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InvisibleGreat_Satan
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Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims
    #3428976 - 11/30/04 07:09 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

You'll notice that the USA isn't giving any compensation because nobody in the USA is responsible

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Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims

MISNA

CHILE: LAGOS PRESENTS TORTURE REPORT TO NATION, PENSION FOR VICTIMS

?A truth owed to us to complete the work of recovery and justice?. This was how the President of the Chilean Republic, Ricardo Lagos, in a radio-TV address to the nation, officially presented the report of the National Commission on political detention and torture (?Comisi?n Nacional sobre la Detenci?n Pol?tica y la Tortura?), presided by the Catholic Bishop Sergio Valech and consigned to him after a year?s work on Wednesday, November 10. The document, undisclosed until yesterday, contains the testimonies of 35,000 people submitted to torture during the dictatorship of Augusto Pinochet Ugarte (1973-1990); the stories were gathered throughout Chile and in other 40 nations, through diplomatic delegations. In expressing himself ?moved? by the content of the report, President Lagos stated that ?if the responsibility of State agents was compromised? in those years, due to the barbaric acts committed by the dictatorship, the State must therefore ?adopt measures to indemnify the effects of such sufferance?. For this reason, the President of the Republic announced the prompt introduction in Parliament of a bill that foresees the recognition of a lifetime pension of 112,000 pesos (equivalent to around 150 Euro), as well as home and health benefits, in favour of the 35,000 torture victims of the Pinochet regime. ?How could we have lived 31 years in silence, a silence that enhanced the damages of the sufferance of what we had wanted to occult? Lives were destroyed, covered with a thick blanket of silence, and this must end?, stated a visibly tense Lagos, reminding that political detention and torture represented an institutional practice in the 17 years of the regime, during which at least 3,000 political opposers were assassinated.

http://us.oneworld.net/article/view/98751/1/


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Offlinefalcon
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: Great_Satan]
    #3430437 - 12/01/04 12:51 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

nobody in the USA is responsible

so it would seem...


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InvisibleDNKYD
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: Great_Satan]
    #3430486 - 12/01/04 01:04 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Great_Satan said:
You'll notice that the USA isn't giving any compensation because nobody in the USA is responsible




You forget that the CIA assassinated Salvador Allende, their democratically elected leader. Then they replaced him with Pinochet, who tortured these thousands of innocent people.

http://expage.com/notowar3e

So when you say "nobody in the USA is responsible" you are dead wrong. Check your facts before you make absurd comments like that.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: DNKYD]
    #3432315 - 12/01/04 12:54 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Your link doesn't work. Further, I searched for expage and it is some apparent blog by some guy named William Wallace. You really need to come up with better sources if you're going to allege that the CIA assassinated Allende


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InvisibleDNKYD
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: zappaisgod]
    #3432778 - 12/01/04 02:55 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

As you wish:

Quote:

1964 ? 1973
American-backed Overthrow of the Democratic Government of Chile

Estimated civilian deaths: over 5000 people from the subsequent Pinochet terror campaign; at least 1000 people missing and presumed dead

From Killing Hope
by William Blum:

[Democratic Marxist President] Salvador Allende was the worst possible scenario for a Washington imperialist, [who] could imagine only one thing worse than a Marxist in power ? an elected Marxist in power, who honored the constitution, and became increasingly popular. This shook the very foundation stones on which the anti-Communist tower was built: the doctrine, painstakingly cultivated for decades, that ?communists" can take power only through force and deception, that they can retain that power only through terrorizing and brainwashing the population.

After sabotaging Allende?s electoral endeavor in 1964, and failing to do so in 1970, despite their best efforts, the CIA and the rest of the American foreign policy machine left no stone unturned in their attempt to destabilize the Allende government over the next three years, paying particular attention to building up military hostility. Finally, in September 1973, the military overthrew the government, Allende dying in the process.

