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rogue_pixie
faerydae


Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 3,977
Loc: UK
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A philosophy degree?
#3382829 - 11/19/04 02:33 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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I was wondering if anyone here has done a philosophy degree before or has any kind of knowledge of what sort of things you get taught on this subject at uni. I'm thinking about doing a degree in it but I have no real background on the subject, I just find it intriguing. Without having a background it'll make it hard to write a personal statement for my uni application so I was wondering if anyone could give me some tips?
-------------------- "Whatever you do, you need to keep moving. Because when you stop moving you die (physically and emotionally). Good luck and blessings of happiness and fortune." ~ RandalFlagg RIP
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stefan
work in progress

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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: rogue_pixie]
#3382874 - 11/19/04 03:05 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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I do know a girl that studies philosophy but I odn't exactly know what kind of things thay have to learn.
I looked on the website of the university I go to and there's a big description of alls tudies, also philosophy, but it's in Dutch and I don't think you can read that 
just check out the websites of some universities that you might consider they probably have good descriptions about what kind of subjects etc the study philosophy has.
I hear from more people that it's a very interesting study!
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spudamore
Stranger

Registered: 06/12/03
Posts: 1,460
Loc: Australia
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: rogue_pixie]
#3382956 - 11/19/04 04:31 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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what are you going to do with that degree once you finished??
philosophise about being unemployed???
-------------------- suicide a permanent solution to a temporary problem
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Rob_K
s p a c e d

Registered: 03/23/03
Posts: 447
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: rogue_pixie]
#3382969 - 11/19/04 04:54 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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My mum did a philosophy degree, then went into teaching primary school. She now manages the service that ensures proper education of all the deaf children in my home town, so there's always possibilites..
-------------------- -{ divined from the mind }-- My music
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder


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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: rogue_pixie]
#3383008 - 11/19/04 05:53 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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I have a B.A. degree in philosophy from Long Island University. I changed from pre-med studies after my 3rd semester to philosophy, and the professor I consulted with said: "You're gonna starve, man." Well, it was a lot of LSD that was behind the change, and when I finally came down to Earth, and found myself being a janitor for minimum wage, I had a kind of breakdown. I ran to the first and nearest university and got back to school - a Masters of Theological Studies program at Drew University. Even with that degree and 6 years of higher education, I was unemployable, so once again I looked for school and spent the following 4 years living as an impoverished grad student at the University of Maryland where I earned a Ph.D. I also met my 1st wife there (whom I NEVER should have married), moved to a state that I NEVER should have moved to, and didn't get full time employment for a year and a half. It wasn't until I'd been here for 3 years that I got a career-track position.
So, the whole trip began with me leaving the world of practicality completely. I have a number of credentials, but I still think of myself as a philosopher first, and take the Ph.D. literally as Doctor of Philosophy, which most Ph.D.'s never think about beyond the title's capacity to get them a job. It took me a dozen additional years to acquire a niche in the world. Before I even left for U. of MD, one childhood friend had 2 homes, a Corvette and a fishing boat to play with - which he generously shared with me - but he never went to college and he never reads. He was eligible for retirement maybe 9 years ago, and I can't even think about retiring for a minimum of 11 more years. If he wanted to study philosophy now, he could do so for the rest of his life in leisure, collecting a pension. Of course, he would not want to study philosophy, but my point is that too much Wisdom, too early in life can make mundane and profane living particularly difficult. Build your life from the rock-bottom basement up, not from the roof down. Establish the Root Center, then the Power Center; THEN with a firm foundation in the world, and providing you don't lose your way in the comforts of materiality, you can then built a tower to higher worlds. Just one person's experience.
Peace
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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tomk
King of OTD

Registered: 09/22/04
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I'm a phil major. What he said ^^^
I'd add: Find out if your department is contential or analytic. There is so much difference between these subfields.
-------------------- "I am eternally free"
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Ped
Interested In Your Brain



Registered: 08/30/99
Posts: 5,494
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A friend of mine is working toward his philosophy degree at the University of Calgary. He tells me that the curriculum he's following downplays easter philosophy while emphasizing and even favouring western philosophy. He talks about how unfair comparisons are often drawn between the two, that the mechanistic worldview receives a lot more attention in his class than any other. Was your experience at all like this, Markos?
--------------------
Dark Triangles - New Psychedelic Techno Single - Listen on Soundcloud Gyroscope full album available SoundCloud or MySpace
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MOTH
Wild Woman


Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 23,431
Loc: In the jungle
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Informative thread...I was actually planning to major in Philosophy, but now I am rethinking this.
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deafpanda
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Ped]
#3383386 - 11/19/04 09:08 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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I'm probably going to do a philosophy degree. I've been reading what is basically a degree level textbook for philosophy. My course is philosophy of mind, political philosophy, epistemology, ethics and some other stuff. You need to be willing to consider arguments that may conflict with your personal beliefs with an open mind, and you need to be able to use logic well. Philosophy can be quite a bit like maths, actually. If you don't have any real knowledge of it, I'd read up on the basics, just to see if you can stand 3 years of it.
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looner2
ABBA fan

Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 3,849
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: deafpanda]
#3383398 - 11/19/04 09:11 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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I enjoy thinking about philosopy and reading a few books here and there. When I first got to college, i was idealistic and was told to, "study something you like". Good thing I didn't take that advice. I'm sure If i had to sit through 80 credits of philosophy I wouldn't enjoy it like I do now. Instead I picked a practical route that will guarantee employment.
-------------------- I am in love with Acidic_Sloth
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LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story


Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: rogue_pixie]
#3383599 - 11/19/04 10:20 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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.
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
Edited by LunarEclipse (11/21/04 03:39 PM)
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Gomp
¡(Bound to·(O))be free!


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haha, kinda miss obligated school :P My "why the hell do i have to be in school, when i want to be home sleeping" degree, really did not get me really far, they should be giving dry grams of Hawaiian shrooms in the birth delivery room, pre-school, and kinder garden?? hihi had i gone to "youth-school" now, maybe I would have had 'more' interest in learning?
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-------------------- Disclaimer!?
Edited by Gomp (11/19/04 10:52 AM)
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LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story


Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Gomp]
#3383833 - 11/19/04 11:16 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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"."
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
Edited by LunarEclipse (11/21/04 03:38 PM)
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Nomad
Mad Robot

Registered: 04/30/02
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But see, Markos, it has worked out perfectly for you. Can you honestly say you would be here now, had you pursued the practical path?
Establish the Root Center, then the Power Center; THEN with a firm foundation in the world, and providing you don't lose your way in the comforts of materiality, you can then built a tower to higher worlds.
Materialism is a creepy thing. It sneaks up from behind and strangles you. When you realize it, it is too late.
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Gomp
¡(Bound to·(O))be free!


