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Invisibledownforpot
Stranger
Male
Registered: 06/25/01
Posts: 5,715
Re: Shrooms make you Schizoid? [Re: Mastaba]
    #350522 - 06/28/01 11:09 AM (21 years, 3 months ago)

what if i got hit in the head real bad and got a concussion? think itll get worse?



--------------------



http://www.myspace.com/4th25


"And I don't care if he was handcuffed
Then shot in his head
All I know is dead bodies
Can't fuck with me again"


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InvisiblethePilgrim_0
Stranger
Registered: 05/11/01
Posts: 19
Loc: Spain
Re: Shrooms make you Schizoid? [Re: Thor]
    #350912 - 06/29/01 02:09 AM (21 years, 3 months ago)

Very right, conphormant:

I have been lately reading some books about psychology from my sister, who studied it, and that?s is morelikely what it said. Schizo brains contain a excessive activity of the NT dopamine, probably due to a larger proportion of the receptors of such NT. Any amphetamine, MDMA (extasi) included, exarcebates the activity of Dopamine in the brain, being such use fatal in a schizophrenic brain.
On the other side, LSD and Psylocibin are more similar in structure to the neurottansmiters serotonin and neropinephrine. So I believe (only my opinion) shrooms won?t get you schizo -as long as we use our vocabulary properly, instead of messing up concepts by rambling...
It is true that -some- schizo brains are also different to "normal" ones; still, also normal brains may be schizophrenic, though in these cases it is easier to treat.
Schizophrenia is believed to be caused due to:
a)biological basis: genetic predisposition, neural missadjustments...
b)behavorial basis: parental lose, bizarre parental comunication, self-alienation...
c)social, familiar margination, radical exclussion, trauma...
---

There are many disorders making pray out of society, and schizophrenia is not always the word to be used to denominate an aparent disorder. Depression, obsessive compulsive disorder, manias (phobias), bipolar disorder (mood constantly switching from depression to a very agitated state---remember the beats: "raving maniacs"?), anti-social personality (Kid?) -sociopath, narcisst disorder,,,

I am going to bed, what did I just write>?



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OfflineRashiki
enthusiast

Registered: 05/24/01
Posts: 201
Last seen: 20 years, 2 months
Re: Shrooms make you Schizoid? [Re: trendal]
    #350921 - 06/29/01 02:28 AM (21 years, 3 months ago)

A long time ago i believe it was the late 50's early 60's correct me if i'm wrong. But any way the date isn't really important the fact is psychologists began taking lsd because they thought that the effects would show them what being schitzophrenic was like. Well a bunch of the students they were teaching and giving it to started doing it recreationally, and when further studies were done they found that lsd is nothing like being schitzophrenic in fact they have found that pcp gives an accurate feeling of what schitzophrenia is like. Do your own research at erowid.org and you will find that lsd and shrooms are just as safe as marijuana, if you are healthy to begin with. If you have a history of mental illness then don't take them because they have been know to bring out latent mental problems, But THEY DO NOT CAUSE THEM. And there is no such thing as a permanent trip!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Go to erowid and learn the truth and stop all the stupid rumors surrounding acid and shrooms!!!



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love the life you live, live the life you love


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OfflineRashiki
enthusiast

Registered: 05/24/01
Posts: 201
Last seen: 20 years, 2 months
Re: Shrooms make you Schizoid? [Re: conphormant]
    #350929 - 06/29/01 02:43 AM (21 years, 3 months ago)

"The chemistry of your brain under the influence of psychedelics and the chemistry of schizo's is basically the same."
Where in the hell did you hear that!!!! Because it is still unknown as too how exactly hallucinagens do what they do to make you trip. It is a mystery that has only been guessed at and not discovered so don't be making shit up or mindlessly repeating some parternship for a drug free america bull shit man.
peace and stop the rumors



--------------------
love the life you live, live the life you love


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InvisibletrendalM
J♠
Male User Gallery

Registered: 04/18/01
Posts: 20,808
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Re: Shrooms make you Schizoid? [Re: Rashiki]
    #351041 - 06/29/01 05:05 AM (21 years, 3 months ago)

You have a problem, Rashiki.