They closed the country to the outside world for a week, while the tanks rolled and the soldiers broke down doors; the stadiums rang with the sounds of execution and the bodies piled up along the streets and floated in the river; the torture centers opened for business; the subversive books were thrown into bonfires; soldiers slit the trouser legs of women, shouting that ?In Chile women wear dresses!?; the poor returned to their natural state; and the men of the world in Washington and in the halls of international finance opened up their check-books. In the end, more than 3,000 had been executed, thousands more tortured or disappeared.
(End of Killing Hope excerpt)

In the bloody coup of September 11, 1973, Henry Kissinger and the CIA helped General Augusto Pinochet overthrow the democratically-elected leftist government of President Salvador Allende. The Fascist puppet-regime of Augusto Pinochet then embarked on a 17-year terror campaign against the people of Chile, which included mass arrests and executions, death squads, torture and disappearances. Many of the victims were fingered as ?radicals? by lists provided by the CIA.

Santiago?s national stadium was used as a mass execution site. Robert Saldias, the first army officer to come forward publicly without concealing his identity, said prisoners entering the stadium were identified by yellow, black, and red discs. ?Whoever received a red disc had no chance,? Saldias said.

Many of the professional torturers and assassins in the Chilean military (and in every other Fascist country of Central and South America) were trained at the School of the Americas, in Fort Benning, Georgia.

Under Pinochet, Chile also participated in ?Operation Condor,? a joint collaboration between the U.S.-backed dictatorships of Chile, Argentina, Paraguay, Uruguay and Brazil to hunt down and murder exiled opponents of those regimes. Successful hits included the 1976 car-bomb explosion in Washington D.C., which killed Allende?s exiled foreign minister Orlando Letelier, and his aide, American Ronnie Moffitt.




http://free.freespeech.org/americanstateterrorism/ChronologyofTerror2.html#Chile73

expage.com is a website hosting service, not a blog website. But the above link should satisfy you.


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Invisibleafoaf
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: Great_Satan]
    #3433112 - 12/01/04 04:26 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

for all the volumes of supported and well cited information
provided to the contrary, it's amazing that you still resort
to fallacious attempts to disprove something that's a proven
historical fact.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: DNKYD]
    #3433366 - 12/01/04 05:12 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Another loony-link that doesn't even support your allegation that the CIA assassinated Allende. Keep trying. If all you can find are loony-links to support your argument then maybe you should rethink your view.


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InvisibleGreat_Satan
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: zappaisgod]
    #3433700 - 12/01/04 06:28 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

http://free.freespeech.org is run by Iranian and North Korean agents. That site is nothing but lies.


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Invisibleafoaf
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: Great_Satan]
    #3433817 - 12/01/04 06:52 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

http://www2.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB8/nsaebb8i.htm

here you'll find links to the declassified CIA docs


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InvisibleKrishna
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: Great_Satan]
    #3433828 - 12/01/04 06:53 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

OK the CIA didn't assasinate him personally, but they funded, supported, attempted, etc etc etc.

Here is a post that I made in a previous thread Great_Satan made about this topic.

Quote:

Krishna said:
OK - so let's lay out the facts.

Quote:


The major CIA effort against Allende came earlier in 1970 in the failed attempt to block his election and accession to the Presidency.




Quote:


In April 1962, the "5412 Panel Special Group" - a sub-cabinet body charged with reviewing proposed covert actions - approved a proposal to carry out a program of covert financial assistance to the Christian Democratic Party (PDC) to support the 1964 Presidential candidacy of Eduardo Frei.


Also in 1962, the CIA began supporting a civic action group that undertook various propaganda activities, including distributing posters and leaflets.


In December 1963, the 5412 Group agreed to provide a one-time payment to the Democratic Front, a coalition of three moderate to conservative parties, in support of the Front's Presidential campaign.


In April 1964, the 5412 Group approved a propaganda and political action program for the upcoming September 1964 Presidential election.


In May 1964, following the dissolution of the Democratic Front, the "303 Committee," successor to the 5412 Group, agreed to give the Radical Party additional covert assistance.


In February 1965, the 303 Committee approved a proposal to give covert assistance to selected candidates in upcoming Congressional elections.


In 1967, the CIA set up a propaganda mechanism for making placements in radio and news media.


In July 1968, the 303 Committee approved a political action program to support individual moderate candidates running in the 1969 Congressional elections.


As a result of 1968 propaganda activities, in 1969 the "40 Committee" (successor to the 303 Committee) approved the establishment of a propaganda workshop.


