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Offlinesnoopaloop53
No BetterFriend. NoWorse Friend.

Registered: 01/21/05
Posts: 311
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this
    #3656746 - 01/21/05 01:58 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Washington Times
January 19, 2005
Pg. 1

Army Affirms Its Ban On Women In Combat

Questions raised whether policy will be enforced

By Rowan Scarborough, The Washington Times

Army Secretary Francis Harvey has told Congress that the service will keep the Pentagon's ban against female soldiers in ground combat, including no assignments to units that routinely embed with war fighters.

The Army had been reviewing the 1994 ban to see whether changes should be made to coincide with a sweeping transformation plan for combat brigades. Some officers at the Pentagon advocate lifting the ban on embedding, or collocating, sex-integrated support units with infantry, armor and other combat units.

Elaine Donnelly, who heads a pro-military group, said yesterday that it is still not clear whether the Army is telling Congress one thing, while in actual operations, it plans to mix integrated Forward Support Companies (FSC) within combat units.

"It's disappointing that official information from the Army seems so difficult to come by," Mrs. Donnelly said. "If they say the FSC will be all-male, and historically they have been, that would be true compliance with law and policy. However, if there are female soldiers being trained for the FSCs, that would be something else."

Mr. Harvey sent a memo to four senior members of Congress on Thursday, a day after The Washington Times reported that the president had said in an interview that he opposes any move to change the ground combat prohibition. The president was emphatic: "No women in combat."

The Army, for months, has been reviewing the role of female soldiers. Confidential briefing papers obtained by The Times showed that senior officers advocate lifting the so-called "collocation rule." This would have allowed women to serve in support units, such as Forward Support Companies, that normally embed with combat units such as armor or infantry and are in fact combat troops.

Mr. Harvey last week notified the chairmen and ranking members of the House and Senate Armed Services committees that he was retaining the ban. The Stars and Stripes newspaper first reported on the memos.

Mrs. Donnelly, who heads the Center for Military Readiness and has been working to expose the internal Army debate, expressed suspicion and asked why the Army is reluctant to explain its decision in full.

She questions whether the Army intends merely to assign co-ed Forward Support Companies outside a combat unit's organizational chart, even though they will have to embed with those units to do the resupply mission.

The Army in November gave a private briefing to House military staffers that showed FSCs attached to brigade support battalions, a move the Army did not consider to be collocation. Mrs. Donnelly disagrees.

"The issue is not where they put them on paper, but the reality," Mrs. Donnelly said. "If they put gender-integrated FSCs with the brigade support battalion, then they would be violating the collocation policy."

Gen. Peter Schoomaker, the Army chief of staff, is spearheading a major transformation of Army brigades by turning them into "units of action" that train and deploy as one. To fully achieve these rapid deployment brigades, some inside the Pentagon have advocated changing the collocation rule so that mixed-sex FSCs can be embedded with them.

The Times has reported on two sets of briefing papers circulated at the highest levels of Army headquarters. One states that the Army does not have enough male soldiers to keep the FSCs all-male and should therefore consider the change.

A second Nov. 29 briefing from the director of the Army's Human Resources Policy Directorate states: "The way ahead: rewrite/eliminate the Army collocation policy."

With the Harvey memo, that idea appears, for now, to be dead.

Reporters and editors of The Times asked Mr. Bush in a Jan. 11 Oval Office interview whether he supported internal Army proposals to change the land-combat rules.

"There's no change of policy as far as I'm concerned," Mr. Bush said. "No women in combat. Having said that, let me explain, we've got to make sure we define combat properly: We've got women flying choppers and women flying fighters, which I'm perfectly content with."

The Clinton administration in 1994 lifted the ban on women in combat aircraft and ships, but left in place the prohibition on direct land combat and collocation.

Advocates of lifting the collocation cite a need for deploy-as-one brigades, and note that in Iraq there are no clear lines of battle. Islamist terrorists attack support units about as often as they strike all-male units that are clearly combat units.
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some of you probably won't like this, but oh well that's the way it is and the way it needs to stay


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InvisibleAbstractHarmonix
Love is like a train...
Female

Registered: 07/09/04
Posts: 3,509
Loc: The Sea
Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: snoopaloop53]
    #3656763 - 01/21/05 02:02 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Snoopaloop?  Bwahaha if i didnt know any better i would think you were a puppet....Hmmmmm.


