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OfflinePhred
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I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one
    #3438674 - 12/02/04 06:50 PM (12 years, 3 days ago)

Swiss TV has video of French Army helicopters firing without warning on an Ivory Coast demonstration, on November 6, 2004.

http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/?entry=13791_French_Helicopters_Fire_on_Ivory_Coast_Civilians

pinky


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Offlinezahudulallah
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Registered: 10/21/04
Posts: 10,579
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Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: Phred]
    #3438690 - 12/02/04 06:53 PM (12 years, 3 days ago)

Damn lefties.


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Offlinelonestar2004
Live to party,work to affordit.
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Registered: 10/03/04
Posts: 8,978
Loc: South Texas
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Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: zahudulallah]
    #3441355 - 12/03/04 10:41 AM (12 years, 2 days ago)

the BBC has just mentioned for the first time something about the u.n. scandal. (they are doing an investigation) so there is hope. maybe in a few years the media will jump on this one.


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America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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InvisibleCJay
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Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: Phred]
    #3441416 - 12/03/04 11:05 AM (12 years, 2 days ago)

Sounds like the 'developed' nations of the world alright.
All the same.
Sounds like governments the world over - all as bad as each other.

Burn the witch! Burn the witches!


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OfflineGazzBut
Refraction

Registered: 10/15/02
Posts: 4,733
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Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: Phred]
    #3441449 - 12/03/04 11:19 AM (12 years, 2 days ago)

Do you believe this to be true because its on some website? Tsk..pinky I thought u were more critical than that.


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Always Smi2le


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Invisibleafoaf
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Registered: 11/08/02
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Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: GazzBut]
    #3441480 - 12/03/04 11:34 AM (12 years, 2 days ago)

anything to back up the left-wing media conspiracy crock.

I mean....some blog site and an unintelligible video shot
in bad light.

THE CONSPIRACY MUST BE TROOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!


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All I know is The Growery is a place where losers who get banned here go.


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OfflinePhred
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Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: GazzBut]
    #3441716 - 12/03/04 12:38 PM (12 years, 2 days ago)

The video is from a Swiss TV station. I was unable to post the direct link because I can't cut and paste it -- it stays in my browser window for maybe a tenth of a second before it starts downloading instead. That's why I linked to the blog rather than directly.

You are of course aware there have been multiple reports from several international media sources of French troops (not helicopter gunships but infantry armed with rifles) firing into crowds of unarmed civilians with no warning as well, aren't you?

You're not? I wonder why that might be.

Here are some links to look at. You can tell me whether or not these links meet your criterion of credibility.

From http://www.adetocqueville.com/200411282252.iasmqbi27779.htm --

Meanwhile in Ivory Coast?s main city Abidjan, Ivorian police chief Colonel Georges Guiai Bi Poin gave a damning account of clashes that reportedly pitted French forces against protesters at a rally on November 9.

Guiai Bi Poin said he was in charge of about 60 gendarmes outside Abidjan?s Hotel Ivoire to prevent demonstrators from storming the building.

He told AFP: ?French troops fired directly into the crowd. They opened fire on the orders of their chief Colonel D?Estremon. Without warning.?

Guiai Bi Poin he said he was at the French colonel?s side in the hotel lobby throughout the night.

Ivorian authorities said a total of 57 civilians were killed and more than 2,200 injured between November 6 and 10, including an unconfirmed number by French troops ? but there is no specific toll for the Hotel Ivoire protest.

Followers of President Laurent Gbagbo accused French soldiers, including snipers hidden in the hotel, of firing on ?Young Patriot? loyalists.

Until now, Alliot-Marie has insisted the victims were killed in clashes between Young Patriots and Ivorian police. The French military says only that warning shot were fired in the air.

But Alliot-Marie told RTL radio Sunday, without specifically referring to the Hotel Ivoire incident, that some casualties may have been caused by French troops during the demonstrations.

?They were forced to shoot,? she said. ?They carried out warning shots and, in a few cases, were forced to make full use of their firearms. There was no way of avoiding it.?

?There were doubtless a few victims; we don?t know for certain because when things take place by night it is very difficult to know what is going on.?

She said there were ?also a great number of victims inside the crowds, killed by the crush and also from a number of stray bullets,? and insisted French troops had shown admirable ?self-control and restraint? in ?abominable circumstances, faced with a crowd armed with Kalachnikov rifles and guns.?

Guiai Bi Poin said the crowd at the Hotel Ivoire was yelling insults but was unarmed.

?Not one of my men fired a shot,? he said. ?There were no shots from the crowd. None of the demonstrators was armed ? not even with sticks, or knives or rocks.?

He said that when he reported to the French commander on the day of the riot, he was told: ?Colonel, my barbed wire has been crossed, and the crowd is getting excited. If they do not let us leave within 20 minutes, I am going to shoot.?

