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 incubaby_421
half naked andfull witted
Registered: 08/14/04
Posts: 2,629
Loc: the center of the univers...
Last seen: 5 years, 9 months
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 Re: Truth or Trash>  [Re: Clark]
#3675637 - 01/24/05 11:36 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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well homie i could sit here for days disproving the bible, but i dont really care that much, you believe in god, that is awesome, im glad that you have found something that you can believe in, that is alot more than most can manage, but my opinion is that organized religion is a power and control and money scam, but that is my opinion.
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"yet the more i dig, the more i consume, the more i unfold... the less protected i feel.
i am the spit on the hair of the son of an electron, swimming around the nucleus of a cell inside the sperm of a killer bee, and my purpose is as nebulous as why weve been bestowed with the capacity to give a shit" Brandon Boyd
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incubaby_421
half naked andfull witted
Registered: 08/14/04
Posts: 2,629
Loc: the center of the univers...
Last seen: 5 years, 9 months
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and after all of this sensi im begining to wonder, are you beingining to wonder? is your min headed out of bounds and you are rying to reassure your faith, are you extremely bored?
what are you searching for?
not here, at the forum,
in life
what is it that you are looking for or trying to prove, disprove, or reenforce through all of this?
riddle me that.
i found myself a long time ago, it seems you havent come as far to me, i just want you to think about all of this.
have you ever used hallucinogens.
please tell me your not some radical who came here to try and disprove or convert any of your sheppards lost sheep.
im just curious.
love and light
incubaby
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"yet the more i dig, the more i consume, the more i unfold... the less protected i feel.
i am the spit on the hair of the son of an electron, swimming around the nucleus of a cell inside the sperm of a killer bee, and my purpose is as nebulous as why weve been bestowed with the capacity to give a shit" Brandon Boyd
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blaze2
The Witness
Registered: 12/20/02
Posts: 1,883
Loc: San Antonio, TX
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
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Quote:
Sensismoker said:
-This mainly pertains to the Atheists out there-
Characteristic--------God------SuperUniverse
Transcendence---------yes------yes
Eternal---------------yes------yes
Creation of Universe-designed--random
Intelligence----------high-----low
What we see in the table is a comparison of the two possible types of creators. Both creators must possess certain characteristics in common, such as being eternal and being transcendent to this universe. However, the naturalistic creator must be "stupid" and must have created our exquisitely-designed universe through some sort of random process. For some reason, the atheist chooses to believe that the universe arose randomly by the action of a stupid creator, instead of seeing the obvious - that a well-designed universe would most likely come into being through the actions of an intelligent designer.
You make a huge leap of faith there. By definition a leap of faith is something with no proof or basis in fact. So your argument it already flawed.
Also you are saying that Atheist believe in a "stupid" creator. They do not. They believe that the world is simply what it is. Nothing more theres nothing going on behind the scenes what you see is what you get.
Just because science cant explain everything in this universe, and it probrobly never will, does not automaticly mean that there has to be a God or higherpower involved in its creation and formation. There is no logic in that assumption.
Quote:
Let me give you an example. I show you a computer and ask you to make your best choice as to how it came into being:
1.Designed and put together by intelligent human beings.
2.Random computer parts were put into a large box and the parts soldered randomly by spraying molten lead into the box as it was rotated. This process was continued many times until the computer happened to be produced.
-Well, its your choice. Have you checked your tent lately?
Yet again this is not a logical argument. just because we are intelligent, and are able to make complicated things, does not mean that there is a God or higher intelligence that made our complicated universe.
Also i think you need to understand something, when the universe first came into being after the big bang, it was not a complicated place, it was very simple. There were basicly 2 things Vacuum and Hydrogen. Gravity drew the hyrdrogen together and the first stars formed. They were massive, and under the pressure and heat inside of them the hydrogen, was fused into new heavier elements. Then they went supernova and spread the heavier elements out in the nearly formed universe. I could go on giving you a step by step of the universe's history, but needless to say after that more stars formed and they were drawn together into galaxies and here we are today.
Why does a god need to be involved for that to happen? There is nothing there that is magical its just simple physics really. Its certainly not "random" as you so elequently put it.
There is no reason to believe that this world and universe were created and shaped by a god. I forget who said it but someone said that the simplest answer to a question is usually the right one. There are two ways of viewing this universe, science doesnt lie even in a universe created by god so lets compare. I dont know your opinion on Evolution. But its a fact so im going to use it here. If you want to debate that you will lose. As for how life started on Earth well there is no proof either way so it will be left out of this argument.
