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Offlinehyphae
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Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. * 51
    #3290155 - 10/28/04 05:56 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

We will start with the use of cakes to make casings as most newbies will be starting this way. Once you get the hang of it you can then apply this to any casing. (rye, wbs, straw, straw/dung, etc;)

Lets begin with your cakes they need to be incubated at optimum temps (for best results) 82-84 degrees until colonized fully this means not just the surface but throughout the cake. This will usually happen 3-4 days after the outside has been colonized. I then suggest a 24hr. fridge dunk in "clean" water after the cakes have been cleaned of all pins/knots (anything that can be wiped off the surface) under the faucet using cold water, don't worry about contams because you washed your hands with anti bac. soap didn't ya? :wink: and fully colonized cakes are very resistant to contams. After dunking I then rinse once more time shaking excess water off the cakes and then drop them into a gal. ziplock bag and seal. Now the casings here are but just 2 half pints, that have been crumbled in the bag from the outside (it works slick!) into nickel sized chunks. Once the cakes have been crumbled I like to let them sit overnight to recoup so any exposed areas will be covered. I will then place them into a cleaned tray/container and make it as level as possible, this is actually very important in getting nice even flushes because this allows the myc to break the surface much more evenly.

I apply my preferred casing which 50/50+ IMO gives the best microclimate for pin development at a depth of 1/2-5/8in.at an even thickness (also very, important for even flushes) I then mist it down stopping often and looking at the surface of the casing to see the point where it glistens, this is the point that I call "Near Saturation" This is the optimal moisture level for mycelium growth.
At this point I will cover with foil or saranwrap and again
incubate at 82-84 degrees for 3 days without opening and looking, on the third day I will take a look and see if any mycelium has poked through if not I cover for another day. as soon as I see any mycelium poking through in a number of spots around the container I patch and place directly into the fruiting chamber which has a temp. of 74-77 degrees (again optimal) I also introduce 12-16hrs. of light, some people say you don't need this what they don't realize is that yes the pins do need this amount of stimulation to get the most pins possible and after that once the pins are set then you can find there sweet spot which I suggest at least 12hrs. At this time you will see no myc. on the surface and you will want to bring the casing back up to optimal moisture (near saturation) you will also want to be fanning 3-6 times a day to get that transpiration going lightly misting after each fanning to bring the casing up to optimal which may be only a couple of squirts. Now once you see the myc. starting to poke through stop misting the casing has the perfect amount of moisture to carry you through the pinset, I still fan 3-4 times a day and by fanning I usually take the lid and use that to give it a few fans I suppose you could use one of those battery operated personal fans which may work better IMO and then a very light misting from a distance using a pumpup sprayer always! they when adjusted correctly produce a extremely fine mist :wink: If you do not have one of these then don't mist it's not that critical at this point.

This is the hardest time waiting but if you coincided everything (FAE, light, drop in temps) you will have knotting to worry about :wink: hopefully lots of knotting :lol:

Now you will notice that some of these knots will turn reddish-brown these are primordia and the beginning of your first flush :laugh: and also that your pins are for the most part set so here is where you need to pay careful attention the your water delivery. To wet or to dry will cause an increased number of aborts which mean smaller flush, you really need to keep things along an even keel here if things are looking a bit on the wet side continue fanning without misting if it's to dry then you'll need to take a look at your water delivery technique, I find if ya don't love them to death they seem to do pretty damn good :thumbup: It's not always easy to bring them all to maturity and you will find your own technique with time, this technique I've explained is a combination from Stamets and from Nan and a few other Pro's along with my own experience. This isn't for everyone in every situation just a guideline for some to follow. I will post some pin porn to give you an idea how things should look, I've never had Overlay so I can't post any personal pics but there out there if ya want to take a look-see. We will talk more on second flushes and also the reasons you do not want to scrape your casings later on. GL everyone. :smile:

Here is a proper looking casing notice how happy at least one is? :laugh:



Now remember your first,second and subsequent flush pins are created in your initial pinset! :wink:



The first flush bolts!!!!



