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OfflineHershey
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LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms?
    #3521960 - 12/19/04 09:58 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

I've heard that it is a lot, and I just want to hear for sure if lsd is more dangerous than mushrooms(mentally). The only case I can think of is Syd Barrett, and I'm not sure of his family history or anything like that. So, I just want to know if it is any more dangerous, and if so, provide some evidence(like a link or just anything). Thanks!


--------------------
Breathe, breathe in the air.
Don't be afraid to care.
Leave but don't leave me.
Look around and choose your own ground.

Long you live and high you fly
And smiles you'll give and tears you'll cry
And all you touch and all you see
Is all your life will ever be.
:stoned:


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InvisibleSociety
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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: Hershey]
    #3522073 - 12/19/04 10:21 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

There are multiple users on this forum who have suffered negative consequences from both LSD and mushrooms... including psychosis and HPPD.


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InvisibleWorld Spirit
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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: Hershey]
    #3522118 - 12/19/04 10:30 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

There has not been enough research done on this to give you a good enough answer.

I'd think it safe to say that "most" hippies will tell you to stick with what's natural if you're concerns are strong. One hippie at a headshop told me that he has nothing against Hofmann's concoction but he's seen way more bad trips "and people who ended up in rough shape" after LSD was involved.

Cacti, Ayahuasca, Psilocybes are "considered" more gentle when taken RARELY, in the right place and an appropriate time, with the appropriate people or by oneself.

www.erowid.com will give you some horror stories that are probably quite true and some delightful experiences that are probably quite true.


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OfflineHershey
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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: World Spirit]
    #3522238 - 12/19/04 10:52 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Yeah, I've looked up on erowid and searched here, and neither has said directly. I guess that means there is no direct answer. Eh, I don't have a history of mental illness anyway, so I'm not worried about it.

BTW, erowid doesn't have anything at all about psychosis in the mushrooms section. That is one thing that has led me to believe they are a bit safer but I don't know.

EDIT:hmm, even in the experiences archive of mushrooms mental illness is not mentioned, whereas several cases of psychosis and hppd are mentioned with lsd. that may or may not mean anything, but I think I will at least try mushrooms first, and be more cautious with lsd(not that I won't be cautious with shrooms..I mean like set a limit on how often to do it and the max number of hits.)

I don't know, maybe I'm over-analyzing this..


--------------------
Breathe, breathe in the air.
Don't be afraid to care.
Leave but don't leave me.
Look around and choose your own ground.

Long you live and high you fly
And smiles you'll give and tears you'll cry
And all you touch and all you see
Is all your life will ever be.
:stoned:


Edited by Hershey (12/19/04 10:59 PM)


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InvisibleWorld Spirit
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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: Hershey]
    #3522449 - 12/19/04 11:38 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

It's probably healthy to plan in advance and read about the effects. (!)

I once read an article in a magazine named "Shaman's drum" where the author used the following phrase "Ayahausca can exact a price that you may not be prepared to pay."


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: Hershey]
    #3522890 - 12/20/04 02:14 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

I think the dangers are pretty close to equal, but I've actually found quite a few people who say that LSD is much more gentle than mushrooms, and this certainly holds true for me.


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"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: Phluck]
    #3523448 - 12/20/04 07:54 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

I think the dangers are pretty close to equal, but I've actually found quite a few people who say that LSD is much more gentle than mushrooms, and this certainly holds true for me.




My feelings as well. I don't think there has been much, if any, research done in this area... why waste money on research, we all know that "drugs are bad, m'kay" (stupid governments)... I really doubt that either substance is safer or more dangerous to a persons mental wellness than the other...


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Offlinemoosehead
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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: Hershey]
    #3523582 - 12/20/04 09:45 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

I dont have much experience with lsd, but I find that it tends to be kinder than mushrooms. Mushrooms, at higher doses tends to take you places you dont wanna go.


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OfflineMushmonkey
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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: moosehead]
    #3525281 - 12/20/04 08:32 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

really i think it doesn't matter.

if you're going to have a bad trip, you're going to have a bad trip, whether you're on lsd or shrooms..  and such things tend to just jump out of nowhere, so i can't say if it's easier on acid or shrooms.

i've had a nasty, nasty acid trip that left me pacing and shakey, and i've had a nasty, nasty shroom trip that left me curled up in a little ball..  the former was in my apartment alone, and the latter was behind several tens of thousands of people at neil young, bonnaroo, and both did have good points..  kinda like eating a lime.  tasty but so damn sour.

six to one, half dozen to the other.

long term.. there's no telling :wink:  to actually test it i'd think you'd have to have a group of people who do neither, a group who trip only acid, and a group who trip only shrooms, and well..  that's way too much hassle.