A) Natural forces shape the universe. single celled organisms evolve into increasingly complex organisms, eventually winding up with humans.
B) Natural forces shape the universe. single celled organisms evolve into increasingly complex organisms, eventually winding up with humans. God is in control of all these forces and uses them for his "Plan".
Which one is simpler?
You dont need a god to believe in things my friend. You dont need a God to believe in the computer your typing on, or the food you eat. You dont need a God to believe that you exist, you get reminded everytime you stub your toe. You can be happy, sad, in love, or enraged, and There doesnt have to be a God involved. The point of religion is to live a "moral" life. Well you can live a moral life without religion, so if you can do these things yourself why do you need a God?
I said it before and ill say it again. All religions are focused on death, in most cases so much so that the people who devote themselves to them never really get to live. What is the point of life if not to live? As far as i know you only get one go through. Make it count. Dont waste it on things that may or may not be true. And if there is something else after death deal with it when you get there. Live for the now not the future is all im saying.
peace
blaze2
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"Religion without science is blind, Science without religion is lame." Albert Einstein
"peace is not maintained through force it is acheived through intelligence." Albert Einstein
"Those who desire to give up Freedom in order to gain Security, will not have, nor do they deserve, either one."
Thomas Jefferson
"To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors, is sinful and tyrannical." --Thomas Jefferson
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Phluck
Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 04/10/99
Posts: 11,394
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 5 months, 22 days
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Re: Truth or Trash> [Re: blaze2]
#3677132 - 01/25/05 10:00 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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I wonder is Sensismoker is going to come back to this one...
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"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us
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incubaby_421
half naked andfull witted
Registered: 08/14/04
Posts: 2,629
Loc: the center of the univers...
Last seen: 5 years, 9 months
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Re: Truth or Trash> [Re: Phluck]
#3677303 - 01/25/05 10:56 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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i hope we didnt push him away....
or....
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"yet the more i dig, the more i consume, the more i unfold... the less protected i feel.
i am the spit on the hair of the son of an electron, swimming around the nucleus of a cell inside the sperm of a killer bee, and my purpose is as nebulous as why weve been bestowed with the capacity to give a shit" Brandon Boyd
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Phluck
Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 04/10/99
Posts: 11,394
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 5 months, 22 days
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BLOW HIS MIND!
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"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us
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incubaby_421
half naked andfull witted
Registered: 08/14/04
Posts: 2,629
Loc: the center of the univers...
Last seen: 5 years, 9 months
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Re: Truth or Trash> [Re: Phluck]
#3677898 - 01/25/05 01:25 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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or maybe forcefully crack it open with a blunt object to new perspectives, probably quite frightenening to the stereotypical jesus freak.
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"yet the more i dig, the more i consume, the more i unfold... the less protected i feel.
i am the spit on the hair of the son of an electron, swimming around the nucleus of a cell inside the sperm of a killer bee, and my purpose is as nebulous as why weve been bestowed with the capacity to give a shit" Brandon Boyd
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 Swami
Eggshell Walker
Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
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Of course this kind of faith comes much easier when you've been exposed to it that long(I'm 18).
Brainwashing comes from long, repetitive exposure, not faith.
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The proof is in the pudding.
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incubaby_421
half naked andfull witted
Registered: 08/14/04
Posts: 2,629
Loc: the center of the univers...
Last seen: 5 years, 9 months
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Re: Truth or Trash> [Re: Swami]
#3678149 - 01/25/05 02:19 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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where has our homie vanished to i wonder???
and i have been exposed to religion since birth as every human is, ive gone to church, that is how i know it isnt for me.
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"yet the more i dig, the more i consume, the more i unfold... the less protected i feel.
i am the spit on the hair of the son of an electron, swimming around the nucleus of a cell inside the sperm of a killer bee, and my purpose is as nebulous as why weve been bestowed with the capacity to give a shit" Brandon Boyd
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incubaby_421
half naked andfull witted
Registered: 08/14/04
Posts: 2,629
Loc: the center of the univers...
Last seen: 5 years, 9 months
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HAHA!
TRASH!
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"yet the more i dig, the more i consume, the more i unfold... the less protected i feel.
i am the spit on the hair of the son of an electron, swimming around the nucleus of a cell inside the sperm of a killer bee, and my purpose is as nebulous as why weve been bestowed with the capacity to give a shit" Brandon Boyd
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Phluck
Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 04/10/99
Posts: 11,394
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 5 months, 22 days
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God loses!
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"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us
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skystone
stop the motion
Registered: 11/08/04
Posts: 465
Loc: state,country,etc.
