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Anonymous

Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws
    #3422453 - 11/29/04 11:18 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws

"...Besides California, nine other states allow people to use marijuana if their doctors agree: Alaska, Colorado, Hawaii, Maine, Montana, Nevada, Oregon, Vermont and Washington. Arizona also has a law permitting marijuana prescriptions, but no active program.

After hearing the arguments, the Supreme Court will consider whether the federal law that bans marijuana possession can be enforced in those states...."


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InvisibleFucknuckle
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: ]
    #3422488 - 11/29/04 11:37 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

It is true that Pot has it's medical reasons.

But the real reasons to make pot legal are far different then medical.

How about all the reasons for Hemp fuels? And other things?

The law makers of this country see right thru this. They know the real reasons.

To get High
To compete with Fuels


Those are the reason people should be fighting these crap laws.

I get disturbed when I read shit saying " Passing laws for legal pot use for medicial reason are the first step to legal get highs"

As a group people, Please try to say the real deal.

Nothing personal. But I think that we should just say it like it is. I know there are some saying so but not enough

Our counrty would be very very much better off with a legal and taxed POT market.

But good luck at the Surpreme court. But I think they will shoot it down only because they don't like to be tricked

Besides all those states can not make laws that break National laws. Those states have made illegal laws and that will be exactly what the Supreme Court will say.


--------------------
What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.


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Offlinericyjo
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #3422644 - 11/29/04 12:41 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Fucknuckle said:


Our counrty would be very very much better off with a legal and taxed POT market.





in one thread you flame potheads and in this one you endorse it...

with gods direction no doubt...


:thumbdown:

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/3422447/an/0/page/0/gonew/1#UNREAD


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InvisibleFucknuckle
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: ricyjo]
    #3422654 - 11/29/04 12:44 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Excuse me?

You should not talk from your...........

I don't not flame Pot heads

I am a pot head

But I am a pot head who gets things done


--------------------
What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.


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Offlinericyjo
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #3422665 - 11/29/04 12:50 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Im not a pot head.
I get things done.
and I smoke RECREATIONALLY.

I think what you are trying to say is..
it hurts you to see lazy pot heads because they don't do anything productive.

You are destined to become a motivational speaker.



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Offlinericyjo
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #3422672 - 11/29/04 12:53 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

i see your point though..

a lot of do nothing pot heads suck.

but whats worse..

is a lot of do nothing pot heads that drive escalades...

arghhh!!!

hey jealousy!


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InvisibleFucknuckle
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: ricyjo]
    #3422676 - 11/29/04 12:54 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

ricyjo said:
[in one thread you flame potheads and in this one you endorse it...






And I just noticed you got it all wrong anyway.

While I may get down on stoners who do nothing but get high and complain about the world around then and do nothing but get high.

I fully support the legalization of POT. Even if I did not smoke weed

So .............Flaming lazy potheads and endorsing legal weed are very different things :smirk:


--------------------
What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #3422687 - 11/29/04 12:58 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

> It is true that Pot has it's medical reasons.

Which negates it status as schedule-1. Even cocaine isn't schedule-1.

> But the real reasons to make pot legal are far different then medical.

Very true.

> I get disturbed when I read shit saying " Passing laws for legal pot use for medicial reason are the first step to legal get highs"

I agree 100%. I hate seeing people that want to smoke legally using the medicinal arguement. I don't want to smoke because I am sick and need to, I want to smoke because nobody has the right to tell me what I can or cannot put into my body.

> Our counrty would be very very much better off with a legal and taxed POT market.

Don't stop at cannabis, legalize everything (for adults). I don't need somebody deciding what is safe or not to put into my body, or when it is ok or not to have sex, or what time I need to go to bed at night, or what church I should attend, or what books I can read, or ...

> Good luck at the Surpreme court. But I think they will shoot it down...

I have been surprised at some of the rulings of late. Maybe, maybe not... time will tell.

> Besides all those states can not make laws that break National laws.

Other way around.

> Those states have made illegal laws and that will be exactly what the Supreme Court will say.

