this way heal quickly and cleanly like this lawn tractor wound I got last spring(May 25th)

This at 4months and after an infection treated with Pleurotus myc.
The foot and achilles were gutted on that side with a wound that I had to stick my hand into to pinch the artery and had 2 chunks of 3/4" gravel embedded. Having diabetes had me on the short list for amputation but instead I am working on stretching my repaired tendons.
Great post BH! I came very close to needing a skin graft.
WR


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: Potential Therapeutic Application of Fungal Filaments in Wound Management [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #3808591 - 02/20/05 10:38 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Nice one!

Did you tell your doctor you were putting mushrooms on your feet?


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Invisiblewhiterasta
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Re: Potential Therapeutic Application of Fungal Filaments in Wound Management [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #3808685 - 02/20/05 10:56 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

yeah, and at first he just thought I was wack and being diabetic he would eventually have to amputate, he confided the truth after I was out of infection danger around november. I actually got some grudging respect from Dr. Enzyteman(j/k) and he will probably release me next month,with both feet. Even though that achilles separation will be another year at least before I regain all the strength in my foot and calf.
Right after surgery in a cast I stepped into a mud puddle off balance so I poured 2 bottles of vetrenary Absorbine Jr over and down the cast to disinfect it. Everyone thought I was wack after that :lol:
WR
Am I just wack or do I know whatI'm doing?
You may choose 2
Yer wack!
You know a thing or two


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Offlinecurenado
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Re: Potential Therapeutic Application of Fungal Filaments in Wound Management [Re: whiterasta]
    #5246548 - 01/31/06 01:50 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Both nice ones you guys!
My only two cents is that after any wound or surgery when bleeding is under control I put my people on a regular myco protocol because I have observed that you just get better tissue granulation and wound healing with less scar. I attribute this to a number of reasons, not just infection control. Oxygenation, tissue conditioning - but these two posts were the first I had heard of such.
A recent example here was a 56 yo female who had a large cactus spine embedded under her index fingernail. I said "Wow. That is deep. I'll get the needle tip tweezers and get that for you." she said "Oh don't worry. When it festers it will push it out." (heh-heh) I said "Hon, that's not going to fester because you are eating your mushrooms." She looked at me with the dawning of realization but elected to keep her splinter anyway - over the next couple of weeks we watched as - like I said, no infection - but, the skin actually granulated and healed around the spine, and it essentially "fell out" dry.
If it wasn't you two guys - but no kidding. I got to watch that happen and it made a believer out of me in new ideas of "wound-ology"
:psychsplit:
Good thread! :thumbup:


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Re: Potential Therapeutic Application of Fungal Filaments in Wound Management [Re: whiterasta]
    #5256664 - 02/02/06 09:15 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

whiterasta said:
One of the folk remedies local to coastal PNW natives is that the mycelium of pleurotus species is a powerful anti-infection agent. A poultice is made from the fully colonized wood(alder) and applied to the wound.The aggresive myc seems to consume the infection and also release an anti-microbial. Most septic wounds treated this way heal quickly and cleanly like this lawn tractor wound I got last spring(May 25th)

This at 4months and after an infection treated with Pleurotus myc.
The foot and achilles were gutted on that side with a wound that I had to stick my hand into to pinch the artery and had 2 chunks of 3/4" gravel embedded. Having diabetes had me on the short list for amputation but instead I am working on stretching my repaired tendons.
Great post BH! I came very close to needing a skin graft.
WR




I'm gonna shoot my mouth of and say that regular topical application of aloe Gelly (not necessarily all the time !) and aloe Gel taken orally (with the addition of a multi-mineral colloid perhaps ?) will help repair that tendon injury. Also use a topical pepper based application to stimulate circulation in an "aloe-sandwich"*and/or Horse Chestnut gel, I got some real hot vibes for its use in tissue repair when I used it recently on a "patient" ("Horse" is a corruption of the Welsh word "gwyres" which means "hot" !).

*Which I've just realised is a perfect companion medicine to the myco-tech, but not tonight folks, I'll post on this to you annon-asap.


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (02/02/06 09:19 PM)


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OfflineFreeSporePrints
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Re: Potential Therapeutic Application of Fungal Filaments in Wound Management [Re: Silverwolf]
    #5257882 - 02/03/06 02:15 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

not to be OT but here in Italy, i've listened a story of a friend of mine family about an infection on a leg: this guy tried a lot of medicine but without luck, a day his dog licked that infection and a few of months after it disappeared.