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Offlinebrowndustin
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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: Mushmonkey]
    #3525637 - 12/20/04 11:11 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

My understanding leads me to believe that generally it's easier to stay consistantly happy when on acid. Mushrooms can be somewhat of an emotional roller coaster, and it's easier to lose track of things when you try clinging to your ego.

Everyone that I've seen on acid are usually so happy, that there's not much room for error while trippy. However, and again from what I've read about acid, it seems that it can very well be destructive at the same time. And there's the catch about psychedelics, they vary so much from person to person. Asides from doses and preparation, all trip reports and information of the like I now almost completely disregard. Confidence and setting are key.

I hope that this can shed a little bit of light on the subject. Perhaps it may not be what you were looking for, but I'm trying to help.


--------------------
When the stress burns my brain it's like acid raindrops
maryjane is the only thing that makes the pain stop


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OfflineAdamist
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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: Hershey]
    #3525793 - 12/20/04 11:51 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

I agree with whoever said it doesn't really matter. It all depends on your state-of-mind going into the trip. I've had bad trips on both mushrooms and LSD, but generally I would have to say that LSD is actually harder for me to have a "bad trip" on.

Mushrooms have a way of distorting reality so strongly that it's hard to deny, while LSD is more of a mental thing with me, making it easier for me to distinguish the drug from reality.


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Offlinekrin
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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: Adamist]
    #3526855 - 12/21/04 09:02 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

for me mushrooms seem to jumble the world up in a way that seems to be out of my control,whereas on acid it feels more like the source of all my hallucinations and feelings are from myself,and in that way easier to handle and cope with.
from what ive observed in a few people close to me and myself,mushrooms tend to make you a moody person,it tinkers with your emotional control,acid just makes you spaced out.
dats just one view tho


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InvisibleCosmicJokeM
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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: Hershey]
    #3530634 - 12/22/04 08:15 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

well, with a little preparation and a guide you should be able to instantly give up your thought based tension that puts a squeeze on all your sensations, thoughts, ideas, and beyond.

however, we're mentally addicted to all sorts of unnecessary tensions (belief systems) and feel more comfortable keeping them as they always have been, even though they can make us miserable. the more you struggle the easier it becomes to be having a panic attack during a very intense drug experience. sure, you could find yourself in a worse mental state, more scatter brained, and less rhythm and life.

each drug is equally safe or dangerous, imho.


--------------------
Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.


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Offlinedeathcapcubensis
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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #3558269 - 12/29/04 07:19 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

All drugs change your brain chemeistry in one way or another...period. When you are dealing with hallucinogens this is about 10 fold in my opinion. things happen on psychs, be it natural or unnatural. Just know the risks, and be prepared to take them, I do. Taking this path towards enlightenment is not as safe as a meditation, for example, wich also changes your brain chemistry, its just not as forced, you sort of train your mind and it slowly eases its way into a new way of thinking its sort of like, "stretching". I just ahd a wonderful trip on shrooms, but it increased my anxiety and hppd. My hppd started with a very powerful negative experience on LSD, wich made me very suicidal for a long time, it felt like nothing was real. I had an equally powerful bad trip on mushrooms a while back. But was fine after. I just dont think we will ever be able to prevent or predict such reactions, while theyre chances can be decreased considerably they, I dont believe, chemicals so powerful will ever be able to be tamed by us.


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OfflineJCoke
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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: deathcapcubensis]
    #3558412 - 12/29/04 07:57 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

syd barrett showed signs of schizophrenia before ever touching drugs, he also did both shrooms and acid, we can't really tell witch was worse for him, so he's not a good example as for as the question goes...

both have been known to cause hppd.

I dont think one is more dangerous than the other.


--------------------
hello, your name is life on earth
------------------------------------

"I traveled a long way seeking God, but when I finally gave up and turned back, there He was, within me! O Lalli! Now why do you wander like a beggar? Make some effort, and He will grant you a vision of Himself in the form of bliss in your heart." -the saint of the Kashmir Shaivism tradition: Lalli.