There are no illegal laws, only unconstitional laws.


--------------------
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InvisibleAnnapurna1
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #3422690 - 11/29/04 12:58 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

this case will be decided within days..and by a unanimous vote in favour of bush...otherwise..the SCOTUS would simply have dismissed the case...

EDIT ..and i should also add that the parliamentry structure in congress makes it impossible to change the law there too...


--------------------


"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...


Edited by Annapurna1 (11/29/04 01:08 PM)


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InvisibleFucknuckle
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: ricyjo]
    #3422694 - 11/29/04 01:00 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

ricyjo said:
You are destined to become a motivational speaker.






Thanks and yes I have made some cash doing exactly that. I also have spoken to thousands of people for free. I have been having a very strange life full of Motivational talks.

Strange as it may sound I was once a Ordained Prophet in the Assembly of God church.

I also have been a spokesman for the homeless of the Detroit area and was responsible for starting a homeless shelter in another Michigan city

And I am involved with several political agendas

I just wish people who used drugs often would stand up and be heard. :grin:


--------------------
What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.


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InvisibleGabbaDj
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #3422698 - 11/29/04 01:02 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

I havnt smoked pot in a LONG time..

Im no pot head, Im a Medical Marijuana Advocate.

As for the debate on fuel, textiles and oils... Blah, their are FAR better plants suitable for Biofuel/biomass production. Theirs already cut and gathering systems in place in every major city and suburb in the US but no fuel production system is being developed..

Every roadway and highway in the US gets mowed often. If all these trimmings were collected and converted to fuel, their would be enough to fuel every state and federal vehicle in the US..

Thats enough of that though.. The reason is NOT just to get high.. Youve never met someone who has a true medical need have you? Probably never met any of the professionals working on the legalization projects..

Sure most of the footwork is done by pot smoking young adults but the true fight is done by doctors and lawyers who know what good this drug can do for millions..

Shame on you.


--------------------
GabbaDj

FAMM.ORG          C8.com                    http://www.beatsopjefiets.com/   


Edited by GabbaDj (11/29/04 01:03 PM)


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InvisibleAnnapurna1
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: ricyjo]
    #3422708 - 11/29/04 01:07 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

>> it hurts you to see lazy pot heads because they don't do anything productive.

that raises an interesting ?...until 2003..we had the opportunity to go public with our case the same way the gays did..and we might have won had we done so...but we didnt use that opportunity and now its too late...


--------------------


"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...


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InvisibleFucknuckle
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: GabbaDj]
    #3422747 - 11/29/04 01:18 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

You have made a mistake

Medical Pot.

I think it is a very good reason


Important but, I think that all the focus on the Medical reason is foolish. And will backfire. The Goverenment will always say that the real reason are the "GET HIGH THING" And I think that may be true to a certian degree.

The bigger picture is the real truth.

And getting high is a very good reason to make it legal.

Who are they to say what I can put into my body :confused:


--------------------
What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.


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OfflineLothar121
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: GabbaDj]
    #3423526 - 11/29/04 05:00 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

I am a former medical cannabis user. The medical argument is as true as the recreational argument.

We have to fight both battles, both are equally important.

http://www.mpp.org/trials

Send a quick message to your senators. We have a bill in the house AND senate now to give medical patients an affirmative defense. Progress is being made, but you have to spread the word on the internet! Get this link around, get all the information around!

We can all agree that the Federal government is slighty out of control. This case means alot to me. But even if the states rights argument fails, we still have congress and the state legislators to turn to. Let's do this!


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InvisibleGijith
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: ]
    #3423651 - 11/29/04 05:30 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Maybe a libertarian, or someone with good knowledge of the Constitution, can shed some light on the feds' argument.

From what I've read, they're going to argue that medical marijuana should be banned under federal jurisdiction because it falls under interstate trade. They go on to say that this is true because medical pot could easily be turned around and sold as illegal pot on the street and be transported between states. So, they claim, it can't be regulated by th FDA as proper drugs could, and therefore, should be eliminated entirely. That's what I've heard. Seems kinda flimsy to me.