Registered: 09/11/04
Posts: 10,888
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hear hear! ;P
if they don't go as pets, don't forget, even fish can trip? :P
an aquarium full of guppy's on LSD, could be fun right?
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-------------------- Disclaimer!?
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Moonshoe
Blue Mantis


Registered: 05/28/04
Posts: 27,202
Loc: Iceland
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Gomp]
#3384550 - 11/19/04 01:51 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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marko, your post has thrown me into a quagmire of existential despair.
seriously
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Everything I post is fiction.
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LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story


Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Gomp]
#3385294 - 11/19/04 04:18 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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-----
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
Edited by LunarEclipse (11/21/04 03:36 PM)
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder


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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Nomad]
#3386698 - 11/19/04 09:45 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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That's what I've ben telling myself now for a couple of decades, but what if I had completed medical studies and discovered Andrew Weil, M.D. for example? As it turns out, one of the reviewers of his 'Natural Mind' was the husband of my own childhood baby-sitter who lived across the street. I witnessed their wedding. She was a Harvard-Oxford graduate who later taught at Harvard. Maybe I could've been hooked up with enlightened medicine. Maybe I could have fallen in with the likes of Rick Strassman who did work on DMT as in his book 'DMT: The Spirit Molecule.'
ON THE OTHER HAND, I have a hunch that my life developed exactly as it was supposed to. As an INTP, I am constitutionally made for things like philosophy and psychology, and medical training is about as physical-material as one can delve. I would have been lacking in the Extraverted Sensing aspects and not been particularly good at observation of physical phenomenon because my psychic energy is tied up with Introverted Thinking, with "possibilities" more than with empirical realities.
I need lots of space, and that means a life-style not dominated by worldly ambitions of career-enhancement. I want TRUTH, not power, wealth, status - i.e., the illusion.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder


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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Ped]
#3386761 - 11/19/04 10:07 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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Well, as you can imagine, even during my undergrad years of 1971-75, when I was a philosophy major for 5 semesters (following biology), I was a freak. I was taking lots of LSD, practicing Yoga (which I learned in college courses), being vegetarian, even celibate for long periods and therefore the Western philosophies that I favored were similar to, maybe even derivative of Eastern philosophy. There was Plato (Bob Brier gave a course on the Mysticism of Plato), and when another class dropped out entirely from a course in Mysticism, the prof gave me a tutorial in The Enneads of Plotinus and Pseudo-Dionysus [The Areopagite] - the great Christian Neoplatonist. I avoided the worldly philosophers, the political philosophers, at least insofar as I was building my personal world-view. I mean, I read some Hobbes, and Voltaire and took a course in Utilitarianism (Jeremy Bentham, John Stuart Mill), Symbolic Logic was mandatory, but the mystico-religious philosophies helped me to grasp the Psychedelic Experience. They also paved the way for a Masters in Theological Studies later. I tried to get with the few other philosophy students, but my strong convictions on things like karma, transmigration of soul (from Greek and Indian sources) caused those people to shy away. Also, they were not into taking acid, and so remained in ordinary sense data-reason-based philosophies. I even offered LSD to a couple of philosophy and one theology prof during under grad years.
The center of my college year book - the only two page full color spread - shows a lonely, pony-tailed, denim-clad, unsung Western hero meditating in lotus position on the setting sun one chill November evening on the Great Lawn. Can you guess the identity of that guy trying to exist in the clog-shoed, disco music, polyester shirted, gold-plated razor bladed, cocaine culture that the 1970's became by the time I finished college?
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder


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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Moonshoe]
#3386811 - 11/19/04 10:22 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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Don't you put your existential despair on me! Seriously. We are BOTH woven into the existence of space-time, and if you are experiencing "The Sickness Unto Death," than perhaps you should consult the first Christian Existentialist - Soren Kierkegaard - and see what he suggests. I mean, I can read Existentialism, even 'Existential Psychotherapy' by Irv Yalom, yet all of the conclusions are devoid of Essentialism - Being - the Ground of Being - GOD. I prefer the theological existentialism of Paul Tillich ('The Courage to Be,' and 'The Eternal Now') to any atheist existentialist. I have lived as an atheist, as an agnostic, as a theist and as a gnostic. I really must tell you - theism and gnosis have given me 'the courage to be' as well as the joy of living and Living Joy. I will never live the existence of spiritual inertness again. Existence without Essence will be my dried bones.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly


Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: MOTH]
#3386887 - 11/19/04 10:49 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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Many states won't even give financial aid for philosophy and theology majors.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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Amber_Glow
Sat Chit Anand

Registered: 09/02/02
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I'm majoring in philosophy now. After graduating college I plan to go on to law school (apparently you can major in anything to get into law school, and philosophy sounds like an appropriate lawyer major). Philosophy is really the only thing that interests me in college except for psychology and politics (and both of those majors don't really have a very clear career path either).
Don't know what kind of things they teach you in philosophy classes? Philosophy!! Reading and analyzing different philosopher's ideas and stuff.
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Nomad
Mad Robot

Registered: 04/30/02
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One thing you must understand is that you are dealing with people who are about to make the first major independent decision in their life, and that decision has a lot of conditioning effect. Discover Strassman, but can you stand up to do the right thing later, after having started with blank opportunism? If you make materialist decisions today, you will be a materialist tomorrow.
"There is no such thing as the pristine 'I' floating above the mud of the world" - Terence McKenna.
They call it karma; do it today - be it tomorrow. Don't think that you can just walk away and be spiritual as if nothing happened.
So to the original poster I say, go for it, study philosophy. The last thing the world needs is more practical people. Dammit, I will even do it myself and throw away eight semesters of totally practical computer science. (To avoid overdramatization, I made that decision months ago and this thread had zero influence.) I've never been so at peace with myself: As hard as it has been, I finally managed to do the first right decision in my life. Others will follow. People asked me how I can so easily live with the fact that the last four years of my life were wasted. I told them that, in life, either nothing is wasted, or everything is wasted. There ain't no in-between.
I agree that it is important to develop the Root Chakra and the Power Chakra. But neglect the Heart Chakra, and both will be useless. Because where exactly will your power be rooted?
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Nomad
Mad Robot

