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Phred
Fred's son
Registered: 10/18/00
Posts: 12,949
Loc: Dominican Republic
Last seen: 9 years, 2 months
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Re: can the government make you wear a helmet? [Re: ]
#3329930 - 11/07/04 09:16 AM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
by making healthcare a tax-funded service, you justify government intervention in activities that may be dangerous or unhealthy.
As usual, mushmaster nails it.
pinky
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BleaK
paradox
Registered: 06/23/02
Posts: 1,583
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
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Re: can the government make you wear a helmet? [Re: Phred]
#3330541 - 11/07/04 05:12 PM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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i wave my right to tax funded medical care. i take care of myself. blow me.
-------------------- "You cannot trust in law, unless you can trust in people. If you can trust in people, you don't need law." -J. Mumma
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unbeliever
Yo Daddy!
Registered: 05/22/04
Posts: 5,158
Loc: Gallifrey
Last seen: 15 years, 21 days
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Re: can the government make you wear a helmet? [Re: Tao]
#3331214 - 11/07/04 08:25 PM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
TaoTeChing said: oh and time for a new sig btw lds
speaking of which... I made a shirt of the too many xtians not enough lions a long time ago.. did you come up with it on your own as well? I also had a comic strip on .... oh whatever the hell that do it yourself comic strip creator thing is. I'll see if I can dig them up.
preview edit: found them
Most of them suck due to my lack of talent. But a few of them are kinda funny.
-------------------- Happiness is a warm gun...
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Tao
Village Genius
Registered: 09/19/03
Posts: 7,935
Loc: San Diego
Last seen: 8 years, 9 months
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Re: can the government make you wear a helmet? [Re: Ancalagon]
#3332054 - 11/08/04 01:49 AM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
' What if the Canadian government mandates a government official be present everytime a Canadian wants to drive his/her car, for safety purposes -- would you acquiesce to that? Perhaps the Canadian government can mandate every living residence have completely padded walls and floors; would you be fine with that? I think you see where I'm going here.
ahhh, the good ol' slippery slope arguement
my point was that it is NOT much of an inconvenience nor expensive, while what you mentioned would be both. the ratio of safety to inconvenience is extraordinary. there are always lines that have to be drawn, even libertarianism draws lines where liberty must be sacrificed. it just pisses me off when people mention seatbelt and helmet laws in the same breath as issues that are far, far more important. its not a big deal putting on a helmet or wearing a seatbelt, and requiring its use will stop the stigma of both being somehow 'uncool'().
-------------------- Magash's Grain Tek + Tub-in-Tub Incubator + Magash's PMP + SBP Tek + Dunking = Practically all a newbie grower needs
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Tao
Village Genius
Registered: 09/19/03
Posts: 7,935
Loc: San Diego
Last seen: 8 years, 9 months
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Re: can the government make you wear a helmet? [Re: unbeliever]
#3332064 - 11/08/04 01:58 AM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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no i didnt come up with it, i ran across it looking for bumper stickers a couple months ago and was laughing my ass off when i read it.
-------------------- Magash's Grain Tek + Tub-in-Tub Incubator + Magash's PMP + SBP Tek + Dunking = Practically all a newbie grower needs
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d33p
Welcome to Violence
Registered: 07/12/03
Posts: 5,381
Loc: the shores of Tripoli
Last seen: 10 years, 10 months
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Re: can the government make you wear a helmet? [Re: Tao]
#3348773 - 11/11/04 08:34 PM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
TaoTeChing said: no i didnt come up with it, i ran across it looking for bumper stickers a couple months ago and was laughing my ass off when i read it.
Aha, in my studies guess what i came across? The origin of this saying.
?They think the Christians are at the bottom of every disaster to the state and every misfortune of the people. If the Tiber floods the city or the Nile fails to flood the fields, if there are portents in heaven or earthquakes on earth, if famine comes or plague, they clamour instantly "Throw the Christians to the lion." So many, to one lion?? (Apologeticus, xi)
From the great 3rd century AD christian writer Tertullian.
Thank you, thank you
-------------------- I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends. bang bang
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DirtMcgirt
in a pinch
Registered: 10/20/04
Posts: 2,213
Loc: city of angels
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Re: can the government make you wear a helmet? [Re: Phred]
#3348880 - 11/11/04 08:59 PM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Quote: by making healthcare a tax-funded service, you justify government intervention in activities that may be dangerous or unhealthy.
As usual, mushmaster nails it.
That is stupid. Your connecting two issues that have little to do with one another. Its like saying because I allow the the government to tax my income they have the right to tell what kind of job I get....
BTW helmets do make you look lame
-------------------- "And we, inhabitants of the great coral of the Cosmos, believe the atom (which still we cannot see) to be full matter, whereas, it too, like everything else, is but an embroidery of voids in the Void, and we give the name of being, dense and even eternal, to that dance of inconsistencies, that infinite extension that is identified with absolute Nothingness and that spins from its own non-being the illusion of everything."
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d33p
Welcome to Violence
Registered: 07/12/03
Posts: 5,381
Loc: the shores of Tripoli
Last seen: 10 years, 10 months
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Re: can the government make you wear a helmet? [Re: DirtMcgirt]
#3349372 - 11/11/04 10:28 PM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
DirtMcgirt said:
Quote:
Quote: by making healthcare a tax-funded service, you justify government intervention in activities that may be dangerous or unhealthy.
As usual, mushmaster nails it.
That is stupid. Your connecting two issues that have little to do with one another. Its like saying because I allow the the government to tax my income they have the right to tell what kind of job I get....
Wow someone failed analogies in highschool. Not even close.
