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OfflineMushroomFriend
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Colonisation speed VS. Quantity of spores
    #3520710 - 12/19/04 04:07 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Hello

In my short period of growing mushrooms I think I have found that a syringe where I can see spores in colonises much faster then the "clear" syringe.

It makes sense to me. More starting points in the substrate. Also at this board there is part who want their syringes as purple as possible and a part who says if it has spores thats enough does not matter if it is 1000 or 50000.

I must say that my syringes from a certain vendor (clear can not see anything) start colonising very slow. While from another vendor (can see spores) grows rocket fast. The first shows spots of myc after 5-6 days, the second shows wide lines of myc after 3 days.

Anyway, isnt it simple logic that the more spores the faster it will colonise?

Just like if you spawn 10 quarts of colonised grain to 20 quart of bulk, colonisation will be faster then 4 quarts spawned to bulk.

Or 1 drop liquid cult in a grainjar will be slower then 20 drops liquid cult in jar.

And so on...

If I am wrong at this, why? Why would it work like this with g2g or agar 2 grain or grain to bulk and not with "spores 2 grain"?

Thank you.

MF


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OfflineKaptKid
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Re: Colonisation speed VS. Quantity of spores [Re: MushroomFriend]
    #3520749 - 12/19/04 04:19 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Are your test spore syrinres the same strain?

I Also agree with you.

The faster colonization happens the less chance of contam's. :mushroom2:


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InvisibleMagashM
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Re: Colonisation speed VS. Quantity of spores [Re: MushroomFriend]
    #3520751 - 12/19/04 04:19 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

He he he....your in for it. Many people will say it doesn't matter if they are clear or not. I did many many many tests on this and there is no way this is the case. Dark syringes are much faster but clear syringes will give you more ryzzo growth. With the massive amount of spores you get much more Cotton looking growth.

They say that ryzzo growth puts out much more shrooms then the cotton growth the only prob I have with that is I'm a purple syringe user and I haven't seen ryzzo growth in jars for a long time. With the cotton growth these seem to happen




That whole ryzzo thing is something I have to do more research on.

OK folks you ready to flame me here's the syringes  :tongue:
:razz:


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OfflineMushroomFriend
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Re: Colonisation speed VS. Quantity of spores [Re: KaptKid]
    #3520762 - 12/19/04 04:24 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Ehm no not the same strain, I know what you mean.... :wink: But same substrate. Really huge difference.
The fast one has like white (inch wide) stripes within 3 days, the slow one has only  some white small spots after 6 days. So it is not only slower (less  mating partners?) but also not as "tight". No network.

Hmz the language is killing me now... :grin:


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OfflineMushroomFriend
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Re: Colonisation speed VS. Quantity of spores [Re: MushroomFriend]
    #3520775 - 12/19/04 04:28 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Holy christ those syringes are almost black!

But I knew I could count on you Magash! :thumbup: :lol:

I just learned this weekend that agar people love the rhizo, that they give better flushes I did not hear before.

But I will sign for flushes you show there in the pictures! :grin:

My first selfmade syringe:


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OfflineKaptKid
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Re: Colonisation speed VS. Quantity of spores [Re: Magash]
    #3520778 - 12/19/04 04:29 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Can't argue with those pic's :thumbup:

:mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroom2:


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Invisibleagar
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Re: Colonisation speed VS. Quantity of spores [Re: KaptKid]
    #3520821 - 12/19/04 04:41 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

:thumbup: :thumbup:More innoc points in anything, lead to faster colonization.Simple math.  :wink:


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OfflineMushroomFriend
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Re: Colonisation speed VS. Quantity of spores [Re: agar]
    #3520849 - 12/19/04 04:50 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Ah agar joins the club.. :laugh:


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Offlinelemon_lw
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Re: Colonisation speed VS. Quantity of spores [Re: MushroomFriend]
    #3520926 - 12/19/04 05:10 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

how the hell do you get them that black magash?


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OfflineAnnoA
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Re: Colonisation speed VS. Quantity of spores [Re: lemon_lw]
    #3521108 - 12/19/04 06:01 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

>More innoc points in anything, lead to faster colonization.Simple math.

It is not that simple.
What is important is the amount of VIABLE spores.
A syringe can be black, but if all the spores are old and non viable, it is worthless.

If the spores are fresh, the syringe can be nearly completely translucent and still germinate very fast.

As for the amount of spores: there is a point where there is no difference whether there are 10,000 viable spores in a syringe or 10,000,000. As long the spores are fresh(=viable), both will colonize equally fast.