In the old Rome, during Roman Emperor, was used to apply the worms (for fishing, that one that grow up on the punk meat) to the infection. These worms eat all the dead meat reducing the wide of the infection. Good luck!


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Re: Potential Therapeutic Application of Fungal Filaments in Wound Management [Re: FreeSporePrints]
    #5258200 - 02/03/06 04:58 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

worms.. they still use them, you know..

maggot therapy: healing wounds with worms
http://www.peak.sfu.ca/the-peak/2000-2/issue5/ne-scimaggots.html

:sun:


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Re: Potential Therapeutic Application of Fungal Filaments in Wound Management [Re: Speeker]
    #5260243 - 02/03/06 08:25 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Ah, but this therapy helps grow new tissue not destoy dead tissue as maggot therapy does!


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


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OfflineSilverwolf
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Re: Potential Therapeutic Application of Fungal Filaments in Wound Management [Re: Silverwolf]
    #5270656 - 02/06/06 08:04 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Ah, thinks "is this a blinding light from above or a dark black shaft from below ?" anyhow here goes... could one combine an aloe gel into one of these "myco packs"? (Oooooh -finally reads above article- it's a glucasamine now that's interesting !)
The laying down of granulate tissues is interesting. The auto-oxidization of hydrogen peroxide (the tissue binding properties of which may be dependent on the chemical/physical processes involved in it's production or on the relatively small quantity of the chemical present and the way in which it is introduced to the cells -?- ) is also interesting. The way in which these tissue sources bind is of crucial importance, or so it seems to me, for this and other work.


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (02/09/06 12:36 PM)


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Offlinecurenado
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Re: Potential Therapeutic Application of Fungal Filaments in Wound Management [Re: Silverwolf]
    #5282800 - 02/09/06 08:11 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

The primary concern in any additive is the bacterio/viral resistence of that additive. After one determines if the additive may host/feed infectants then one can evaluate it's potential in the particular application.

No question that aloes benefit the skin - but,
1) is the additive sterile enough to apply and
2) Once applied, will the additive prevent further contamination or at least be held "non-infective" by the other components.

Example: I once had a borderline gangerous leg which I was treating internally and dressing only with a "triple antibiotic" type ointment to fight topical skin breakdown. One day I thought "Maybe I'll irrigate that to debride a little and leave it that way for a day" - BIG mistake! Though the irrigant was sterile, some it remained in the wound and served as a virtual "ocean" for bacterial bloom.
The entire area sloughed completely to the muscle the next time the dressing was changed. Rapid! Bloom and flesh destruction. This set back the healing process.
There was no perceiveable merit in that approach beyond...it finished killing all the infected skin? The result was not, in my mind, worth the extra healing time and potential for limb loss that occured by exposing that much more clean tissue to the open air.
I am happy to say that the resulting "mess of green stinking yuck" that shocked and frightened me was back under control by the next day, and with the exception of a thin scar type (or "natural suture") line, the leg regrew succulent flesh and is a pretty leg to this very day.
In "wound-ology" the sterility and contaminate-ability (septic potential) of any additive is the primary concern. It's therapeutic properties are the second consideration.
If that helps....
:psychsplit:


--------------------
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"The woods are lovely, dark and deep; but I have patches to keep, and jars to sterilize before I sleep...."


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Re: Potential Therapeutic Application of Fungal Filaments in Wound Management [Re: curenado]
    #5298433 - 02/14/06 10:49 AM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Well aloes are mostly water but the cellular binding contains many trace elements, vitamins and minerals. The appropriateness for it's immediate topical use on anything but the smallest of skin rupturing or burning injuries is questionable. However a large open (we're talking skin-rupurting wounds here not burns) prepared wound (the preparation of which includes a painkilling protocol) could well be tolerant, aloe is "alkaline-sterile" (I hope all reading this realise that I am talking about the inner-gel here not the leaves). However for this application the gel must be stabilised properly, the patent for the proper process for which is held only by one man. His original gelly formula contains: Aloe Barbadensis Gel (Stabilized Aloe Vera Gel U.S patent No. 6713095), water, glycerin, triethanolamine, carbomer, tocopherol (vitamin E natural), allantion, ascorbic acid, diazolidinyl urea, disodium EDTA and methylparaben. I suspect that any medical applicant gel would have to partake of some or all of these, however I still don't think that this would impair it's sterility (although the impact on the body of the chemical compounds involved might be of some concern -in which case one would be forced to achieve the same balance with less ?-).
Chitin is a glucosamine and aloe and glucosamine have been stabilised together (but how does this peroxide process work? That is what we need to know ).