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Invisibleshroomydan
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: Gijith]
    #3424870 - 11/29/04 09:38 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

"medical pot could easily be turned around and sold as illegal pot on the street and be transported between states"


Isn't this true for any perscription drug?

I would love to see it pass. Maybe the reason why pot is medicinal is because getting high is good for you in moderation. I would love to be able to get a persciption.


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InvisibleGijith
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: shroomydan]
    #3424946 - 11/29/04 09:49 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

I really can't see the court ruling in favor of the states on this one. But, hopefully, I'm wrong.


--------------------
what's with neocons and the word 'ilk'?


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OfflineCatalysis
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: ]
    #3425324 - 11/29/04 11:01 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

I just saw the fox poll. 92% in favor of medical marijuana. Quite frankly, its disgusting that people are more worried about finding a bag on thier kids than a dying cancer patient getting something to make them feel better.


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: ]
    #3425409 - 11/29/04 11:22 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

If the Court votes in favor of the medicinal marijuana using people, wouldn't the DEA have the change marijuana to a schedule 2 drug, since it would then have accepted medical usage?

Of course I doubt they will, but it's a possibility


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: ]
    #3425478 - 11/29/04 11:43 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

this is a big time case!!!!! the court does not like to overturn established laws of congress, but the alternative will be to overturn states rights principles....

I PREDICT THE STATES WILL WIN.

the conservative judges are pro states rights and i think a few liberal judges will also join in. maybe they will get together and decide on a unanimous vote. that would be great.


--------------------
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We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

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OfflineAaronEvil
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #3426154 - 11/30/04 02:26 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

My grandmother is a former cancer patient. She had breast and lung cancer. They put her in kimo therapy and basically told her she might not live. They suggested that she illegally find marijuana to help deal with the pain caused by her treatment. She is living in Missouri and luckily the doctors were wrong and she overcame the cancer, but there is a point where you have to look at the problem and say "If professional doctors are advising people to use an illegal substance to help them, maybe it shouldnt be illegal." If someone you know is sick wouldnt you rather them have a medicine with minimal side effects? I would want my grandma to risk getting the munchies over a risk of heart failure or stroke.
I think pot should be legal 100% or at least left up to the states to decide, but the idea of having a plant outlawed is insane to begin with. That is like saying Redwood trees are illegal because licking the bark relaxes you. You cant cut down every redwood tree. Its natural to earth and this continent. Just like how mushrooms are illegal eventhough they grow in nature.Its crazy what the government restricts. I was taking this medication after I got my wisdom teeth out and the side effects were far more serious than those of pot. Basically, it would be an easier, and safer, drug to help people deal with certain pain and ailments.


--------------------


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OfflineDivided_Sky
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: AaronEvil]
    #3426195 - 11/30/04 02:36 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

The more I think about it the more silly Medical Marijuana is. Considering the FDA has already approved prescription THC medicines such as Marinol, that won't give you lung cancer the push to legalize it for medical use seems a little silly. The real issue should be legalizing it all together!

I think Medical Marijuana critics may be right in saying that most people that support it just want to legalize. We might as well be up front about it, so we can have a seriously public discussion marijuana and our government's policy.


--------------------
1. "After an hour I wasn't feeling anything so I decided to take another..."
2. "We were feeling pretty good so we decided to smoke a few bowls..."
3. "I had to be real quiet because my parents were asleep upstairs..."


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OfflineLothar121
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #3426543 - 11/30/04 04:09 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

For the people that are confident that the states will win, quit being so confident.

This case is going to be as close as you can get.

Conservatives are split because conservatives fall under two categories- social conservatives and privacy conservatives/states rights. Three of the judges were extremely skeptical. The arguments put forth by Cato in briefs and other areas are the only hope.

These judges have to think very carefully. A judgement could be made but it will have to be very narrow, if not the commerce clause could simply be applied to destroy Federal drug prohibition all together. The justices know this, and that's why you will see such a close ruling because this case puts principles vs principles, and it's going to be the court grappling with itself over how far the commerce clause implicates states' rights.


