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OfflineLunuTrance520
Stranger
Registered: 01/22/01
Posts: 11
Loc: Southeastern U.S.A
Last seen: 21 years, 8 months
Re: levels [Re: ArCh_TemPlaR]
    #372804 - 08/16/01 02:15 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

How would it feel
thoughts stored unreal?
To conjor a dream
A break through a seam
possabillties unlimeted you shal redeam.
Not as easy as it sounds, nor hard as it appears
because light is the difference between mercky and clear.
Life controled by fastious dictation
With the antichrist with his own T.V station.
While your waiting for an imposter son of God who's self he will protect.
The beast comes in from behind you the place you'ed least exspect.
Media hype builds ivory towers
heavenly glitter from evil showers.
Change the meaning of life, our spirit we lost
Life only worth how much it cost
No talk of God the loves done been sold.
While the controller of all we hear and see sits back and counts our gold.
I heard of a man named jesus a prophet son of God,
who walks around performing miracals like Moses with a rod.
But I do believe this man is the creators son,
humble, thougtful not selfish well done.
Do without for others a sacrifice indeed.
Thats why the antichrist would be in the center of all greed.



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OfflinePhyl
old hand
Registered: 01/17/00
Posts: 597
Loc: United Kingdom
Last seen: 14 years, 1 day
Re: levels [Re: ArCh_TemPlaR]
    #372805 - 08/16/01 02:16 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

Hmmm.. Sounds like Holographic theory?
Holographic theory?

The book bridging their works is, "Holographic Universe", by Michael Talbot
Thanks, I'll check that out...

Take care

Phil




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OfflinePhyl
old hand
Registered: 01/17/00
Posts: 597
Loc: United Kingdom
Last seen: 14 years, 1 day
Re: levels [Re: baloo]
    #372809 - 08/16/01 02:28 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

I?ve been playing with the idea that perhaps our ego does exist with us in the higher realm and that we incarnate the ego separate from the rest so we can view it in operation then take the necessary steps to adjust it.
This very act of separation means the separated part would need some kind of limited temporary consciousness, which is us and which is discarded or reintegrated upon completion.


The way I see it, the temporary consciousness is your ego. I see the ego simply as a mechanism to allow existance in the 3 Dimensional realm, and is created by combining information from your senses with aspects of your subconscious. Once you leave the 3 Dimensional realm your ego will disolve, as it is it unable to comprehend non-linear space and time.

Anyway, It's early and my brain hasn't kicked in yet, so I won't go on.

Take care

Phil



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Invisiblebaloo
Stranger
Registered: 08/14/01
Posts: 14
Re: levels [Re: Phyl]
    #372916 - 08/16/01 08:52 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

I am of the mind that the hereafter isn?t the commonly held heaven or hell as two distinct realities. Nor do I believe that we just lay around in utter bliss or pain. but even if we did, we would need some kind of ego to be able to appreciate our predicament at the time. We would still need a sense of identity separate from the mass around us. And to appreciate experience we would still have to be able to say the basic ?I Am?.
If this holds water then perhaps it is our ?id? or subconscious that will no longer apply.




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Invisiblebaloo
Stranger
Registered: 08/14/01
Posts: 14
Re: levels [Re: aluminum_can]
    #372920 - 08/16/01 09:03 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

aluminum_can
Very good points.
But not very exciting is it?
The road you?re on leads to depression and violence.
But that?s OK
It is your path right now
At least you are facing reality honestly