?Suddenly,? said Guiai Bi Poin, ?there was a movement on our left and my gendarmes were pushed violently by the crowd. They fell back a meter or two. D?Estremon then said to me, ?Colonel, the red line has been crossed. I am going to open fire. FIRE!??

The officer said the French troops began shooting. ?It was not a haphazard fusillade. It was carried out on the orders of their chief. And there was no warning.?

Guiai Bi Poin said he yelled at the French officer to fire in the air, to aim higher, ?He did this but some of his men did not obey and some continued to fire on the crowd. I saw lots of people falling, but I do not know how many victims there were.?

From a Reuters report http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/L29703422.htm

PARIS, Nov 29 (Reuters) - French soldiers opened fire on crowds of angry youths during days of mob violence and looting in Ivory Coast earlier this month, French Defence Minister Michele Alliot-Marie said.

French forces had previously said they fired warning shots during the unrest, but Alliot-Marie told France?s RTL television on Sunday night the troops had most probably ?made full use of their weapons? in some cases.

The mob violence erupted after government forces killed nine French soldiers and an American aid worker in a bombing raid on the rebel-held north, prompting the former colonial power to destroy most of Ivory Coast?s small air force in retaliation.

The Ivorian government has repeatedly accused French forces of firing on crowds of unarmed demonstrators, particularly at the Hotel Ivoire in the main city, Abidjan. Paris has insisted the protesters were often armed with guns and machetes.

Alliot-Marie said the French troops sometimes had no choice but to open fire, particularly when they were returning from other parts of the country to protect French and other foreign nationals from attack in Abidjan.

?When they tried to stop our armoured vehicles from getting to Abidjan, to stop them from protecting our citizens and other foreigners who were victims of the violence, they had to fire,? she said.

?Naturally, they fired warning shots and in some cases, most probably, they had to make full use of their firearms. That is the reality. There was nothing else that could be done.?

From the Los Angeles Times: http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-fg-ivory10nov10,1,2466600.story?coll=la-headlines-world

"French soldiers opened fire on a crowd of pro-government demonstrators near the residence of Ivory Coast President Laurent Gbagbo, killing five people, witnesses said.

"The bloodshed by peacekeepers stationed at the nearby Hotel Ivoire in Abidjan seemed likely to fuel more anti-French sentiment in the cocoa-producing West African nation."

From The Guardian http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,1280,-4605511,00.html --

"ABIDJAN, Ivory Coast (AP) - Security forces opened fire Tuesday as thousands of angry government loyalists massed outside a French evacuation post for foreigners, reportedly killing seven people and wounding 200 in violence pitting France against its former prize colony.

France's military denied responsibility, saying it was loyalist demonstrators who opened fire as a French convoy left the post, and Ivorian security forces who returned fire."

In this MPEG video http://radioci.embaci.com/englishdownload/frenchsoldiersshootingcivilians2.mpg -- you can see French troops firing indiscriminately on unarmed Ivory Coast civilians.



I thought Ivory Coast was an independent nation. Maybe I was wrong about that and they are still a French colony.

Do any of the readers of this thread who routinely condemn the coalition in Iraq for being there without USNC approval recall the French getting UN Security Council permission to have armed forces there, much less armed forces that are "at war"?


pinky


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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: Phred]
    #3441855 - 12/03/04 01:12 PM (12 years, 2 days ago)

You're not? I wonder why that might be.

Care to tell us your latest conspiracy theory? Is it because the american media love the French?  :rolleyes:

Do any of the readers of this thread who routinely condemn the coalition in Iraq for being there

I think you're confusing things. They are condemned for launching an illegal invasion of another sovereign state in defiance of the UN and installing their own puppet.


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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero

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Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: Xlea321]
    #3441981 - 12/03/04 01:37 PM (12 years, 2 days ago)

> Is it because the american media love the French?

Ah yes, the American media:

http://www.guardian.co.uk <--- United Kingdom
http://radioci.embaci.com <--- France

> and installing their own puppet.

I think you are confusing things. There is no American puppet government in the middle east, especially in Iraq.


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Just another spore in the wind.


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InvisibleXlea321
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Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: Seuss]
    #3442036 - 12/03/04 01:48 PM (12 years, 2 days ago)

Ah yes, the American media:

Yes, those are UK and French sources. Obviously they have reported the story so I presume pinky is referring to the US media? Otherwise the title of his thread is nonsensical.

There is no American puppet government in the middle east, especially in Iraq.

So who is propping up Allawi right now?

The most amusing puppetry was when the Iraqis said "We will be releasing female prisoners" after Bigley was kidnapped. The americans said "No you won't" and the Iraqi "government" then said "We will not be releasing female prisoners".


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Don't worry, B. Caapi


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InvisibleVvellum
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Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: Phred]
    #3442430 - 12/03/04 04:01 PM (12 years, 2 days ago)

if this barely documented video is true, then fuck that.