First off, the statement "The chemistry of your brain under the influence of psychedelics and the chemistry of schizo's is basically the same" is a very good statement. A lot of research has been done on the issue of just how hallucinogens work. Not enough, granted, but some.

Most hallucinogens appear to work by affecting the serotonin receptors in your brain. I'm too lazy to look it up right now (long day) but didn't someone here say that one of the theorized causes of schitzophrenia were disorders involving serotonin/dopamine? So that statement that you so readily bashed is, in fact, valid enough.

It's perfectly fine for you to dissagree with that statement. Your opinion is your opinion. But to say "don't be making shit up or mindlessly repeating some parternship for a drug free america bull shit man" makes you come off as a real jackass.

-----------------------
You, too, can become a Sideburn Wearing Drug Buddy.


--------------------
Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.


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OfflineRashiki
enthusiast

Registered: 05/24/01
Posts: 201
Last seen: 20 years, 2 months
Re: Shrooms make you Schizoid? [Re: trendal]
    #351106 - 06/29/01 06:53 AM (21 years, 3 months ago)

the fact of the matter is that there is not enough info to say something like he said. No one knows exactly just what goes on in the brain when you are tripping what I am saying is that the relationship between tripping on lsd and schitzophrenia has been researched and concluded that tripping on lsd is not like being schitzophrenic nor does tripping cause schitzophrenia. Just because the two involve the same chemicals doesn't make the chemistry the same. For instance one could be a severe lack of serotonin and the other a distortion of serotonin-not the same chemistry. Take X for example it causes a large release serotonin yet it is clearly not the same chemistry although it involves the same chemicals. Take this for example both ecstasy and lsd have something to do with serotonin but it is definately not the same chemistry. In the same way both lsd and schitzophrenia have something to do with serotonin, but it is not the same chemistry.
by the way sorry if the comment bothered anyone. please accept my appologies it has been one of those days for me too.
peace and love to all.



--------------------
love the life you live, live the life you love


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InvisibleKid
Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 07/22/00
Posts: 2,365
Re: Shrooms make you Schizoid? [Re: thePilgrim_0]
    #351141 - 06/29/01 07:56 AM (21 years, 3 months ago)

> anti-social personality (Kid?) -sociopath

Sociopath is a worse degree of Anti-social personality disorder. Psychopath is the worst degree of it. The diagnostic criteria for ASPD is as follows:

There is a pervasive pattern of disregard for and violation of the rights of others occurring since age 15 years, as indicated by three (or more) of the following:

failure to conform to social norms with respect to lawful behaviors as indicated by repeatedly performing acts that are grounds for arrest

- Yes, but probably everyone on this board would meet this criteria.

deceitfulness, as indicated by repeated lying, use of aliases, or conning others for personal profit or pleasure

- Other than internet use (aliases), I don't meet this criteria on nearly a regular basis.

impulsivity or failure to plan ahead

- nope.

irritability and aggressiveness, as indicated by repeated physical fights or assaults

-nope.

reckless disregard for safety of self or others

- Safety of others, yes, but not a reckless disregard. Safety of self, no.

consistent irresponsibility, as indicated by repeated failure to sustain consistent work behavior or honor financial obligations

- nope.

lack of remorse, as indicated by being indifferent to or rationalizing having hurt, mistreated, or stolen from another

- Sometimes.

The individual is at least age 18 years.

- Yes.

There is evidence of Conduct Disorder with onset before age 15 years.

- Nope.

The occurrence of antisocial behavior is not exclusively during the course of Schizophrenia or a Manic Episode.

- I'm neither schizophrenic nor bipolar.


I fully meet 1 of the diagnostic criteria and perhaps 2. I've also read a lot of books about ASPD, sociopathy and psychopathic personality disorder. I've checked out Robert Hare's psychopathy checklist. Also, I happen to know a forensic psychiatrist (she works with psychopaths). I am not anywhere near diagnosable with ASPD, nor any other personality disorder for that matter. I don't know why you'd think I do based on my online persona.

A real psychopath, sociopath, and/or anti-social personality really sticks out.



or the European criteria if you prefer:Personality disorder, usually coming to attention because of a gross disparity between behaviour and the prevailing social norms, and characterized by at least 3 of the following:

(a) callous unconcern for the feelings of others;

- Yes, though not all others, which would really make this a maybe.

