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Invisibleblacksabbathrulz
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Fictitious quotes
    #3655995 - 01/20/05 11:33 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Okay, I figured I would start a thread to clear up some commonly quoted things that were never actually said. Feel free to add to the quotes, I'll probably add some more later, I'll start with two:

Bush never said "Iraq is an imminent threat"
Condi never said "We need a common threat to unite us"


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: Fictitious quotes [Re: blacksabbathrulz]
    #3656016 - 01/20/05 11:35 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Hitler never said, "Jews suck, we should gas all those bastards!"

Stalin never said, "I think we'll kill millions in concentration camps."

What's your point? People actually mean things when they speak, even if they don't say exact words. That's why there's inferences and synonyms in the English language


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Invisibleblacksabbathrulz
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Re: Fictitious quotes [Re: Ravus]
    #3656055 - 01/20/05 11:42 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Again, Bush said:
"Some have said we must not act until the threat is imminent"

That right there is an acknowledgement on his behalf that the threat was not yet imminent.


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OfflineJ4S0N
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Re: Fictitious quotes [Re: blacksabbathrulz]
    #3656090 - 01/20/05 11:50 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Not yet imminent? I'd hate to see what happens when a threat is imminent.


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Invisibleblacksabbathrulz
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Re: Fictitious quotes [Re: J4S0N]
    #3656094 - 01/20/05 11:52 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

J4S0N said:
Not yet imminent? I'd hate to see what happens when a threat is imminent.




Probably the same thing that happened to the 800,000+ people saddam slaughtered if the US failed to act, whether it was through throwing people off buildings, woodchippers, vx gas etc.


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OfflineDivided_Sky
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Re: Fictitious quotes [Re: blacksabbathrulz]
    #3656130 - 01/20/05 11:59 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Yeah dude, people have been putting words in his mouth for a pretty long time. I guess they can only debate a straw man.


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OfflineJ4S0N
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Re: Fictitious quotes [Re: blacksabbathrulz]
    #3656137 - 01/21/05 12:01 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

So your saying that if the U.S had failed to kill 150,000 people, Saddam would have killed 800,000?

You do know that the U.S government sold Saddam the weapons he used on his own people? That he was put into control by American money and weapons. Iraq was being used to fight Iran at the time. The U.S didn't give a shit about what he was doing to his people, and they still don't give a shit about the people there.

Hell when you consider what is happening to the poor troops because of depleted uranium in the bullets and missles its obvious that they don't even care about their own troops. Gulf war syndrome was only the beginning.

Depleted uranium has a half life of 400million years or something, causes all kinds of diseases. Very high radiation. The Iraq people will be getting cancer for millions of years now.


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"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA


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Invisibleblacksabbathrulz
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Re: Fictitious quotes [Re: J4S0N]
    #3656155 - 01/21/05 12:05 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

J4S0N said:
So your saying that if the U.S had failed to kill 150,000 people, Saddam would have killed 800,000?

You do know that the U.S government sold Saddam the weapons he used on his own people? That he was put into control by American money and weapons. Iraq was being used to fight Iran at the time. The U.S didn't give a shit about what he was doing to his people, and they still don't give a shit about the people there.

Hell when you consider what is happening to the poor troops because of depleted uranium in the bullets and missles its obvious that they don't even care about their own troops. Gulf war syndrome was only the beginning.

Depleted uranium has a half life of 400million years or something, causes all kinds of diseases. Very high radiation. The Iraq people will be getting cancer for millions of years now.




A. The US did not install Saddam.
B. Saddam already had killed over 800,000 people, that alone warrants a war.
C. We sold saddam less than 0.1% of his total weapons cache.
D. Gulf war syndrome is a fictitious disease perpetuated by ambulance chasers and their ilk.


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OfflineCatalysis
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Re: Fictitious quotes [Re: J4S0N]
    #3656161 - 01/21/05 12:06 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

No, its not "very high radiation", that why it is called depleted.

Also, while the US may be responsible for some errors in governments that they help put into power, remember thier contributions to the downfall of nazi germany, the tearing down of the berlin wall, the disintigration of the soviet union, etc..