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Offlinegnrm23
Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 08/29/99
Posts: 6,488
Loc: n. e. OH, USSA
Last seen: 3 hours, 31 minutes
Re: levels [Re: aluminum_can]
    #373000 - 08/16/01 10:57 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

oy
sound like koan: what was your original face before your parents were born?
word is spelled "mormon" & they got a special addition to the christian bible, dleivered & recovered by a bona fide angel (moroni) in NY in the early 1800s to joseph smith...
~~~
buncha molecules bumpin into each other?
"random chance is insufficient to explain random chance... (heinlein)
~~~
aliens? well, your timescales are skewed a bit... why million of light years? our local galaxy is maybe 30,000 l.y across (=/-) and there are a lot of g type stars within a spere 100 ly radius... with a decent bussard ramjet & shielding, a high-tech civilization could approach lightspeed in under 10 years... and the time dilation effect once you're past 95% C is quite noticable... and this assumes starfaring civilizations would be using constant accel/decel technology (one might hope for other intersting techs to become available as a species' knowledge/wisdom/power increases )
clarke: a sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic)
your "belief system" seems a bit nihilistic... when i think of an agnostic with a heart, i remember dr sagan... (yes, he did seem a bit immersed in"scientism", but some of those physicists seem to do much more than rage against the blind machinery of the universe, don'tchathink?)
~~~
me, well i don't think i've got a patent on any "big answers" but it's always fascinating to ponder on a few of the "big questions"...
~~~
and ah hello markos my friend... hmmmm, mahayanist christianity, hehheh... ain't nothin wrong with that... i hope you and yr lady are very well indeed...
~~~
"thinking young and growing older surely is no sin
and i can play this game of life to win'
(goin' back/c.king(&the byrds/notorious byrd brothers...)...)
~~~
& leave it on!!!

old enough to know better
not old enough to care


--------------------
old enough to know better
not old enough to care


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OfflinePhyl
old hand
Registered: 01/17/00
Posts: 597
Loc: United Kingdom
Last seen: 14 years, 1 day
Re: levels [Re: baloo]
    #373061 - 08/16/01 12:55 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

We would still need a sense of identity separate from the mass around us
I don't believe we would be separate from the mass around us as without the physical I don't think such as distinction can be made. In a non-physical dimension, I believe our realities would manifest themselves from our consciousness, and our identity would be our reality.

And to appreciate experience we would still have to be able to say the basic ?I Am?.
To say 'I' implies a singular identity, but I think we would exists as everything, essentially being infinite.

Does that make any sense? Dammit... language fails me sometimes :)

Take care

Phil



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Invisiblebaloo
Stranger
Registered: 08/14/01
Posts: 14
Re: levels [Re: Phyl]
    #373158 - 08/16/01 04:00 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

?To say 'I' implies a singular identity, but I think we would exists as everything, essentially being infinite.?-
An existence like this would not support such things as demons, angels, spirits, ghosts etc. Each operating from an individual premise whether in support of a consensus reality or a singular delusional state such as our own.


?I? is the delusion of an illusion?




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OfflineHB
Male User Gallery

Registered: 04/06/01
Posts: 42,528
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
Re: levels [Re: baloo]
    #373189 - 08/16/01 04:54 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

i don't really care what anybody says but aluminum_can is a genius. it is the same way i think about it: if you were nothing before you were born, why would you be something after? if there is heaven and hell, then why wouldn't animals go? why just humans? if adam and eve existed, where the fuck did they come from? if god created the universe, where did he come from?

too many questions for me to believe anything about religion. i just believe religion is human's way of kidding ourselves into thinking that there will be something else after this life or that being "good" in this life will help you in the "next life." i think its all BS. live your life, i highly doubt you'll have another. all we are are organisms with organs that make us move and breathe; nothing more. but i guess we'll all see when the day comes that each of us fade away.

We're all MADD here...


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Offlinespiralviral
Stranger
Registered: 08/17/01
Posts: 4
Last seen: 20 years, 8 months
Re: levels [Re: HB]
    #373496 - 08/17/01 03:06 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

I totally agree. Not that it makes any difference anyway.

If there was another "level" I wonder why people think mushrooms connect you to it? I find a biochemical imbalance causing an altered perception of the same reality to be more believable.



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Offlinebatou
artist

Registered: 05/06/00
Posts: 398
Loc: colorado
Last seen: 12 years, 5 months
Re: levels [Re: spiralviral]
    #373501 - 08/17/01 03:21 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

hummmmm, where to start....

