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Zhuangzi pg. 48-49 wrote:
Suppose you and I have had an argument. If you have beaten me instead of my beating you, then are you necessarily right and am I necessarily wrong? If I have beaten you instead of your beating me, then am I necessarily right and are you necessarily wrong? Is one of us right and the other wrong? Are both of us right or are both of us wrong? If you and I don't know the answer, then other people are bound to be even more in the dark. Whom shall we get to decide what is right? Shall we get someone who agrees with you to decide? But if he already agrees with you, how can he decide fairly? Shall we get someone who agrees with me? But if he already agrees with me, how can he decide? Shall we get someone who disagrees with both of us? But if he already disagrees with both of us, how can he decide? Shall we get someone who agrees with both of us? But if he already agrees with both of us, how can he decide? Obviously, then, neither you nor I nor anyone else can know the answer. Shall we wait for still another person?
But waiting for one shifting voice [to pass judgment on] another is the same as waiting for none of them? Right is not right; so is not so. If right were really right, it would differ so clearly from not right that there would be no need for argumentation. If so were really so, it would differ so clearly from not so that there would be no need for argumentation.
-------------------- suicide a permanent solution to a temporary problem
Then i would be interested in the objectivity of the argument. Being right or wrong about non objective or relative ideas can be translated in the process of following a moral code or ethics as base for argumentation. Being right or wrong about any objective or factual ideas can be translated in the logical process of simply being right or wrong.