Last seen: 19 years, 2 months
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Re: Truth or Trash> [Re: Phluck]
#3678708 - 01/25/05 04:09 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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I'm retty sure that if Jesus was alive today, he'd tell us not to go to church
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"..and suddenly it began to rain"
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flowstone
blustering
Registered: 01/25/05
Posts: 6,485
Loc: precious
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Re: Truth or Trash> [Re: skystone]
#3678802 - 01/25/05 04:54 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
skystone said:
I'm retty sure that if Jesus was alive today, he'd tell us not to go to church
For sure.. I don't think Jesus ever intended to Spawn the Catholic religion, and then later the many branches of Protestant churches...
A lot of stuff would be different if a lot of people were still alive, but why speculate? We gotta take what we have and work from there.
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these long agonizing months without you...have been long and agonizing..
"War Doesn't Decide Who's Right... It Only Decides Who's Left."
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skystone
stop the motion
Registered: 11/08/04
Posts: 465
Loc: state,country,etc.
Last seen: 19 years, 2 months
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Re: Truth or Trash> [Re: flowstone]
#3678813 - 01/25/05 04:57 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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Oh.. another 'stone  welcome brother
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"..and suddenly it began to rain"
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flowstone
blustering
Registered: 01/25/05
Posts: 6,485
Loc: precious
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Re: Truth or Trash> [Re: skystone]
#3678822 - 01/25/05 04:59 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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we should all get stoned  
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these long agonizing months without you...have been long and agonizing..
"War Doesn't Decide Who's Right... It Only Decides Who's Left."
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shroomydan
exshroomerite
Registered: 07/04/04
Posts: 4,126
Loc: In the woods
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Re: Truth or Trash> [Re: blaze2]
#3679670 - 01/25/05 08:11 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Why does a god need to be involved for that to happen? There is nothing there that is magical its just simple physics really. Its certainly not "random" as you so elequently put it.
The physics itself seems magical to me. If the relative strengths of the four forces were changed even slightly, then the universe would never have developed beyond a giant cloud of hydrogen.
What is your explanation for this perfectly ballanced ratio which allows for the universe to develope in complexity until it produces a rational being, capable of contemplating the cause of his rationality?
There are some of us who see purpose, there are others who do not. Too bad for them. They will remain chained at the bottom of Plato's cave, there by their own choice. "They have eyes but they do not see; they have ears but they do not hear."
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skystone
stop the motion
Registered: 11/08/04
Posts: 465
Loc: state,country,etc.
Last seen: 19 years, 2 months
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Re: Truth or Trash> [Re: shroomydan]
#3679692 - 01/25/05 08:15 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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Support from my side...
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"..and suddenly it began to rain"
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TrippinNinjaBuddha
ShroominSamurai
Registered: 04/11/04
Posts: 279
Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
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Re: Truth or Trash> [Re: skystone]
#3680200 - 01/25/05 09:41 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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heh, did he run home crying or what?
84,350,594). If GOD IS LOVE, she would choke me when I cum.
sorry I couldn't resist. =D
Insert other sex/prostitute/ironic joke above.
Think about what would happen today if some guy appeared claiming to be the son of God. He might do some interesting things, and probably 12 guys would really believe him. He'd be named a blasphemer and probably be crucified(at least in Texas) and life would go on. Someone writes a sketchy book about him and X-thousand years later, BAM! fucking organized religion. What the fuck?
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Jumped in a river, what did I see?
Black eyed angels swimming with me
Moon full of stars and astral cars, all the figures I used to see
All my lovers were there with me
All my past and all my futures
We went to heaven in a little rowboat
There was nothing to fear and nothing to doubt
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TheShroomHermit
Divine Hermit of the Everything
Registered: 02/19/02
Posts: 7,575
Loc: border of Canada and Mexi...
Last seen: 9 months, 29 days
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Re: Truth or Trash> [Re: vampirism]
#3680207 - 01/25/05 09:42 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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>"bing bang theory and evolution" are not beliefs.
-You are correct. Science's theories are, in my opinion, superior to religious beliefs. Theories develop from evidence, and are tested. They move through heavy criticism before being accepted. A belief, on the other hand, is like a theory... but it's accepted as fact without any proof and often little support. When it does not stand up to criticism the believer keeps insisting it's true anyways. It's no truth at all.
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flowstone
blustering
Registered: 01/25/05
Posts: 6,485
Loc: precious
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I thought theories were named that because they can't be prov-en in a scientific setting, but rather, are just good guesses about what possibly most likely is happening
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these long agonizing months without you...have been long and agonizing..
"War Doesn't Decide Who's Right... It Only Decides Who's Left."
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