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InvisibleSclorch
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Registered: 07/13/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
Recession...
    #3611037 - 01/11/05 02:51 AM (12 years, 6 months ago)

When was the last time that actual philosophical material was covered in S&P?
Will I ever recieve the kind of intelligent feedback I used to get in S&P?

I want to talk about contemporary philosophers.
Deleuze... Derrida... Hakim Bey...

Is there anyone in here that I won't have to bring up to speed before we can actually get to a decent discussion?
How many philosophy books do you own?
You may choose only one
1 or less
2-5
6-10
>10


Votes accepted from (01/11/05 02:50 PM) to (No end specified)
You must vote before you can view the results of this poll



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InvisibleLoosifa
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Re: Recession... [Re: Sclorch]
    #3611488 - 01/11/05 06:34 AM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Philosophy: n. 1: The use of reason and argument in seeking truth and knowledge of reality esp. of the causes and natures of things and the principles governing existence, the material universe, perception of universal phenomena, and human behaviour. 2: a particular system or set of beliefs reached by this. 3: a personal rule of life.
Definition: The Concise Oxford Dictionary, eighth edition.
My point is that philosophy is subjective. You don't have to be trained in classical or contemporary doctrine to have a life view, or theory.
This is what's wrong with contemporary fine art. Only the initiated can understand it, so it just looks like elitist indulgence to the layman.


--------------------
LURK


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Recession... [Re: Loosifa]
    #3611580 - 01/11/05 08:28 AM (12 years, 6 months ago)

On the contrary, I think that contemporary fine art is very accessible to the uninitiated.
much conceptual art has appeal for its packaging only to the initiated, but when a certain degree of integration is achieved anyone - for instance, a child - can appreciate the virtue of it.

My brother in law and sister in law are both university professors of philosophy, we discuss many things related to culture, family and food. They frequently visit and stay all weekend.

I could not read their books at all.


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OfflineGazzBut
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Re: Recession... [Re: Sclorch]
    #3611593 - 01/11/05 08:39 AM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Why dont you just bring up a philisophical subject for discussion and see how people get on without referring to any "big name" philosophers... You can always introduce people to the concepts and ideas of the likes of Bey etc etc as they come up in discussion.


--------------------
Always Smi2le


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Re: Recession... [Re: GazzBut]
    #3612300 - 01/11/05 01:28 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

GazzBut said:
Why dont you just bring up a philisophical subject for discussion and see how people get on without referring to any "big name" philosophers... You can always introduce people to the concepts and ideas of the likes of Bey etc etc as they come up in discussion.




Because if I wanted to teach, I'd get a job at the university...

I'm here to discuss.
If you're familiar with Bey, do you think there is a difference between a Permanent Autonomous Zone and a Permanent Temporary Autonomous Zone?


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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Invisiblewhiterasta
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Re: Recession... [Re: Sclorch]
    #3612604 - 01/11/05 02:25 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

do you think there is a difference between a Permanent Autonomous Zone and a Permanent Temporary Autonomous Zone?




Objective or subjective difference? Objectively probably none, subjectivly possibly a great deal. Any permanent temporary condition is in conflict with itself yet remains permanent. This would best be descibed as a Permanently Unstable Autonomous Zone.
Am I getting close? Bey was BOOORING so didn't pay much attn when I read(uh, yeah) the work.
I amy not be a "philosopher stoned" but I've read a bit and if nothing else will give off some mental Gordian knots to play with.
WR :wexican:


--------------------
To old for this place


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Registered: 07/13/99
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Loc: On the Brink of Madness
Re: Recession... [Re: whiterasta]
    #3613470 - 01/11/05 05:43 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

whiterasta said:
Quote:

do you think there is a difference between a Permanent Autonomous Zone and a Permanent Temporary Autonomous Zone?




Objective or subjective difference? Objectively probably none, subjectivly possibly a great deal. Any permanent temporary condition is in conflict with itself yet remains permanent. This would best be descibed as a Permanently Unstable Autonomous Zone.



Hmm...
So we're talking orders of stability, then?

Permanent on a grand scale, but becoming more temporary as it closes in on the individual?

An amorphous, blob-like structure maybe...


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Registered: 07/13/99
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Loc: On the Brink of Madness
Re: Recession... [Re: Sclorch]
    #3613496 - 01/11/05 05:47 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

BTW... PAZ and 2012

Quote:

Q-Are you suggesting that small groups, communities, local governments, whatever, right here in the USA, declare themselves "permanent autonomous zones?"
A-Why yes, in fact. Thanks for putting that question so succinctly! Why should this sort of resistance to globalization activity fall only to indigenous people in remote mountainous areas of the planet?