Registered: 04/30/02
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Many states won't even give financial aid for philosophy and theology majors.
Still, it is unlikely that anyone will starve in the western world. You can dedicate your life fully to a spiritual or philosophical ideal, and you will still have a substantially higher life standard than those people (talking about hermits and the like) who did that in the past.
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder


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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Nomad]
#3388419 - 11/20/04 09:26 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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Working backwards: The Heart Chakra, like the other chakras, belong to the Astral Sheath in Yogic terms, one of our psychophysical 'layers.' The Heart Cave, Hridayam, Sacred Heart, Jewel in the Lotus of the Heart, etc. is a different order of Being and underlies the Astral and the Physical, so please do not misunderstand me. The Heart chakra is NOT the 'Atman' or 'Self' or 'Christ' - the Sacred Heart is. There would BE no quest for TRUTH if this Heart Cave were not being 'filled by the Grace of God' in the first place.
The Tibetan Buddhist Stupa is a structure (in the abstract) of a large cube, upon which is a large sphere, upon which is a long cone, upon which is a small hemisphere, flat side up, upon which is a drop. Each shape represents a psychic center or chakra and an element. The cube is the Root (Earth) and the sphere is the Navel (Water). In all systems that I know of, the 'heaviest' and most earth-bound must be developed first for stability-sake. I, for one, had an undeveloped Navel Center all the way into adulthood. It required real ANGER to open it up (my divorce) for the first time in my life. The anger lent tremendous power which I took to the gym and built muscle, exuded more testosterone, created attitude, stopped being co-dependent, and took charge of my life in a new way. Compassion was directed at ME for a change, whereas earlier, it had been to my ex-spouse and clients and little to take care of MY equally important needs. For a co-dependent, any self-care seems to be selfish. I am not selfish, but I have equal Compassion for myself now.
Secondly, I was not expressing an opinion so much as retracing the steps of my own life over 33 years. The younger one is, the less inclined one is to consider the 'distant' future. The less inclined to consider the future, the less likely will one be to sacrifice for that future, like setting aside hard-earned money for a tax shelter annuity or something. This is especially true if thinking about money is uninteresting or disturbing, coupled with the fact that one doesn't know that one is supposed to know about these things. I have invested money in a tax shelter for many years now. I also inherited some money which I invested with Smith Barney and then another firm. I have to work 30 full years to receive a pension for the rest of my life (43% of my 3 highest-earning years). If one doesn't exercise practicality, my quality of life will drop off radically after I retire, and at 63, I will be pretty used to a certain standard of living. I am a philosopher, not a hedonist, so my standard might not seem 'high' to a money-addict, but I want to live in my home and begin to 'soar,'again, unfettered by work and responsibility - much like I did in my college years. Without planning a practical strategy, I'll 'fall.' My energy will be sucked down into survival levels and instead of passing upward through the Centers and transcending, I'll fall into the Earth centers. Young Icarus, full of youthful pride, did not take the Middle Way between the moisture of the deep sea and the fire of the sun. He flew too high, too soon, and fell, perishing in the darkness below. Let those who have ears, hear.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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Moonshoe
Blue Mantis


Registered: 05/28/04
Posts: 27,202
Loc: Iceland
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"Don't you put your existential despair on me! Seriously"
i was being a bit melodramatic. its just that the you that you described as a teenager, into meditating, yoga and philosophy, and jsut thinking about what to do in university, is a perfect description of me. I too am hardwired for philosophy and psychology, and thats what i would most likely want to take.
Your post just reminds me how hard it will be to maintain my personal freedom of choice and follow my dreams while still feeding myself, i for one cant wait 12 years to be employable. or can I?
well see what happens
it sounds to me that your life did work out quite excellently though, so its all for the best
--------------------
Everything I post is fiction.
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Nomad
Mad Robot

Registered: 04/30/02
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Last seen: 16 years, 1 month
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I thought that thing about the Heart Chakra would be a witty one-liner , but it wasn't, obviously. 
I understand that you did not state an opinion. But let me point out again, that, if you had stated an opinion, you would recommend a path you have not walked, in favor of a path which you have walked and which worked for you. Anyway, thanks for the advice (I understand that you gave no advice...).
Young Icarus, full of youthful pride, did not take the Middle Way between the moisture of the deep sea and the fire of the sun. He flew too high, too soon, and fell, perishing in the darkness below.
He flew, at least he flew. Let him fall; he will rise again.
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder


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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Moonshoe]
#3389328 - 11/20/04 01:33 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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I'll add this postscript. Three years after I graduated from college, which included two six month periods of employment that sandwiched a two year Masters program, I visited my college campus on the first day of a fall semester. I had just begun a Ph.D. program in Maryland, yet here I was revisiting Long Island University. Anyway, I got into a conversation with a kid who was just beginning college there and I told him how I had graduated 3 three years earlier, etc., etc. He asked me if there was anything I could advise him on and I responded with "Faith...You have to have faith." The kid sort of reared back (we were sitting on the Great Lawn) and exclaimed "What?!," with a certain amount of hostility in his voice, as if he were plainly offended by my response. With that response from him, I simply got up and left.
Besides my discovery of LSD, of sex, of falling in love, of betrayal, of my first exposure to madness and suicide, of pure self-discovery, I also discovered my first crisis of meaning. When I told my first girlfriend (I was a late bloomer), a dark-eyed, petite, curvey little chick that I was planning to change my major from pre-med to philosophy, she freaked out on me. I realized that she was in school primarily to find a potential physician to marry. I saw in a flash how the world worked, what the girls were about, how I was valued merely as a potential source of lifestyle as programmed into the mind of a Jewish girl from Bethlehem, PA. She became a symbol for women, marriage and the worldly. She was not the girl I was in love with - that would come shortly before I graduated - a fair-haired version who was truly bright, 3 years younger than me, who turned me onto Huxley's 'Island,' but who used jealousy in the misguided attempt to draw me closer. Sleeping with my roommate of three years only caused me to reject her forever, but it reinforced my previous suspicions. Looking back, it is not difficult to see why I entered a seminary and embraced ascetic ideals - loneliness and horniness was a form of pain I could control (I believed); betrayal, heartbreak, jealousy, mistrust resulted from dependence on another. Eight years later I unfortunately married a similar woman. I stayed 10 years (I'm a slow learner in matters of the heart).
What's the point in the above paragraph? ARE YOU GOING TO GO IT ALONE? If not, please bear in mind that the average girl (assuming you're heterosexual) seeking marriage and childrearing is NOT going to wait for a 'seeker' to 'find himself' spiritually and occupationally. Casual sex as a component of lifestyle is incommensurate with the philosophical or the religious life - straight OR gay.
Hey, Saint Paul was a tent-maker, Benedict Spinoza was a lens-grinder, Jacob Boehme was a cobbler, Diogenes was a vagrant who lived in a drain pipe, and Jesus worked as a carpenter. Some people find jobs teaching others about these people, but everyone is a philosopher inasmuch as everyone develops a philosophy of life, articulated or not.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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rogue_pixie
faerydae


Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 3,977
Loc: UK
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Thanks for the input guys, nice and thought confusing/provoking :/ Well I'm not bothered about any other subject, they are all so rigid, I'm not academic in the slightest and I don't consider myself intelligent, just thoughtful.
-------------------- "Whatever you do, you need to keep moving. Because when you stop moving you die (physically and emotionally). Good luck and blessings of happiness and fortune." ~ RandalFlagg RIP
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder


Registered: 12/09/99
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Nomad]
#3402453 - 11/24/04 05:26 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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Icarus perished. That is the myth. His Father Daedalus did not perish, but was true to the wisdom of the middle way. Icarus is not the Phoenix and will not rise once fallen.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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Nomad
Mad Robot

Registered: 04/30/02
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They all rise again.
Suppose it is true; we live life after life in an endless cycle of suffering, until we finally manage to lead an ascetic life dedicated to a transformation in consciousness. Then, shouldn't we lead this life here, in this world, where we have access to all the scriptures of all religions, countless sacred plants, technological devices for achieving altered states of consciousness, and a society in which the material needs are so easily fulfilled that no one is going to starve? Instead of living it in a world where someone interested in religion might in all actuality starve?
Suppose it is true; depending on our actions in this life, we will experience an eternity somewhere else. Then, the above still applies, only a little more so.
Suppose it is wrong; we die and it's over. Then I still do not see why I should participate in the rat race. I can achieve a draw just by waiting it off. Bill Gates might have the bigger house, but a couple years from now, we will live in the same kind of place. It will be about two meters long, half a meter wide, and made of wood.
The problem with the rat race is that, even if you win, you're still a rat.
Gotta find a philosophical girl.
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ferago2
gnubie
Registered: 03/02/04
Posts: 136
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: rogue_pixie]
#3402923 - 11/24/04 09:30 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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I'm studying philosophy in school myself. I'm in my 3rd semester of college, and so far I've taken an intro level class in which we read a whole variety of different philosophical writings, from political philosophy to metaphysics (do we have free will?) and epistimology (what are the limits of human knowledge?). I've also taken what's called "modern philosophy," which is really the progression of philosophical thought from Descartes (whose skeptical method would be useful on this board :p) to Kant, who has a whole lot to say about what we are able to know, and what we can never know. The third class I'm taking currently. It's philosophy of song, and we're focusing on what makes songs appealing, including analyzing the melody, rhythms, structure, lyrics and so on, as well as reading Shopenhauer, Plato, and some contemporary theorists.
Academic philosophy really breaks down into 3 areas: Political philosophy (self explanitory) value theory or aesthetics (what makes things beautiful, important, etc... like my song class) and metaphysics/epistimology (how the world is, and what constitutes knowledge). The later is probably going to be my area of focus, and is the most closely linked with what goes on on this board, although most of the posters here could learn a whole lot from any philosophy class's discussion of logic, and what constitutes valid and sound arguements.
I dunno what jobs you can get with a philosophy degree besides graduate school or law school, so I'm either going to double major in journalism, or triple major in that and another subject.
Hope this helps.
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MarkostheGnostic
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Nomad]
#3406466 - 11/24/04 10:42 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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Your last sentence is the most important one of all.
What if?, what if? Establish yourself in peace here and now, and you will not fret about 'what if?' so much. Each moment will arise and pass including your final inspiration and expiration. Old fashioned ice cube trays could divide and separate water in frozen forms. Allowing the trays to thaw returned the various frozen forms to their essential formless, clear nature. So it is with our formless minds frozen into thoughts and feelings. Accustom the mind to return to its formless and blissful condition. Practice the pre-post-mortem state even in life. What did your face look like before you were conceived? TRUST. Only form is annihilated, not awareness. We think that we're only a wave, but we are really the entire Ocean. Why focus on the immediate form which arises, and perishes? Become COSMIC!
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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falcon


Registered: 04/01/02
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pre-post-mortem state Outstanding!
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Diploid
Cuban


Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
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...my point is that too much Wisdom, too early in life can make mundane and profane living particularly difficult. Build your life from the rock-bottom basement up, not from the roof down. Establish the Root Center, then the Power Center; THEN with a firm foundation in the world, and providing you don't lose your way in the comforts of materiality, you can then built a tower to higher worlds. Just one person's experience.
Better advice I have never heard given anyone.
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Nomad
Mad Robot

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Old fashioned ice cube trays could divide and separate water in frozen forms. Allowing the trays to thaw returned the various frozen forms to their essential formless, clear nature.
That reminds me of that incident when the student said to the zen master,
"When we die, it is like ice returning to water, right?"
And the master, smiling, replied:
"No, it is like water returning to water."
The point being, why not transcend even that? Why not realize that this search, this struggle, this desire, this non-peace, is the perfect expression of the formless?
I put my faith in the Pali. I am not a Theravadin, because Theravada consists of the Pali plus commentaries, and, frankly, I think Buddhaghosa didn't have a clue. Still, I am close to being a realist; rebirth either exists or it does not. It is a scientific question which can be answered by the scientific method. If it exists, there must be a way out of it; that, again, is a scientific question. I believe that ultimate reality consists of rivers, trees, and rocks. The Mahayana concept of emptyness is an illusion; albeit it may be a necessary one on the path.
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MarkostheGnostic
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Nomad]
#3407968 - 11/25/04 11:57 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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Of course, you are entitled to your own opinion, but I do not trust opinion - even my own. I have my own experience, which I compare and contrast with those whose experiences have been remembered through the ages. If ever I become wise in my own eyes, I will require a slap upside my head to adjust my attitude.
And you sir, if you believe that you can evaluate entire religious traditions from your armchair, and then misconstrue the physical and the metaphysical, epistemology and gnosis, then Life is going to deal you a startling blow. When it comes, think of it as a Compassionate blow from 'The Cosmic Zen Master' for falling asleep during a seshin of Zazen.
The Mahayanist view IS closer to the "scientific" view of physical reality inasmuch as the "ultimate reality" of time-limited phenomena like "rivers, trees, and rocks," is anything but "ultimate." Why, even as a child I broke down water into Hydrogen and Oxygen, and thrust glowing broom straws into each testtube to see the difference in the ignition of those two basic elements. Beneath the atomic is the subatomic level of the electrical, of strangeness and spin, and quarks. Even these are not "ultimate reality." You need to think in 'time-lapse' mode. An acorn is potentially an oak tree, but an oak tree is actually a time-developed acorn. The physical matter of the entire universe is likewise a time-developed extension of 'earlier' and simpler manifestations of form. "Ultimate reality" necessitates a harkening back to origination of 'all of it' - beyond the Singularity of the Big Bang to Ultimate Mystery.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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MarkostheGnostic
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Diploid]
#3407970 - 11/25/04 11:58 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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Uh...Thankyouverymuch.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder


