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InvisiblePsilostylin
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opium extraction?
    #3675939 - 01/25/05 03:21 AM (12 years, 29 days ago)

hello all,

i was wondering if anyone here had either a link or advice on extracting a smokable form of opium from dried poppies. and please don't mention smoking pod putty, i've tried smoking putty and hate it. i was thinking more along the lines of a simple yet efficent lab procedure. anyone?

normally i would just lance some pods, but i might be moving soon and the backyard at this place sucks. plus there's a lot of college people around those parts and i'm sure a few could spot out my patch. fucking rippers.

thanks in advance
peace and love :mushroom2:


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Offlinemrjim202000
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: Psilostylin]
    #3676722 - 01/25/05 10:34 AM (12 years, 29 days ago)

the general agreement seems to be no. i have asked around alot and all people tell me is know ...too many plant sugars get released then you steep the pods. My only question would be if you could ferment the sugers into alcohol and then cook that off then ???? who knows???

sorry if that does not help but that is what people kept telling me
make peace with tea and enjoy


--------------------
dont tell lies, there will be less to remember


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Offlineesin
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: Psilostylin]
    #3676851 - 01/25/05 11:00 AM (12 years, 29 days ago)

You cannot extract opium, but you can definitely extract morphine and the other alkaloids that can be smoked like heroin.

You will easily find methods to do this in the web.

Just be damn careful with that stuff, man.


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InvisiblePsilostylin
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: esin]
    #3679408 - 01/25/05 09:09 PM (12 years, 29 days ago)

thanks esin. you wouldn't happen to have a link on hand for a morphine extract, would you? the morphine extract sounds good but heroin isn't something i want to mess around with. though it's just a super potent form of morphine, using it still makes me uneasy. about how many dried pods would be necessary for a good morphine extraction? i was thinking of ordering a case of 150....but that's only if i move. if i stay at my OG house, i'm sticking to latex. thanks again holmes.


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Offlinetheocean06
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: Psilostylin]
    #3679440 - 01/25/05 09:18 PM (12 years, 29 days ago)

You would probably have to make the pod puddy first, then do your extraction.  I don't know, I like the old pods = tea, latex = :spliff:

I just have a question, why is it that morphine and opium are fine by you, but heroin scares you?


--------------------


The story of life is quicker then the blink of an eye, the story of love is hello, goodbye.            - Hendrix :bow:


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Offlineesin
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: Psilostylin]
    #3679798 - 01/25/05 10:32 PM (12 years, 29 days ago)

Only have this at hand, but i'm sure you can find more info easily.

Quote:

The process of extracting morphine from opium involves dissolving opium in hot water, adding lime to precipitate the non-morphine alkaloids and then adding ammonium chloride to precipitate the morphine from the solution. An empty oil drum and some cooking pots are all that is needed.

The following is a step-by-step description of morphine extraction in a typical Southeast Asian laboratory:

An empty 55-gallon oil drum is placed on bricks about a foot above the ground and a fire is built under the drum. Thirty gallons of water are added to the drum and brought to a boil. Ten to fifteen kilograms of raw opium are added to the boiling water.

With stirring, the raw opium eventually dissolves in the boiling water, while soil, leaves, twigs, and other non-soluble materials float in the solution. Most of these materials are scooped out of the clear brown 'liquid opium' solution.

Slaked lime (calcium hydroxide), or more often a readily available chemical fertilizer with a high content of lime, is added to the solution. The lime converts the water insoluble morphine into the water soluble calcium morphenate. The other opium alkaloids do not react with the lime to form soluble calcium salts. Codeine is slightly water soluble and gets carried over with the calcium morphenate in the liquid. For the most part, the other alkaloids become part of the residual sediment 'sludge' that comes to rest on the bottom of the oil drum.

As the solution cools, and after the insolubles precipitate out, the morphine solution is scooped from the drum and poured through a filter of some kind. Burlap rice sacks are often used as filters. They are later squeezed in a press to remove most of the solution from the wet sacks. The solution is then poured into large cooking pots and re-heated, but not boiled.

Ammonium chloride is added to the heated calcium morphenate solution to adjust the alkalinity to a pH of 8 to 9, and the solution is then allowed to cool. Within one or two hours, the morphine base and the unextracted codeine base precipitate out of the solution and settle to the bottom of the cooking pot.

The solution is then poured off through cloth filters. Any solid morphine base chunks in the solution will remain on the cloth. The morphine base is removed from both the cooking pot and from the filter cloths, wrapped and squeezed in cloth, and then dried in the sun. When dry, the crude morphine base is a coffee-colored powder.

This 'crude' morphine base, commonly known by the Chinese term p'i-tzu throughout Southeast Asia, may be further purified by dissolving it in hydrochloric acid, adding activated charcoal, re-heating and re-filtering. The solution is filtered several more times, and the morphine (morphine hydrochloride) is then dried in the sun.

