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InvisibleSwami
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God & Sports
    #3697924 - 01/29/05 12:58 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Serena Williams' trophy acceptance speech on winning the Australian Open: "First, I would like to thank God for my victory."

If the most powerful force in the Universe was truly on her side, isn't that a slight edge - akin to cheating? (Kind of like a beauty contestant sleeping with a judge.)

If not, should she receive a full psychiatric evaluation for this delusion?


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The proof is in the pudding.


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: God & Sports [Re: Swami]
    #3697950 - 01/29/05 01:05 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Perhaps she was just thanking God for putting her on this earth, and thereby allowing her to develope and train, just as he did the same to her opponent?

Doubtful she actually meant God's long arm stretched into the tournament and hit the ball past her opponent or whatnot.

If she thanked her mother and father in her victory speech (as God as often viewed as, the creator of life,) then would she be insinuating that their powers helped her win by cheating, or that they gave her life and inspired her to become a great tennis player? Probably the latter.


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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InvisibleCalifornia
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Re: God & Sports [Re: Swami]
    #3697957 - 01/29/05 01:06 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

That "God" dude sure is popular with those sports types, actors also. Do actors and athletes know something?(extremely rhetorical)


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Offlineskystone
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Re: God & Sports [Re: Swami]
    #3697978 - 01/29/05 01:11 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

I can't believe this, just leave the woman alone.
Why do you force truth so much? Sometimes it just doesn't matter.
What matters is that she is succesfull.


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"..and suddenly it began to rain"


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: God & Sports [Re: Swami]
    #3697993 - 01/29/05 01:14 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Maybe she should be cursing God for helping her to win something as trivial as a tennis match, while leaving millions of starving kids overseas to die.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: God & Sports [Re: Ravus]
    #3697997 - 01/29/05 01:15 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Perhaps she was just thanking God for putting her on this earth, and thereby allowing her to develope and train, just as he did the same to her opponent?

If that is what she meant (which I doubt, as there was a recent article on her in a Christian magazine), then is that not unnecessary to state? Do athletes publicly thank other live-giving, yet neutral elements such as water, oxygen and sunshine?

If that is what she meant, then why not thank publicly than God for her losses as well - both personal and sports related. "I would like to take this opportunity to thank God for the murder of my sister..." or "I would like to take this opportunity to thank God for my complete collapse, stomach pull and humiliating defeat."


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Offlineexclusive58
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Re: God & Sports [Re: Swami]
    #3698006 - 01/29/05 01:17 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

I've often heard that profesional sportsmen and sportswomen have some kind of mystical experiences during the time whent they are deeply concentrated on the game they are playing.

For example, i heard of a soccer player saying at one point when he was in possession of the ball, all of a sudden time slowed down (kinda like in the matrix) and he had a total lucid perception of what was going on on the field.

I'll try to find some more of these experiences to post later.

But i think this would relate to the fact that through hard work, motivation and will, one may be able to develop one's spiritual potentials and have a metaphysical experience which makes them think that God must be responsible for what happened, when really none only than themselves are responsible.

So does Serena need a psychiatric evaluation? Well i'd say the only help she needs, for all i know, is that there is no separation between god and herself. She's probably deeply rooted in duality mode, and if you consider a psychiatric to be some sort of spiritual teacher, then yes, an evaluation would be good.


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: God & Sports [Re: skystone]
    #3698016 - 01/29/05 01:20 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

I can't believe this...
You could if you had faith!

Why do you force truth so much?
Please explain what I am forcing.

Sometimes it just doesn't matter.
Which is why you took the time to respond?  :tongue:


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: God & Sports [Re: exclusive58]
    #3698034 - 01/29/05 01:23 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

I have had those moments of which you speak, yet there is nothing religious about not being mentally distracted or having one-pointed awareness. During or afterwards, there is no hint of the cosmic or divine about it. It is just a well-tuned and disciplined mind working nearly perfectly for a short time.


--------------------



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Offlineskystone
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Re: God & Sports [Re: Swami]
    #3698050 - 01/29/05 01:27 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Swami..

What are you forcing?
You are always expecting people to spend their lives questioning their beliefs and testing them to see if they are true.
If the woman feels confortable believing in her god, let her, as long as she doesn't hurt anyone in the name of her belief.
If kids want to believe in santaclaus, let them, if they want to believe in fairtales, let them.


--------------------
"..and suddenly it began to rain"


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InvisiblePaou
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Re: God & Sports [Re: skystone]
    #3698060 - 01/29/05 01:30 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

What about the people back in the 1800's who were comfortable believing that black people were subhuman, and therefore that slavery was justified? Beliefs SHOULD be questioned. That is how we make progress.


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: God & Sports [Re: skystone]
    #3698074 - 01/29/05 01:32 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

And if your sister wants to drink cyanide-laced Kool-aid...

How am I stopping anyone? What is your great fear about discussing this topic? Don't like it, then don't participate! How can it get any simpler? Did I force you to read this and reply? (Sorry, I forgot to turn off my psy-waves - my bad!)