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InvisibleLe_Canard
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: Gijith]
    #3426588 - 11/30/04 04:36 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Gijith said:
I really can't see the court ruling in favor of the states on this one. But, hopefully, I'm wrong.




I don't know. They recently refused to hear a case involving gay marriage for just that reason. As conservative as it is, the current SCOTUS has been pretty consistant on ruling in favor of state's right. So there's still lots of hope for them to rule in favor of this...


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OnlineBaby_Hitler
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #3426617 - 11/30/04 04:58 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

You seem to have been misinformed as to hemp's efficacy as a fuel source. There are many other species of plants that perform as well or better than hemp in this arena. Corn, soy, tallow tree, and several species of algae are all just as viable as hemp for biomass energy.


Marijuana should be legal because there is no reason for it to be illegal.


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #3426794 - 11/30/04 07:01 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

> many other species of plants that perform as well or better than hemp in this arena.

Yes, but few of them grow as well as hemp without having to add nutrients to the ground, rotate fields every few years, etc.


--------------------
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OnlineBaby_Hitler
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: ]
    #3427778 - 11/30/04 02:56 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Crop rotation is no big deal. Soy is a legume, so it adds nitrogen. Corn isn't too bad about draining nutrients. Tallow tree is a tree, and so that isn't even an issue there. Algae is grown hydroponically , so soil isn't even applicable in that case, but it does consume some amount of nutrients, some of which can be recycled.

Hemp's strongest advantage is it's ability to grow in some places that corn or soy won't. In fertile feilds where any of the three could be planted, it comes in dead last in the oil production department, which is where biodiesel would come from, but it also produces a large amount of useable fiber, which can be pyrolysed into methanol. For energy production, oil is preferred over cellulse, fermentable carbohydrates, or protein.


Biomass energy would probably work better with hemp than it would without it, but it's hardly the species that's going to make or break biomass. They have hemp in Europe, has it caused any technological revolutions over there yet?


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OfflineMcKennaFan200
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: ]
    #3427825 - 11/30/04 03:09 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

THIS IS THE TIME TO STAND UP PEOPLE!  McKenna said it best when he said "Keep your head up high and say "I'm stoned, if you have a problem with that, then you have a problem buddy" :smile:.  But this opposition to medicinal marijuana cannot be passed.  It's the breaking point.  It's like having an arm wrestling match.  We're almost pinned.


--------------------


"It seemed to me culture is a shabby lie. Or at least this culture is a shabby lie. If you work like a dog, you get 260 channels of bad television and a German automobile. What kind of perfection is that?"-McKenna


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InvisibleGijith
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: Le_Canard]
    #3427859 - 11/30/04 03:18 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

ToiletDuk said:
I don't know. They recently refused to hear a case involving gay marriage for just that reason. As conservative as it is, the current SCOTUS has been pretty consistant on ruling in favor of state's right. So there's still lots of hope for them to rule in favor of this...




Yeah, but this is a very different situation, involving trade and lots of money. The attorneys arguing for medical pot are having to argue that it should be legal, so long as it's never sold between states. This is a very difficul thing to argue and, as far as I know, nobody has every effectively done it at the SCOTUS. I think there's a bit of precedent againt it. Additionally, I know at least two justices (Scalia was one, I forget the other) have already stated they have major 'reservations' about any legalization of pot.


--------------------
what's with neocons and the word 'ilk'?


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OfflineFlameBait9000
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: AaronEvil]
    #3428237 - 11/30/04 04:55 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

I support the Legalized use of marijuana for medical and entertainment purposes.


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Invisibleshroomydan
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #3430142 - 11/30/04 11:41 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Divided_Sky said:
The more I think about it the more silly Medical Marijuana is. Considering the FDA has already approved prescription THC medicines such as Marinol, that won't give you lung cancer the push to legalize it for medical use seems a little silly. The real issue should be legalizing it all together!