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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: JCoke]
    #3562839 - 12/30/04 09:53 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

I'm new to the shroomery. first post actually. anyways, I've been looking for a forum like this to ask some advice about my mental instability since my first trip on acid a little over two months ago.

I had heard before that you shouldn't trip unless you're in a generally stable place in your life. I was definitely not. I had just started at a college that I totally hated. My boyfriend lived over 6 hours away. I hated class, wasn't going and smoking myself into oblivion. My best friend from home flew up for the weekend and I had purchased some micro dots for the occasion. She used to trip on acid all the time, but it was my first time so I was very unprepared.

I bought 14 with a friend up at school and he took 4 a couple of days before my best friend and I took them. When I asked him about the trip he said that it was pretty mild and what he described sounded very similar to the trips I had had when I took less than an 1/8 of shrooms. He took them at about 10pm and was able to sleep at 2am.

With the knowledge of his experience my best friend and I thought it would be fine to take 5 micro dots each. whoops.

We took them at 9:30pm and started feeling the effects about a 45 minutes later.

The first half of the trip was the most amazing thing I think I have ever experienced and because of this i don't regret taking the acid. My body has never felt so amazing. My ceiling was breathing and soon melted completely and started raining all over the room. My carpet turned into millions of Technicolor worms moving and shaking with the music... wow. Sgt. pepper's makes perfect sense to me now. Creating art was such a different experience. Everything I drew was animated the entire time. Time ceased to exist. i told my sober friends that they didn't have to hang around and that we would be fine on our own. I honestly thought I'd be fine. I felt amazing.

But the second have of the trip was not so fun. It almost felt like the bad trip came on suddenly. My body no longer felt amazing, instead i was in terrible pain all over and felt very sick. My friend was going through the exact same thing. The visuals that were once so beautiful changed. I tried to get into bed and sleep but there was no way. Once i closed my eyes the visuals got so much more intense. I can't describe in words what I saw, it would do no justice. Basically what I saw no person should ever have to witness. I saw some of the most frightening things imaginable. It was during this part of the trip that my friend and I were both convinced that we were completely crazy. I was afraid to leave her alone but I had to go to the restroom (never a nice place while tripping). When I came back she was huddled in the corner telling me that she was thinking about jumping out of my 4th floor window and i had come back just in time. At about 7am the sun still hadn't come up and we we're still tripping hard/bad. We were convinced that the sun had come up but to us it was going to be dark forever. I really thought i was insane. At 7:30 i tried going to sleep again... i just wanted the Trip to stop. I couldn't take it anymore. i closed my eyes and completely blacked out. I became conscious again at 12:30pm. When I woke up she was still freaking out but I wasn't tripping anymore.

i was not OK after the trip. My best friend and I came down hard. The depression was unbearable. We drove up to San Fran that night to visit a friend, where we proceeded to each take adderol before going out. also not a good idea considering that it will heighten any feelings of depression. I stayed up until 5am that night and barely spoke any words to anyone. my friend and I felt completely dead. I dropped her off at the airport the next day with just a goodbye. I broke down on my drive back to school and decided that i had to move back home. I was not stable enough to handle any of this. I was having a major panic attack after the trip and had to make an emergency trip to a medical clinic to get anti-anxiety medication to clam my nerves.

I moved back home a week later. I took about a week to feel slightly normal again. I'm still recovering from the trip and I worry sometimes that this feeling of being completely disconnected from reality will be with me forever. Every once in awhile things still move like I'm tripping.

What used to seem real/normal doesn't make sense to me anymore. I don't understand purpose or why we're here at all and it really bothers me. I can say that I've gotten better but not close to how i used to be. I feel very isolated and get lost in my thoughts everyday. I've become very uncomfortable with myself and with living in general. The only release i have is the fact that i have a lot of responsibility..school, 2 jobs, an apartment to pay for... and it distracts me from thinking too much.

I'm sorry about the length of my post and the fact that it's mostly about LSD but i don't really know where else to turn. I guess I just need some advice, support... I don't know. My anxiety is till really intense and I still feel very disconnected from what is "real."

I appreciate anyone's help. I really need it.


