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Offlinelonestar2004
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No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor
    #3682454 - 01/26/05 09:50 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

http://www.christianpost.com/article/ame...rosecutor/1.htm

i guess the family of four accidentally slipped and cut their throats.( and the teenage girl stabbed the cross she had tattooed on her wrist)

nothing to see here, just move along folks. Chief Moose is on the case.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: lonestar2004]
    #3682582 - 01/26/05 10:31 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

I like how you equate "religious hatred not to blame", with "they weren't murdered".

Way to spin.


From the article:
"The possibility of a religious grudge, which has strained relations between Muslims and Christians in the area, still is being investigated, said Hudson County Prosecutor Edward DeFazio, as reported by the Associated Press."

It just means that they don't have proof of the motive... there's evidence, but not proof.

Do you understand the difference?


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


Edited by Phluck (01/26/05 10:33 AM)


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: Phluck]
    #3682601 - 01/26/05 10:36 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

i understand a white wash when i see one.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: lonestar2004]
    #3682611 - 01/26/05 10:38 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

You obviously don't understand the difference between good police work and jumping to conclusions.

More from the article:
"
While authorities are investigating the possibility that the Coptic Christian family was slain by a Muslim angered over postings that Armanious wrote in an Internet chat room, AP said investigators also continue to look at robbery as a possible motive. Detectives are reviewing the family's finances to see if there are any obvious motives."

How is there anything wrong with that?

Do you honestly think it's a good idea for police to jump to one conclusion and stick with it, without investigating other possibilities to ensure that they haven't missed any motives?


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: Phluck]
    #3682643 - 01/26/05 10:48 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

good police work. ha

i am no detective but how many robbers tie people up slit their throats (including two children) and leave Jewelery in the house.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: Phluck]
    #3682659 - 01/26/05 10:51 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Do you honestly think it's a good idea for police to jump to one conclusion and stick with it, without investigating other possibilities to ensure that they haven't missed any motives?




Obviously it was a hate crime done against Christians by Muslims. Only Muslims murder Christians. It is a complete waste of time for the police to consider anything other than the obvious. Think about it... when was the last time a Christian family was murdered by anybody other than a Muslim?

(Sarcasm for the sarcastic impaired...)


--------------------
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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: lonestar2004]
    #3682663 - 01/26/05 10:52 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

my point is somebody is keeping this story quite.

lets just say a family of Muslims in new jersey had there throats slit after receiving threats by some christian skin heads. the fucking media would be all over it.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: lonestar2004]
    #3682664 - 01/26/05 10:52 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Some do. But that's why they're investigating the crime to its fullest.

Did you even read the article you posted, or did you just get outraged by the headline and then come on here to complain about it?

Another quote from the same damn article:

"However, DeFazio added that the grisly slayings of the family of four did not appear to stem from a simple robbery?which authorities had stressed last week as being a possible motive.

Certainly, based on the viciousness of the attacks, we think there's more than taking the money that was in the apartment," DeFazio said."


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: lonestar2004]
    #3682677 - 01/26/05 10:56 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

my point is somebody is keeping this story quite.

Bullshit, it's getting international press attention.

It's also just plain common sense to try to keep people behaving moderately. The last thing we need is people thinking that this makes it okay to attack muslims.

Another quote: "As mourners took the city?s streets to St. George & St. Shenouda Coptic Orthodox Church on Monday, grief and rage erupted as many blamed Muslims for the killings."

Is it not common sense to try and minimize this kind of reaction?


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflineChiefThunderbong
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: Seuss]
    #3682681 - 01/26/05 10:56 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Those devil worshiping heathans! Lets bomb another country!


--------------------
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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: Seuss]
    #3682682 - 01/26/05 10:57 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Seuss said:
Quote:

Do you honestly think it's a good idea for police to jump to one conclusion and stick with it, without investigating other possibilities to ensure that they haven't missed any motives?