Morphine hydrochloride (still tainted with codeine hydrochloride) is usually formed into small brick-sized blocks in a press and wrapped in paper or cloth. The most common block size is 2 inches by 4 inches by 5 inches weighing about 1.3 kilograms (3 lbs). The bricks are then dried for transport to heroin processing laboratories.




(from: http://opioids.com/jh/index.html )

This is for opium but will probably work just as well with poppy straw.

Standart a/b would work well to extract all alkaloids instead of only morphine.


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InvisiblePsilostylin
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: esin]
    #3680184 - 01/25/05 11:37 PM (12 years, 29 days ago)

very interesting post and link. thanks esin, that was a good read.

so you think one could yield sucess by simply following a DMT style extraction procedure? using sodium hyroxide and muriatic acid instead of calcium hydroxide and ammonium chloride? it seems like substituting for these chemicals wouldn't cause any negative issues. any other links or advice by any chance?


"I just have a question, why is it that morphine and opium are fine by you, but heroin scares you?"

good question. it just does i guess. i know they are all equally addictive, i just don't like the idea of using it. sounds silly i'm sure, but this is just how i feel.


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Offlineesin
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: Psilostylin]
    #3682231 - 01/26/05 10:07 AM (12 years, 28 days ago)

Yes.

I'd do it more like mescaline as to end up with the hydrocloride salts.

I'd prolly do it like this:

-Make poppy tea.
-Optional: Defat
-Basify with NaOH or ammonia until precipitation ceases, or ph10-12 or so.
-Extract with NPS
-Mix NPS with very dilute HCl
-Evaporate aqueous phase.
-Be very careful not to OD :tongue:

Personally i'd stick to the tea, though.


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InvisiblePsilostylin
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: esin]
    #3682257 - 01/26/05 10:21 AM (12 years, 28 days ago)

awesome.

thanks bro, you've been a big help.

5 shrooms for you :smile:


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Offlineesin
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: theocean06]
    #3682264 - 01/26/05 10:23 AM (12 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

I just have a question, why is it that morphine and opium are fine by you, but heroin scares you?




I can see why.

First of all, i'd never use street heroin.
And i would never make my own heroin.

But i'd smoke opium if it was grown by myself or someone i trust.

IMO it's very different to smoke opium which has a ritual, history and tradition than to smoke some random dirty brown powder which only tradition is junkie-ness.

Both are enslaving, but everyday i see H slaves and i don't like what i see and i don't need to meet their master.
I don't think i would smoke purified morphine either anyways...


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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: esin]
    #3682994 - 01/26/05 02:21 PM (12 years, 28 days ago)

I spoke to a gnome who told me poppy tea was the easiest way to use poppies. He also said it make him puke for hours. Decent buzz but the nausea ruined it. He just boiled ground up poppy pods and stem, filtered the brown tea and drank it. An expresso maker is a fast way to do it.


--------------------
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Offlinetheocean06
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: esin]
    #3683396 - 01/26/05 03:58 PM (12 years, 28 days ago)

I wasn't talking about street heroin, I was talking about heroin in general.  Even if you made the heroin yourself, you still think opium is less dangerous?  Everyday you see heroin slaves...opium is just as big of a beast as heroin, you just won't see many opium addicts due to it not being that available (I guess it would depend on where you live).  It really doesn't matter that is has a history, it is just as dangerous as H.  I see a lot of this, "well, it has history and rituals behind it, so it must be better/safer/etc." - the only reason it has a history is because it was discovered before anyone even thought of heroin, it doesn't mean its any less dangerous.

I can understand if you don?t like it because of the method of ingesting, the high, something like that.  But to just say that opium is safer because it has a history...

I'm not trying to start a fight, I just don't share the same point of view :flowers:


Psilostylin: Good luck with the extraction, and be safe and careful about it :thumbup: :heart:


--------------------


The story of life is quicker then the blink of an eye, the story of love is hello, goodbye.            - Hendrix :bow:


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Offlineesin
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: theocean06]
    #3684085 - 01/26/05 06:20 PM (12 years, 28 days ago)

I understand that opium is as big a beast as heroin, theocean06.

If you read my post again you'll see i never said it was safer, i just said it has a background to it that kinda makes me and other people curious.
Knowing that if i use with responsibility and moderation i shall have no problems with it, i may one day give it a shot.

Heroin has zit. Its only history is junkie-ness.
I don't even want to smell it. There is nothing about it that makes me curious, zero.

I'm not saying the one is better than the other, i'm just saying i don't want to try the other.
Objectively the difference is small. However subjectively the difference is big, for me.


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Offlinetheocean06
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: esin]
    #3684124 - 01/26/05 06:30 PM (12 years, 28 days ago)

I agree with you, opium is just much more interesting.  Whenever someone mentions opium, I have to read.  That is not the case with heroin.  Though, the reason I don't want to try it isn't because that it has no history, just that the IVing (wrong word?)/needle and snorting things isn't very appealing to me.  Also, street heroin... :lipsrsealed: (I really doubt if I had opium that I would try and turn it into heroin)

I may try it somewhere down the road, who knows...


