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OfflineSin Bad
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Fly Agaric: Question that needs clearing up.
    #3382901 - 11/19/04 05:20 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Good Evening fellow Shroomerites.

I have a nagging query that I want to be answered once and for all.
It concerns the drying of Fly Agaric.

Now - for a long time, I was under the impression, that simply drying out fly agaric at a low temperature, was enough to cause the conversion of Ibotenic Acid to Muscimol.

However, a little while ago, Gumby drew it to my attention, that he beleived the important factor in the chemical conversion reaction was a high temperature (such as one would expose the mushrooms to if drying in an oven or over a fire).

I would like to know what actually causes the (decarboxylation?) reaction of the Ibotneic Acid to the more potent Muscimol - i.e. at what temperature range does this reaction take place.

Thankyou and good night.


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Invisiblespores
haploid
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Registered: 02/19/99
Posts: 2,483
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Re: Fly Agaric: Question that needs clearing up. [Re: Sin Bad]
    #3383115 - 11/19/04 09:22 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

I'm not sure about the temperature range, but it shouldn't be too high. a similar reaction occurs in pot as it dries and is smoked or cooked, organic acidic compounds (cannabinic acids or something) in the plant decarboxylate to alcohols (cannabinols), analogous to muscimol from ibotenic acid. the temperature range for the reaction would probably be pretty easy to find with a search, pretty sure I've seen it in things around the net but I can't remember the figures. easily reached in an oven though.

DH


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OfflineGumbyM
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Re: Fly Agaric: Question that needs clearing up. [Re: Sin Bad]
    #3383834 - 11/19/04 01:16 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

From what I've read temps around 150-190 seem to be the right amount. Shamans used to dry them on rocks by the side of the fire, I'd imagine those temps get pretty fierce.


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Offlinesuperblingtheory
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Re: Fly Agaric: Question that needs clearing up. [Re: Gumby]
    #3383900 - 11/19/04 01:28 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

I hit mine in the oven at 175 degrees for a good amount of time and recover lost liquids.


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Guts and danger, Airborne Ranger...


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InvisibleBobHumboldt
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Re: Fly Agaric: Drying Temps... [Re: superblingtheory]
    #3386206 - 11/19/04 09:41 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Hey there,

I dry them in a food dehydrator at 140 degrees. According to Donald E. Teeter, author of The Sacred Secret (great book available at amazon.com) room temp to 140 works best. Hawk and Venus, authors of Soma Shamans, available at somashamans.yage.net, also state that boiling fresh amanita muscaria for "20 magical minutes" does the trick in making tea from fresh mushrooms. I'm not sure what the folks who sell them commercially dry them at. But a food dehydrator or an oven with the door open a crack set at low heat should do the trick.

P.S., I've eaten them maybe 25 times so I'm not an expert, but I've had some good experiences and not many bad ones, on these shrooms. And by the way, I also mix the tea with milk and honey because Gawd it tastes awful.

Bob


Edited by BobHumboldt (11/19/04 09:42 PM)


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OfflineSin Bad
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Registered: 04/04/00
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Re: Fly Agaric: Drying Temps... [Re: BobHumboldt]
    #3387584 - 11/20/04 04:15 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

So - the concensus seems to be that drying them at room temperature would not be suffeicient to cause the reaction?


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InvisibleSuper_Blunt
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Re: Fly Agaric: Drying Temps... [Re: Sin Bad]
    #3387732 - 11/20/04 05:02 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Drying at room temperature would probably just make you sick.


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OfflineORHunter
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Re: Fly Agaric: Drying Temps... [Re: Super_Blunt]
    #3391429 - 11/21/04 01:24 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

If you're making tea I have to suggest an old-school percolating coffee pot! A friend of mine had a 6-8 cup one that worked beautifully for this. Such a wonderful invention.

The old ones are constantly boiling to pass the water through the grounds until the timer is up (light to dark, like a toaster usually) or you turn it off. The drawback is that the grounds (almost) always get in the coffee/tea.

I wouldn't bother trying with a newer coffee pot though. They only pass the water through the "grounds" once. So if a pot takes 5 minutes to brew you have to feed it 4 times. Too much work, the grounds aren't well soaked and the temp is going to vary(though this may not make much difference).

The last time I made some (muscaria [from behind the cop shop, no less], in '98-'99, IIRC) I had enough that I didn't feel bad about dumping the last portion in the sink so I could skip filtering. Just fill your glasses/jars/milk jugs carefully and it's cool.

Cleaning it afterwards is up to you. Ours was used on a daily basis for coffee so we just ran a couple pots of water and figured if there was anything left the coffee would mask it.

My friend had a freak accident and passed away earlier this year so bringing this memory back is nice and painful at the same time but I must quote, "Soma in the summa, soma in the winta, soma at suppa time! OMFG, this giggle-juice is...whoa, dude!"


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