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OfflineX24
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what do you get when you cross....
    #3705053 - 01/31/05 01:07 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

so i have yet to fruit anything. ive been tryin many different teks and methods that i read about. some are still in progress, some have failed. ive been throwing random bits of mycilium and substrate into a bar table/terarium that i picked up awhile back. imagine a mcdonalds playland bubble on its side with a flat piece of glass on top of it. it had a few house plants in it with potting soil. it had many different spots of pretty white mycillium growing. some of my WBS (failures) ended up in there also. so when i noticed the lil green spots i opened it up and started pulling out the bad parts, turned out to be pretty extensive. BUT so did the mycilium. this table was about 50% colonized from just tossing random chunks in there with no enviro controls....
this made me very frustrated actually. i decided to go down the road and steal some horse shit and some of the horses straw. i went thru the shit/straw tek and all that. but that wasnt good enough. i cooked up some WBS and some BRF cakes also. now ive got a table full of this mixture that has part of every tek ive tried so far. is there a reason that i dont read about people using many different ingredients? is this gonna work? i figure if this table can colonize from my scraps lets see what happens when i give it everything.


--------------------
X II IV


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InvisibleADoobie
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Re: what do you get when you cross.... [Re: X24]
    #3705120 - 01/31/05 01:20 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Woah woah woah...

If you had any sort of mold before, it is going to hang around.

First, take EVERYTHING out of there.

Then, I want you to introduce an anti-bacterial agent to your workspace. It should go something like this;

Clorox, meet bucket
Bucket, meet table
Water, meet everything
Alcohol swabs, make love

When you are done, go to the store and buy some additive-free wild bird seed. Put it in a strainer, and let your kitchen faucet give it a shower. Put it in a bowl, and fill with water. A bunch of crap will float to the top (make sure the water level exceeds the WBS by a couple inches). Scoop off the floaters. Cover and let sit for 12-24 hours. Strain, rinse, let drip till it stops dripping
Toss the shit into your jars, wrap some tyvek on top, screw on the lids, PC for 70 mins, inject, incubate, case, harvest.

Ahhh...so much easier said than done.

Don't be discouraged man. You have been very unorthodox in your methods, and rules is rules because the rules make life easier.

Peace and love


--------------------
ADoobie said:
I know what strikes me as odd about this. It is totally unnatural. The whole idea is just totally backwards.

So are historians going to look back at 'The Great Cake Eaters'? Damn. That was a backwards step in the evolutionary process. We left Shroomheads in the dust. Welcome to the new age of Vermheads.

VvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVv

I ONLY STUDY legal, edible mushrooms and mycology. Any mention of any other kind of mushroom is purely fictional, and pictures are ripped from the internet. I do not grow mushrooms!


Edited by ADoobie (01/31/05 01:21 AM)


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InvisibleDamn_Skippy
Fell off theWagon

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Posts: 403
Re: what do you get when you cross.... [Re: ADoobie]
    #3705256 - 01/31/05 01:45 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

ADoobie said:
Clorox, meet bucket
Bucket, meet table
Water, meet everything
Alcohol swabs, make love




hahahahaha....  :grin:


--------------------
~Skipp
"I like cigarettes, Miss Taggart. I like to think of fire held in a man's hand. Fire, a dangerous force, tamed at his fingertips. I often wonder about the hours when a man sits alone, watching the smoke of a cigarette, thinking. I wonder what great things have come alive from such hours. When a man thinks, there is a spot of fire alive in his mind---and it is proper that he should have the burning point of a cigarette as his one expression."


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OfflineX24
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Re: what do you get when you cross.... [Re: ADoobie]
    #3705272 - 01/31/05 01:48 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

thanks adoobie,

that is just about the exact tek i followed yesterday. yesterday is the day after my first WBS attempt. the table experiment is a totally seperate thing. it started out as a place that other experiments went to die. now its become its own multi substraight bulk experiment. ive also got about 30+ brf cakes of different methods goin on. i may be new but im gonna try everything and see what works best for me. multitasking is one of my favorite rushes.


--------------------
X II IV


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InvisibleADoobie
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Re: what do you get when you cross.... [Re: X24]
    #3705390 - 01/31/05 02:16 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Ahh I see.

Well in that case, if all you are asking is;

"If I mix up a bunch of different substrates and throw them together, will they work and be a good fruiting substrate?"

Then the answer, theoretically, is yes. Now that raises some other questions;

Myc has defenses for many different kinds of diseases. Does mushroom mycelium come "fully armed" and ready to fight back at any time? Let me put it this way;

You have a VAST nutrient source, which your mycelium has to adapt to. I would assume that once it has adapted, it has tapped into that nutrient source in a very efficient manner. Now, does this mean that it is taxing to make the mycelium do that? Furthermore, with the increase in disease diversity through added pathways (compost, for example is prone to a whole host of diseases you might never ever get with BRF) are you going to devastate the mycelium through exhaustion in fighting all these paths? In the end, will you just be looking at a bunch of colorful mold?