In the runup to the 1970 Presidential elections, the 40 Committee directed CIA to carry out "spoiling operations" to prevent an Allende victory.


As part of a "Track I" strategy to block Allende from taking office after the 4 September election, CIA sought to influence a Congressional run-off vote required by the Constitution because Allende did not win an absolute majority.


As part of a "Track II" strategy, CIA was directed to seek to instigate a coup to prevent Allende from taking office (see discussion below).


While Allende was in office, the 40 Committee approved the redirection of "Track I" operations that "combined with a renewed effort to support the PDC in 1971 and a project to provide support to the National Party and Democratic Radical Party in 1972" funneled millions of dollars to strengthen opposition political parties. CIA also provided assistance to militant right-wing groups to undermine the President and create a tense environment.





Support for the coup attempt in 1970
Quote:


Under "Track II" of the strategy, CIA sought to instigate a coup to prevent Allende from taking office after he won a plurality in the 4 September election and before, as Constitutionally required because he did not win an absolute majority, the Chilean Congress reaffirmed his victory. CIA was working with three different groups of plotters. All three groups made it clear that any coup would require the kidnapping of Army Commander Rene Schneider, who felt deeply that the Constitution required that the Army allow Allende to assume power. CIA agreed with that assessment. Although CIA provided weapons to one of the groups, we have found no information that the plotters' or CIA's intention was for the general to be killed. Contact with one group of plotters was dropped early on because of its extremist tendencies. CIA provided tear gas, submachine-guns and ammunition to the second group. The third group attempted to kidnap Schneider, mortally wounding him in the attack. CIA had previously encouraged this group to launch a coup but withdrew support four days before the attack because, in CIA's assessment, the group could not carry it out successfully.





Awareness of the Coup of 1973
Quote:


Although CIA did not instigate the coup that ended Allende's government on 11 September 1973, it was aware of coup-plotting by the military, had ongoing intelligence collection relationships with some plotters, and - because CIA did not discourage the takeover and had sought to instigate a coup in 1970 - probably appeared to condone it.




Knowledge of Human Rights Violations
Quote:


CIA officers were aware of and reported to analysts and policymakers in 1973 that General Pinochet and the forces that overthrew the Allende Government were conducting a severe campaign against leftists and perceived political enemies in the early months after the coup.





Propaganda in Support of Pinochet
Quote:


After the coup in September 1973, CIA suspended new covert action funding but continued some ongoing propaganda projects, including support for news media committed to creating a positive image for the military Junta. Chilean individuals who had collaborated with the CIA but were not acting at CIA direction assisted in the preparation of the "White Book," a document intended to justify overthrowing Allende. It contained an allegation that leftists had a secret "Plan Z" to murder the high command in the months before the coup, which CIA believed was probably disinformation by the Junta.





So, you are correct - the CIA did not personally send troops to overthrow Allende. They did, however, give lots of money and direct support in the years from the last 1960s until the foiled attempt in 1970. They continued to support internal factions that were against Allende - factions that eventually overthrew his democratically elected government. They then continued to support the regime of Pinochet, even though CIA sources indicate that they had at least some knowledge of his violation of human rights. The facts speak for themselves, in my opinion. Feel free to claim the US is not responsible on the technicality that the sucessful coup attempt was an idea formulated by a Chilean group, and not by the United States. However, that group could never have functioned as they did without the unconditional support of the United States, without the over 5 years of propaganda, contra-funding, disinformation, paid kidnappings, etc etc etc that the CIA was involved in.

All the quotes are from: http://www.cia.gov/cia/reports/chile/




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InvisibleGreat_Satan
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: Krishna]
    #3433863 - 12/01/04 07:00 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Hispanics are far more prone to violence than non-Hispanic white people. That is the problem. There is corruption and violence all over Latin America.


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: Great_Satan]
    #3433871 - 12/01/04 07:02 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

:lol:

You never cease to amaze me...


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BTC - 1KqrSHZ1C3NsQP4g3PkHhppBnhdgyXr6sB


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InvisibleDNKYD
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: Great_Satan]
    #3433893 - 12/01/04 07:07 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Great_Satan said:
Hispanics are far more prone to violence than non-Hispanic white people. That is the problem. There is corruption and violence all over Latin America.