--------------------


The story of life is quicker then the blink of an eye, the story of love is hello, goodbye.            - Hendrix :bow:


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Offlineesin
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: theocean06]
    #3684247 - 01/26/05 07:07 PM (12 years, 28 days ago)

I don't want to try it to protect my own arse.

Basically i'd pass on trying opiates of any kind. They scare me. Even my experiences with kratom kinda scared me. More than "the evil itself" methamphetamine. But there's this thing about opium, mostly its huge role in recent history that makes me curious and interested about it.

So i just made an exception for it, and that's basically it :smile:

EDIT: For the record [not trying to turn you on], you can just eat heroin :wink: It also works by mouth. And it can be very effectively smoked as well.


Edited by esin (01/26/05 07:11 PM)


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OfflineNachoPoop
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: esin]
    #3696449 - 01/29/05 03:54 AM (12 years, 25 days ago)

BTW... I hear that heroin tastes just like chicken.


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OfflinePsilocybeingzz
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: NachoPoop]
    #3696494 - 01/29/05 04:05 AM (12 years, 25 days ago)

"Heroin has zit. Its only history is junkie-ness."

Untrue.

"I don't even want to smell it. There is nothing about it that makes me curious, zero."

Well its more addictive, and you would be better off trying poppies, but dont have any illusions about what you are doing, sure the poppies contain more then Morphine(40 alkaloids last I checked) but its mostly Morphine, morphine is why poppies feel so good, and the second Heroin enters your brain.......its turned back into, you guessed it....... :laugh:...Morphine.

Heroin, as a chemical, is SAFER then Morphine :wink: (I am NOT joking)

But its the lifestyle of a heroin addict that leads to trouble, not to mention the fact that its easier to consume, like Cannabis, there is no waiting, smoke it, and your high.

Have I ever done heroin?? NO, do I EVER plan on using?? NO.

But keep it real man, Heroin comes from poppies,and all the opiates are closely related.

The only difference between your high, and a "junkies" high, is that he is out on the street, and will need to fix again in a couple of hours, your poppy tea will last well over a day(well a nights sleep, and then some)

Dont get carried away, even pods can sneek up on you.
Play Safe.


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Offlineesin
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: Psilocybeingzz]
    #3697512 - 01/29/05 10:37 AM (12 years, 25 days ago)

Quote:

"Heroin has zit. Its only history is junkie-ness."

Untrue.




Perhaps. I don't know anything other than it was originally sold in cough syrup and also as a 'non-addictive' alternative to morphine...


Quote:

Well its more addictive, and you would be better off trying poppies, but dont have any illusions about what you are doing, sure the poppies contain more then Morphine(40 alkaloids last I checked) but its mostly Morphine, morphine is why poppies feel so good, and the second Heroin enters your brain.......its turned back into, you guessed it....... ...Morphine.




Quote:

But its the lifestyle of a heroin addict that leads to trouble, not to mention the fact that its easier to consume, like Cannabis, there is no waiting, smoke it, and your high.




Quote:

Dont get carried away, even pods can sneek up on you.





Nothing of this is new to me. I think i expressed it well enough in my posts.
Understanding this is as easy as spending 5 minutes reading poppies.org.

Quote:

Heroin, as a chemical, is SAFER then Morphine  (I am NOT joking)




Didn't know this, care to explain?

Quote:

Have I ever done heroin?? NO, do I EVER plan on using?? NO.





Why than?
Perhaps you think like i do after all?

:sun:


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Offlinegnrm23
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: Stonehenge]
    #3697830 - 01/29/05 12:33 PM (12 years, 25 days ago)

if you examine the relative solubilities of morphine (& the other poppy alkaloids) in various alcohols (say, in a merck index, or CRC handbook, or lange's chemistry, etc.) it would seem that a nice dry methanolic extraction (maybe tweaking the pH could enhance solubility enough to justify the water; or maybe do a dry MeOH extract first on ground pods, & then a re-extraction of the marc with a pH 9 (or a Ph 5) wash & see what sort stuff "got left behind" with the alcohol extr...)

dry ethanol or dry isopropanol could substitute, but methanol dissolves more of the "goodies", according to the merck...
& oughta leave the sugars & such behind...
as for other "crud", well - consult the classic literature on opiate chemistry (prolly in yr local college library, unless somebody snipped out the useful articles, grrrrr...)


--------------------
old enough to know better
not old enough to care


Edited by gnrm23 (01/29/05 12:40 PM)


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Offlineswinetown
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Re: opium extraction? [Re: Psilocybeingzz]
    #8701378 - 07/30/08 11:40 AM (8 years, 6 months ago)

opium is just as addictive as heroin, only pure heroin is 10 times stronger than pure opium.
i smoke heroin and I'm not on the street to beg, steal or borrow. chemicals that are used to make heroin will catch up on all users later on in life, its not all about the stereotypical junkie lifestyle.


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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics >> The Ethnobotanical Garden

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