Any one ever seen "defending your life" ?? in my personal view that is how it is. once one dies they have to prove their readyness to move on to a higher level. just a thought-- feed back/critisim is welcome.

The multiple troubles of man,
My brother, like slander and pain
Amaze you? Consider the heart
That holds them all in strangeness
And doesn't break.
"The Dude abides..."--jeffrey lebowski


--------------------
The multiple troubles of man,
My brother, like slander and pain
Amaze you? Consider the heart
That holds them all in strangeness
And doesn't break.
"The Dude abides..."--jeffrey lebowski


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InvisiblePynchon
Slow Learner

Registered: 04/28/01
Posts: 578
Loc: New Zealand
Re: levels [Re: spiralviral]
    #373550 - 08/17/01 06:17 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

I would say that when the perception of reality is altered, it automatically becomes another "level". I'm sceptical of attaching mystical significance to it, tho'.



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Offline~`Tursiops truncatus`~
enthusiast

Registered: 11/01/00
Posts: 105
Loc: CO... UsA
Last seen: 21 years, 8 months
Re: levels [Re: Pynchon]
    #373568 - 08/17/01 06:50 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

This is something that has made me wonder. . . Would egos even exsist if we didin't have verbal languages>?


Words fool us into thinking that we are separate...

Words fool us into thinking...

Words just fool us...



Cultivation of telepathy... it will unlock many doors and break down many walls...


Peace<><><><>



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OfflineLOBO
Vagabond

Registered: 03/19/01
Posts: 655
Loc: NY
Last seen: 16 years, 11 months
Re: levels [Re: batou]
    #373591 - 08/17/01 08:12 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

I will put another spin on the idea.
I feel and belive by personal experience, That we live and experience things in several levels at once but we are not awere of whats going on on the other levels, is like if you are having a conversation with somebody but at the same time you are transmmiting other things at a different level.
It is hard to explain this but I had this "doble memories" and I expecxt that they may be even more levels.


"We have infinite possibilities of existence"


--------------------


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OfflineSampson
member
Registered: 12/17/00
Posts: 154
Last seen: 21 years, 5 months
Re: levels [Re: aluminum_can]
    #374410 - 08/19/01 02:16 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

that is interesting. i think genetic code is how one would see themselves before they were born. your right we do not have a lot of freedom because we are all written into a program. we all start out with basically the same hardware, our individuality depends on what software(life experience) is plugged in from there(which i find quite funny because we consider thought unique even though it is just a copy of other thoughts- we all want to know "God's" thoughts but can you achieve origin with copies of copies). however, in rare cases our code is deviated for the better- Einstein(sp). then there are not so rare cases where the code is deviated for the worse- genetic disease.

your existance is chemical. altered states are your elements. ~me


--------------------
your existance is chemical. altered states are your elements. ~me


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OfflineSampson
member
Registered: 12/17/00
Posts: 154
Last seen: 21 years, 5 months
Re: levels [Re: Sampson]
    #374414 - 08/19/01 02:18 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

perhaps genetic knowledge is another level.

your existance is chemical. altered states are your elements. ~me


--------------------
your existance is chemical. altered states are your elements. ~me


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OfflineColtergeist
Stranger
Registered: 08/19/01
Posts: 2
Loc: Canada, Alberta
Last seen: 22 years, 1 month
Re: levels [Re: Sampson]
    #375923 - 08/21/01 09:23 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

With respect to levels, what kind of ?levels? of being do insects have? I mean?does a small bug even experience things like humans (hunger, joy, the color red) They must be hungry but do they feel the raw sensation of hunger. Do they have the same sort of visceral consciousness overlaid on all thoughts, stimlus and actions that we humans do and would anyone consider that a level of being anyways? And if our minds or whatever go into another dimension when we die, do bugs go there too? Even if they are just complicated robots walking around with no real consciousness?
That?s a lot of questions with no answers?but I?d like to know what you all think!




