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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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What is after death?
    #3573411 - 01/03/05 12:23 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Whatever comes after death holds huge implications for the human race. Does one particular religion have it right when it comes to describing the afterlife? Is there no afterlife? Do a person's beliefs affect what they experience in the afterlife?

I think the only real tangible evidence of what is in the afterlife that we have is the "near death experience". Does anybody have any information on this phenomenon? Are there some similar things that occur regardless of a person's race, location, ethnicity, culture, or religion?


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Offlinezahudulallah
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Re: What is after death? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3573416 - 01/03/05 12:25 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

The Afterlife is Substance instead of Form.


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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: What is after death? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3573529 - 01/03/05 12:54 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

my current idea is that after death we will essentially be in a dream state, our conciousness continuing to create an illusory external world and an equally illusory body to explore it in. It may be a lucid dream state, of instant manifestation. in this case, our previous expectations will shape our experience significantly. one who believes deeply in hell will experience that as he concieves of it, if he believes that is where he is going.

This would be consistent with near death experiences, where the person usually recounts a surreal dreamlike but vivid vision, and will often see religious images, but those images will be dictated by prior beliefs. catholics see saints, jews abraham.

similar principle to sensory deprivation and regular dreams. cut off from bodily stimulus and sensation, the mind rapidly creates its own set of perceptions.


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Everything I post is fiction.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: What is after death? [Re: Moonshoe]
    #3573541 - 01/03/05 12:57 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I have no memories of before I was born...after death may be similar...
No pain anyhow. I will embrace eternity as I will have no choice in the matter.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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Offlinedeff
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Re: What is after death? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3575254 - 01/03/05 04:35 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

but wouldn't that imply that the religious conditiong and belief structures that one held during life was not lost at death, as in through losing connection to the physical brain, which stores these memories and behavioural functions?

to me, it seems that these aspects of being would be lost at death, as they are all physical in origin, and ultimately are a false wardrobe atop our true selves (or true self- as in, we are all the same being :wink:)

personally, I think that death is not a linear experienced event like that of life. human perception creates this linear transition due to linking moments of being and holding a continued sense of singular self, much the same as a motion picture creates the illusion of true motion.

when we lose the physical body and therefore the physical ability to create an experience of linear 'time travel', 'we' are left with our most bare, non-physical, observatory state of awareness.

now comes the question of what would fill this awareness, if anything at all. the idea of a lucid dream state, imo, might be experienced while the brain is still functioning prior to complete death (much like in waking life), but I do not personally believe such a state would exist, alteast perceivable by our living standards of logic. of course, one could argue this state would not exist after my death for the reason that i do not believe it will, and this remains rational to the idea, but obviously impossible to prove either way.

to me, it seems, that we are all one source of Beingness, or consciousness. that we are all one awareness that has not so much fragmented apart, but has slid into tunnels of false containment, such as the ego. this sliding is in essence the travel through time as a stationary dimension. this means that nothing exists without the perception of it, and so, that consciousness literally is the IS factor to the universe. if this is the case, it will not be so much what "happens" to "me" at death, but rather what already IS for US in ETERNITY :smile:

and then the concept of enlightment or ascension comes into play. now, perhaps this state is reached when the pure awareness following death does not attach itself or traverse down another tunnel of illusionary seperate existence, and instead dissolves back into the whole or source of the flow. if this is the case, then at death, assuming enlightenment is not reached, "we" are temporarily drawn back to the source before re-entering another tunnel of experience.

now, does the self remain singular and constant? i really do not think that it is a linear flow from one life to another like many propose reincarnation to be. rather, at the momet of return to source, this infinite awareness is all One, in that when it is re-drawn out into experience (the tunnels), it has 'mixed' with remaining awareness as to not remain the same.

now all of this was one rather long analogy of the wordless whole. i struggle with explaining my views on this, because as i do, it reads back to me like i meant something i actually tried to avoid. but, alas all we have are words :cool:. the state of 'return to source' though is not linear as our verbiage implies, but is rather eternally and simultaneously occurring with all experience. we are all one on a fundamental level, yet our onesness is divulged in order to create inner awareness of this SELF, to in turn create self-awareness on a univseral level.

i really dunno though :smile:


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OfflineGomp
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Re: What is after death? [Re: deff]
    #3575612 - 01/03/05 06:24 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

-yes- indeed, What is...


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Disclaimer!?


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InvisibleSkorpivoMusterion
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Re: What is after death? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3575917 - 01/03/05 07:40 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)



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Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: What is after death? [Re: SkorpivoMusterion]
    #3575926 - 01/03/05 07:43 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

with little real estate equity,
one might want a condo after death.

basically - looking for investments, outside of this realm, is a red herring.

I like the moment as the cosmos and I think it is plenty to work with; keeps changing too.


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Invisibleuriahchase
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Re: What is after death? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #3576174 - 01/03/05 08:38 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

i think you all should look into Wiccans "omnicyclic Universe" theory...that's where i'm at for now. ~makes sense~


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Wanting to be someone else is a waste of the person you are -Kurt Cobain
       



     
Hotter than the left sink handle.