...but sometimes tells me that if it were American troops, you'd
say something like "well this is what happens with stupid demonstrators get unruly."


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InvisibleGreat_Satan
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Registered: 09/05/04
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Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: Vvellum]
    #3443139 - 12/03/04 07:16 PM (12 years, 2 days ago)



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InvisibleGreat_Satan
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Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: Great_Satan]
    #3443144 - 12/03/04 07:17 PM (12 years, 2 days ago)



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OfflinePhred
Fred's son
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Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: Vvellum]
    #3443685 - 12/03/04 10:22 PM (12 years, 1 day ago)

There are at least two videos -- one showing the helicopter attack, the other showing the troops firing into the crowd. There are also the print reports from such diverse sources as AP, Reuters, and AFP.

What I find interesting is contrasting the outrage over a soldier shooting an Iraqi combatant who was purportedly playing dead vs the lack of outrage over French troops and helicopters firing at unarmed demonstrators. The only reason I can determine for the difference is that one involved a US soldier and the other involved French soldiers.


pinky


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InvisibleGijith
Daisy Chain Eater

Registered: 12/04/03
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Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: Great_Satan]
    #3443958 - 12/03/04 11:54 PM (12 years, 1 day ago)

Checked Google to see who's running this so far::

ABC (australian)
BBC
CTV
CBC
Associated Press
MSNBC


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what's with neocons and the word 'ilk'?


Edited by Gijith (12/04/04 03:43 AM)


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OfflineGazzBut
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Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: Seuss]
    #3444466 - 12/04/04 03:31 AM (12 years, 1 day ago)

Quote:

I think you are confusing things. There is no American puppet government in the middle east, especially in Iraq.




Thats a good one! tell me another...


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Always Smi2le


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Invisiblecarbonhoots
old hand

Registered: 09/11/01
Posts: 1,351
Loc: BC Canada
Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: Phred]
    #3444467 - 12/04/04 03:31 AM (12 years, 1 day ago)

Quote:

What I find interesting is contrasting the outrage over a soldier shooting an Iraqi combatant who was purportedly playing dead vs the lack of outrage over French troops and helicopters firing at unarmed demonstrators. The only reason I can determine for the difference is that one involved a US soldier and the other involved French soldiers.





OK then...

I'm pretty sure no one here is in favour of the French murdering the innocent. What do you think?

Anyways, in a thread about the American murdering the downed Iraqi fighter, a lot of posters were in favour of it.

Do you find that interesting?


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  -I'd rather have a frontal lobotomy than a bottle in front of me

CANADIAN CENTER FOR POLICY ALTERNATIVES


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InvisibleTeragon
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Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: Phred]
    #3444484 - 12/04/04 03:42 AM (12 years, 1 day ago)

Is it just me...or is shooted NOT a word?

They used it twice in that link of yours...

Quote:

It?s a REALMEDIA video (23 seconds only). It?s from a Swiss TV (TSR.CH) news show from 30.11.2004.

You learn that the 6 .11.2004 french army helicopters shooted WITHOUT ?warnings shots? on the crowd made of hundreds people.

??????

Here is a translation:

(speaking about 9.11.2004, Ivoiry hotel ?massacre? )

?....However it?s wasn?t the first time French Army shooted without ?warning shots? (shot in the air).

We are on November 6, three days before the shooting of the hotel ivory.

the demonstrators (manifestors) move towards the French military base. French helicopters shoot directly at the demonstrators.

There would have been sixty died at the time of these various operations.

Tonight, the French Army admits ?a score? of about 20 deaths.

??????

This Swiss TV investigation is made by the same person who forced french army to acknoledge the ?9 november ivoiry hotel massacre". (It?s based on differents witnesses, and some French TV Canal+ images)




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need that cash to feed them jones.


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InvisibleXlea321
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Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: Phred]
    #3444594 - 12/04/04 05:03 AM (12 years, 1 day ago)

What I find interesting is contrasting the outrage over a soldier shooting an Iraqi combatant who was purportedly playing dead

As usual you appear to have twisted the truth into a lie to suit your prejudices. He wasn't "purportedly playing dead". He was laying on the floor seriously wounded, helpless and unarmed.

Incidentally - you quote the Guardian reporting the story. A newspaper you probably consider the most left-wing and biased of all "left-wing rags". Doesn't this tend to demolish your theory that the "left-wing" media won't report the story?


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InvisibleXlea321
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Re: I'm sure we'll see the media jump all over this one [Re: Phred]
    #3444650 - 12/04/04 06:45 AM (12 years, 1 day ago)

The only reason I can determine for the difference is that one involved a US soldier and the other involved French soldiers.

It is also interesting that this appears to be the only reason why you raise threads when France kills a handful of civilians yet remain strangely silent while the US butchers thousands upon thousands in Iraq.


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Don't worry, B. Caapi


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