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OfflineMushroomFriend
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Re: Colonisation speed VS. Quantity of spores [Re: Anno]
    #3521155 - 12/19/04 06:10 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Hmz Anno thanks,

Presuming same quality, I still think it makes a difference the quantity. Or is it the amount of CC? Like 1 CC with 100000000 spores cant spread much but 5CC with same ammount of spores will colonice faster cause the water transports it better through the substrate?

And still, same CC, same quality, but different quantity it makes so much sense to assume that plays a role too. Just like quality and other variables.

Another Q, which "things" can make a spore less viable?
- age?
- which temperatures? (freezing? warmth?)
- light?
- ?

EDIT: now you say it Anno, the strain which colonized so agressively was very fresh! I remember the "vendor" (its more a foundation) saying that he just made new sporewater, and he said the spores started germinating in 5 days at 62,6 F!



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Edited by MushroomFriend (12/19/04 06:14 PM)


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Offlinescatmanrav
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Re: Colonisation speed VS. Quantity of spores [Re: MushroomFriend]
    #3521217 - 12/19/04 06:28 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

5cc's will generally do worse because you will throw off your water content. I think what Annos point is, it will level off. 100 spores in a cc will do the trick..1000 will be say 5 times as better as 100 and 10000 will be say 2 times better then 1000 and 100,000 would be just as good as 10,000 and 10,000,000

My numbers are completly made up..but its not a straight line graph, more of a parabola which will almost level off at a point where you won't notice a difference.

I'm sure Anno will have more answers for your post..


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"life is like a drop of rain getting closer and closer to falling into a lake, and then when you hit the lake there is no more rain drop, only the lake."

Growing with bags, start to finish (including my new grain and substrate prep)
Anyone looking to start bulk tubs/mono tubs/shotgun hybrids? Good tubs to use..
How I do grain (old still good tips)
Turn your closet into a fruiting chamber
Casing layer colonization and overlay


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OfflineAnnoA
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Re: Colonisation speed VS. Quantity of spores [Re: scatmanrav]
    #3521252 - 12/19/04 06:38 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

>My numbers are completly made up..but its not a straight line graph, more of a parabola
>which will almost level off at a point where you won't notice a difference.

Exactly

>which "things" can make a spore less viable? age? which temperatures? (freezing? warmth?) light? .

Age, warm temperatures, oxygen and light.


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InvisibleNOS4A2
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Re: Colonisation speed VS. Quantity of spores [Re: scatmanrav]
    #3521254 - 12/19/04 06:38 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I'm surprized noone brought up liquid culture.

ooops! :crazy2:


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OfflineMushroomFriend
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Re: Colonisation speed VS. Quantity of spores [Re: MushroomFriend]
    #3521265 - 12/19/04 06:41 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

the 5CC was just as made up as yours smr :grin:  for the theory. Spores need to be transported through the substrate their medium is water in this case. Much much much spores and very little water is inefficiento imho.

I understand that, that both 1000 and 100000 will do the trick. But just as adding 1 teaspoon of spawn to a grainjar or 5 tablespoons. They both do the trick but I dont have to tell you which is faster.

And maybe in a substrate as little as a quart 100.000 or 50.000 spores dont make a difference, but the difference between a purple syringe and a waterlike syringe is much more the ntwice as much spores, rather factor 10.
Makes sense, one sporeprint, one syringe, one sporeprint 10 syringes.

Ok ready for more info! :thumbup:

Edit: Ah Anno already reacted. ok for a small space like one quart it might equal a bit, but I am not really convinced yet! Will do some tests in the future to find tha trueth! :laugh:

Still I think all variables matter, quality, quantity, of spores and of substrate. Also the medium (water in this case) quantity does matter. 1 billion spores (made up hehe smr) in 1/4 CC will probably give worse results then 1 million in 2CC.

But if everything is constant and quantity differs, if I can choose I choose for the billion. ;P


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Edited by MushroomFriend (12/19/04 06:49 PM)


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OfflineMushroomFriend
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Re: Colonisation speed VS. Quantity of spores [Re: NOS4A2]
    #3521303 - 12/19/04 06:54 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Why? Those are not spores.
And I think I brought it up.

Logically 1 CC of liquid culture will colonise slower then 2 CC of that same liquid culture.

I think teh difference in size/amount of the medium (water here as well) plays a big role. Since it is the transporter of the myc/spores.

I am not convinced that a clear syringe is just as "good" as a purple one (rest of variables is equal) but ive woken upp on the "other variables part".

Quantity does play a role ofcourse, but so does quality (which is influenced by different variables).

I think purple = better quality :grin:


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