Obviously it was a hate crime done against Christians by Muslims. Only Muslims murder Christians. It is a complete waste of time for the police to consider anything other than the obvious. Think about it... when was the last time a Christian family was murdered by anybody other than a Muslim?

(Sarcasm for the sarcastic impaired...)




didn't you know hate crimes can not be commited against white people or Christians.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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InvisibleLe_Canard
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: Phluck]
    #3682689 - 01/26/05 10:58 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Phluck said:

Do you honestly think it's a good idea for police to jump to one conclusion and stick with it, without investigating other possibilities to ensure that they haven't missed any motives?




Yes, it could have possibly been some random crazy. To go off half-cocked in an investigation would only lead to mistakes, not to mention inflame an already volitile situation


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: Phluck]
    #3682695 - 01/26/05 11:00 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

MSM reported it a few day ago..... family murdered police looking into Robbery as motive. and that's all i have seen about it.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Offlineblaze2
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: ChiefThunderbong]
    #3682697 - 01/26/05 11:00 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

im with Phluck on this one, i mean jumping to conclusions is the reason we are in Iraq now...

blaze2


--------------------
"Religion without science is blind, Science without religion is lame." Albert Einstein

"peace is not maintained through force it is acheived through intelligence." Albert Einstein

"Those who desire to give up Freedom in order to gain Security, will not have, nor do they deserve, either one."
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OfflinePhluck
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: lonestar2004]
    #3682701 - 01/26/05 11:01 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

didn't you know hate crimes can not be commited against white people or Christians.

No shit. Didn't you know sometimes they aren't?


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: Phluck]
    #3682732 - 01/26/05 11:10 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Try to imagine running a police force.

You need to do a variety of things to keep the peace, and one of the most important ones is conveying to impression to the public that you are handling cases fairly.

It has turned out, many, many times in history, that sometimes even when the evidence seems to obviously point in one direction, there are little clues that are missed.

Sometimes when someone has enemies that seem too obvious, others know that they can get away with something, and be overlooked. There are all kinds of possible things that may have happened, and they want to make sure that they get everything before making arrests and going ahead with the prosecution. If they've done a good job of investigating all the possibilities, there's a much better chance they'll be able to raise a good case against the actual perpetrator, and convict them.

Even if it is the most obvious suspect, and they jump to that conclusion right away, ignoring everything else, and convicting that person, they've made themselves look like reactionaries. Their public image will decline, and they'll lose the trust of more of the population.

It's extremely important to be fair, and make sure everyone knows they're being fair.

Unless you just want someone to call the investigation "unfair" so you can bitch and moan about how the liberals whine even when it's obvious they're wrong.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: Phluck]
    #3682747 - 01/26/05 11:13 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Also, it's not uncommon for police to not disclose all their evidence to the public.

How the hell would you know if there's a significant clue indicating the crime had other motives that you didn't know about?


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: lonestar2004]
    #3682792 - 01/26/05 11:28 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

MSM reported it a few day ago..... family murdered police looking into Robbery as motive. and that's all i have seen about it.

I first heard about it on a Canadian news program. They seemed to emphasize the idea that it was motivated by the guy's anti-muslim posts on the internet.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflinePhred
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: Phluck]
    #3682807 - 01/26/05 11:30 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Well said, Phluck.

Sometimes in a murder investigation things look just a little too pat. Cops have been raked over the coals in the past for focusing exclusively on the most obvious subjects while ignoring other plausible avenues of approach. It's not as if they can't run down other leads while digging further into their main surmise, after all.

The thing is -- as Phluck points out -- here we have a situation practically custom-made for a bit of misdirection. How hard would it be for a business rival (for example) to arrange a hit and make it appear to be religiously motivated? Or even for your slightly brighter than average gang of thieves to attempt to lay a false trail?



pinky


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: Phred]
    #3683418 - 01/26/05 02:02 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

pinksharkmark said:
Well said, Phluck.