Fanning creates transpiration which creates nice flushes and large shooms. :laugh:



Which brings us to the end of the first flush :frown: Wait! :laugh: :wink:



Now why would we want to scrape a casing? The main reason is "Overlay":

Overlay is caused by a couple of things:
#1 initiating pinning too late.
#2 improper watering.
#3 humidity is too low.
#4 Too much evaporation.

The first three are what I see here the most and of the three the first two are the most common here.

#1 Can be influenced by strain as to when.
#2 Is something that only comes from practice and by practice I mean practicing to get it right! Near saturation but not over!!!
#3 For the majority Perlite and misting will do the trick for the others full-auto kicks ass!!!!!
#4 Means fanning without misting lightly afterwards, simple enough.

Anything but optimum techniques will result in less than perfect results, But who the [Email]fu@k[/Email] wants to be perfect anyway right!? Now nice 1st, 2nd and 3rd flushes are something any real mycologist would strive for. :wink:
Also If for some reason (over/under watering, too cold/warm, too much CO2 or to much evaporation, etc;) you had an over abundance of aborts you will need to scrape and recase in order to save that casing. Other than that it is only wasting precious energy.
If your worried about contams give it a light h2o2 misting but Don't make the myc expend anymore energy running!!! (PLEASE says the myc! I just want to fruit!!!) Let it use that energy to put forth another flush!!! By scraping you are by no means going to get an extra flush if anything you will get less and perhaps weaker!!! Really this is basic basic shit here! Ya I know bad habits are hard to break but... I know, put yourself in the myceliums place that might help (think like the mycelium :wink: )

Word of advice don't scrape a casing and do patch when necessary thats the only way to do it right!!! The myc's energy is totally wasted when colonizing the casing a second time and if peeps are having poor second flushes then they need to look at there pinning strategy and water delivery techniques, BTW who was the first one to suggest scraping off the casings on casings anyway? Only if Overlayed!!!
This has been a trend thats gone too far IMHO and people need to know the basics of casings and how to pinset and maintain a proper environment beneficial for pin development along with proper water delivery which someone figuratively said soak that casing real well and that someone is no longer here so I'd like to reiterate that statement for him. Soaking does not mean in anyway to actually soak it past NEAR saturation!!!! This means to you that you will want to observe the casing real well and watch for the point that the water just makes the casing glisten NO MORE!!!!! this is getting far too many into trouble! :wink: You don't want to rely on your bottom absorbing layer to suck up anything but accidental overwatering  :thumbdown:

To reiterate you will be wasting time the myc will have to recolonize the casing again simply unnecessary, soak it down and let the energy go into second flush pinset not into recolonizing the casing cakes are different and can be recased. Point many times your second flush pins have been knotting by the time the first flush is off. This has been my experience with 50/50's anyway. Hope this makes sense to you guys?
First of all if your first pinset was initiated optimally there should be no overlayish? ish. I've had second flushes that were much better than the first and many damn close to the yeild of the first never once recasing. actually the myc covered surface is receptive to water and the myc itself can become waterlogged if over watered, only when you have overlay does the surface become water resistant this is only because it becomes a thick impervious mat.

This was the second flush a week or so later. Now these aren't the greatest flushes but they're decent and I'm sure many of you have done just as good and I know some have done better. No recasing here Maybe a patch here and there thats the way its done downtown anyway. If ya look closely you'll see the third flush already knotted .This is the way I do it. Also Patching is good for two reasons cover exposed myc and future flushes. Also adding a 1/4" casing on top after the first flush can be helpful if your not covering up pins. Excuse all the cut-n-paste just saving myself some typing. :wink:

Second flush matured  as long as your casing doesn't go acidic (trich :wink: ) :frown: your casings will continue to flush as long as there are nutes available!!! :thumbup: Look closely and you can see the third flush knots already formed! Although third flush was less than the second these flushed a total of 5-6 flushes. Being that it was PF cakes the weight was less than desired overall  but still made for a nice venture into lala land!!!



