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Amazon Shop for: ½ Pint Jars, Brown Rice Flour, HEPA Filter, Impulse Sealer, Laminar Flow Hood, Mycobags, Pressure Cooker, Rye Grain, Vermiculite, Wild Bird Seed

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Offlinetregar
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BJ's panaeolus recipe as spawn to advanced tek
    #3657619 - 01/21/05 09:58 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

I have been researching panaeolus for 2 months now and was wondering how well 2 of BJ's colonized half-pint jars would work as spawn (pretty much would be a dung to dung spawn)to spawn the more advanced tek used below:
http://www.shroomery.org/index/par/7983

Foaf plans to use 2 of BJ's half pint jars to spawn a mycobag full of sterilized dung/straw/vermiculite/water mixture in front of an
advanced hepa filter. How well would BJ's recipe used as spawn compare to a standard millet/wild bird seed grain used as spawn?

The reason I ask is because foaf is interested in getting into a more
rewarding and advanced bulk type culivation tek using pans. Bob Roberts over at the nook was a college friend of BJ's and BJ taught Bob Roberts the recipe. Zoom also used the recipe with success.

This is BJ's modified dung containing PF tek substrate:

"Mix for 10-12 half pints:

5 cups vermiculite
3 cups manure
10 tablespoons (0.625 cups) brown rice flour or wild bird seed flour
1.5-1.75 cups of water

Fill your canning jars, sterilize for an hour in a pressure cooker and inoculate via the PF tek method. Once your substrate is fully colonized, crumble and case with 50/50+"

I remember reading that the only problem that Anno or Una had with the mushmush tek was that when the millet grain spawn (about 300mL or 0.63 pint) was poured into the mycobag full of dung/straw/verm/water, that most of the grain would fall through the mixture towards the bottom of the bag, so maybe not enough mycelial take off points were created near the top/middle of the bag.

Foaf plans to scrape two of the wispy colonized half pints (or should more be used?) using a sterilized fork into the mycobag full of the sterilized substrate listed below (tek's recipe shown below)in front of a hepa of course, to experiment with bulk substrates.
Steps will be followed exactly as the mushmush tek with results posted of course.

The tek above uses the following recipe in the autoclavable mycobags:

4 liters dung (17 cups, or 1 gallon)
3 liters verm (12.7 cups, or 3.17 quart)
500 grams straw (1.10 LB)
3 to 4 liters water as needed to get the substrate the proper consistency so that when a fistfull is squeezed, only a drop or two falls out

I understand that pan mycelium is very prone to contamination, and also difficult to fruit, requires lots of fresh air exchange. I have read just about every post there is on pans here and elsewhere and just looking to see what thoughts would be on using BJ's recipe as spawn instead of millet as spawn. Foaf has lots of experience with pf tek, and is ready for advanced pan, and that is the only way foaf plans wants to go at this time.

I like the experience from pans, and this is my report from a long ago trip:

3 of my friends and I had a run in with panaeolus about 10 years ago (yes, I know, a very long time ago) and it was the most incredible visual and auditory experience I have ever had on organics. We had one of the best times of our lives that hasn't been repeated since, and I reflect on that night often. I would love just to have a slight taste of that same experience. On the way to the club (yes, we were driving (incredibly stupid) and the mushrooms hit too fast) the road turned into a roller coaster of colors, wavy flat looking cartoon like aliens appeared out in the farm pasteurs to the sides of us, the crystal shop on the way to the club formed faces in all of the crystals through the window, and at the club playing house music (lit up with red and green laser spirographic patterns and intellabeams) the music sounded heavenly and out of this world. The punk rock chic collecting money at the door appeared spooky and freaky, we couldn't wait to enter inside. Cigarettes produced tracers. The tripped out videos of nuclear fallout and lab scientist experiments playing in the chill room grabbed our attention with intensity. The trip had an alien theme or presence to it and when we all finally came down, we were sad that it ended. The colors were electric and fascinating. I learned things on this trip that forever changed my life course, and was taught things that I never could have learned without the special pan mushrooms. I had taken LSD low dose, middle dose, and even high dose about 20 times in the past and even though I experienced remarkable visions on acid, there was something very special and spiritual about the pans that tapped into the mind to answer the question in my head, and help guide me on the path to follow. I am still in awe at what I was taught that night and for being led to the shroomery and nook to continue my learning.


Edited by tregar (01/21/05 10:42 AM)


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InvisibleEonTan
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Re: BJ's panaeolus recipe as spawn to advanced tek [Re: tregar]
    #3657954 - 01/21/05 12:13 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

It will work fine.

The added steps of spawning bulk just increases risk of contamination. Since you have a flow hood, I don't see much problem with using the jars to spawn some bulk substrate.


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Invisibleralphster44
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Re: BJ's panaeolus recipe as spawn to advanced tek [Re: tregar]
    #3658047 - 01/21/05 12:56 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

works good...but, you can just spawn your jars to zoodoo or dung...



