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InvisibleGreat_Satan
prophet of God
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Registered: 09/05/04
Posts: 953
Debunking 911 myths
    #3775977 - 02/13/05 10:49 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

There's a long article in Popular Mechanics proving that the conspiracy theorists are delusional.


http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/defense/1227842.html?page=1&c=y


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OfflineJ4S0N
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Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: Great_Satan]
    #3776245 - 02/13/05 11:35 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Interesting, but didn't really provide any information that wasn't already known. There is still quite a few questions which were not answered..

This sort of article is kind of weird coming from Popular Mechanics. So I did a bit of digging.

Popular Mechanics is owned by the Hearst Corporation.
CEO of Hearst Corpoaration is Victor F. Ganzi.
Mr. Ganzi has some interesting connections:

Ganzi is on the board of directors of The National Center on Addiction and Substance Abuse at Columbia University (CASA), alongside Columba Bush, wife of Jeb Bush, Governor of Florida, brother of George W. Bush, President of the USA and son of George H.W. Bush, former DG of the CIA.

Victor F. Ganzi is a member of B.E.N.S. - "Business Executives for National Security" wherein we learn that "When it came time to evaluate In-Q-Tel, the CIA's innovative technology development enterprise, Congress turned to BENS"

In October 2002, B.E.N.S. received a "CIA Agency Seal Medallion" for its work on the In-Q-Tel program.

But then again im crazy, and these connections are all coincidence theory.

COINCIDENCE OR CONSPIRACY?
Did you know that on 9/11
1) New york & Washington airspace was undefended ? because NORAD jets were sent away to play war games (Richard Clarke, Against All Enemies p.4)
2) inside traders made billions ? and bet against United and American Airlines (CBS news, 9/26/01)
3) a third World Trade Center building (#7) collapsed mysteriously ? destroying Secret Service & CIA files (www.wtc7.net)
4) WTC crime scene evidence was ordered destroyed ? and investigators were stonewalled (Shin, Daily News 3/7/02).
5) When Senator Leahy demanded answers in writing, he got an anthrax letter from a classified U.S. government lab ? no arrests. (www.freefromterror.net)

Now people will ask where is the evidence.. well I'll ask the same thing. Where is the evidence that Bin Laden and his 19 hi-jackers were the only ones involved in Sept 11? On Sept 23, 2001 Condoleezaa Rice stated "...the U.S. has evidence of bin Laden's role in terrorist acts that it will present in due time." to this day the world is still waiting for this evidence. Where is it? Why all the secrecy from the government?


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"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA


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Invisibleusefulidiot
It's notfascist, it's...Neoconservative!

Registered: 11/21/02
Posts: 732
Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: Great_Satan]
    #3776254 - 02/13/05 11:37 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Jim Hoffman's rebuttal to the Popular Mechanics article http://911research.wtc7.net/essays/pm/index.html


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Invisiblez@z.com
Libertarian
Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 2,876
Loc: ATL
Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: usefulidiot]
    #3776491 - 02/14/05 12:24 AM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

usefulidiot said:
Jim Hoffman's rebuttal to the Popular Mechanics article http://911research.wtc7.net/essays/pm/index.html




What a load of garbage.

Quote:

This absurd idea that NORAD had no radar coverage over much of the continental US is distilled from the 9/11 Commission Report. Predictably, the article makes no mention of evidence that war games were planned for the day of 9/11/01. See Multiple War Games on 9/11/01 Helped to Disable Air Defense.




He doesn't even bother to address the statement that NORAD has no radar coverage in the continental US. Instead he changes the subject.


Quote:

"It is safe to assume that a significant fraction of scrambles lead to intercepts, so the fact that there were 67 scrambles in a 9-month period before 9/11/01 suggests that there are dozens of intercepts per year. To its assertion that there was only one intercept in a decade, the article adds that "rules in effect ... prohibited supersonic flight on intercepts," and the suggestion that there were no hotlines between ATCs and NORAD.




So he bases his entire argument on an assumption? And he doesn't even bother to address the claim that "In the decade before 9/11 NORAD intercepted only one civilian plane over North America: golfer Payne Stewart's Learjet, in October 1999.".


I could go on, but what is the point?


--------------------
"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: z@z.com]
    #3776818 - 02/14/05 01:37 AM (12 years, 2 months ago)

I heard ppl talking about a missle hitting the pentagon and not a plane

1) I've talked to someone who saw the plane hit

and 2

2) ppl are always like "well if a plane hit the pentagon then how come they didnt find a plane engine lying around in the wreckage.. Where were the jet engines?" answer... "IN PIECES, DUMBASSES!"


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Invisibledaussaulit
Forgetful

Registered: 08/06/02
Posts: 2,894
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Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: BrAiN]
    #3777180 - 02/14/05 04:05 AM (12 years, 2 months ago)

what about that camera that caught the impact on the pentagon? The government release the pictures. They had the wrong date on them, obviously doctored, and two of the pictures had the same time stamp on it.


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: daussaulit]
    #3777198 - 02/14/05 04:13 AM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Proof? Oh wise Canadian.


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Fiddlesticks.



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Invisibledaussaulit
Forgetful

Registered: 08/06/02
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Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: Rose]
    #3777270 - 02/14/05 04:46 AM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Ask and he shall receive.
http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/custom/attack/sns-worldtrade0307attacks,0,1249045.photogallery?index=1
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/flash/photo/nation/pentagonattack/movie.htm

I thought the "plane" hit the pentagon on September 11.
How can there be 2 different pictures at the same exact time?