Let's take US Greens, for example, who can make an invaluable contribution to this topic with your considerable involvement in local grass-roots politics and elections, including many election victories of late. This would not distract you from your main focus, since all you'd have to do is send in an occasional summary of local successes (or failures) of Green involvement in local self-government ("autonomy"). The Bill of Rights Defense initiative among municipalities comes to mind as an example of a movement toward autonomy from Washington. Another example is the tiny municipality in Pennsylvania seeking to end corporate "personhood" for corporations within its jurisdiction. A third example would be the struggle of Californians (proven to be decidedly un-autonomous) to maintain their legal medical marijuana programs in the face of Federal efforts to eradicate their local self-determination.

Q-Hey ! Is this a left-wing thing, or a right-wing thing? Dammit, I won't be associated with something that is on my wrong wing, dammit!
A-Sorry, you're on your own there, my friend.

The idea of a manual is also to create a self-fulfilling prophecy about a very important upcoming date--the astronomically-predicted end of a great cycle on the Mayan Long-Count calendar, the date Dec. 21, 2012, and the beginning of a new great cycle. This was believed to be a time of huge changes in civilization (a big "paradigm shift" if you will). For example, if enough people begin to believe that autonomy is possible, then the possibility grows for permanent autonomous zones which owe less and less allegiance to the global economy and its dominating security force centered in Washington, D.C.

Q-So you're not suggesting some sort of Christian "end-times" or apocalyptic Millennial movement here?
A-Aw, hell no. Those are "spectator" trends. All you have to do in those systems is be a believer, and await the Rapture. Or hang out somewhere on an appointed date and await the UFOs to take you off-planet. Well, this autonomy is gonna take hella work. You have to participate in it, you can't spectate. But I would like to listen to some "apocalypso" music right now, can you put on a CD?




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OfflineFrog
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Re: Recession... [Re: Sclorch]
    #3615798 - 01/12/05 01:59 AM (12 years, 6 months ago)

It's all philosophy. It just so happens that it's all modern.

What, are you waiting for Plato to appear?

Everything we discuss here is the philosophical matter of our times. We will never discuss the stuff that Plato discussed when Plato was around.


--------------------
The day will come when, after harnessing the ether, the winds, the tides, gravitation, we shall harness for God the energies of love. And, on that day, for the second time in the history of the world, man will have discovered fire.  -Teilard


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OfflineZekebomb
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Registered: 08/24/03
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Re: Recession... [Re: Sclorch]
    #3616290 - 01/12/05 03:51 AM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Sclorch said:
I want to talk about contemporary philosophers.
Deleuze... Derrida... Hakim Bey...




dude you're talking to contemporary philosophers

honestly, 'how many phil books you own'??


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Registered: 07/13/99
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Re: Recession... [Re: Zekebomb]
    #3617469 - 01/12/05 12:51 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Zekebomb said:
Quote:

Sclorch said:
I want to talk about contemporary philosophers.
Deleuze... Derrida... Hakim Bey...




dude you're talking to contemporary philosophers
honestly, 'how many phil books you own'??




I'm not trying to be a dick. I just want to know the knowledge boundaries of the current S&P population.
One doesn't have to read a book to be a philosopher, but a lack of familiarity with what's already been covered by others is going to limit discussion.


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Registered: 07/13/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
Re: Recession... [Re: Frog]
    #3617476 - 01/12/05 12:54 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Frog said:
It's all philosophy.  It just so happens that it's all modern. 
What, are you waiting for Plato to appear?
Everything we discuss here is the philosophical matter of our times.  We will never discuss the stuff that Plato discussed when Plato was around.



You lost me.
Your point appears to be a non sequitur.  :confused:


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Offlinerelativexistance
"beads, bees!?!?beads ....BEADS!!!"
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Re: Recession... [Re: Sclorch]
    #3617560 - 01/12/05 01:16 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Sclorch said:
I'm not trying to be a dick. I just want to know the knowledge boundaries of the current S&P population.
One doesn't have to read a book to be a philosopher, but a lack of familiarity with what's already been covered by others is going to limit discussion.




Why do you care about the knowledge boundaries of others? You best step up off your high horse. If you honestly want to discuss a specific subject or about a philosopher then go start a thread. I'm sure if you start discussing something specific, only those that know what you are talking about will respond and you won't be going over the same information. All you have done is merely try to alienate those that are as not as knowledgeable as you. I may not know much philosophy because I am usually busy studying other areas, however I enjoy having philosophical discussions. Usually discussions about seeking answers to questions that I may have. Isn't that the goal of philosophy to find answers? If it wasn't why would anyone ever ask any questions. I'm sorry if your grace has to enlighten me because I would be causing your discussion to regress. Regardless, if you want to discuss a specific topic then post about it.


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Registered: 07/13/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
Re: Recession... [Re: relativexistance]
    #3618491 - 01/12/05 04:19 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

No high horse here...
*sigh*


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