Bwahahaha :rotfl:


--------------------
A plethora of music aspirations control my temptations of future revelations beyond "now". The percussion, and the heart beat of my love and devotion. The rhythm goes beyond, prying into the third eye, releasing the creativity held so far inside. The melodicies, through the out of tune pianos and broken classical guitars...there lies a beauty. A beauty as prevelent as the fire inside. To release these energies is pure ecstacy, to deveop these gifts is sacred. The vocality, so pure as can be, shying away from herself, lies within me. For the underlying serenitity, this is what I live for. I plea for harmony, and nothing more. Music equals love. Creation of love leads to the procreativity of the World, and it's spirals and puddles prevailing.


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Offlinesnoopaloop53
No BetterFriend. NoWorse Friend.

Registered: 01/21/05
Posts: 311
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: AbstractHarmonix]
    #3656857 - 01/21/05 02:23 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

nope not a puppet, but i think i've seen you say the same thing before. I'm just a new member kind of, been away for a while, now i'm posting again.


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Offlineunbeliever
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Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: snoopaloop53]
    #3656871 - 01/21/05 02:25 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

I stay stick the women alongside the men on the front line. Let the press start plastering photos of our country's young women broken and dead from the mess we've made over there. Maybe it will help wake people up and realize that having a chicken-hawk president has consequences.


--------------------
Happiness is a warm gun...


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InvisibleAbstractHarmonix
Love is like a train...
Female

Registered: 07/09/04
Posts: 3,509
Loc: The Sea
Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: snoopaloop53]
    #3656892 - 01/21/05 02:30 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Nah, only you I think is a puppet due to the Snoopaloop. there is only one snoopaloop, and if its the Snoop Im thinkin of, there arent room for the both of you!


--------------------
A plethora of music aspirations control my temptations of future revelations beyond "now". The percussion, and the heart beat of my love and devotion. The rhythm goes beyond, prying into the third eye, releasing the creativity held so far inside. The melodicies, through the out of tune pianos and broken classical guitars...there lies a beauty. A beauty as prevelent as the fire inside. To release these energies is pure ecstacy, to deveop these gifts is sacred. The vocality, so pure as can be, shying away from herself, lies within me. For the underlying serenitity, this is what I live for. I plea for harmony, and nothing more. Music equals love. Creation of love leads to the procreativity of the World, and it's spirals and puddles prevailing.


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Offlinesnoopaloop53
No BetterFriend. NoWorse Friend.

Registered: 01/21/05
Posts: 311
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: unbeliever]
    #3656906 - 01/21/05 02:34 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

don't ever say "Let the press start plastering photos of our country's young women broken and dead from the mess we've made over there." that is so disrespectful of those who have sacrificed. thier loss should not be used for any kind of political agenda as you want it to be. what they do is real, when they die or get sent back maimed they have to live with it, while you just look at it as another political arguement. the president has nothing directly to do with what is going on over there and that what has been started will continue for years and decades to come.


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Offlineunbeliever
Yo Daddy!
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Registered: 05/22/04
Posts: 5,158
Loc: Gallifrey
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Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: snoopaloop53]
    #3656913 - 01/21/05 02:35 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

snoopaloop53 said:
don't ever say "Let the press start plastering photos of our country's young women broken and dead from the mess we've made over there." that is so disrespectful of those who have sacrificed. thier loss should not be used for any kind of political agenda as you want it to be. what they do is real, when they die or get sent back maimed they have to live with it, while you just look at it as another political arguement. the president has nothing directly to do with what is going on over there and that what has been started will continue for years and decades to come.




Wow.


--------------------
Happiness is a warm gun...


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Offlinesnoopaloop53
No BetterFriend. NoWorse Friend.