The problem with Marinol is that it must be swallowed. For someone who is too nauseous to eat or drink, a pill is ineffective. I've never taken Marinol, but if its anything like pot brownies, then it would also take quite a while to kick in. The person dry heaving from chemo therapy could never hold it down long enough for it to relieve his nausea.


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InvisibleGabbaDj
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: shroomydan]
    #3432417 - 12/01/04 01:22 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

shroomydan said:
Quote:

Divided_Sky said:
The more I think about it the more silly Medical Marijuana is. Considering the FDA has already approved prescription THC medicines such as Marinol, that won't give you lung cancer the push to legalize it for medical use seems a little silly. The real issue should be legalizing it all together!





The problem with Marinol is that it must be swallowed. For someone who is too nauseous to eat or drink, a pill is ineffective. I've never taken Marinol, but if its anything like pot brownies, then it would also take quite a while to kick in. The person dry heaving from chemo therapy could never hold it down long enough for it to relieve his nausea.




Marijuana is non carsonigenic and dont cause cancer.

Marinol is too strong for most people.. People can easily regulate how much medicine they toke with a joint..

As for the hemp thing.. Baby Hitler said it all..


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InvisibleLe_Canard
The Duk Abides

Registered: 05/17/03
Posts: 94,392
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Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: Gijith]
    #3432444 - 12/01/04 01:29 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Could be. Hopefully, they'll rule as they traditionally have in favor of the state's laws versus federal law. But time will tell...
I'm watching this one closely, as I'm sure most everyone here is as well...


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OfflineLothar121
Marijuanaactivist
Registered: 04/15/03
Posts: 105
Loc: Texas
Last seen: 13 years, 5 months
Re: Supreme Court to weigh medical marijuana laws [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #3512397 - 12/17/04 07:13 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Divided_Sky said:
The more I think about it the more silly Medical Marijuana is. Considering the FDA has already approved prescription THC medicines such as Marinol, that won't give you lung cancer the push to legalize it for medical use seems a little silly. The real issue should be legalizing it all together!

I think Medical Marijuana critics may be right in saying that most people that support it just want to legalize. We might as well be up front about it, so we can have a seriously public discussion marijuana and our government's policy.




I was disturbed that you referred to marinol as an effective substitute to Marijuana as a medication. I will describe below substantial evidence to the contrary and the reasoning for supporting the medical use of Marijuana in its full herbal form.

Marijuana contains over 400 different chemical compounds in it. At least 66 are unique to the plant, and have earned the name "cannabinoids." Some of the major cannabinoids found in Marijuana are D-8-THC, D-9-THC, cannabinol, and cannabidol. I'll concentrate on the latter.Cannabidiol has been found to help people with dystonia disorder, Huntington's Disease, epilepsy, sleeping, Tourette Syndrome, Dyskinetic syndrome, stroke, and psychotic activity. Cannabidiol has also been found blocking of effects of THC, which included increased pulse rate, disturbed time tasks, and psychological reactions. It also decreased the anxiety from THC. Cannabidiol is apparently not psychoactive. Again, Marinol does not contain cannabidiol. Smoked Marijuana can provide relief from ailments almost immediately. Marinol can take from 30 to 90 minutes (or even longer, this can vary from person to person). For some individuals who are suffering from nausea, the act of swallowing a pill can induce vomiting. So smoking (or vaporization) might be the only way they can use the drug.

Another issue is metabolization. When someone swallows Marinol, the THC gets metabolized into 11-OH-THC, which is more psychoactive than THC. Keep in mind there is no cannabidiol in Marinol, so side effects from THC such as anxiety can be more extreme in Marinol than Marijuana.

Patients and doctors admit that Marijuana in its herbal form is a better treatment option than Marinol in many instances. It has been found that taking out all the other components of cannabis and only using one component isn?t nearly as effective as all of them together. Saying that Marijuana is not an effective medicine while marinol is would be the same as saying vitamin C is healthy but oranges are not.

However crazy it seems, marijuana is the best treatment option availiable for many patients.


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