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InvisibleHelp on the Way
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Re: What is after death? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3576184 - 01/03/05 08:40 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

everything else except ourselves


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:shocked: *Divine Moments of Truth* :shocked:


"Limitless undying love which shines around me like a million suns - it calls me on and on across the universe" ~ John Lennon

"Once in a while you get shown the light in the strangest of places if you look at it right" ~The Grateful Dead

"Religionists, with their guaranteed eventual paradise, of which they know nothing, taking it all on 'faith,' can't be expected to understand or sympathize with those with a yen to storm the Gate of Heaven and see for themselves what all the praying's about!" ~Robert Hunter


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InvisibleGreat_Satan
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Re: What is after death? [Re: Help on the Way]
    #3576213 - 01/03/05 08:50 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)



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Offlineendokrin
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Re: What is after death? [Re: Great_Satan]
    #3832353 - 02/25/05 12:00 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

...life


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"If King Kong sells drugs, we'll put him in jail"


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OfflineMAIA
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Re: What is after death? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3832409 - 02/25/05 12:24 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

What is after death?




The ultimate uncertainty, and the ultimate certainty is death itself ...

MAIA


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Spiritual being, living a human experience ... The Shroomery Mandala



Use, do not abuse; neither abstinence nor excess ever renders man happy.
Voltaire


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InvisibleJellric
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Re: What is after death? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3832867 - 02/25/05 02:04 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Do a person's beliefs affect what they experience in the afterlife?

Yes, if you believe the NDE reports. Those who were very religious in life tend to be greeted at some point by their God, be it Krishna, Buddha, Mohammad, Jesus, etc. "He" seems to appear in whatever form that soul would recognize. Those who are not religious tend to see a white light which envelops them with intense feelings of love and wisdom.

Are there some similar things that occur regardless of a person's race, location, ethnicity, culture, or religion?

Yes. People tend to experience initially traveling through a dark tunnel or energy membrane and emerging into the presence of disceased loved ones. In the case of NDEers they are told something to the effect "It is not your time yet." At that point they find themselves back in their bodies dealing with whatever trauma caused them to have the NDE in the first place.

Presumably the others go on to merge fully in the spiritual realm and there are third party accounts of that process as well if you're interested.


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I AM what Willis was talkin' bout.


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OfflineAldous
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Re: What is after death? [Re: Jellric]
    #3833008 - 02/25/05 02:31 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Jellric said:
Do a person's beliefs affect what they experience in the afterlife?

Yes, if you believe the NDE reports. Those who were very religious in life tend to be greeted at some point by their God, be it Krishna, Buddha, Mohammad, Jesus, etc. "He" seems to appear in whatever form that soul would recognize. Those who are not religious tend to see a white light which envelops them with intense feelings of love and wisdom.


It seems that beliefs affect the form of what is experienced (the identity of the saintly person seen (be it Krishna... etc.), but not its essence. Religious NDE's occur also in atheists, most of the time profoundly changing their beliefs for the rest of their lives afterwards. So in this respect, I think there's a major element of the experience that is independent of belief, culture and whatnot.

Quote:

Presumably the others go on to merge fully in the spiritual realm and there are third party accounts of that process as well if you're interested.


Yes, I am. But how did you get those accounts? Through channeling?  :eek:


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OfflineProsgeopax
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Re: What is after death? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3833034 - 02/25/05 02:35 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

RandalFlagg said:
Are there some similar things that occur regardless of a person's race, location, ethnicity, culture, or religion?



Decomposition.


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Money doesn't grow on trees, but deficits do grow under Bushes.

You can accept, reject, or examine and test any new idea that comes to you. The wise man chooses the third way.
- Tom Willhite

Disclaimer: I reserve the right to change my opinions should I become aware of additional facts, the falsification of information or different perspectives. Articles written by others which I post may not necessarily reflect my opinions in part or in whole, my opinions may be in direct opposition, the topic may be one on which I have yet to formulate an opinion or have doubts about, an article may be posted solely with the intent to stimulate discussion or contemplation.


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InvisibleJellric
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Registered: 11/08/98
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Re: What is after death? [Re: Aldous]
    #3833125 - 02/25/05 02:55 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

But how did you get those accounts? Through channeling?

Nothing so mystical. I got them over the internet. :wink:


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I AM what Willis was talkin' bout.


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OfflineAldous
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Re: What is after death? [Re: Jellric]
    #3833235 - 02/25/05 03:20 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

OK, but how could they be told in the first place? By definition, those are stories of people who did NOT come back.

And, feel free to post a link or stories.


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InvisibleJellric
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Re: What is after death? [Re: Aldous]
    #3833387 - 02/25/05 04:29 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Many individuals over human history have had what they perceived as visions of the spiritual realms. Do a search on 'afterdeath communication' and you should find plenty to whet your appetite.


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I AM what Willis was talkin' bout.


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: What is after death? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3833462 - 02/25/05 04:53 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

NDE's seem to happen when there's activity in certain parts of the brain... which ends when people actually die.

What's the evidence that a 'near death experience' has anything to do with what actually happens when we die?


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"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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