These were with birdseed...don't forget the manure:)


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Offlinetregar
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Re: BJ's panaeolus recipe as spawn to advanced tek [Re: ralphster44]
    #3658463 - 01/21/05 03:02 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Thanks for the replies EonTan and ralphster44, ralphster I have read
your tek and I like it, using the pennington's brand finch seed in the half pint jars with the vermiculite layer. I noticed that you spawned this to manure only (no straw). I have read over and over that straw creates problems with contamination if not careful.
As an experiment, foaf will spawn manure only like you mention...I assume we are using only pasteurized manure in your tek, not sterile. Should the manure be mixed with an equal amount of vermiculite? Did you find that this pasteurized manure method did not contaminate as apposed to say....a sterile straw/dung/verm fully colonized substrate (once layed out to rest in a bin that perhaps became contaminated in the last stages somehow)?

Here also is the simple pan tek by eatyualive:

1. get spores from ralphster
2. inject pf jars
3. presoak straw overnight in water, i use tapwater!
4. now drain straw, then mix with some black angus composted cow dung
5. the mix is roughly 50% dung, 50% straw, i sometimes add a little verm
6. now just add water until it is at a good moisture content, say one drip when squeezed between hands, u can also refer to the pan tek on www.mushmush.nl
7. mix well using plastic gloves, then stick into a filter patch bag from www.mushroompeople.com
8. seal with an impulse sealer and then pc for two hours
9. now, prep a fork by boilin it for about 10 mins. then dry off with a clean paper towel.
10. now use a laminar flow hood and spawn the pf jar into the dung/straw/verm using the fork by scraping it into pieces. fishy taught me this technique so give him credit.
11. seal bag with impulse sealer, then mix up bag and make sure mycelia touches everywhere.
12. once colonized, prepare a tray with aluminum foil in the bottom. this is for cleaning purposes after tray is spent. dump bag in and spread (using plastic gloves) then apply a sterilized 50/50+ casing with nondolomitic lime and allow to colonize like any other casing.
13. cold shock overnight and then birth once the tray has fully colonized.
14. notes: it should take, no more than 3 days for the pans to colonize a 1/2" casing layer.

additonal note I read is that Zoom found a colonizing time of 4 weeks for each of the BJ jars and an extra week to leave it in there, for a total of 5 weeks.

more notes: It is seen by viewing Una's tek that he is using a double tub...also eatyualive mentions that a double tub should get you great results...with a simple bin you need to air out at least 7 times a day, or just use the double tub tek.

another note: A cheese grater (sterilized) may work better than a fork to get many more finer pieces of mycelium in the bag to spread around even quicker.

Nice pic ralphster! I saw that pic in your tek also...did those picture perfect specimens result from your tek?


Edited by tregar (01/21/05 03:28 PM)


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Offlinetregar
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Re: BJ's panaeolus recipe as spawn to advanced tek [Re: tregar]
    #3662277 - 01/22/05 12:09 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Ok, answered my own question, I see in your tek that you stuck with using dung/compost combinations, and never used straw. Looks like you pasteurized it also, and didn't run into any contamination problems that I could tell of. Foaf will go a new direction, using rye grain as substrate, then spawn this to mushmush tek, exactly as they did. Ralph, in your tek, you mention that with wbs, potency is fabulous, and that rye is also a great substrate...very good potency too. Thanks for the help, your tek pointed me in the right directions.


Edited by tregar (01/22/05 02:24 PM)


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Offlineillahee
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Re: BJ's panaeolus recipe as spawn to advanced tek [Re: tregar]
    #3670286 - 01/24/05 01:28 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

could you use the poo/brf pf tek recipe for regual cubensis if they planned on being used for casing in the same manner? could they benefit from the nutes that the poo has to offer?  how about poo and straw.  (I'm cheap and don't want to buy autoclavical bags. :frown:


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Invisibleralphster44
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Re: BJ's panaeolus recipe as spawn to advanced tek [Re: tregar]
    #3672020 - 01/24/05 01:28 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Good Tek :smile:


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Offlinetregar
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Re: BJ's panaeolus recipe as spawn to advanced tek [Re: ralphster44]
    #3679388 - 01/25/05 09:05 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Yes, the poo and straw will definately benefit the cubensis and once BJ's jars (contain only brown rice/or wbs flour and dung/vermiculite/water, no straw)are grown out, just crumble and case with 50/50+

What is special on dung, is partially unprocessed lignin in the cell walls of the many grasses and feeds ruminent animals eat. The fungi use extracellular digestion to break the lignin down into simpler sugar molecules and free things such as cellulose and hemicellulose.

In addition, dung is rich in other nutrients and is good at retaining moisture, and should help either with or without straw to increase potency of your fruits.


Ralphster, this is a question that has been nagging at me--why have so many of your posts been "deleted by administrator" in old posts?


Edited by tregar (01/25/05 11:55 PM)


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Offlineillahee
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Re: BJ's panaeolus recipe as spawn to advanced tek [Re: tregar]
    #3679966 - 01/25/05 11:05 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

nice, nice. I've got some aged alpaca poop outside in a can and I think i'm gonna mix up some brf/verm/poo jars and inoculate sometime soon.


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Amazon Shop for: ½ Pint Jars, Brown Rice Flour, HEPA Filter, Impulse Sealer, Laminar Flow Hood, Mycobags, Pressure Cooker, Rye Grain, Vermiculite, Wild Bird Seed

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