Registered: 01/21/05
Posts: 311
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: unbeliever]
    #3656916 - 01/21/05 02:36 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

elaborate on "wow"


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InvisibleAbstractHarmonix
Love is like a train...
Female

Registered: 07/09/04
Posts: 3,509
Loc: The Sea
Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: unbeliever]
    #3656920 - 01/21/05 02:37 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

unbeliever said:
Quote:

snoopaloop53 said:
don't ever say "Let the press start plastering photos of our country's young women broken and dead from the mess we've made over there." that is so disrespectful of those who have sacrificed. thier loss should not be used for any kind of political agenda as you want it to be. what they do is real, when they die or get sent back maimed they have to live with it, while you just look at it as another political arguement. the president has nothing directly to do with what is going on over there and that what has been started will continue for years and decades to come.




Wow.




--------------------
A plethora of music aspirations control my temptations of future revelations beyond "now". The percussion, and the heart beat of my love and devotion. The rhythm goes beyond, prying into the third eye, releasing the creativity held so far inside. The melodicies, through the out of tune pianos and broken classical guitars...there lies a beauty. A beauty as prevelent as the fire inside. To release these energies is pure ecstacy, to deveop these gifts is sacred. The vocality, so pure as can be, shying away from herself, lies within me. For the underlying serenitity, this is what I live for. I plea for harmony, and nothing more. Music equals love. Creation of love leads to the procreativity of the World, and it's spirals and puddles prevailing.


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InvisibleAbstractHarmonix
Love is like a train...
Female

Registered: 07/09/04
Posts: 3,509
Loc: The Sea
Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: snoopaloop53]
    #3656927 - 01/21/05 02:39 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

The president is DIRECTLY related to "what is goin on over there" what is goin on "over there" is fuckin money laundering, embesselment, governmental cheating policies, and oil, everyone is dying for oil due to contracts signed years ago involving daddy. thats wow.


--------------------
A plethora of music aspirations control my temptations of future revelations beyond "now". The percussion, and the heart beat of my love and devotion. The rhythm goes beyond, prying into the third eye, releasing the creativity held so far inside. The melodicies, through the out of tune pianos and broken classical guitars...there lies a beauty. A beauty as prevelent as the fire inside. To release these energies is pure ecstacy, to deveop these gifts is sacred. The vocality, so pure as can be, shying away from herself, lies within me. For the underlying serenitity, this is what I live for. I plea for harmony, and nothing more. Music equals love. Creation of love leads to the procreativity of the World, and it's spirals and puddles prevailing.


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Offlinesnoopaloop53
No BetterFriend. NoWorse Friend.

Registered: 01/21/05
Posts: 311
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: AbstractHarmonix]
    #3656928 - 01/21/05 02:40 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

do you have something to contribute XOIIAresIIOX?


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Offlineunbeliever
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Registered: 05/22/04
Posts: 5,158
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Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: snoopaloop53]
    #3656939 - 01/21/05 02:43 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

snoopaloop53 said:
elaborate on "wow"




Okay: You're so far out of touch that you're not even worth responding to with intelligent discourse. Assuming you truly believe your statement I bolded earlier. Comprende?


--------------------
Happiness is a warm gun...


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InvisibleAbstractHarmonix
Love is like a train...
Female

Registered: 07/09/04
Posts: 3,509
Loc: The Sea
Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: snoopaloop53]
    #3656943 - 01/21/05 02:45 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

That was my contribution. i dont like copy and paste posters anyways.


--------------------
A plethora of music aspirations control my temptations of future revelations beyond "now". The percussion, and the heart beat of my love and devotion. The rhythm goes beyond, prying into the third eye, releasing the creativity held so far inside. The melodicies, through the out of tune pianos and broken classical guitars...there lies a beauty. A beauty as prevelent as the fire inside. To release these energies is pure ecstacy, to deveop these gifts is sacred. The vocality, so pure as can be, shying away from herself, lies within me. For the underlying serenitity, this is what I live for. I plea for harmony, and nothing more. Music equals love. Creation of love leads to the procreativity of the World, and it's spirals and puddles prevailing.


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Offlinesnoopaloop53
No BetterFriend. NoWorse Friend.

Registered: 01/21/05
Posts: 311
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: unbeliever]
    #3656948 - 01/21/05 02:47 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Well I do believe my earlier statement that President Bush doesn't directly have anything to do with what is happening in Iraq. I can't believe that you would want to make the casualties of war into poltical pawns, these men have sacrificed more than you can imagine to preserve our way of life and all you want to do is politicize their lives and actions.