And to ice the cake, presume things stay healthy...are you looking at suffering yields due to the exhausting fight to get through pinning, and the use of drastic resources?

Hmmm...kind of makes you wonder what THC does to your brain eh? Eh? EH?


--------------------
ADoobie said:
I know what strikes me as odd about this. It is totally unnatural. The whole idea is just totally backwards.

So are historians going to look back at 'The Great Cake Eaters'? Damn. That was a backwards step in the evolutionary process. We left Shroomheads in the dust. Welcome to the new age of Vermheads.

VvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVv

I ONLY STUDY legal, edible mushrooms and mycology. Any mention of any other kind of mushroom is purely fictional, and pictures are ripped from the internet. I do not grow mushrooms!


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InvisibleKahSol
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Registered: 01/27/05
Posts: 418
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Re: what do you get when you cross.... [Re: Damn_Skippy]
    #3705485 - 01/31/05 02:32 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Damn_Skippy said:
"I like cigarettes, Miss Taggart. I like to think of fire held in a man's hand. Fire, a dangerous force, tamed at his fingertips. I often wonder about the hours when a man sits alone, watching the smoke of a cigarette, thinking. I wonder what great things have come alive from such hours. When a man thinks, there is a spot of fire alive in his mind---and it is proper that he should have the burning point of a cigarette as his one expression." 




Nice signature man :thumbup:


--------------------
I was strolling through the park one day...
On a very merry month of May..
When I was taken by surprise!
By a pair of Cube-ee Psi's!
In the merry merry month of May!


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InvisibleATWAR
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Registered: 01/26/03
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Loc: #108768 in line...
Re: what do you get when you cross.... [Re: ADoobie]
    #3705867 - 01/31/05 03:45 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

This thread sounded odd when I first read it, sorta like a compost pile inside. Then I got to this part:



Quote:

ADoobie said:
Myc has defenses for many different kinds of diseases. Does mushroom mycelium come "fully armed" and ready to fight back at any time?




The mycelium does sense and adapt to the surrounding environment/substrate/conditions/stimuli. It will produce the necessary enzymes and other natural digestive "juices" as required. Secondary metabolites usually also have some sort of antibiotic property to them. Some species are less prone to some types of contaminants than others, but this is in general.


Quote:

You have a VAST nutrient source, which your mycelium has to adapt to. I would assume that once it has adapted, it has tapped into that nutrient source in a very efficient manner. Now, does this mean that it is taxing to make the mycelium do that?




This is where I get confused on what you were trying to say. The more complete and complex the substrate is, in theory the better off the mycelium will be. This mycelium will maintain a very healthy growth through such a complex substrate, keeping it very aggressive. It is known that growing mycelium on simple sources of sugar is not good, especially long term. The more complex the substrate or media is, the healthier the growth will be. There may be a slight delay when it encounters a new source of food (if the mixture is not homogeneous), but it will quickly adapt. This is clearly evident when spawning bulk (there is little lag time). You can compare it to someone who doesn't exercise and eats poorly. Eventually they become weak, their immune response starts to diminish, and will eventually be in poor health overall.


Quote:

Furthermore, with the increase in disease diversity through added pathways (compost, for example is prone to a whole host of diseases you might never ever get with BRF) are you going to devastate the mycelium through exhaustion in fighting all these paths?




This is somewhat understandable. It is common knowledge that compost is very diverse in microbial content. But, it is these same microbes that keep other contaminants at bay, and are actually beneficial to the mycelium as additional nutrition. When you say the mycelium will be exhausted, it is actually the other way around. If the organisms in the substrate do not pose an immediate threat to the mycelium (as seen with pasteurization), then they become an advantage, and help stimulate healthy growth. Furthermore, many of the same common pathogens will be seen on BRF as compost (and more). In reality the contaminants will usually win the battle for the substrate in this case (especially with BRF). But in normal situations with the proper precautions, these organisms are "good" for the mycelium provided they are kept in check.


But back to the actual topic of the thread:
Dumping a bunch of contaminated attempts into a big tank...
Doesn't sound like a good idea to me unless only good sources of mycelium were used. I mean, if you only threw the good chunks in, and made sure it stayed uncontaminated, it could be possible. Any uncolonized pieces of high nitrogen substances such as brown rice flour or grain will be immediately attacked by bacteria. But, if you did it right (and were very lucky) it could work. Doubtful, but still plausible...