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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: Hershey]
    #3562945 - 12/30/04 10:21 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Drugs affect people differently, so I can't speak for everyone here, but I can't really imaging having this happen to me on shrooms.


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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InvisibleWorld Spirit
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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: mrs_crazy]
    #3563027 - 12/30/04 10:52 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Hello there and welcome to this site.

I will try to be brief.

I may be able to point out two things that can help you.

1. You're focusing on stuff you're not meant to focus on, let alone get answers out of. Try to get out of a state of mind in which you're questioning and analyzing every single detail. A little analysis here and there is fine, but constant analysis will drive anyone up the wall. I would personally recommend the use of herbal teas to help calm your nerves. One to three cups each day of Valerian powder Tea (www.mountianroseherbs.com) may prove to be very helpful. Herbs in general will probably help you quite a bit.
Tip: Tonics will strengthen you
Tip: Sedatives will help you chill out but this is best in every-now-and-then scenarios.

2. How strong is your mind? Only as strong as Being will allow. How strong is your heart? Only as strong as Being will permit. And how strong is that body of yours? Only as strong as Being allows.
If you're going to run headfirst into Reality, you'd better where a helmet of some sort (a logical yet adaptable theological approach to life). It's best to know yourself and the mind in general before experiencing a psychedelic food. No matter how strong-willed you are, no matter how well-read you are and intelligent you are, you must learn that the trip isn't yours to begin with. Therefore, only trip if you are lead or feel Permission has been granted.

It doesn't have to be this serious. Yet for some of us, some of the time, it is this serious. Smile regardless. Be thankful. Take it all as experience and move-on as gracefully as you can. There is a time and a season for each thing. Ride this season into the next one.

Be well.


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: mrs_crazy]
    #3570575 - 01/02/05 11:50 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Welcome to the Shroomery. Firstly, after having read your trip report and the replies, Enter offers some good advice. I would add, somewhat paternalistically (but then, I'm an 'elder') that your decision to take LSD without an experienced guide and for undefined purposes was the first mistake. The second mistake was to take Adderal, a psychostimulant, when your entire system was in need of rest and restoration. You taxed your adrenal glands which contributed all kinds of stress responses throughout your body. The other neurotransmitters were already in an unstable condition from the acid. Psychologically, I need say nothing. YOU know from your experience. Lay off any psychostimulants, and consider buying some 5-HTP, the precursor to the production of the neurotransmitter Serotonin. Either that, or eat s**tloads of turkey, milk and bananas (but I prefer the capsule even if it's not cheap).

If you look back, you'll probably find that feelings of 'dissociation' or 'derealization' have always occurred. Andrew Weil, M.D. pointed this out in one of his books. When we have these after having taken acid (with its negative connotations, guilt about it) we then attribute these transient experiences of disengagement as some kind of 'flashback.' These can be considered very useful states from the point of meditation. They do not prevent one from functioning in the world, although it seems as though your body and thoughts are not yours. Don't be afraid - read some Buddhist psychology (on meditation states, or 'jhanas'). Buddhist psychology is much older and wiser than the Western theories which consider such states to be 'pathological' (abnormal), not 'transpersonal' (transcending the personality) or 'spiritual' (the religious term for transpersonal).

Taking entheogens/psychedelics must be done under guidance, with purpose and with a model with which one knows how to move the psychic energy which is generated and which pools (like in the solar plexus) upward, such as Hatha Yoga. Without such 'scaffolding,' nothing is going to be constructed. These things are like a rocket and its launch gantry. Without such preparations, a trip is nothing more than the ignition of a big pile of rocket fuel - WHOOSH - colors, light, flash, and nothing. Nothing gained, nothing learned, arrival at no destination. And then, the possibility of 'burn out.' Please take heed, and take care.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


Edited by MarkostheGnostic (01/02/05 06:49 PM)


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Offlineholio1
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Re: LSD mentally more dangerous than shrooms? [Re: silversoul7]
    #3576556 - 01/03/05 10:10 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

silver soul, i could see that happening just as easily on a high dose of mushshrooms

as a matter of fact, very similar things have occured, while not necessarily to myself or with parents. i have seen friends unintentionally turn violent upon others who presented no harm and often they cannot even recall it
a lot people wont have this as 'the' main reason for taking large doses alone, it should be considered as somewhat important still


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