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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: falcon]
#3407972 - 11/25/04 11:59 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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Thanks.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


Registered: 03/12/02
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I just have to say, Markos, its been great, reading and feeling your perspective. 
I'm amazed and reassured that someone such as yourself has evolved to this point in life where your mind is extremely encompassing and complexly structured, and not only this, but that it seems to be that the individual facets of that mind are networked properly. At the same time, it appears that your mind, while being an immense, elaborate system, is free of clutter and needless, emotional residue - its structure is kept at a bare minimum to perform its required tasks, and it does not interfere or obstruct your direct perception of reality.
Not only all of this, but perhaps the most important aspect of what I perceive of you is that while your mind is quite advanced and formed, the formless beyond your mind, your pure state of being, is almost infinitely more deep and conscious. I feel that you are experiencing reality and pure awareness beyond the constrains of the mind. 
I am not saying these things to cater to your ego, or mine, for that matter. I find these aspects that I have observed of you very interesting as they mirror myself to similar degrees, and considering your extensive worldly knowledge, your much longer time on this planet, and your apparent deep state of being to be a glimpse of where I may someday (soon ) be, if I continue on this path moment by moment.
I surmise that perhaps there are times when you are almost completely free of the operation of your mind, and other times when your being might get lost in the complex workings of your mind, but the majority of the time, keeping a most important balance between the two, depending on the situation present in your life at the time and what it requires from you. It seems as though you have followed the upward spiral and have indeed reached a higher place.
Some might get lost in the structure and elaborations of your expressions here, but it seems that you hold it as a mere convention, a tool, and a powerful tool at that. The meaning and the being run deep and are formless and most ripe for experience. 
Sorry, I just felt the need to express some appreciation for you and your being here, you've definitely helped me evolve and grow, perhaps this is partially why the similarities that I note developed in the first place. 
I will end with one question: Have you read The Well of Rememberance by Ralph Metnzer? I've been reading it recently, and just curious if you have as well. Its reading has been indefinitely put on hold, however, as I recently came to find a Norwegian Elkhound puppy (Odin ), and I have now been reading a book, The Art Of Raising A Puppy, by a group of monks from New Skete, who exclusively raise German Shepherds. Interesting perspective on dog ownership. 
Any thoughts on all of this? 
 Peace.
--------------------
If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Nomad
Mad Robot

Registered: 04/30/02
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Of course, you are entitled to your own opinion, but I do not trust opinion - even my own. I have my own experience, which I compare and contrast with those whose experiences have been remembered through the ages. If ever I become wise in my own eyes, I will require a slap upside my head to adjust my attitude. And you sir, if you believe that you can evaluate entire religious traditions from your armchair, and then misconstrue the physical and the metaphysical, epistemology and gnosis, then Life is going to deal you a startling blow. When it comes, think of it as a Compassionate blow from 'The Cosmic Zen Master' for falling asleep during a seshin of Zazen.
Huh? Did I miss something? What have I done? Was it the reference to Buddhaghosa? If so, I'm certainly sorry - I should perhaps have tried to shroud it in a different kind of language. Still, of one thing I am certain: I will prefer the direct, first-hand psychedelic experience over any scriptures. If I have seen things with my own eyes, while a holy scripture claims the opposite, I will burn the scripture - in each and every case. If that makes me "evaluating entire religious traditions from my armchair", then so be it. I can live with that. And the reality of rivers, trees, and rocks is ultimate enough for me. I will stick to my understanding that the eightfold path is supposed to lead up to the triple knowledge - not to some mystification of epistomological concerns.
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly


Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Nomad]
#3409376 - 11/25/04 07:14 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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"I will prefer the direct, first-hand psychedelic experience over any scriptures"
While the entheogenic experience has a spiritual dimension, so to do all things in life...walking in the forest...dreaming...reading a book...hunting or fishing...driving to work are examples. Entheogens can open one to new ideas as can they make one prey to falsehood and delusion. One's perception of the spirit should be based on much more than the ingestion of indole ring compounds and phenylethylamines. One's daily experience is direct communication with the spirit if one will but look. The spiritual signifigance of entheogens should never be given MORE weight than any other experience in life.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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SkorpivoMusterion
Livin in theTwilight Zone...


Registered: 01/30/03
Posts: 9,954
Loc: You can't spell fungus wi...
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Quote:
fireworks_god said: I just have to say, Markos, its been great, reading and feeling your perspective. 
I'm amazed and reassured that someone such as yourself has evolved to this point in life where your mind is extremely encompassing and complexly structured, and not only this, but that it seems to be that the individual facets of that mind are networked properly. At the same time, it appears that your mind, while being an immense, elaborate system, is free of clutter and needless, emotional residue - its structure is kept at a bare minimum to perform its required tasks, and it does not interfere or obstruct your direct perception of reality.
Not only all of this, but perhaps the most important aspect of what I perceive of you is that while your mind is quite advanced and formed, the formless beyond your mind, your pure state of being, is almost infinitely more deep and conscious. I feel that you are experiencing reality and pure awareness beyond the constrains of the mind. 
I am not saying these things to cater to your ego, or mine, for that matter. I find these aspects that I have observed of you very interesting as they mirror myself to similar degrees, and considering your extensive worldly knowledge, your much longer time on this planet, and your apparent deep state of being to be a glimpse of where I may someday (soon ) be, if I continue on this path moment by moment.
I surmise that perhaps there are times when you are almost completely free of the operation of your mind, and other times when your being might get lost in the complex workings of your mind, but the majority of the time, keeping a most important balance between the two, depending on the situation present in your life at the time and what it requires from you. It seems as though you have followed the upward spiral and have indeed reached a higher place.
Some might get lost in the structure and elaborations of your expressions here, but it seems that you hold it as a mere convention, a tool, and a powerful tool at that. The meaning and the being run deep and are formless and most ripe for experience. 
Sorry, I just felt the need to express some appreciation for you and your being here, you've definitely helped me evolve and grow, perhaps this is partially why the similarities that I note developed in the first place. 
Yup. 
-------------------- Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.
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Nomad
Mad Robot