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Offlineunbeliever
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Registered: 05/22/04
Posts: 5,158
Loc: Gallifrey
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Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: snoopaloop53]
    #3656953 - 01/21/05 02:49 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

snoopaloop53 said:
Well I do believe my earlier statement that President Bush doesn't directly have anything to do with what is happening in Iraq. I can't believe that you would want to make the casualties of war into poltical pawns, these men have sacrificed more than you can imagine to preserve our way of life and all you want to do is politicize their lives and actions.




You make an awful lot of assumptions about people and things you know nothing about. It does not impress nor sway.


--------------------
Happiness is a warm gun...


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InvisibleAbstractHarmonix
Love is like a train...
Female

Registered: 07/09/04
Posts: 3,509
Loc: The Sea
Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: snoopaloop53]
    #3656955 - 01/21/05 02:50 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

snoopaloop53 said:
Well I do believe my earlier statement that President Bush doesn't directly have anything to do with what is happening in Iraq. I can't believe that you would want to make the casualties of war into poltical pawns, these men have sacrificed more than you can imagine to preserve our way of life and all you want to do is politicize their lives and actions.




you my friend are what I refer to as "the tool".
caution, brainwash brainwash!


--------------------
A plethora of music aspirations control my temptations of future revelations beyond "now". The percussion, and the heart beat of my love and devotion. The rhythm goes beyond, prying into the third eye, releasing the creativity held so far inside. The melodicies, through the out of tune pianos and broken classical guitars...there lies a beauty. A beauty as prevelent as the fire inside. To release these energies is pure ecstacy, to deveop these gifts is sacred. The vocality, so pure as can be, shying away from herself, lies within me. For the underlying serenitity, this is what I live for. I plea for harmony, and nothing more. Music equals love. Creation of love leads to the procreativity of the World, and it's spirals and puddles prevailing.


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Offlinesnoopaloop53
No BetterFriend. NoWorse Friend.

Registered: 01/21/05
Posts: 311
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: AbstractHarmonix]
    #3656975 - 01/21/05 02:58 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

I did one of your posts refering to oil and i agree with you 100% on that. Just think about how many petroleum products you rely on each day from gas in you car to electricity to plastics. But when you say things like plastering pictures of the dead and broken it makes their sacrifice seem trivial.


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InvisibleAbstractHarmonix
Love is like a train...
Female

Registered: 07/09/04
Posts: 3,509
Loc: The Sea
Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: snoopaloop53]
    #3657039 - 01/21/05 03:23 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

There wasnt a draft. It was their choice. Some of the adventurous, some gun hungry, some "blood" hungry, and brainwashed, some money hungry, everyones gettin sumthin outta it, and we all live life for our own entertainment...so live on. shine on.


--------------------
A plethora of music aspirations control my temptations of future revelations beyond "now". The percussion, and the heart beat of my love and devotion. The rhythm goes beyond, prying into the third eye, releasing the creativity held so far inside. The melodicies, through the out of tune pianos and broken classical guitars...there lies a beauty. A beauty as prevelent as the fire inside. To release these energies is pure ecstacy, to deveop these gifts is sacred. The vocality, so pure as can be, shying away from herself, lies within me. For the underlying serenitity, this is what I live for. I plea for harmony, and nothing more. Music equals love. Creation of love leads to the procreativity of the World, and it's spirals and puddles prevailing.


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: snoopaloop53]
    #3657265 - 01/21/05 04:58 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Is it wrong for women to kill, but ok for men to kill?
Or is it wrong to send women to die, but ok to send men to die?

Why?

I'm not sure I understand.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: some of y'all probably won't be able to handle this [Re: Phluck]
    #3657274 - 01/21/05 05:04 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)


Is it wrong for women to kill, but ok for men to kill?

Whether a woman or a man kills, it is the same thing.


Or is it wrong to send women to die, but ok to send men to die?

The reason that women are not traditionally on the front lines is because it is surmised that their presence will not help the military effort. They are physically weaker than men. They might be a distraction for the male soldiers. And, it is unknown if women would have the needed aggression to consistently participate and succeed in combat.


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