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Invisiblephalloidin

Registered: 07/03/04
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White san pedro pups
    #3298174 - 10/30/04 06:55 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

A while back I got a bunch of san pedro logs that I was gonna use to do an extraction. Anyways, I set them aside in a box in my closet for about a month or so. I pulled them out today, and there are about 6 or seven pups sprouting off various cuttings that are completely white. They are rather skinny and range for around an inch to four inches long. Could these be clipped off and planted? would they survive? Is it worth the effort?


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Invisibleblink
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Re: White san pedro pups [Re: phalloidin]
    #3298206 - 10/30/04 07:03 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

the white means no chlorophyll... makes sense if they arent able to photosynthesize (IE no light)

pups are white before they break the surface of the dirt as well for the same reason


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Offlinekoppie
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Re: White san pedro pups [Re: blink]
    #3298316 - 10/30/04 07:43 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

They probably will survive. Exposure to light will force them to produce chlorophyll and turn green.

If you absolutely want to make sure they'll survive, keep the logs in the light for a couple of weeks until the pups have turned green, and then cut them off.


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OfflineGr0wer
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Re: White san pedro pups [Re: koppie]
    #3299691 - 10/31/04 01:31 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Root the logs and throw them under some floros. Let the pups get about a foot tall. Leave a good 3-4" on the rooted log to throw out more pups and root a 8-12" cutting.


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Invisiblezee_werp
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Re: White san pedro pups [Re: Gr0wer]
    #3300245 - 10/31/04 06:35 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Mr.Tryptastic, I've had this exact thing happen to me before. If you leave it in there for 2+ months they start growing roots too. In my case I was leaving the cutting in the dark to stress it before consumption.

Anyway, the answer is yes those little white pups will easily root up and grow really good! No need to leave them on the main branch, that is still good for eating. All you need to do is pull or cut the white pups off where they join onto the branch. Then, get yourself some good draining soil (either buy cactus mix, or else get normal potting mix and add 1/3 - 1/2 washed sand or fine perlite).

Plant the babies about 1 inch deep, and soak the soil once when you do that (causes any empty spaces around the cutting to fill in, so that the cutting stays more stable and theres soil contact at its surface). Then, put them under medium strength light (fluoro works well, or a non-sunny window sill). You should notice them start to green up, eventually all the white flesh will turn a healthy green.

Water them about once every two weeks after you plant them, until they have become firmly rooted and then you can start watering them more often.

When they start growing, I like to gradually add more soil around their base (the skinny part) so that theres only the wider parts above the soil. New roots grow out from the covered area and the cacti continue to fatten up.

Then, just grow them as per usual. I find these little pups make excellent grafting stock for slower growing cacti once they get 5-8 inches (10-15cm ish) tall.

Good luck, happy tripping, happy growing!


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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: White san pedro pups [Re: zee_werp]
    #3301622 - 10/31/04 06:21 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

zee, that may work but I would not do it that way. The smaller the pup the less likely for it to survive and the longer it takes to root. I like Grower's method better. I would also not water any cutting right after taking it. Let it callous off for at least a week and then put it in dry soil. I have done it the wet soil way and it worked but other times I got rot. Water them after they have roots. Cacti put out roots when they are thirsty, water does not make them grow more roots.

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Re: White san pedro pups [Re: phalloidin]
    #3302141 - 10/31/04 08:51 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I can't think of the word that's used to describe that effect, i want to say etiolation but i looked up the exact definition and it doesn't include bleaching/blanching due to insufficient light.


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Invisiblezee_werp
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Re: White san pedro pups [Re: neuro]
    #3302236 - 10/31/04 09:20 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Yes stonehenge it is true that its best to let a normal cactus cutting callous over before you ever plant it or give it any water, but these pups are different in the sense that (a) they are tiny so they can shrivel up easier, and (b) they usually join onto the main stem at a very tiny point meaning that they don't have much of a spot to callous over. The first watering I mentioned is simply to bring the soil properly in contact with the cutting. Air gaps between the soil and the cutting are undesirable. If your soil is well draining enough it should dry out sufficently within 6 hours or so of watering. As for watering after that, I've found that a cutting should have thrown out at least a few baby roots by the 2 week mark, though yes it can take longer so maybe its best to wait a month before the next watering.

I'm just outlining the way that it has worked succesfully for me in the past in this exact same situation with white pups. When it comes down to it, I think its pretty hard to screw up rooting a cactus cutting, so most of the ideas mentioned in this thread will probably all work out fine. :smile:


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Offlineneuro
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Re: White san pedro pups [Re: zee_werp]
    #3302404 - 10/31/04 10:02 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

The plant in question is a whole fleshed cactus except for a small spot where it was joined to the main stem?

If this is the case, then the only thing you have to do is let the small button callus up a bit, then plant it deepe enough to support it, water it once, then leave it. I do this with a lot of arms and i've had no trouble yet.


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Re: White san pedro pups [Re: neuro]
    #3303157 - 11/01/04 01:57 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I would never try to root a unhealty pup, your asking for failure. If anything you can look into tissue culture for the white pups. I wouldnt expect much but rot if you plant un-callused cuttings. Your much better in the long run to root that log and have it returned to you by next fall. Then you can harvest your pups and still thave the rootstock for another harvest next season.


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Re: White san pedro pups [Re: Gr0wer]
    #3303896 - 11/01/04 09:09 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I don't think you are really getting how easy it actually is to root these white pups, trust me, I've done it before. It is really, really unnecessary to even consider tissue culture for that type of thing, these little pups can be viewed more as a bonus than anything else. The point here is yeah he could plant the branch that the pups are coming off and that would root up and the pups could grow, but in the end he could also make a brew out of the branch, have a great trip and plant the pups for some bonus graft stock or whatever.

Yes I agree that it is not a good idea to root an uncalloused cutting, but these little things can callus up in a couple of days, when you cut them off the only bit thats exposed is usually just the woody vascular bundle area and hardly any actual 'flesh'.


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Re: White san pedro pups [Re: Gr0wer]
    #3303969 - 11/01/04 09:59 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

It's not unhealthy as you think. The cactus is surviving on stored sugars, the only problem it has is that it can't make more food at the moment, but that by no means classifies it as unhealthy. It's similar to when i was keeping white african violets in tissue culture, think of the agar with nutrients as the sugars in the cactus.

So long as that small spot is callused and you don't water the shit out of it continually there shouldn't be too much of a problem. The chlorophyll will start to reproduce and green up again.


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Invisiblephalloidin

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Re: White san pedro pups [Re: phalloidin]
    #3309605 - 11/02/04 04:31 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Thanks everyone for the advice. I think I'll probably root one of the logs (it already has roots coming off of it), and cut the pups off the other logs and try root them also. The pups also have little roots coming off of them, so I think they'll have a good chance of surviving. I've already got several San Pedros growing, but its always cool to have more. Thanks again


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Re: White san pedro pups [Re: phalloidin]
    #3314761 - 11/03/04 02:30 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I would calus the cutting, ive had some experience with not calusing enough that brought only rot. I also tried to root a 3" white tip and it grew no roots after 5 weeks while all my other logs had large roots.


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