Registered: 04/30/02
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While the entheogenic experience has a spiritual dimension, so to do all things in life...walking in the forest...dreaming...reading a book...hunting or fishing...driving to work are examples.
I understand that you are coming from a shamanic perspective. I am on a different path; I don't say that you are wrong or something, but ultimately one has to accept that there may be different approaches to spirituality. I am a buddhist within a certain tradition; as such, my spirituality is based on certain primary texts which I rely on as the source of my understanding, through "rational faith" - as if, when one finds that a certain map is correct on known territory, one will use it when approaching the unknown, too. For me, in the context of my path, walking in the forest, hunting or fishing, and driving to work do not have a spiritual dimension - while entheogens, dreaming, and reading a book may have one.
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder


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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Nomad]
#3411663 - 11/26/04 09:42 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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How is it that your own singular experience outweighs a consensus of a tradition that you supposedly hold dear?????????? I read the Bible for a long time, and because I could not see things from a higher perspective, I was in disagreement with certain doctrines. My response was not to "burn" the book, but to develop to the degree where I could understand and conform to the more profound perspective.
I also "prefer" MY own experience, psychedelically enhanced or otherwise because it's MINE, MINE, MINE,. I expecct that you get the point. If not, there are the ol' Beatle lyrics: "...all through the day...I-Me-Mine...I-Me-Mine...I-Me-Mine..." EGO, just EGO. One has to test one's own experience against the Wisdom of the ages. If one thinks that one's own individual experience is more insightful than a truly revered tradition, then one is wise in one's own eyes, and one is deluded by Ego. The scriptures serve as a higher frame of reference for individual experiences. NOW...interpretation of the scriptures based upon one's compelling experiences is another matter. For example, I can clearly see a whole Gnostic interpretation of St. Paul's words, pointed out BTW by Princeton scholar Elaine Pagels, whereas the whole world sees only a surface [my 'opinion'] meaning to Paul's words. My job (and yours too, I might add) is to be humble enough to listen and understand what the Elders were teaching, and to conform yourself and see your experiences through a higher perspective than one's own little Ego.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder


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I don't know quite what to say, so I'll deal with your kind adulation by working backwards with my reply and stating 'Nice puppy!" Coincidentally, my Lady and I just listened to a dog expert on the Diane Rheme [sp?] show on NPR. I wish you both a long and happy relationship.
As to the first part of your post, I believe that I have managed to keep my mind to a large extent "at a bare minimum to perform its required tasks." It is quite perceptive of you to know that. My Lady oftentimes reminds me how fortunate I am to live with so much free mental space. One major contributing factor is the nature of my job which has no paperwork, is from 8:20-3:40 PM, Monday-Friday, 212 days of the year. A second major component, which is too great a sacrifice for others, is that I have no children. This is not a sacrifice for me because I have never had even a fleeting desire for children, but the benefit is lots of free time for a contemplative, action-free lifestyle.
As to your kind projection of spiritual advancement: firstly, the same metaphysical depth that my being emerges from is the same metaphysical depth that your being emerges from - ONE and the same. If the 'weave' of my life is looser because of the 'space' that my lifestyle permits, you can more easily see the radiance of that metaphysical substratum come through with my words. It is not so much a matter of personal attainment as it is a lifestyle "free of clutter and emotional residue" as you so eloquently put it. I occurs to me that the swords belonging to wrathful Tibetan deities like Mahakala and Manjushri, are symbols for the continual cutting free of attachments. We have to do this because just like computer spyware, those virtual barnacles that keep secretly attaching to our PCs, the impressions of life - the sexy, the dangerous, the envious, etc. constantly register in us if only subliminally, weighing us down and slowing our journey.
As a professional counselor, I believe in what is called 'counselor transparency,' the opposite of an analyst who remains opaque and impenetrable to the analysand, so that my counselees can see that I have no hidden agendas, no dark motives moving about in my see-through being. This also is what comes through no doubt in my posts, and as I was blown away by similar perceptions of psychologist Richard Alpert (AKA Ram Dass) when he used to take callers on W-BAI radio in the 70's, I wanted to do as he did back then. He was one of my teachers. So was Stephen Gaskin of The Farm who wrote 'Monday Night Class' and 'Caravan.' These guys manifested ruthlessly, or should I say, Wrathfullly Truthful perspectives on selfhood.
So, thank you for your appreciation but allow me to leave you with this bit of Biblical Wisdom attributed to Jesus: "Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is God..." -Matthew 19-17
With peace and affection, -MtG
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


Registered: 03/12/02
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Quote:
MarkostheGnostic said: As to your kind projection of spiritual advancement: firstly, the same metaphysical depth that my being emerges from is the same metaphysical depth that your being emerges from - ONE and the same.
Indeed, and to put what you said of this following what I quoted in my own words, which I probably should have done in the first reply, it shines through because you are more conscious and aware of that state of being. Your mind is not seperating you from it. 
I like that you used the word "transparent", I used that word to describe a better functioning mind in a post at the revolution forum not even a couple of hours ago, and it is not a word I have used in that context before... 
Anyways, I basically made that post because I've been having a lot of quick, new insights as a result of a long period of sobriety and constant seeking, and the state of mind and being that I've been slowly piecing together and striving for, with an idea of what I was developing but not as a whole, has really started to come to be, and reading your posts here, it really helped confirm and assure.
And, as to your closing comment, indeed. Do not attempt to grasp onto this experience or identify it as "your" experience, or characterize it into a sense of self. Just let it be, let it flow through you, experience without attachment... etc. etc. etc... 
 Peace.
--------------------
If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly


Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Nomad]
#3412267 - 11/26/04 12:32 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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You do not recognize that the process of living is a spiritual experience...only certain arcane texts or drug experiences have meaning for you? That sounds very limited and blind.
Edited by Huehuecoyotl (11/26/04 04:09 PM)
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Nomad
Mad Robot

Registered: 04/30/02
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You do not recognize that the process of living is a spiritual experience
Life can be an awesome spiritual experience; I just do not think it is necessarily that way. I try to make living into a spiritual experience - I do not think it inherently is.
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Nomad
Mad Robot

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How is it that your own singular experience outweighs a consensus of a tradition that you supposedly hold dear?????????? Because Theravada is just one of several early buddhist schools; the commentaries were not held in common, but the Pali apparently was. Theravada did not survive because it was the school which best represented the Buddha's teaching. The other schools were wiped out through a historical accident. "Be ye, therefore, islands unto yourselves, refuges unto yourselves, seeking no external refuge; with the truth as your island, the truth as your refuge, seeking no other refuge. " - Mahaparinibbana Sutta. And thanks for the psychological evaluation, but you do not know a damn thing about me.
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder


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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Nomad]
#3420599 - 11/28/04 07:46 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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I beg to differ inasmuch as the Theravadin school is the ONLY remaining school of the Hinayana (Small Vehicle), whereas the Mahayana (Great Vehicle) and Vajrayana (Thunderbolt/Diamond Vehicle_ continue to this day. The Buddhism of Thailand and Cambodia, monastic for the most part, are Theravadin schools.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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Nomad
Mad Robot

Registered: 04/30/02
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This not being my mother tongue, I sometimes have a hard time with grammatics. So this should read: "The reason why Theravada did survive was not because it was the school which best represented the Buddha's teachings. The other schools were wiped out through a historical accident." You do not differ at all.
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CosmicJoke
happy mutant


Registered: 04/05/00
Posts: 10,848
Loc: Portland, OR
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i suppose my downfall as a psychology and philosophy double major was the psychedelic experience. my care and appreciation for the subjects became entirely extricated from the academic fields. i found myself again and again charming my professors into letting me do what i wanted - e.g. i'd take a class on Taoism and wind up writing my final paper on Timothy Leary, instead of valuing and trying to understand the course material they presented - fortunately, my main philosophy prof. was a student of Alan Watts at Berkeley nonetheless, unless you wind up in an extremely progressive and alternative school suited to your needs, i think the further you go with the psychedelics the more detached you will become from your intended fields of study. i mean, you really have to understand your own mind pretty well before you jump into a path like this. what are your motives for doing this? how much do you truly like -philosophy- as it is in academics - compared to your self-image as a philosopher. you realize you have to throw all YOUR opinions, thoughts, likes and dislikes out the window, and develop a lust for history, culture, and the complex systems of thought that arose from them ---- that is, you want to objectively understand them, not judge them. and can you still remain a youthful, social, sexual, hip person? can you integrate this rigid philosophy world of academia which you must strive for excellence to get into a grad program and have a real chance as a professor, while the psychedelic hepcat your youthful soul says you're born to be is just coming to life?
not i - i'm 24 years old now, it's been 2 years since i finished my degrees in 2002, and i'm finally back in school doing computer engineering so i can some day afford a house in downtown seattle. psychedelics showed me that regardless of whatever you do it's utterly essential that you are your own psychologist and philosopher, that you understand your own mind, your own existance. these are suprisingly only fully realized through comparatively much simpler practices than i ever allowed myself the time for as a philosophy student.
however, this is me, and i know nothing about you. and nobody can rob you of your big decision. i'm sure it would daunt me, excite me, and i'd inevitably go against the odds when i faced that situation. you know, it really is an exciting time to be alive. some major breakthroughs are headed your way no matter what direction you take. keep us posted.
-------------------- Everything is better than it was the last time. I'm good. If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care. It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence. I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too. If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.
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rogue_pixie
faerydae


Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 3,977
Loc: UK
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: ferago2]
#3422159 - 11/29/04 03:11 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
ferago2 said: I'm studying philosophy in school myself. I'm in my 3rd semester of college, and so far I've taken an intro level class in which we read a whole variety of different philosophical writings, from political philosophy to metaphysics (do we have free will?) and epistimology (what are the limits of human knowledge?). I've also taken what's called "modern philosophy," which is really the progression of philosophical thought from Descartes (whose skeptical method would be useful on this board :p) to Kant, who has a whole lot to say about what we are able to know, and what we can never know. The third class I'm taking currently. It's philosophy of song, and we're focusing on what makes songs appealing, including analyzing the melody, rhythms, structure, lyrics and so on, as well as reading Shopenhauer, Plato, and some contemporary theorists.
Academic philosophy really breaks down into 3 areas: Political philosophy (self explanitory) value theory or aesthetics (what makes things beautiful, important, etc... like my song class) and metaphysics/epistimology (how the world is, and what constitutes knowledge). The later is probably going to be my area of focus, and is the most closely linked with what goes on on this board, although most of the posters here could learn a whole lot from any philosophy class's discussion of logic, and what constitutes valid and sound arguements.
I dunno what jobs you can get with a philosophy degree besides graduate school or law school, so I'm either going to double major in journalism, or triple major in that and another subject.
Hope this helps.
At last a sensible answer! Thank you, that has helped me a lot.
-------------------- "Whatever you do, you need to keep moving. Because when you stop moving you die (physically and emotionally). Good luck and blessings of happiness and fortune." ~ RandalFlagg RIP
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CosmicJoke
happy mutant