Sometimes in a murder investigation things look just a little too pat. Cops have been raked over the coals in the past for focusing exclusively on the most obvious subjects while ignoring other plausible avenues of approach. It's not as if they can't run down other leads while digging further into their main surmise, after all.

The thing is -- as Phluck points out -- here we have a situation practically custom-made for a bit of misdirection. How hard would it be for a business rival (for example) to arrange a hit and make it appear to be religiously motivated? Or even for your slightly brighter than average gang of thieves to attempt to lay a false trail?



pinky


8 year old little girl throat slit ==business rival.

8 year old little girl throat slit ===false lead.

no, i see Hate.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: lonestar2004]
    #3683498 - 01/26/05 02:18 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

I see you didn't understand that post whatsoever.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: Phluck]
    #3683535 - 01/26/05 02:25 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

yes i understand it and i agree. but America needs to wake the fuck up.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: lonestar2004]
    #3683649 - 01/26/05 02:41 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Wake the fuck up and do what? Stop investigating crimes properly? Stop collecting enough evidence to conduct trials fairly?

I think you just don't have the balls to admit when you've completely lost an argument.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: Phluck]
    #3683888 - 01/26/05 03:30 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

this is not the first or last argument i have lost in PAL.

let me check the news to see if the MSM is investigating this story.

lets see.

CNN is talking about how McDonald's is making people fat and killing them.

FOX news headline = SUV KILLS 10 PEOPLE.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: lonestar2004]
    #3684067 - 01/26/05 04:15 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

There are lots of murders that don't get the same attention as other murders.

Are you somehow implying that the US media is largely ignoring muslim violence within the US based on the coverage of a single story?


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: lonestar2004]
    #3684857 - 01/26/05 06:48 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Hey, I personally am 99.9 % certain that this was done by Muslim whackos pissed off at this guy's disrespect for the practices of violent Islamists. It is the most probable explanation by a long shot. It's exactly the kind of thing those scum delight in carrying out.

I merely point out that the police and prosecutor do not have the luxury of resting on the same assumptions I do. They are required by law to dig into all the possibilities to a reasonable degree. This case is a death penalty case if ever there was one, and there have been innocent men executed more than once in the US because the law enforcement types snagged the most convenient suspect and ignored any signs pointing elsewhere. That won't happen in this case.

I can guarantee that when this case comes to trial the defense will immediately try to show that the police concentrated on the Muslim defendants to the exclusion of all else. Hell, every defense attorney worth his salt tries that on. Well, in this case that ploy will get nowhere.



pinky


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: Phred]
    #3687631 - 01/27/05 07:01 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

> no, i see Hate

Hate does not have to be religiously motivated.


--------------------
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OfflinePhred
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: Phred]
    #3872969 - 03/05/05 01:09 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Well, well, well.

http://www.nypost.com/news/regionalnews/41881.htm

Looks very much as if this was a robbery gone wrong after all, not a religiously-motivated hate crime. From the information in the above article, it would seem it wasn't even deliberately staged to appear like a hate crime.

Of course, the alleged assailants have yet to be tried, much less convicted, but at this point it appears there is little doubt the cops have the right guys.




Phred


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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: Phred]
    #3872979 - 03/05/05 01:13 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Whaddaya know...

Good thing people didn't go on a crazy witch hunt before they had all the information... even though I'm sure some people would have LOVED that.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: Phred]
    #3872980 - 03/05/05 01:13 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

eating CROW.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Invisibledownforpot
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: lonestar2004]
    #3873746 - 03/05/05 04:58 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

There is no way that the prosecutor would say that a Muslim did it. Think of the shit that would happen once word got out that a Muslim intentionally killed a Christian. There would be dozens maybe even hundreds of attacks on Muslims the next day.


--------------------



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Then shot in his head
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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: No proof religious hatred to blame for New Jersey slayings says Prosecutor [Re: downforpot]
    #3877189 - 03/06/05 12:37 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Yep, must be a coverup.


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