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OfflineCaRnAgECaNdYS
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: Learyfan]
    #3597602 - 01/08/05 10:13 AM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Learyfan said:





I used to stay with a friend in Window Rock, AZ. I was 15 or so. She'd occasionally ask if I wanted to participate in a few of thier
"calling of the spirits"/praying/blessing rituals. I'm not sure what they called it  :confused:(I'm getting old)
They lived in a hogan and this was in the middle of the cold AZ desert. Yes, it was cold. I'm so awful when it comes to the name of the specific items used so I'll do my best in trying to recollect the events.

They'd place a pan in the middle of a circle we'd form. Mother, and all four girls and sometimes me. The pan was filled with some specific wood, had to be a specific kind...(damn I should've paid more attention) Occasionally they'd play some indian tribal music in the background...very low. The music was amazingly comforting. Then after lighting the wood in the pan on fire, they'd start chanting. Their words floating out of their mouths smoother than the music was very numbing...it put me in a strange place. Then as the images jumped out of the smoke from the flames, they(my friends) would jump from their seats and with their voices raised would take their bundled up sage and walk around the hogan (sometimes we'd do this in other places, depending on the circumstance) or house and pray and chant throughout the area.
After they were through with the walking about...they's sit back around the fire and pull out there pipe. Sometimes, this was done earlier in the rutual, sometimes later. Different circumstances led to different rituals, almost all were basically the same and almost all included peyote. I never smoked the peyote becuase I didn't feel it was my place to do so while they were more of a part of what was going on than I was.
This was family thing. That was the only time the drug was ever done and it was for the purpose of praying and/or driving out bad spirits or even for blessing a new baby or house.

This got a little off-topic but basically, yes...I think that depending on the enviroment you provide for your child including all the right information and the proper reasons...it is okay to bring up a child in a so called "drug enviroment"


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OfflineAdamist
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: CaRnAgECaNdY]
    #3597612 - 01/08/05 10:16 AM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Thanks for that story! I can't wait to try peyote.  :laugh:


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OfflineCaRnAgECaNdYS
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: Adamist]
    #3597629 - 01/08/05 10:22 AM (16 years, 8 months ago)

BTW, I am native american myself and would love my kids to experience such rituals as part of their culture. I do have two girls and both are interested in their back ground..which are different from eachother. My first child is Yaqui/Cheyanne sioux while my second is Yaqui/black/hawiian(sp?)
I would allow them to use peyote for that purpose.(spiritual)
Whichever they chose to do as they grow are beyond my control, all I can to is give them as much information as possible and trust that they make good decisions.


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OfflineAdamist
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: CaRnAgECaNdY]
    #3597637 - 01/08/05 10:25 AM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Whichever they chose to do as they grow are beyond my control, all I can to is give them as much information as possible and trust that they make good decisions.



That is a great outlook, one in which my own mother had, for which I am thankful. The world needs more mothers like you!


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Offlinegrphish
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: Adamist]
    #3597644 - 01/08/05 10:28 AM (16 years, 8 months ago)

dont raise your kids as hippies, or else, youd be giving them no choise and a hard time in the real world
wouldnt you rather your daughter becomes a doctor than a shroom hippie?


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OfflineAdamist
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: grphish]
    #3597645 - 01/08/05 10:30 AM (16 years, 8 months ago)

How about a shroom doctor?


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OfflineCaRnAgECaNdYS
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: grphish]
    #3597647 - 01/08/05 10:33 AM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Using mushrooms does not classify someone as a hippie. I'm sure there are doctors who have done there share of pyschedelics.


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InvisibleCalifornia
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: Adamist]
    #3597659 - 01/08/05 10:38 AM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Adamist-I also read that article you mentioned about a man raising his daughter in the woods in Oregon. He was raising his daughter in the woods just outside of the city of Portland to PREVENT his daughter from being exposed/overexposed to the common streetlife of a city (drugs,junkies and whores).


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OfflineAdamist
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: California]
    #3597662 - 01/08/05 10:40 AM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Doing drugs in a city and doing them in a forest are pretty different experiences though.


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InvisibleCorporal Kielbasa
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: Adamist]
    #3597863 - 01/08/05 12:25 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

A friend of mine wrote a book called Healing The Hole In the Heart of the World, the book discusses how to raise children, because children are the future. Any negativity a child recieves he carries on with him to eventualy shaire with somone else. Treat them as if they are as smart as you dont talk babby to them or undermine them because they are small. Dont lie to them tell them like it is. Watch Meet The Fawkers. The people that you let near your children have influencs to just by beeing around them. A bad person oozes bad vibes. Good people ooze good. Do you want your children around junkies? Do you want your children around friendly potheads? Its up to the parents to say whats moraly right for the children.


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OfflineCaRnAgECaNdYS
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: Corporal Kielbasa]
    #3597900 - 01/08/05 12:37 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

I've seen Meet the Fockers, it's a great movie. I do like the way the encouraged throughout his childhood years, celebrating even the smallest of victories. All children need encouragement always. Sorry, this was not what the topic was about...continue.