Ya they're alright :wink: This will hopefully give some an opportunity to try there hand at casings who were reluctant to do so before :wink: A pinning strategy is a must and a good one will reward you with bountiful harvests right skillet? :thumbup: (DA Man) This is just a starting place for those learning :wink: and sorry if I've left out anything as it's been awhile (semi-retired) :wink: at the moment :laugh:
Also curious as to when this recase a casing came about and who was the one suggesting? :thumbdown:  :tongue:  I suppose a quick search of the posts would reveal the culprit!!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:  We'll let sleeping dogs lie I suppose :wink:

A special thanks to 4nick8 for the use of these "near saturation" pics this is what ya want: :wink:



This ones slightly less than near saturation :wink:



And this one here is back very close to near satuation :laugh: If you can see the difference in these pics then you'll know if not time will heal all wounds :frown: :wink:



--------------------
Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy.
Oyster Shell "Flour" $2 for 1lb. a hell of a deal :wink:
Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is
Gas Exchange vs. FAE

"We all have priorities. I used a closet once setup a nice little lab trouble was all the shit that was in there ended up in the bedroom that pissed off the GF then I ended up dumping her as she was getting in the way of my sterile culture technique! Ya I got priorities too!!!"


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OfflineAmygdala
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: hyphae] * 1
    #3290334 - 10/28/04 06:35 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I've seen this somewhere before...

ah, i've found it. Its been at the nook for awhile, didn't realize you wrote it though! Very informative!


--------------------
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." --Albert Einstein


Edited by Amygdala (10/28/04 06:41 PM)


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Invisiblegeorge castanzaM
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: hyphae] * 1
    #3290802 - 10/28/04 08:11 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

ya... me and kramer read that before his first pin....:thumbup:
you da man!:bow:
:shroomer:


--------------------



     
Quote:

pftek said:Impossible to clean everything right now. Maybe in a week.





ROTHBURY

:pm:


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InvisibleQbanMoJo
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: george castanza] * 1
    #3290940 - 10/28/04 08:48 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

:thumbup: Good. Maybe people will actually read this before trying casings and not knowing whats wrong  :thumbup:


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OfflineKaptKid
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: QbanMoJo] * 1
    #3292844 - 10/29/04 08:49 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Great info :thumbup: as always
:mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroom2:


--------------------
Child of the 60's, Tripping ever since.


:sun:


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Offlinebeejay
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: KaptKid] * 1
    #3292995 - 10/29/04 10:09 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

yes thanks for posting this, it helped me get a good pinset. By the way I did end up getting the Nook account. Good advice my friend. Follow this post and you might end up with something like this

I couldnt have done it without ya hyphae


--------------------
Anjaba said:
Oh shit, don't drink it.... It would eat away your esophagus...
mantis said:
Leave me out of this pissing contest, you fascist wang-dang-doodle!
Hattori Hanzo said:
If on your journey, you should encounter God, God will be cut


Edited by beejay (10/31/04 11:34 PM)


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Offlineshirley knott
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: hyphae] * 1
    #3294074 - 10/29/04 04:22 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

excellent post  :thumbup:

(try a few spaces between paragraphs to break up the text, maybe a pic in the middle)


--------------------
buh


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OfflineMushroomFriend
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: hyphae]
    #3294166 - 10/29/04 04:46 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Hey this can be helpfull for me when I am gonna case! :laugh:

Must find out about ood  patching though...

:thumbup:


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Offlineticktock
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: MushroomFriend]
    #3295315 - 10/29/04 10:32 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

This looks really important. I'm just now dipping my toe in the shallow end of the pool. (PF) If I bookmark this thread, will it stay put?


--------------------
Don't panic!


