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Amazon Shop for: ½ Pint Jars, Peruvian Torch, Salvia, San Pedro

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OfflineGNIOM1498
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Mescaline Dosage Acid-base extraction
    #3591534 - 01/07/05 01:03 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

I recently did an acid base extraction on san pedro and i ended up with a orange powder on the bottom and white crystals on the edge of the pyrex baking pan i took the crytsals and figured the orange powdery shit was left over citric acid I took 400mg Nothing happened so an hour and 15 mins later took another 400mg and nothing did i do something wrong is it the other shit (powdery orange shit) which i think is the left over citric acid or just not big enough dosage? :confused:


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InvisibleStranger
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Re: Mescaline Dosage Acid-base extraction [Re: GNIOM1498]
    #3591695 - 01/07/05 01:30 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Isn't the extract supposed to be orangy brown? or at least from what i remember. maybe u did the wrong shit lol..


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OfflineGNIOM1498
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Re: Mescaline Dosage Acid-base extraction [Re: Stranger]
    #3591932 - 01/07/05 02:19 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

ok orangy brown lets be technical with the color---LOL thanks for the help


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Invisibledblaney
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Re: Mescaline Dosage Acid-base extraction [Re: GNIOM1498]
    #3592511 - 01/07/05 06:54 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Mescaline usually takes several hours to fully come-up. It could very well have been mesc. unless you did this at least a day ago?


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Offlineesin
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Re: Mescaline Dosage Acid-base extraction [Re: GNIOM1498]
    #3592524 - 01/07/05 07:04 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

You used citric acid to salt out?

I hope you at least used pure citric acid...

Well you can easily salt out with HCl without compromising purity b/c given enough time and heat HCl will completely evaporate. Citric acid won't so it'll remain on your product.

Most of your crystal is probably just citric acid  :crazy:

You can purify that stuff with acetone, but even so i doubt citric acid will disolve in acetone.

What was your expected yield (dried san pedro aprox. 1% / fresh pedro ~0.05% to 0.15%) and how much citric acid you used exactly in grams?

If the stuff is very unpure you can dissolve it in water again, basify, re-extract 3x and salt out with dilute muriatic acid.
I think clean acetic acid will also do but it will be a lot more messy.
Don't use acids that do not evaporate at this step.


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Offlineesin
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Re: Mescaline Dosage Acid-base extraction [Re: dblaney]
    #3592564 - 01/07/05 07:27 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Raw mescaline HCl crystal should look like this:

It should not taste like lemon or table salt at all (citric acid tastes like lemon / NaOH + HCl = NaCl, most common contaminant in mesc extractions).
Your crystal should taste just like the horrid bitterness of pedro flesh X 1000, and only like this taste alone.

After grinding crystal, washing with acetone, redissolving in water and re-evaporating it should be just transparent crystal.


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OfflineGNIOM1498
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Re: Mescaline Dosage Acid-base extraction [Re: esin]
    #3593152 - 01/07/05 12:11 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

well my crystals tasted quite good they were orangy brown i know they are suppose to be white but from erowid they recommend u using citric acid because its easier to handle I did the whole process step by step. It was pure citric acid that i got from a health food store vitamin c. Im going to try the process over again with new cactius just skipping the de-fatting process. and reusing the citric acid poweder i got left over again. ill try using acetone for the final step because i got some left over from salvia extractions. hopefully that will work ya i took 800mg total and nothing happened. the problem might have been is i figured that maybe i just supersaturated it and i just used to much acidic water. I wanted to make sure i got everything out. If this doesn't yeild good results on 10 lbs or 4.5 kg of cactius that i boiled down to just 1000Ml i will switch to HCL. Thank you and one more question can i skip the defating step?


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InvisibleHippieD9
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Re: Mescaline Dosage Acid-base extraction *DELETED* [Re: GNIOM1498]
    #3595129 - 01/07/05 08:26 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

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OfflineGNIOM1498
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Re: Mescaline Dosage Acid-base extraction [Re: HippieD9]
    #3595988 - 01/07/05 11:46 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

HA! F*&% your right thats probably the problem that means i just waisted a whole lot of time and money THANK YOU!!! -----should have looked at more depth into that got to cocky because of all my chemistry classes I have taken. But now im curious to if it will still work?


