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CleverName
the cloudsshould know meby now...
Registered: 08/26/02
Posts: 1,121
Loc: red earth painted with mi...
Last seen: 18 years, 4 months
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Re: M.I. (Mushroom Intelligence) [Re: Mixomatosis]
#3394768 - 11/21/04 09:09 PM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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come on man, give the guy a break. there is no proof in existence that mushrooms have intelligence....so what, science will never know. we all understand your point. it seems that your just ripping into him for the sake of discussion. but if it can never be proven, then whats the point?
perhaps you have a great point, in that case, rip on.
-------------------- if you can't find the truth right where you are, where else do you expect to find it? this is the purpose
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Mixomatosis
great ape
Registered: 10/28/03
Posts: 1,306
Loc: cipherland
Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
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Re: M.I. (Mushroom Intelligence) [Re: CleverName]
#3394818 - 11/21/04 09:20 PM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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um, mostly I'm just rippin' in on him for the sake of artistic expression.. to me this isn't about whether or not mushrooms are intelligent, at least not yet. My problem is his poorly organized and logically wanting thoughts.. I would love him to define his terms a little more and explain how he reaches his conclusions without asking me to join him in an irrational leap over logicville. I mean, how am I supposed to get satisfaction from driving over a rotting carcass, or knocking down my little brother's block castle if he hasn't even built them up into a structure that can be toppled?
Edited by Mixomatosis (11/21/04 09:27 PM)
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Mixomatosis
great ape
Registered: 10/28/03
Posts: 1,306
Loc: cipherland
Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
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Re: M.I. (Mushroom Intelligence) (now with cool new pictures) [Re: dmtrypr]
#3407870 - 11/25/04 11:30 AM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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Dmtrypr, are you discouraged so easily? I've invited you to clarify your thoughts and communicate them better since I first posted in your thread, but you refuse. Somewhere I read you saying that you loved writing and found this forum suited your needs to express yourself and practice communicating ideas.
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tekramrepus
Registered: 02/20/02
Posts: 2,253
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Re: M.I. (Mushroom Intelligence) (now with cool new pictures) [Re: Mixomatosis]
#3408142 - 11/25/04 01:14 PM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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The concept of ANY living thing having an awareness seems plausible to me.
Plants, earth, humans, mushrooms....I could see the possibility of them all having an awareness, however basic or subtle.
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Gomp
¡(Bound to·(O))be free!
Registered: 09/11/04
Posts: 10,888
Loc: I re·side [primarily] in...
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Re: M.I. (Mushroom Intelligence) (now with cool new pictures) [Re: tekramrepus]
#3408147 - 11/25/04 01:18 PM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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""come on man, give the guy a break. there is no proof in existence that mushrooms have intelligence...."" is there proof in existence that animals have intelligence?
-------------------- -------------------- Disclaimer!?
Edited by Gomp (11/25/04 01:19 PM)
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lePage
Strangler
Registered: 11/14/04
Posts: 29
Loc: toronto
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Re: M.I. (Mushroom Intelligence) (now with cool new pictures) [Re: Gomp]
#3408265 - 11/25/04 01:59 PM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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hey gomp, my dog knows how to sit
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Gomp
¡(Bound to·(O))be free!
Registered: 09/11/04
Posts: 10,888
Loc: I re·side [primarily] in...
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Re: M.I. (Mushroom Intelligence) (now with cool new pictures) [Re: lePage]
#3408286 - 11/25/04 02:04 PM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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and mushrooms know how to stand?
-------------------- -------------------- Disclaimer!?
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Mixomatosis
great ape
Registered: 10/28/03
Posts: 1,306
Loc: cipherland
Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
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Re: M.I. (Mushroom Intelligence) (now with cool new pictures) [Re: Gomp]
#3409549 - 11/25/04 07:56 PM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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But not stand or sit.
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Adamist
ℚṲℰϟ✞ЇѺℵ ℛ∃Åʟḯ†У
Registered: 11/23/01
Posts: 10,211
Loc: Bloomington, IN
Last seen: 9 years, 29 days
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Re: M.I. (Mushroom Intelligence) (now with cool new pictures) [Re: dmtrypr]
#3409835 - 11/25/04 09:02 PM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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Nice post. To me, mushrooms are more of a portal to Intelligence; what we know as DNA is definately aware to me. I think that what you are perceiving is the DNA of the mushroom.
-------------------- { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } }
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Ped
Interested In Your Brain
Registered: 08/30/99
Posts: 5,494
Loc: Canada
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Re: M.I. (Mushroom Intelligence) (now with cool new pictures) [Re: dmtrypr]
#3410994 - 11/26/04 02:00 AM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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Let's get off his back now. This is probably a young guy entertaining some new perspectives. He doesn't need to have concrete proof or some powerful insight to post the idea for some feedback. It's just a discussion. He doesn't need anybody assailing him or his ideas. When you attack him and his idea, he is going to get defensive. When he is defensive, he is not going to listen to your almighty logic. Dialog turns into a complete waste of time.
It is a tiresome theme at S&P.
>> I would like hearing if anyone else has thought about mushroom awareness, or the "consciousness" of psilocybes.