(b) gross and persistent attitude of irresponsibility and disregard for social norms, rules and obligations;

- No.

(c) incapacity to maintain enduring relationships, though having no difficulty in establishing them;

- No.

(d) very low tolerance to frustration and a low threshold for discharge of aggression, including violence;

- No.

(e) incapacity to experience guilt and to profit from experience, particularly punishment;

- No.

(f) marked proneness to blame others, or to offer plausible rationalizations, for the behaviour that has brought the patient into conflict with society.

- By no means a "marked proneness", more of an opportunist. Usually the antisocial personality will rationalize his/her responsibility away even when evidence is stacked against them (eg// Ted Bundy and the Chi Omega murders).

There may also be persistent irritability as an associated feature. Conduct disorder during childhood and adolescence, though not invariably present, may further support the diagnosis.

- Irritability is on an off, and typically not present during face to face interactions. No conduct disorder.


If you want to read some really amusing examples, to get a feel for it, of what psychopathic personality disorder really makes people like, read Hervey Cleckley's _Mask of Sanity_. They are some truly fucked up people. One notable feature of the antisocial personality is that the antisocial behaviour is typically carried out for no real reason (lack of motive) and the person has a shockingly shallow affect (shallow emotions), as well as an astonishing lack of anxiety.




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OfflineCrobih
rap-cord
Registered: 11/04/98
Posts: 2,015
Loc: cave
Last seen: 10 years, 27 days
Re: Shrooms make you Schizoid? [Re: Kid]
    #351266 - 06/29/01 04:29 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

Sch. is in matter of fact group of simmilar diseases. SIMMILAR. Next, do not any of you ever try to believe LSD or SHROOMs are safe for you cause they do not effect dopamine sites. They are WELL KNOW as inducers of psychosis. I know MANY people who where or where not diagnosed as schyzos -ut where kind of weird-, and some of them decided to play with halucinogens. Drug effects on imbalanced brain chemistry where too strong to them, and most of them would enter into acute state of their illness.
This is no bullshit, so if you guys have possibilitie of being latently sick, DO NOT PLAY with THESE DRUGS. You can play with MJ, with H but must never play with LSD or shrooms - even I believe shrooms are safer-.
But if you choose to play with them, you have to be aware that you are risking a LOT.

____________________________________
Friend to PGF, the Last Resort of lucidity in Western Hemisphere (sp?)


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InvisiblePynchon
Slow Learner

Registered: 04/28/01
Posts: 578
Loc: New Zealand
Re: Shrooms make you Schizoid? [Re: Crobih]
    #351296 - 06/29/01 05:21 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

Bah. Are you saying there are no schizophrenic members of the Native American Church? Psychedelics, taken in the proper environment, can be safely used by anyone.



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OfflineCrobih
rap-cord
Registered: 11/04/98
Posts: 2,015
Loc: cave
Last seen: 10 years, 27 days
Re: Shrooms make you Schizoid? [Re: Pynchon]
    #351549 - 06/30/01 12:46 AM (21 years, 3 months ago)

Its up to one. But I and medical literature are hardly against it. Unless you love being schizoid.

____________________________________
Friend to PGF, the Last Resort of lucidity in Western Hemisphere (sp?)


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Offlinemissulena
enthusiast
Registered: 05/27/01
Posts: 251
Last seen: 20 years, 7 months
Re: Shrooms make you Schizoid? [Re: Crobih]
    #351590 - 06/30/01 02:12 AM (21 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah thats really good advice crobih, i dont think people with mental illness should take psycedelics because even everyday reality is overwhelming for them so imagine what tripping would be like for them



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InvisiblePynchon
Slow Learner

Registered: 04/28/01
Posts: 578
Loc: New Zealand
Re: Shrooms make you Schizoid? [Re: missulena]
    #351766 - 06/30/01 09:15 AM (21 years, 3 months ago)

I accept that a person with latent schizophrenia is more likely to develop the illness after being exposed to psychedelic drugs, but I'm not so sure I believe that someone who is ALREADY schizophrenic is more prone to having an "overwhelming" trip than anyone else. In my experience, its the "straight" people who end up out of their depth more often. But I could be wrong, and I would genuinely like to know more about this subject...anyone have any references?



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