Quote:

In the end, will you just be looking at a bunch of colorful mold?




This is on par with what hit me initially.
Along with visions of a huge contamination bloom inside the house from this "experiment". No wonder why his attempts are failing...

Edit:
Quote:

Hmmm...kind of makes you wonder what THC does to your brain eh? Eh? EH?




Come on ADoobie... Was that really necessary?
Please tell us what the effects are. It certainly doesn't make a person less intelligent (or more intelligent for that matter).


Edited by ATWAR (01/31/05 04:26 AM)


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InvisibleDamn_Skippy
Fell off theWagon

Registered: 01/25/05
Posts: 403
Re: what do you get when you cross.... [Re: ATWAR]
    #3706626 - 01/31/05 07:47 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

thanks kah sol. Ayn Rand "Atlas Shrugged"


--------------------
~Skipp
"I like cigarettes, Miss Taggart. I like to think of fire held in a man's hand. Fire, a dangerous force, tamed at his fingertips. I often wonder about the hours when a man sits alone, watching the smoke of a cigarette, thinking. I wonder what great things have come alive from such hours. When a man thinks, there is a spot of fire alive in his mind---and it is proper that he should have the burning point of a cigarette as his one expression."


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InvisibleADoobie
AdoobieShroomery
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Registered: 11/25/04
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Re: what do you get when you cross.... [Re: Damn_Skippy]
    #3706893 - 01/31/05 11:08 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Well ATWAR thanks for the thoughts...sounds like I am ready to borrow that micro-biology book from the library. I'm interested!

Ahh a fresh new world out there...

err...in my terrarium :smile:


--------------------
ADoobie said:
I know what strikes me as odd about this. It is totally unnatural. The whole idea is just totally backwards.

So are historians going to look back at 'The Great Cake Eaters'? Damn. That was a backwards step in the evolutionary process. We left Shroomheads in the dust. Welcome to the new age of Vermheads.

VvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvVv

I ONLY STUDY legal, edible mushrooms and mycology. Any mention of any other kind of mushroom is purely fictional, and pictures are ripped from the internet. I do not grow mushrooms!


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OfflineX24
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Registered: 10/01/04
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Re: what do you get when you cross.... [Re: ADoobie]
    #3707586 - 01/31/05 03:12 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

you guys are great! this is the stuff i was lookin for. i feel that i will understand the outcome no matter what happens.
as for the contam bloom.. come now guys. i know enough to only stick the good stuff in there. the WBS was sneeky, it was a sneeker i tell ya. just downright underhanded contamination.
i neglected to get pics of the first table run cuz i didnt think much of it. but heres the table with the new "mulch"...





i blacked the glass on top with black plastic and used a fully colonized brf cake to start it up.

with all these different methods im tryin at the same time i should be able to make a chunk of myc the size of a beach ball soon  :wink:


--------------------
X II IV


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OfflineX24
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Re: what do you get when you cross.... [Re: X24]
    #3743142 - 02/07/05 12:33 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

well,
you guys are right....
i just got back from a trip to the house of blues in los angles, great show. what did i find? you called it. contamination bloom, nasty nasty nasty. im afraid to open it. tommarrow i will take it out to the burn pile and take pix just before i dose it with acetone and flame on.
im gonna try again though. the pasturizing thru oven tek is horseshit, pardon the pun.


--------------------
X II IV


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OfflineIGnosticAbhorI
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Registered: 11/06/04
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Re: what do you get when you cross.... [Re: X24]
    #3743234 - 02/07/05 12:48 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

x24->, did you leech it..If it smells like amonia then that's probably why it didn't work...and did you pasturize at 170F for an hour?.....

I PC personally and leech for 2 days...but i use horse poo when i can....cow's are next hopefully :thumbup:


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Offlinescatmanrav
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Registered: 05/08/04
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Trusted Cultivator
Re: what do you get when you cross.... [Re: X24]
    #3743941 - 02/07/05 03:28 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

X24 said:
the pasturizing thru oven tek is horseshit, pardon the pun.




Just because you attempts failed doesnt make the tek horse shit. You threw a bunch of teks together, half assed following a bunch at once. You need to pick ONE tek and do EXACTLY as it says. No modifications. Many MANY people who do large amounts of bulk do poo in the oven. I think most who have done it a number of times do at this point..


--------------------
"life is like a drop of rain getting closer and closer to falling into a lake, and then when you hit the lake there is no more rain drop, only the lake."

Growing with bags, start to finish (including my new grain and substrate prep)
Anyone looking to start bulk tubs/mono tubs/shotgun hybrids? Good tubs to use..
How I do grain (old still good tips)
Turn your closet into a fruiting chamber
Casing layer colonization and overlay


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