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Invisibleblacksabbathrulz
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Re: Fictitious quotes [Re: blacksabbathrulz]
    #3656168 - 01/21/05 12:08 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Oh also, the half life of depleted uranium is much more than 400 million years. It actually becomes more radioctive over time due to accumulation of byproducts of degradation.


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: Fictitious quotes [Re: blacksabbathrulz]
    #3656175 - 01/21/05 12:09 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

"I believe to this day that it (Iraq) was an urgent threat. This could not go on and we are safer as a result because today Iraq is no longer going to be a state of weapons of mass destruction concern."
?Condoleezza Rice, National Security Adviser, Mar. 14, 2004

"Saddam Hussein and his weapons are a direct threat to this country, to our people and to all free people."
?George W. Bush, Mar. 6, 2003

"Within a week, or a month, Saddam could give his WMD to al-Qaeda."
-Donald Rumsfeld, November 2002

Condi, the National Security Adviser, directly said Iraq was an urgent threat. Bush said Saddam was a direct threat to the US. Rumsfeld made many quotes of this nature, and said that Saddam could give his WMDs to al-Qaeda in a week (even though there were none.) Useless semantics aside, how could the American people NOT think Iraq was an imminent threat by these statements?


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Invisibleblacksabbathrulz
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Re: Fictitious quotes [Re: Catalysis]
    #3656176 - 01/21/05 12:09 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Catalysis said:
No, its not "very high radiation", that why it is called depleted.




Exactly, it will become more radioactive, but not for a very long time.


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Invisibleblacksabbathrulz
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Re: Fictitious quotes [Re: Ravus]
    #3656190 - 01/21/05 12:11 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Ravus said:
"I believe to this day that it (Iraq) was an urgent threat. This could not go on and we are safer as a result because today Iraq is no longer going to be a state of weapons of mass destruction concern."
?Condoleezza Rice, National Security Adviser, Mar. 14, 2004

"Saddam Hussein and his weapons are a direct threat to this country, to our people and to all free people."
?George W. Bush, Mar. 6, 2003

"Within a week, or a month, Saddam could give his WMD to al-Qaeda."
-Donald Rumsfeld, November 2002

Condi, the National Security Adviser, directly said Iraq was an urgent threat. Bush said Saddam was a direct threat to the US. Rumsfeld made many quotes of this nature, and said that Saddam could give his WMDs to al-Qaeda in a week (even though there were none.) Useless semantics aside, how could the American people NOT think Iraq was an imminent threat by these statements?




Easily, they could educate themselves, and realize that Iraq was not yet an imminent threat. Also, even if Saddam had no WMD's at the time, one month is sufficient time to create them.


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: Fictitious quotes [Re: blacksabbathrulz]
    #3656235 - 01/21/05 12:20 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

The administration knows most Americans don't "educate themselves," as you put it, they rely on the government and the media, and when the National Security Advisor directly says that Iraq is an URGENT threat, when Rumsfeld says Iraq has WMDs and is going to give them to the terrorists, when Bush says Iraq is a direct threat to us, they eat it up and draw the only conclusion: Iraq is an urgent threat, armed with weapons of mass destruction and cooperating and aiding terrorists like al-Qaeda. Brainwashed Americans can't see any more of an imminent threat than that after 9/11.

I'm guessing the reason you're defending these bullshit government administrators is because you thought Iraq had WMDs and supported the war, eh?


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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Invisibleblacksabbathrulz
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Re: Fictitious quotes [Re: Ravus]
    #3656252 - 01/21/05 12:23 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Ravus said:
The administration knows most Americans don't "educate themselves," as you put it, they rely on the government and the media, and when the National Security Advisor directly says that Iraq is an URGENT threat, when Rumsfeld says Iraq has WMDs and is going to give them to the terrorists, when Bush says Iraq is a direct threat to us, they eat it up and draw the only conclusion: Iraq is an urgent threat, armed with weapons of mass destruction and cooperating and aiding terrorists like al-Qaeda. Brainwashed Americans can't see any more of an imminent threat than that after 9/11.

I'm guessing the reason you're defending these bullshit government administrators is because you thought Iraq had WMDs and supported the war, eh?