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Offlinehyphae
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: ticktock]
    #3295500 - 10/29/04 11:35 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

It's stuck right where it's at :wink:


--------------------
Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy.
Oyster Shell "Flour" $2 for 1lb. a hell of a deal :wink:
Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is
Gas Exchange vs. FAE

"We all have priorities. I used a closet once setup a nice little lab trouble was all the shit that was in there ended up in the bedroom that pissed off the GF then I ended up dumping her as she was getting in the way of my sterile culture technique! Ya I got priorities too!!!"


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OfflineMcMushrooms420
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: hyphae]
    #3296263 - 10/30/04 05:26 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Very informative.. thank you


--------------------
You Can't Give It Up........


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Offlinescatmanrav
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: McMushrooms420]
    #3296494 - 10/30/04 08:06 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

You finally put this here!

Everyone who compliments me on my pics..Magash got me started with the rye substrate..but this is the pinning guide I follow. Hyphae is spot on with his info, listen up!


--------------------
"life is like a drop of rain getting closer and closer to falling into a lake, and then when you hit the lake there is no more rain drop, only the lake."

Growing with bags, start to finish (including my new grain and substrate prep)
Anyone looking to start bulk tubs/mono tubs/shotgun hybrids? Good tubs to use..
How I do grain (old still good tips)
Turn your closet into a fruiting chamber
Casing layer colonization and overlay


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OfflineMushroomFriend
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: ticktock]
    #3296637 - 10/30/04 09:57 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Just add it to your favourites then you will be able to view it in the "my home" part of the shroomery!

I at least did that but since it is sticky it isnt really needed to do so! :grin:

MF


--------------------


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Offlinecope2
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: MushroomFriend]
    #3296963 - 10/30/04 12:21 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

this is AWESOME!!!!!!!!! Thank You!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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OfflineTripster
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: cope2]
    #3301863 - 10/31/04 07:38 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Very good info to have compiled here.


--------------------
You've raped! I feel dirty
It hurt! As a child
Tied down! That's a good boy
And fucked! Your own child
I scream! No one hears me
It hurt! I'm not a liar
My God! Saw you watching
Mommy why?! Your own child -Korn


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OfflineSugarBooger
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: Tripster]
    #3305971 - 11/01/04 07:43 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

AWSOME info!! See a few steps i missed . thanks


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Offlinehyphae
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: SugarBooger] * 1
    #3306001 - 11/01/04 07:51 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Don't forget to rate this thread (5 shrooms :wink: ) And If ya feel like it I always appreciate a good rating too! :laugh:


--------------------
Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy.
Oyster Shell "Flour" $2 for 1lb. a hell of a deal :wink:
Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is
Gas Exchange vs. FAE

"We all have priorities. I used a closet once setup a nice little lab trouble was all the shit that was in there ended up in the bedroom that pissed off the GF then I ended up dumping her as she was getting in the way of my sterile culture technique! Ya I got priorities too!!!"


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Offlinedoc34
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: hyphae]
    #3307965 - 11/02/04 06:25 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

5 shrooms to ya Hyphae!!!!!

:mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroom2:



:cool: :thumbup:


--------------------


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Invisiblebotanisthype
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: doc34]
    #3308820 - 11/02/04 01:18 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Q? is it that important to let sit one day after crumbling or crumbling to direct casing is not of the matter?ive had mycelium recoup in the casing tray with no problem,is it faster colonizination over the coir by lettin it recoup?wonderin???


--------------------
Please +REP if i've been of any help... thanks!!!

Dinosaur of the Funny Family, though I have short arms, they fit in my GB... lol


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Offlinehyphae
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Re: Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. [Re: botanisthype]
    #3308889 - 11/02/04 01:35 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

No it is not imperative. I've done much more without recouping without a problem. It is imperative that your casing mix be properly pasturized/sterilized of course.


--------------------
Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy.
Oyster Shell "Flour" $2 for 1lb. a hell of a deal :wink:
Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is
Gas Exchange vs. FAE

"We all have priorities. I used a closet once setup a nice little lab trouble was all the shit that was in there ended up in the bedroom that pissed off the GF then I ended up dumping her as she was getting in the way of my sterile culture technique! Ya I got priorities too!!!"


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