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The proof is in the pudding.


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Offlineexclusive58
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Re: God & Sports [Re: Swami]
    #3698089 - 01/29/05 01:36 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

I have had those moments of which you speak, yet there is nothing religious about not being mentally distracted or having one-pointed awareness

Well hey, i guess different people make different associations huh?

Maybe you don't feel that having a metaphysical experience is religious, yet religion IS metaphysical.

It is easier to understand where Serena is coming from when you assume that she is closed-minded enough to make a relation between the idea of God that she made up in her head, and her experience.


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: God & Sports [Re: exclusive58]
    #3698150 - 01/29/05 01:50 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

The moments I experienced were those of acutely sharpened clarity or no-fear. This is not beyond the physical, not can I understand how this even remotely relates to unity, love, understanding, life-after-death or whatever else that is mystical that you are trying to point to.

Being in-the-moment is complete. It does not lead to a "conclusion" nor require a belief system of any sort.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: God & Sports [Re: exclusive58]
    #3698154 - 01/29/05 01:52 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

For example, i heard of a soccer player saying at one point when he was in possession of the ball, all of a sudden time slowed down (kinda like in the matrix) and he had a total lucid perception of what was going on on the field.

Think it's a coincidence that what you've described is one of the effects of adrenaline?


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: God & Sports [Re: Phluck]
    #3698184 - 01/29/05 01:59 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

I am not sure about that, but I do know that many unseasoned athletes in long events lose because of excessive adrenaline release which is quite exhausting.

Many are surprised that sometimes tennis players play their best near the end of a grueling match. This is because they no longer have to slowly dole out their energy and keep a reserve. In a similar way, I was nearly exhausted when running in a half-marathon, yet ran the fastest ever in my life during the last half-mile.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: God & Sports [Re: Swami]
    #3698220 - 01/29/05 02:08 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

I remember once when I was about 11, I was playing football or something at school, and the fastest kid in the school accidentally kicked me in the nuts and took off with the ball. It hurt like hell, but something in my head snapped, and time seemed to slow to a crawl, I effortlessly ran after him and took him down, and then some other kids pulled me off of him.

Maybe it wasn't adrenaline, but there's something that can happen that results in time slowing down, and increased strength and speed, and it can be triggered by blind illogical rage, which I wouldn't exactly consider spiritual. The guy who kicked me in the nuts definitely did it by accident, and he was a good friend of mine, and continued to be afterwards.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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InvisibleSkorpivoMusterion
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Re: God & Sports [Re: Swami]
    #3698345 - 01/29/05 02:39 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

I think superstition is very common in athletes.

As knowledge and emotional maturity is the antidote to transcending such primitive methods of thought - superstitions, etc., it seems that most athletes are usually not the type of individuals who invest substantial energy into erudition and academics. Instead, their bodies and skills become enhanced through rigorous training and frequent visits at Bally's Fitness gyms.

The absence of factual knowledge and objective information often leads the untrained mind to form their own 'models of reality', and often with unstable, insubstantial foundations due to lack of consistency, factual information and so on.
This is most commonly demonstrated in children. But the common difference between children and adults is that children are still in their very open-minded state of being, and are naturally sponges of information with little to no resistance of truths that they encounter in life.
In adults there is the higher tendency to shield their egos and build onto their existing framework of beliefs and so forth.

God forbid they discover that their entire framework is all meaningless, valueless and all worthless and has zero relationship to the divine Ground.

:smile:


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Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: God & Sports [Re: Swami]
    #3698495 - 01/29/05 03:17 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

If that is what she meant (which I doubt, as there was a recent article on her in a Christian magazine), then is that not unnecessary to state? Do athletes publicly thank other live-giving, yet neutral elements such as water, oxygen and sunshine?

If that is what she meant, then why not thank publicly than God for her losses as well - both personal and sports related. "I would like to take this opportunity to thank God for the murder of my sister..." or "I would like to take this opportunity to thank God for my complete collapse, stomach pull and humiliating defeat."




Do you have a copy of what she said in Christian magazine? From her quote, I don't see how you can just jump to the conclusion that she was thanking God for Divine Interference or help in her game, rather than her just thanking God for his inspiration and power that she feels from him and that without she felt her victory would not be possible. Does she feel encouragement and power from water, oxygen and sunshine? Her body does, but if she's a typical God-believer, she believes God created all of it, and is the source of everything. Thanking God is thanking everything he gave her, her inspiration, her victory, the water she drinks and the air she breathes.

As for the latter question, that is all human nature. It is obvious why humans do not thank God or a higher power for their losses, because though they often believe it's God's will, they did not want it to happen. She is no Buddha or Christ, after all, just a simple tennis player thanking God after achieving a victory.


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: God & Sports [Re: Ravus]
    #3698580 - 01/29/05 03:44 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

It is obvious why humans do not thank God or a higher power for their losses, because though they often believe it's God's will, they did not want it to happen.

And you do not see that as indicative of a lack of faith? Believers do not give thanks to God for their losses as they do not truly believe what they state they believe in.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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