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Offlinefresh313
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Re: Mescaline Dosage Acid-base extraction [Re: GNIOM1498]
    #3596010 - 01/07/05 11:54 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

GNIOM1498 said:
I took 400mg Nothing happened so an hour and 15 mins later took another 400mg and nothing




it takes like 3-4 hours to kick in, you would have been tripping real hard if that shit was real. 800mg is alot of mescaline.


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OfflineGNIOM1498
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Re: Mescaline Dosage Acid-base extraction [Re: fresh313]
    #3596053 - 01/08/05 12:10 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

ya but i read when doing the A/B other alkaloids are in there to about 50% of the total weight is mescaline and other weight other alkaloids so 400mg= 200 mg of mescaline if actually would have used the right shiznit


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Offlineesin
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Re: Mescaline Dosage Acid-base extraction [Re: GNIOM1498]
    #3597643 - 01/08/05 10:28 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Look as i said, if you want relatively pure mesc either you use equimolar amounts of any acid or you just use an acid which is volatile so all excess can evaporate off.

If you keep using solid acids without calculating the PRECISE amount you should add to turn all of the mesc into salt form, the excess of acid will always contaminate your product no matter what you do.

Mescaline shouldn't taste good. It should taste kind of like earthy MDMA on the tongue but with a much worser vile taste in the back of the mouth. It's just retched. You'll get a chill down your spine if you lick a thumbprint full of it.

Ascorbic acid works just as well as citric acid in making mescaline ascorbate/citrate. Your problem is not the acid itself, it is the excess acid you used contaminating your whole yield.

If 800mg aren't active i bet your extract is something like 5:1 - vitC:alkaloid. Or worse.
Either that or you fucked up your extraction and your crystal is only vitamn C.

The other Pedro alkaloids will synergize with mescaline. A dose of proper san pedro extract is still 300-500mg, and not 600-1000mg. It is clearly active in doses as low as 100-150mg.


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Re: Mescaline Dosage Acid-base extraction [Re: GNIOM1498]
    #3597666 - 01/08/05 10:43 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

And yes you can skip defat as you'll be extracting alkaloids out of the NPS with water (water doesn't disolve fats).

Deffating in DMT extractions is more essencial b/c you end in non-polar evaporation. And NP solvents do disolve fats very well.

The erowid tek is very outdated and i bet not much based on actual experience.
Just use the teks at the nook archives. Those are tottaly based on empyrical knowledge and are constantly being tested and re-tested and improved with the most recent developments.

Sulphuric acid is the best acid to salt mesc, but it is not recommended for newbies exactly b/c it will not evaporate, thus requiring further cleaning.

But as sulphuric is liquid it can be easily mechanically removed with acetone. WHile citric/ascorbic/tartaric/malic/etc/etc/etc are solids and most likely unsoluble in acetone, thus all excess cannot be removed with this solvent.

Muriatic acid is the cheapest, cleanest and easiest option. It is not dificult to handle at all. A solution of ~1ml or so in a liter of water is not dangerous or corrosive at all and will very efficiently extract all the alkaloids out of your solvent. And all excess HCl will evaporate with a little heat. Just don't smell your mescaline in the final stages of evap or that shit will burn your nostrils.


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OfflineEkstaza
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Re: Mescaline Dosage Acid-base extraction [Re: GNIOM1498]
    #3600898 - 01/09/05 12:32 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Do this instead of what you were trying. It works!!! I gave my best friend a 400mg capsule of part of the results from this process and in an hour and a half he was right as rain. It was a christmas gift. I started out with 55.4 grams of peruvian torch powder and got a yield of more than 1% with only 2 xylene pulls. The jar broke and all of the rest of it went down the drain. I probably could have got 200-400mg more from it otherwise.

Extract the mesc from it using an acid/base non-polar/polar extraction.