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OfflinePhyl
old hand
Registered: 01/17/00
Posts: 597
Loc: United Kingdom
Last seen: 14 years, 1 day
Re: levels [Re: Phyl]
    #376094 - 08/22/01 02:11 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

The book bridging their works is, "Holographic Universe", by Michael Talbot
Thanks, I'll check that out...


Believe it or not, I actually did, and I would recommend this book to everyone. It put's forwards some very interesting ideas, and provides a theory that integrates science and spirituality. I'm not sure I agree with absoloutly everything in the book, but it mostly agrees with my view of reality and consciousness



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OfflineArCh_TemPlaR
enthusiast
Registered: 07/15/01
Posts: 200
Last seen: 21 years, 4 months
Re: Hologram [Re: Phyl]
    #380270 - 08/27/01 08:15 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

Ah, I thought the book will compliment your belief structure.

This link introduces the science behind holographic imaging [by Prideaux J]:
http://www.acsa2000.net/bcngroup/jponkp/#chap2

The word "holography" is derived from Greek roots meaning "complete writing". The idea is that every part of "the writing" contains information about the whole. A hologram (the material manifestation of a holograph) is a photographic emulsion in which information about a scene is recorded in a very special way. When the hologram is illuminated, you see a realistic, three-dimensional representation of the scene. If you cut the holographic photographic plate up into small pieces, the whole image can still be extracted from any of them (although with some loss of clarity). Pribram uses the term holonomy to refer to a dynamic (or changing) hologram.


*** Karl Pribram bases his work on the brain as being holographic: as a synthesizer and by how it stores sensory perceptions and memories. There has been experiments done on the visual system of the brain by using Fourier mathematics to prove his "holonomic brain theory." Basically, Pribram asserts:

1. the brain stores a memory by distributing the holographic impression all over its systems, where each part holds the entire impression.

2. the brain essentially uses fourier principles to transform domains [like visual, sound]

3 Hence, hologram, brain, and fourier are operating interdependently

*** In "Holographic Universe", the author defines the Fourier mathematics as:

Roughly speaking what Fourier developed was a mathematical way of converting any pattern, no matter how complex, into a language of simple waves. He also showed how these wave forms could be converted back into the original pattern. In other words, just as a television camera converts an image into electromagnetic frequencies and a television set converts those frequencies back into the original image, Fourier showed how a similar process could be achieved mathematically. The equations he developed to convert images into wave forms and back again are known as Fourier transforms.

*** As for me, I don't exacly disagree with the author's statements about the holographic quality with other phenonemon [NDE, OBE, parnanormal]. My complaint is he doesn't make a clearcut connection or explain it better.

For Twilight



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OfflineEuphoricDream
Seeker

Registered: 08/28/01
Posts: 17
Last seen: 20 years, 9 months
Re: levels [Re: aluminum_can]
    #381165 - 08/28/01 11:53 PM (22 years, 29 days ago)

Alot of times i wonder if the things that aluminum_can said are true. Maybe we are all just fooling ourselves. I found what he said about being no differant when u die then when u are born really thought provoking. I had never looked at it like that before. But my only problem with this whole theory is that like when al_can says it is so impossible or unlikely that aliens would find and travel to our planet out of such an incomprehensibly vast universe, then what do u think about life itself. Did we arise simply because out of pure chance a bunch of differant atoms combined in a way that they suddenly started to move intentionaly, reproduce, and eventually think. I just cant buy that. The bilogical processes that go on in your body every second seem to be to complex to credit to pure chance. I dont claim to have the answer, i question whether there is something more out there everyday. But there are times that i just cant deny that i feel connected to something greater. Yes this deffinentlty happens when i trip but it also sometimes happens at the most random times in my daily life. Its just a feeling you get in your gut that u cant deny no matter how rational u try to be. At these times i feel that we are all part of something far greater than oursevles alone.



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