Was Rumsfeld wrong when he said that Iraq was an urgent threat? I believe we have evidence that various countries were intending to ease sanctions on Saddam, and we certainly have evidence that Saddam was going to reconstitute WMD's once sanctions were lifted. I could care less whether or not Saddam had WMD's. I would have supported the war if Bush said that we were going to war because Saddam killed a mouse, given Saddam's genocidal record in the past.


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Fictitious quotes [Re: Ravus]
    #3656295 - 01/21/05 12:31 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Iraq did have bio and chem weaponry. No one disputes that. At the time the first group of inspectors withdrew from Iraq in 1998, there remained substantial stocks of bio and chem weaponry Iraq was known to have which weren't yet accounted for. No one disputes that either.

At the time UN Resolution 1441 was passed, these stocks had still not been accounted for. No one disputes that. At the time the second group of inspectors withdrew from Iraq prior to the invasion, these stocks still had not been accounted for. No one disputes that either.

Post invasion, Duelfer's team found evidence of the continuation of Hussein's bio and chem production facilities, in direct violation of the ceasefire agreement. They also found some mustard and sarin artillery shells (thirteen to fifteen depending on which of Duelfer's television interviews you listen to) as well as the single sarin shell used in an improvised explosive device.

To this day, no one has explained what happened to those stocks. Where are they? I don't know. No one knows. It's possible even Hussein himself no longer knows. There is more evidence they were transported to Syria pre-invasion than that they were destroyed. The only "evidence" they were destroyed is Hussein's claims.


pinky


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Invisibleblacksabbathrulz
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Re: Fictitious quotes [Re: Phred]
    #3656309 - 01/21/05 12:33 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

pinksharkmark said:
Iraq did have bio and chem weaponry. No one disputes that. At the time the first group of inspectors withdrew from Iraq in 1998, there remained substantial stocks of bio and chem weaponry Iraq was known to have which weren't yet accounted for. No one disputes that either.

At the time UN Resolution 1441 was passed, these stocks had still not been accounted for. No one disputes that. At the time the second group of inspectors withdrew from Iraq prior to the invasion, these stocks still had not been accounted for. No one disputes that either.

Post invasion, Duelfer's team found evidence of the continuation of Hussein's bio and chem production facilities, in direct violation of the ceasefire agreement. They also found some mustard and sarin artillery shells (thirteen to fifteen depending on which of Duelfer's television interviews you listen to) as well as the single sarin shell used in an improvised explosive device.

To this day, no one has explained what happened to those stocks. Where are they? I don't know. No one knows. It's possible even Hussein himself no longer knows. There is more evidence they were transported to Syria pre-invasion than that they were destroyed. The only "evidence" they were destroyed is Hussein's claims.


pinky




I like the way you articulate things. I think syria is very likely to have these weapons. I think a lot of people fail to realize how devastating many WMD's can be, even in extremely miniscule amounts, nor do they realize the pain and agony, and ultimately death that results.


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Offlineunbeliever
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Re: Fictitious quotes [Re: blacksabbathrulz]
    #3656821 - 01/21/05 02:12 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

*yawn*

Almost all of those bio/chem weapons were over a decade old and way past their "use by" date so to speak. By their natures those sorts of weapons are not stable and were not designed for long term storage and subsequent future use.

I don't know which would be worse, that we are so sure those weapons existed and are now somehow missing beyond our reach or that we might be entirely wrong about the whole damned thing from the top.


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Invisibleblacksabbathrulz
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Re: Fictitious quotes [Re: unbeliever]
    #3657015 - 01/21/05 03:13 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

unbeliever said:
*yawn*

Almost all of those bio/chem weapons were over a decade old and way past their "use by" date so to speak. By their natures those sorts of weapons are not stable and were not designed for long term storage and subsequent future use.

I don't know which would be worse, that we are so sure those weapons existed and are now somehow missing beyond our reach or that we might be entirely wrong about the whole damned thing from the top.




Um, binary weapons like Sarin can last a tremendous amount of time. Highly lethal stuff too, and Saddam had the capacity to create tons of binary weapons.


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