Why is the "impact" photo so much brighter than the others?

Where's the picture for Sep. 12, 2001, 17:37:20?



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Invisiblez@z.com
Libertarian
Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 2,876
Loc: ATL
Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: daussaulit]
    #3777478 - 02/14/05 07:42 AM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Is the clock on your VCR set correctly?


--------------------
"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson


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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero

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Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: daussaulit]
    #3777626 - 02/14/05 09:30 AM (12 years, 2 months ago)

> How can there be 2 different pictures at the same exact time?

How many frames per second does the camera take? Most video is 24 to 30 frames per second, thus you get 24 to 30 pictures all with the exact same hour, minute, and second showing. Most vido will include a frame count as well, in the form of HH:MM:SS.FF.

Even if the camera only takes one picture per second, you can still get two pictures with the same time on them due to rounding errors.

Finally, what makes you think the timestamps in the pictures were not added after the fact? Based on the font of the legend on the left matching the font of the timestamp on the right, I would assume that both were added after the fact rather than a part of the actual realtime footage. If they were added after the fact, this means absolutely nothing other than somebody was adding a label to evidence.


--------------------
Just another spore in the wind.


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InvisibleInnvertigo
Vote Libertarian!!
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Registered: 02/09/01
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Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: Seuss]
    #3777733 - 02/14/05 10:18 AM (12 years, 2 months ago)

:shiftyeyes::shiftyeyes::shiftyeyes::shiftyeyes:


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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InvisibletrendalM
point of inflection
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Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: daussaulit]
    #3777843 - 02/14/05 11:05 AM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Why is the date Sept 12 in all the photos? :smirk:


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BTC - 1KqrSHZ1C3NsQP4g3PkHhppBnhdgyXr6sB


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: trendal]
    #3777853 - 02/14/05 11:10 AM (12 years, 2 months ago)

> Why is the date Sept 12 in all the photos?

Again, it is fairly obvious that the text was added to the photos after the fact, not super-imposed upon the photos during the fact. Who knows, perhaps the tin-hat brigade added the dates to stir up a new conspiracy theory. Oh wait, I know... the missle that hit the pentagon didn't happen until Sept 12th after Rumsfeld personally ordered everybody in the world to close their eyes for and to count to thirty real slow.


--------------------
Just another spore in the wind.


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OfflineProsgeopax
Jaded, yethopeful?

Registered: 01/28/05
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Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: daussaulit]
    #3777871 - 02/14/05 11:15 AM (12 years, 2 months ago)

That's a pretty neat camera that can put those dates and text on the photos. Every other photo I've seen with a date and time stamp has it superimposed over the photo not cut and pasted. How did it determine what actions were taking place when it snapped the photos? Also, notice the distance of the text from the bottom of the photo varies with each shot.


--------------------
Money doesn't grow on trees, but deficits do grow under Bushes.

You can accept, reject, or examine and test any new idea that comes to you. The wise man chooses the third way.
- Tom Willhite

Disclaimer: I reserve the right to change my opinions should I become aware of additional facts, the falsification of information or different perspectives. Articles written by others which I post may not necessarily reflect my opinions in part or in whole, my opinions may be in direct opposition, the topic may be one on which I have yet to formulate an opinion or have doubts about, an article may be posted solely with the intent to stimulate discussion or contemplation.


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: Seuss]
    #3777881 - 02/14/05 11:17 AM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Oh wait, I know... the missle that hit the pentagon didn't happen until Sept 12th after Rumsfeld personally ordered everybody in the world to close their eyes for and to count to thirty real slow.




:lol:


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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: trendal]
    #3778637 - 02/14/05 02:34 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

There is NO f*in way that those airplanes did what they did without SOMEONE knowing about it.

As soon as they deviated from their flight plan the military would have been all over their asses.

Its happened before...anytime an airplane is hijacked the public knows about it....while the plane is still in the air.


NO WAY they didnt know the planes were going to do that...

NO F*in WAY!


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Offlinecb9fl
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Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: niteowl]
    #3778646 - 02/14/05 03:47 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

So it's ... not possible?


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It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: niteowl]
    #3778792 - 02/14/05 04:29 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Its happened before...anytime an airplane is hijacked the public knows about it....while the plane is still in the air.

Example? And how long are they in the air before we hear about it? Planes have been hijacked, and rerouted, which means they're probably going to be in the air longer than if they're hijacked and crashed into buildings.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflineTheShroomHermit
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Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: Seuss]
    #3778969 - 02/14/05 05:00 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

>Again, it is fairly obvious that the text was added to the photos after the fact, not super-imposed upon the photos during the fact.
-Of course. In each picture there is a time, and a description. If you assume that these two elements were added to the picture at the time it first recorded them, you'd have to do it under the premise that a videocamera can analyze a picture and add automatically add captions describing whats happening.


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Offlinefaslimy
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Re: Debunking 911 myths [Re: TheShroomHermit]
    #3779113 - 02/14/05 05:24 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Grrr

it doesn't matter what happened, you still don't prove shit. Whoever focuses on these "conspiracies" of the official story is a dumbass or either deliberatly taking everyones attention away from the points that matter.


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