Given the profundity of the mushroom experience, and how personalized and self-aimed it can be, I've also pondered the idea that mushrooms are intelligent entities with a message to impart. Especially when gripped by the experience, I think it's natural to think this way. These are the conclusions I arrived at over time:
There is a vast spectrum of complexity between plain awareness and self-awareness. When a plant responds to the movement of the sun, we can think of this as an extremely simple form of awareness. When an animal responds to an intrusion on his feeding territory, we can think of this a more complex form of awareness.
Mushrooms respond to their environment by utilizing the available resources in a way that maximizes their life cycle and potential for reproduction. This is the same momentum behind the evolution of all life. Over the course of millions of years, changing conditions will carry a life form to a state of such complexity that an equally complex means of interacting with the environment becomes necessary to continue the life cycle. When those conditions are assembled, conciousness as we understand it appears in that life form. It has achieved a complexity of awareness which is directly proportionate to the complexity of it's living situation.
Given the simple nature of the fungal life cycle, I don't think there's any reason to believe that psilocybin mushrooms have reached any such state of complexity. Psilocybin is a neurotransmitter that causes our brain to behave differently than normal. The reason for the profundity of the mushroom experience probably has more to do with the magnitude of our conciousness than it does with the chemicals involved in it.
And what's with all the McKenna bashing? Terence McKenna did not take his own ideas as seriously as the some of you folks seem to.
-------------------- Dark Triangles - New Psychedelic Techno Single - Listen on Soundcloud Gyroscope full album available SoundCloud or MySpace
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Adamist
ℚṲℰϟ✞ЇѺℵ ℛ∃Åʟḯ†У
Registered: 11/23/01
Posts: 10,211
Loc: Bloomington, IN
Last seen: 9 years, 29 days
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Re: M.I. (Mushroom Intelligence) (now with cool new pictures) [Re: Ped]
#3413064 - 11/26/04 04:37 PM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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Right on.
PS- McKenna was very open-minded and one of the more dogma-less important thinkers of our time, IMO.
-------------------- { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } }
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Zekebomb
sociophagus
Registered: 08/24/03
Posts: 1,164
Loc: BC province
Last seen: 16 years, 5 months
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Re: M.I. (Mushroom Intelligence) (now with cool new pictures) [Re: Adamist]
#3414060 - 11/26/04 09:35 PM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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mckenna just made his own dogma.
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EgoTripping
journeyman
Registered: 04/30/04
Posts: 180
Last seen: 18 years, 3 months
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Re: M.I. (Mushroom Intelligence) (now with cool new pictures) [Re: Zekebomb]
#3414701 - 11/27/04 12:12 AM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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My friend once said to me after a trip...
"The Mushrooms in a sense, offer themselves to us as a sacrifice for the betterment of Mankind."
Personally, I feel the Mushroom does have some form of awareness because it's life, it's from God, and thus it has awareness just as I believe a Plant or Dog or Human has awareness. Does that meant it's intelligence? What is intelligence? We're supposed to be the smartest race 'on the planet' yet through generations of people and technology, we still can't even live next to each other without fighting over Terrorities much as an animal would...we just use bigger and badder weaponry to wage our battles.
I personally feel the Mushroom speaks to us, but not using the same spoken audible language, but that of light and love. I personally feel the Brain has nothing to communicate...it's merely a device to send and recieve information...a cosmic filter so to speak. The Mushroom simply enables us to bypass this physical cosmic filter to gain unadulterated access to the infinite sprawling vastness of The Creator (or God/Vishnu/Buddha/The Light/Ever-existant Infinite Energy).
I am with the Thread starter's perspective entirely. There are simply some people are more and less sensitive to these ideas. These are abstract notions and most people simply aren't on 'that level.' That is not bad and I don't want to come off as pompous...we are all at our own level of development and there are infinite levels. These ideas have always been relatively easy for me to wrap my head around. After my numerous mushroom experiences, they helped validate with experience that these ideas were true (for me).
Mushrooms enabled me to experience Eternity...we all know that feeling of 'timelessness' and it's usually pure bliss. Nothing matters except that moment which is always brand new and repeating over and over with new experiences. They helped me understand through experience what Unconditional Love feels like...what true Freedom without any trace of Fear can really be. My friends and I often say and agree...'I never felt more like myself then during/after a trip.'
I notice that everyone, depending on their developments as a Soul, recieves different information from a trip. Some people just see lots of patterns and colors. Others just think it makes them 'feel cool.' And some have these extremely profound and mindblowing epiphanies that alter their lives. I think the Mushroom experience is much like life which is also much like the Life (lives) to come...it is what you make it.
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fresh313
journeyman
Registered: 09/01/03
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Re: M.I. (Mushroom Intelligence) (now with cool new pictures) [Re: EgoTripping]
#3415037 - 11/27/04 03:13 AM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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id say that its all due to the conditions the shrooms were grown in, i know this isnt the grow forum, but mushrooms dont know where they are being grown, you just cant replicate a natural environment perfectly, id say increase your air exhange and youll have shrooms looking alot closer to the ones that were growing outside.
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