That is a very racist and incorrect statement. What's the source of most of that corruption? CIA intervention.... I honestly don't see how you could say non-hispanic white people are less violent than hispanics.


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InvisibleKrishna
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: Great_Satan]
    #3433910 - 12/01/04 07:12 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Great_Satan said:
Hispanics are far more prone to violence than non-Hispanic white people.  That is the problem.  There is corruption and violence all over Latin America.




last I recalled, it was white Europeans who led some 5 centuries of colonialism. white Europeans/Americans who led the slave-trade. white Europeans/Americans who were the primary parties in WWI and WWII. white Europeans/Americans who were the cause of the vietnam war. white Europeans/Americans who have supported many horrible regimes in Latin America, Central Asia, the Middle East, and Africa that led to civil wars, in-fighting, contra wars, and oppression of huge populations.

It seems like the "crime" you are pointing out seems to be more the desperate acts of poor, uneducated, disadvantaged people without hope or prospects. Although there are certain racial tendencies, that can also be accounted for by the historical violent acts of white Europeans/Americans.

So if you want to be racist about it, it's white people that have been the most violent force in human history. But, in my opinion, only an uneducated, prejudiced, moron of a human being would make a statement claiming that somebody is more prone to violence due to their racial makeup. :shrug:


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InvisibleGreat_Satan
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: Krishna]
    #3433949 - 12/01/04 07:20 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Krishna, you said you were from India, IIRC. Your critisism of the white race is racist. The reason you bash America is racist. Also, Muslims and Hindus have been fighting each other for hundreds of years.


Edited by Great_Satan (12/01/04 07:21 PM)


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InvisibleKrishna
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: Great_Satan]
    #3434012 - 12/01/04 07:32 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

you recall incorrectly. not sure why my racial-makeup is in question here - but anyway, my father is from india, my mother is from ohio. i don't have a "race", really. and certainly, hindus and muslims have been fighting moronic wars for as long as islam has existed... unfortunately, people have trouble with turning "spirituality" into "organised belief"

the point of my post was that you cannot make statements such as "hispanics are genetically pre-dispositioned to violence" - all races, all nations, all people have, at one time or another, been extremly violent (against their own people, against their neighbors, against other races, religions, nations, whatever). when human beings turn to violence, it can be many things - poverty, oppression, religious belief, mental disability, cultural upbringing, etc - but there is no proof that race has anything to do with this. until such time that there is such proof (which isn't gonna happen) - the statement you made is stupid and racist.

and the reason i "bash America" is because I love the Earth, I love humanity, I love the environment, I love the unifying spirit that encompassess all existence. And so, naturally, i'm against a political entity that is driven by greed, religious fundamentalists, and a basic belief that some people are worth more than others. Absolutely nothing to do with race... :shrug:


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: Krishna]
    #3434082 - 12/01/04 07:49 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Thanks Krishna, I knew I had recently read a non-hysterical thread about Chile but didn't remember where.


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InvisibleSoopaX
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: Krishna]
    #3438452 - 12/02/04 06:06 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Krishna said:

So if you want to be racist about it, it's white people that have been the most violent force in human history. But, in my opinion, only an uneducated, prejudiced, moron of a human being would make a statement claiming that somebody is more prone to violence due to their racial makeup. :shrug:




Also the most scientifically and technologically productive.


--------------------


Jackie Treehorn treats objects like women, man


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InvisibleGreat_Satan
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: SoopaX]
    #3443208 - 12/03/04 07:37 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Asian Indians are a mixture of caucasion (white), black and oriental races. I guess that's why the Hindus and Muslims keep fighting all the time.


Edited by Great_Satan (12/03/04 07:38 PM)


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InvisibleKingOftheThing
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Re: Chile to Compensate 35,000 Torture Victims [Re: Great_Satan]
    #3443215 - 12/03/04 07:39 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Great_Satan said:
Hispanics are far more prone to violence than non-Hispanic white people. That is the problem. There is corruption and violence all over Latin America.




omg, seriously ...wow that is a pretty disgusting statement


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