Seriously this is no big difficult process. All it requires is the right chemicals and a little safety consciousness. I happen to know someone that just got through doing something very similar to what I will describe to you right now.

If you feel unequaled to the task, start out by using a small portion of what you have there just to get your hands wet.

Things you'll need:
1.at least 2 glass or HDPE(should show a triangular recycle symbol with a 2 inside of it somewhere on the bottom) plastic jugs or jars. HDPE is preferred because strong lye solutions will etch glass and cause it to break eventually. I know first hand.

2. RedDevil brand lye

3. Muriatic acid (HCL or hydrochloric acid)

4. Acetone

5. Xylene

6. turkey baster

7. a glass or stainless steel funnel

8. cotton balls

all easy to get items (use NO aluminum)

You should not use any type of open flame at any point during this extraction.
Use adequite ventilation at all times.

Extracting
Prepare a solution of lye water by slowly mixing together 1 TBS of lye for every pint of cold water that you think you'll need to dissolve your tar. This will produce a little heat so don't be alarmed. Just swirl it around slowly as you add the lye a little at a time. This is what I will refer to as base or basic water.

Next add you tar. break it up if you can (anything to assist in it's dissolving). Make sure that you fully dissolve the tar as you want it all to be exposed to the base water.

Now add about a pint or so of xylene to the mix. You want enough of a layer to be able to draw off the xylene with the turkey baster later. Shake it all up and let it sit for an hour. If you can see that the xylene layer is separating back out, fine, if not, add a little more pre-made basic water and check again. Now shake it back up and put it away for 24 hours (every second of it).

24 hours later, you want to draw off the xylene so now you need to use the turkey baster to suck it up and put it in a new jar(a mason jar works fine). You don't want any of the water from beneath the xylene to come with it.

Salting
Now you want to mix your acid water in order to dilute it to the proper strength you want. Be very careful not to breath the vapors that come out of the bottle when you open it. HCL come very strong and it will burn you.

You want to add approximately 4-8 drops of HCL acid to 1 cup of water.
Slowly add this acid water to the xylene while gently swirling the liquids around in the jar. Add it all. Put the lid on the jar and shake it all up. Wait a few minutes and shake again.

Once it has returned completely to a separated state loosen the lid on the jar and place it in the freezer. You want the bottom layer(the acid water) to now freeze solid. The xylene will not freeze. Once the water is frozen, work quickly and pour the xylene back into the extraction bottle.

With the water still frozen solid, pour in a little warm water and swirl around and discard quickly. This helps get rid of a little more residual xylene. The rest will evaporate later.

Repeat the extraction and salting steps 4 to 6 times to get all of the goodies. You can reuse the xylene over and over again.

Evaporating
Now thaw out the water and put it in you evaporation dish. A large flat bottomed pyrex dish works best. Using heat(heating pad beneath the dish) or not fan dry it to evaporate the water from the dish. This may take some time depending on how much water you used.

Once all of this is dry you will see a crystalline residue left on the dish. Scrape it off with a razor blade. It will be a brownish powder. It can be used as is but the next procedure is simple if you've got this far.

Cleaning
Put a cotton ball in the spout end of your funnel so that it can filter.

Mix some acetone with your extracted alkaloids and pour it into the funnel with a clean dry jar to catch the liquids. You will notice some color draining through with the acetone. Wash like this with fresh acetone until little to no more color is draining through. Put the funnel somewhere to dry.

Once all acetone smell is gone from the funnel and it's contents you need to pour some hot water into it with it positioned over the evaporation dish. The hot water will dissolve the crystals and allow them to flow through the cotton into the dish.

Evaporate as before. The resulting crystals will be considerably whiter and more pure. This is not only for aesthetics, but also it makes for more accurate dosing.

You can put this powder in capsule to facilitate simple dosing with pre-measured amounts in each capsule. Look to www.erowid.com for dosing guidelines.


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Amazon Shop for: ½ Pint Jars, Peruvian Torch, Salvia, San Pedro

Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics >> The Ethnobotanical Garden

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