-------------------- I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends. bang bang
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z@z.com
Libertarian
Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 2,876
Loc: ATL
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Re: can the government make you wear a helmet? [Re: DirtMcgirt]
#3349441 - 11/11/04 10:42 PM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
DirtMcgirt said: That is stupid. Your connecting two issues that have little to do with one another. Its like saying because I allow the the government to tax my income they have the right to tell what kind of job I get....
BTW helmets do make you look lame
The point is that once it starts to cost the government money they feel it is their right (and I would say it is) to regulate it. The only way to avoid excessive gov't regulation is to keep them out of our day to day lives. And yes the two issues are very much related.
-------------------- "Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson
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DirtMcgirt
in a pinch
Registered: 10/20/04
Posts: 2,213
Loc: city of angels
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Re: can the government make you wear a helmet? [Re: z@z.com]
#3350069 - 11/12/04 02:56 AM (19 years, 4 months ago) |
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How? Because of the negligible costs incurred they are justified? I'm sure they were closing hospitals down everywhere and raising taxes because the system was bogged down by skateboarders cracking their heads open. But you justify them...You claim to be anti government control of our lives but you say they are justified when it affects something state sponsored at all. If government tries to regulate something you don't let them by holding them accountable. Thats how you keep them out of your lives, not by assuming they have the right to run the country like a business. I'm not going into a privatization debate but your clearly just politicking your own views against Canada's health care. The fact is the government is regulating something they have no business regulating.
-------------------- "And we, inhabitants of the great coral of the Cosmos, believe the atom (which still we cannot see) to be full matter, whereas, it too, like everything else, is but an embroidery of voids in the Void, and we give the name of being, dense and even eternal, to that dance of inconsistencies, that infinite extension that is identified with absolute Nothingness and that spins from its own non-being the illusion of everything."
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demon66
Stranger
Registered: 08/19/10
Posts: 677
Last seen: 11 years, 11 months
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Re: can the government make you wear a helmet? [Re: DirtMcgirt]
#14491305 - 05/21/11 08:29 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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I an 100% against all helmet laws. Especially for bicycles, and I am an avid cyclist.
It is my body!!
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demon66
Stranger
Registered: 08/19/10
Posts: 677
Last seen: 11 years, 11 months
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Re: can the government make you wear a helmet? [Re: sir tripsalot]
#14491319 - 05/21/11 08:33 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
sir tripsalot said: The government workers have to clean up the mess when you take a dive so they are attempting to save costs(and lives if you wanna give them that).[/quote
Even if helmets do save any amount of lives this logic goes both ways. Suppose a 50 some year old man dies in an accident that supposidly wouldn't have happened if he had a helmet. This man btw worked all his life and now never collects social security. The government actually saves money cuz he died at this age.
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SirTripAlot
Semper Fidelis
Registered: 01/11/05
Posts: 7,633
Loc: Harmless (Mostly)
Last seen: 17 hours, 56 minutes
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Re: can the government make you wear a helmet? [Re: chodamunky]
#14491808 - 05/21/11 10:35 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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In Illinois, you must wear a seatbelt while operating a motor vehicle (the whole "Click it, or Ticket" campaign) yet, there is no mandatory helmet law.... and thank God for it.....any sane individual knows fully well how much more dangerous it is to drive a car than a motorcycle.
-------------------- “I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”
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txlibertarian
Stranger
Registered: 05/31/10
Posts: 79
Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
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Re: can the government make you wear a helmet? [Re: Anonymous]
#14492323 - 05/22/11 01:24 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
this logic only applies when one is not going to be using nationalized healthcare in the event that one injured.
by making healthcare a tax-funded service, you justify government intervention in activities that may be dangerous or unhealthy.
So why not just make it a law that only non-insured people are required to wear helmets? People that take individual responsibility in order to insure themselves can do as they please - and the people that refuse taking responsibility will be required by law to wear helmets.
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communeart
Registered: 12/04/06
Posts: 1,021
Loc:
Last seen: 11 years, 11 months
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Re: can the government make you wear a helmet? [Re: txlibertarian]
#14492819 - 05/22/11 05:59 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
txlibertarian said:
Quote:
this logic only applies when one is not going to be using nationalized healthcare in the event that one injured.
by making healthcare a tax-funded service, you justify government intervention in activities that may be dangerous or unhealthy.
So why not just make it a law that only non-insured people are required to wear helmets? People that take individual responsibility in order to insure themselves can do as they please - and the people that refuse taking responsibility will be required by law to wear helmets.
The cops will have a hard time guessing who has insurance and who doesn't, it might not be practical. As for the helmets laws i have seen someone on television being quite mad about it since he personally drives slow and enjoy his ride without a helmet, when he drives faster he puts an helmet on. i felt that he was right so i guess perhaps a law that combine speed and helmets would be in order? what do you think about that demon66?
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Shins
Fun guy
Registered: 09/15/04
Posts: 16,337
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Re: can the government make you wear a helmet? [Re: communeart]
#14492840 - 05/22/11 06:12 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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How about we stop being such socialists?
Then if someone falls and hurts themselves the "tax has to pay for medical bills" point is moot.
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communeart
Registered: 12/04/06
Posts: 1,021
Loc:
Last seen: 11 years, 11 months
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Re: can the government make you wear a helmet? [Re: Shins]
#14492851 - 05/22/11 06:19 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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If you want to replace socialism then have it being charity. in the movie sicko, that guy who has to wonder if he keeps in middle finger or his index, well that's fucking crazy and i don't think americans really want a system like that either. i dunno, it feels hard to picture a society like that of america right now for me. healthcare seems like one of the few things that really should be public from my point of view here in canada.
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