The thought repeats itself that we will need to know the effect of these stabilising chemicals on the mycelial fibres (such as the diazolidinyl urea esp ?) and whether the aloe could be of any use as a nutritional source for both fungi and human tissue. If a beneficial interactive relationship of that type could be established we would be into very interesting territory indeed.


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (03/02/06 09:37 PM)


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Re: Potential Therapeutic Application of Fungal Filaments in Wound Management [Re: Silverwolf]
    #5331775 - 02/23/06 03:46 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Surprises from puffball mushrooms

Puffball mushrooms are very widely distributed in
Africa. In many communities children love to play with them, throwing
them around as balls. When puffballs are young, they are fleshy
and firm. When they are fully grown, they do not decay and fall
away, as is the case with most mushrooms: they dry into a soft ball
which, when pressed, releases a cloud of spore dust.

We have been wondering: what prevents puffball mushrooms from
decaying away, like most other mushrooms? Why, like Ganoderma
lucidum, do they keep dry? Our hypothesis is that puffballs and
other mushrooms that display similar attributes, produce potent
antibiotics which overpower the common putrefying bacteria and
other microbial scavengers that catalyse decay. This hypothesis
was recently reinforced when the following story was told to one of
us, during a visit to a rural village community in Tanzania:

?There is this unhappy man with an ugly ulcerous wound that covers
a large area of his leg, below his knee. After several years of
suffering; after trying all sorts of treatment, without success; and
after consultations, the man is advised to travel to a reputed Regional
Hospital, to see a qualified medical Doctor.

The medical practitioner examines the wound, patiently listens to
the patient as he sadly narrates the long history of his chronic wound,
and then suggests that perhaps the affected leg would have to be
amputated, just below the knee. The patient is given a new
appointment date, when he is to go back to see the Doctor. He
returns to his village with a heavier heart than ever before.

The mere idea of getting his leg amputated destroys him. The bad
news spreads to the entire village community. An elder from another
village, who is acknowledged to possess considerable traditional
knowledge and experience on the treatment of wounds and other
medical problems, is informed about the case, and is called upon to
come and see the despondent man, whose leg is in danger of
amputation. The village elder examines the wound, expresses his
sympathy, nods his head, and prescribes some traditional medicine:

The patient?s painful ulcerous wound must be thoroughly
washed with soap and warm boiled water. A special type
of honey must carefully and thoroughly be smeared onto
the wound. (Here we are referring to honey produced by a
small type of bee, a peaceful bee that does not sting, which
in Same District, Kilimanjaro Region, Tanzania, is locally
referred to as ?mvora? honey). Then a cloud of puffball
spore ?dust? must be pressed onto the wound, by applying
some gentle pressure onto the spongy, sporogenous
mushroom. Then the wound must be bandaged?.


All these steps are done. What was the outcome?

Within a few weeks, the wound has dried up, and is healed! The
village elder, using traditional medicinal practice, has saved the
patient?s leg!

We have secured from village communities samples of locally
collected puffball mushrooms. The taxonomic
identification of the puffballs is still being researched.
Tentatively, the specimens seem to be close to the genera
Calvatia and Vascellum. Their envisaged curative antibiotics
(or other natural products) are still being researched. We
have managed to secure also the ?mvora? honey from the
villagers. We are doing research on its envisaged curative
potency. A qualified medical Doctor is involved in these
studies. It is all very interesting. Wound healing is so
important to all of us! Mushrooms thus generate a lot of hope
towards promoting and sustaining good human health.

The villagers in the community where the field study was done, did
not know that puffball mushrooms are edible when young, i.e., when
their flesh is still firm. Now they know: we shared this knowledge
with them during our interaction.

MUSHROOMS AND HUMAN HEALTH / S.T. Chang, Keto E. Mshigeni





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OfflineSilverwolf
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Re: Potential Therapeutic Application of Fungal Filaments in Wound Management [Re: Speeker]
    #5332354 - 02/23/06 07:17 PM (11 years, 4 months ago)

It is "elasticity" we require from both human and mycelial tissue if the aloe can provide this we are away.

Why is this bugging me.. "Calcium Aspartate, essential for electrolyte balance and cellular communication. Crucial for colon cancer patients..." (apart from the fact that it no longer appears on the E.U permitted list of bio-available supplements), Curanado?
Maybe our aloe-fungi pack would also benefit from the presence of a metal or multi-mineral colloid too, or am I "Gilding the Lilly" here?


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""


Edited by Silverwolf (03/01/06 07:47 PM)


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