Registered: 04/05/00
Posts: 10,848
Loc: Portland, OR
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: rogue_pixie]
#3422751 - 11/29/04 11:19 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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i'm sorry, my last post was directed to you, but apparently i replied to the last post, which at the time was Markos' post - now that I know what you want, I can tell you more specifics. The intent from my academic program was that you'd do 3 different things: apply for grad school in philosophy to one day be a professor of philosophy, or use it as a springboard into seminary school or law school. philosophy in my school was the easiest degree you could get you could obtain, there were no math or science or language requirements, though it's most likely your general education requirements for arts and sciences will require you to fulfill some of these. the philosophy degree itself required you merely to take 40hrs of philosophy, including Symbolic Logic and 3 classes over the 400 level. Symbolic Logic is a course that involves systematically testing whether or not philisophical arguments are valid and sound by basically reducing them to math. In fact, there was a low level course in philosophy for non majors called "The Principles of Reasoning" that was a less intensive Symbolic Logic course to fulfill a math General Education Requirement. Another way in my school you could avoid taking a course through the math department was to take a psychology statistics class. Anyways, our philosophy department lumped in all the comparative religions, so you could take Old Testatment, New Testament, Islam, Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism, and Taoism as courses. A perk of taking the Christianity courses is that you will most likely get an incredible, rather expensive, annotated Oxford edition of the Old & New Testament. a philosophy course in Christianity will fall closely under the lines of history, you will learn about the history and culture of the mediterranean 2,000 years ago and will most likely compare the Gospels through different means, like their different themes, the different political agendas of their authors, ect. However, there was also a phiosophy of religion course that showed different philosophers across time's "proofs" (very similar to geometry proofs) of God's existance. There will be a political philosophy, and you may be excited to jump to into the works of Karl Marx and Nietzsche. There will be a modern philosophy course and you'll learn about Descartes "evil deceivers" and you will slave over Spinoza's long lists of axioms and definitions.
That's a philosophy major in a nut shell, man.
-------------------- Everything is better than it was the last time. I'm good. If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care. It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence. I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too. If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.
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Moonshoe
Blue Mantis


Registered: 05/28/04
Posts: 27,202
Loc: Iceland
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Nomad]
#3422958 - 11/29/04 12:25 PM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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"While the entheogenic experience has a spiritual dimension, so to do all things in life...walking in the forest...dreaming...reading a book...hunting or fishing...driving to work are examples. "
hes absolutely right you know. And being a buddhist is not at all in contradiction with what hes saying, far from it. If you are forced to cut your life into the spiritual and the nonspiritual, the sacred and the mundane, your missing the point.
I used to make the same mistake, thinking if i just meditated more, just had a few more enlightening drug trips, or could just lucid dream more, i would be 'spiritual'
now i realize the single most important, difficult, and rewarding aspect of spirituality is being in touch with the tao, the essence of every experience you have. Awareness is the key to spiritual existance.
While on the bus, on the way to school, in class, whatever, being aware, being thankfull , being in love with the world, and trying to be in the moment are the most important parts of a spiritual life.
Meditation and such are good to , but whats the point in meditating or having drug trips if you dont carry over that wisdom into your regular life?
its as hollow and meaningless as the sinner who goes to church on sunday and then says fuck it all week, and does as he wants.
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Everything I post is fiction.
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Nomad
Mad Robot

Registered: 04/30/02
Posts: 422
Last seen: 16 years, 1 month
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: Moonshoe]
#3426687 - 11/30/04 03:44 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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While on the bus, on the way to school, in class, whatever, being aware, being thankfull , being in love with the world, and trying to be in the moment are the most important parts of a spiritual life.
Meditation and such are good to , but whats the point in meditating or having drug trips if you dont carry over that wisdom into your regular life?
I see what you mean, and I sort of agree. But I think that what is spiritual is the actual being in touch with the Tao, not the riding a bus thing in itself. Whatever you do, wherever you are, if you are in touch with the Tao, it is spiritual. If not, then not.
Hey, and whats up with all that talking about awareness? Gotta start a new thread.
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rogue_pixie
faerydae


Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 3,977
Loc: UK
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Re: A philosophy degree? [Re: CosmicJoke]
#3426799 - 11/30/04 05:05 AM (19 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
CosmicJoke said: i'm sorry, my last post was directed to you, but apparently i replied to the last post, which at the time was Markos' post - now that I know what you want, I can tell you more specifics. The intent from my academic program was that you'd do 3 different things: apply for grad school in philosophy to one day be a professor of philosophy, or use it as a springboard into seminary school or law school. philosophy in my school was the easiest degree you could get you could obtain, there were no math or science or language requirements, though it's most likely your general education requirements for arts and sciences will require you to fulfill some of these. the philosophy degree itself required you merely to take 40hrs of philosophy, including Symbolic Logic and 3 classes over the 400 level. Symbolic Logic is a course that involves systematically testing whether or not philisophical arguments are valid and sound by basically reducing them to math. In fact, there was a low level course in philosophy for non majors called "The Principles of Reasoning" that was a less intensive Symbolic Logic course to fulfill a math General Education Requirement. Another way in my school you could avoid taking a course through the math department was to take a psychology statistics class. Anyways, our philosophy department lumped in all the comparative religions, so you could take Old Testatment, New Testament, Islam, Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism, and Taoism as courses. A perk of taking the Christianity courses is that you will most likely get an incredible, rather expensive, annotated Oxford edition of the Old & New Testament. a philosophy course in Christianity will fall closely under the lines of history, you will learn about the history and culture of the mediterranean 2,000 years ago and will most likely compare the Gospels through different means, like their different themes, the different political agendas of their authors, ect. However, there was also a phiosophy of religion course that showed different philosophers across time's "proofs" (very similar to geometry proofs) of God's existance. There will be a political philosophy, and you may be excited to jump to into the works of Karl Marx and Nietzsche. There will be a modern philosophy course and you'll learn about Descartes "evil deceivers" and you will slave over Spinoza's long lists of axioms and definitions.
That's a philosophy major in a nut shell, man.
Thank you for that valuable insight. I'm actually based in the UK so I expect things will be done slightly differently. The study of Taoism, which I recently stumbled accross fascinates me, as does Buddhism, another recent encounter. I'm a "political kind of person" so the philosophy of politics is definitely something that intrigues me, not so much the socialist side but the anarchist thought from the likes of Peter Kropkutin and Emma Goldman, which I don't think you cover in sociology or politics and probably not Philosophy but anyway maybe I could choose to specialise in that area at some point? I gathered your previous post was aimed at me, it was appreciated but I was looking more for a guide to the course specifics and what we learn about as opposed to what it will allow me to achieve in later life - which I have no interest in at the moment, I have no career plan (but I know it certainly won't be law) I just want to do something that interests me and this sounds like the right course from peoples responses. I couldn't help but feel your response was a tad pessimistic but I understand that it isn't the most practical degree in the world. Having said that, isn't every degree valid in society, no matter what it is in nowadays?
-------------------- "Whatever you do, you need to keep moving. Because when you stop moving you die (physically and emotionally). Good luck and blessings of happiness and fortune." ~ RandalFlagg RIP
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