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Invisibleblissedout
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: Adamist]
    #3597917 - 01/08/05 12:42 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

I think that, if you are doing any kind of drug and you have kids, you should try and not expose them to any of it, but you should also educate them on certain aspects of drug use when they get of a proper age. As far as festivals go, I think that festivals such as Bonnaroo, Rainbow gatherings(definitely), etc are okay as long as you keep a tight rein on your rugrat, cause there is plenty of danger in the world to merit this overprotectiveness. However there is also plenty of love and harmony in these places, so in my opinion, it is really quite normal to be a 'drug' user and have kids. You just have to be alot more careful about what you do and where you do it. peace


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:murray:


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OfflineMushroomFriend
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: Adamist]
    #3597935 - 01/08/05 12:46 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Adamist said:
Quote:

Tell my bout your fantastic festivals where only shamans dance and do their rituals.
I wont sign for less.




Welcome Home




Nice link Adamist. But to high hippie-ratio IMHO as far as I can judge.

So again you have drug environments and drugenvironments. In the conscious one, where people have great respect children can be a part of the ceremony.

But to call that "raising people in a drug environment" is not the right word.

Someone who is doing a ritual with peyote is not "doing drugs", he is doing a ritual. Hence I say no to raising children in a "drug environment". And yes to the teaching in spirituality and doing rituals.
But that never becomes a "drug environment" if so, my children will not be present, I hope. :grin:


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InvisibleCorporal Kielbasa
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: CaRnAgECaNdY]
    #3597963 - 01/08/05 12:54 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Thats the kind of family I kinda grew up in minus the praise n stuff. I like how deniro encuraged his child threw talking to him as an adult and not making him feel stupid. Very important in making a child grow up to be strong. I think a combination of Deniro's self reliance style and Hopkins's uncoditional love is the perfect way to raise children.


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OfflineAdamist
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: blissedout]
    #3598032 - 01/08/05 01:14 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

blissedout said:
I think that, if you are doing any kind of drug and you have kids, you should try and not expose them to any of it, but you should also educate them on certain aspects of drug use when they get of a proper age. As far as festivals go, I think that festivals such as Bonnaroo, Rainbow gatherings(definitely), etc are okay as long as you keep a tight rein on your rugrat, cause there is plenty of danger in the world to merit this overprotectiveness. However there is also plenty of love and harmony in these places, so in my opinion, it is really quite normal to be a 'drug' user and have kids. You just have to be alot more careful about what you do and where you do it. peace




:thumbup:


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OfflineCaRnAgECaNdYS
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: Corporal Kielbasa]
    #3598036 - 01/08/05 01:16 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

SHEIKofSHIITAKE said:
  I think a combination of Deniro's self reliance style and Hopkins's uncoditional love is the perfect way to raise children.




:yesnod:


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OfflineAdamist
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: MushroomFriend]
    #3598045 - 01/08/05 01:19 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

I say no to raising children in a "drug environment".



I said at the beginning of this post that the term "drug environment" is a loaded term, and maybe I should of been more specific on how to deprogram your mind to the assumptions associated with it. When I use this term I am talking about an environment where drugs may or may not be used, in which people may or may not be on drugs. I'm not talking about a place where "drug fiends" go for the sole purpose of doing drugs together.


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InvisibleCorporal Kielbasa
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: Adamist]
    #3598059 - 01/08/05 01:24 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

I am a woderful carrying special person. I remeber my dad smoking herb when I was 3 or four with his friends. Siting around a picknik table on a nice summer night. I can still smell it and I am thankful for beeing there with my dad that day.

Im not fucked up. I am happy and I have a good life.


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Offlineld50negative1
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: Adamist]
    #3598068 - 01/08/05 01:28 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

I think that would be a terrible sin.

Drug use has to be something that someone choses on their accord. If a child is brought up with "drugs are OK by Dad" then you get a child that is going to lean towards trying drugs and you have thusly taken away any choice the child had. I mean, if there isn't all the propaganda around drugs then it'll make the child think that it's cool and will keep searching for new highs (in alot of cases). Drugs are not necessary for life and neither are they necessary for the seeking of your own philosophies etc. The younger a person is introduced to drugs the more likely they will become depraved, immoral, and drug addicts in general. If you think that just because LSD/THC/Psilocybin/DXM/whatever else gives you cool ideas doesn't mean that they won't also become a person apathetic to morals and numb to things in life a sober person would be sensitive to. I've seen people that don't do really "addictive" drugs turn into trash balls from doing "enlightening" drugs. Whether one believes it or not ALL (abused) drugs are recreational because they are not necessary.

I think your idea is terrible for the sake of the morality of a person.

Just because most people reject an idea (and as most people with different views believe... that the majority are somehow "stupid" bc their beliefs differ from their own) doesn't mean it's a good idea.

I think that you should teach your children to stay away (focus on addictive drugs as being wrong) from drugs... let the psychedlic experience be completely their own choice... and don't give them the choice because they ARE going to do it if loving Dad says it's cool if they do.


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OfflineAdamist
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Re: Do you think children can be raised responsibly in a "drug environment"? [Re: Corporal Kielbasa]
    #3598069 - 01/08/05 01:28 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Im not fucked up. I am happy and I have a good life.



So your avatar says... :wink:


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