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OfflineKnattyD
Starving Artist

Registered: 10/09/04
Posts: 54
Loc: Core of the Sun
Last seen: 8 years, 11 months
what do u say to army/marines recruiters
    #3289030 - 10/28/04 11:51 AM (19 years, 4 months ago)

ahhh.. its getting sickening. no matter where i go there are people trying to get me into the services. i usually end up in this huge philosophhical and political conversation with them... HOW DO U GUYS DEAL WITH THEM????its alwasy the same

HAVE U EVER CONSIDERED THE SERVICES?

NO I AM AGAINST IT ALL

OH I GUESS U NEVER LOST ANYONE IN 911

IRAQ HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH 911 ITS FUCKING IMPERIALISM USA DONT GIVE A FUCK BOUT THOSE PEOPLE, PROPS TO THE SANE SOLDIERS HELPING THOSE PEOPLE BUT ITS NOT WHY THEY ARE THERE ITS NOT THEIR FAULT BUT I AM NOT GONNA SERVE A FACIST, CORPORATE, BULLSHIT GOVERNEMTN...

WHY ARE U HERE IF U DONT LIKE IT

FUCK THE INTERNATIONAL BOUNDS. I AM WHERE I WANNA BE I AM A MAN OF THE EARTH NO ONE OWNS THIS PLOT OF LAND SO ITS NOT YOURS THEIRS OR MINES. U EXPECT ME TO LEAVE BECUASE A COUPLE COCK SUCKER RUIN IT?

then it switches over to him asking about my hobbies and i say my band and my music and then just like in the movie 911 he goes and starts talking about shaggy... ah! mother fucker quit trying to sell me this shit. i aint gonna buy it. i cant stand people trying to sell shit i dont pick up my house phone anymore because its always corporations and people trying to sell shit. i swear i must get 30 phone calls a day from bullshit...

just venting....

:heart:RALPH NADER FOR PRESIDENT:heart:
fuck bush more then fuck kerry but fuck kerry look at his fucking smile it remninds me of a sleezeball car salesman trying to sell u a worthless piece of shit for mad loot

how do u deal with those cock suckers?


--------------------
_______________
Dreadlocks the time is now
Stand up fight for your rights
Or you ain't gonna get your culture man
Roots natty, don't give up - hold on
If I am wrong, be not afraid to say so
Is there any difference between the black and white?
We are all of one skin - same blood , same soul
But there are some who think dreadlocks don't count

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Invisiblegdman
badger, badger,badger...
Male User Gallery

Registered: 12/10/02
Posts: 16,286
Loc: Dancing In the Streets
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: KnattyD]
    #3289036 - 10/28/04 11:55 AM (19 years, 4 months ago)

nader is a bigger deusch than kerry, I wouldn't vote fro him if you paid me


--------------------


Got a question about a substance?  Erowid might already have your answer! Have questions about the  mushroom experience? The  Tripper's FAQ may have your answer or someone else might have had your question before.
         
I know up on the top you are seeing great sights, but down at the bottom we, too, should have rights.
  - Theodor Seuss Geisel Dr. Suess

"I didn't come here to be easily understood" - Steve

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Invisiblegdman
badger, badger,badger...
Male User Gallery

Registered: 12/10/02
Posts: 16,286
Loc: Dancing In the Streets
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: gdman]
    #3289038 - 10/28/04 11:55 AM (19 years, 4 months ago)

he's not even in the green party anymore


--------------------


Got a question about a substance?  Erowid might already have your answer! Have questions about the  mushroom experience? The  Tripper's FAQ may have your answer or someone else might have had your question before.
         
I know up on the top you are seeing great sights, but down at the bottom we, too, should have rights.
  - Theodor Seuss Geisel Dr. Suess

"I didn't come here to be easily understood" - Steve

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InvisibleMOTH
Wild Woman
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Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 23,431
Loc: In the jungle
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: KnattyD]
    #3289132 - 10/28/04 12:22 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

AVOID EYE CONTACT and keep walking. That is how I deal with recruiters. But I'm a girl, so they don't bother to pursue.

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OfflineDoctorJ
Male

Registered: 06/30/03
Posts: 8,846
Loc: space
Last seen: 1 year, 4 months
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: KnattyD]
    #3289143 - 10/28/04 12:24 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

I just tell them I cant pass a drug test... even though I probably could if I really wanted to.


If they press any farther... well screaming something about bloodthirsty mercenaries who sell their soul to the government usually scares them off.

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OfflineInfrared
sleeping
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Registered: 07/15/02
Posts: 12,988
Loc: Chicago, USA
Last seen: 2 years, 1 month
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: KnattyD]
    #3289157 - 10/28/04 12:27 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

haha.... last time a recruiter asked me to join the military i literally told him he could eat my cock... then i kept walking away and gave him the finger for good measure

dont let him talk.... it only leads to wasted time


--------------------
When chemistry is outlawed.. Only outlaws have chemistry:rainbowdrink:

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InvisibleVvellum
Stranger

Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 10,920
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: KnattyD]
    #3289168 - 10/28/04 12:29 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

say you're gay.

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OfflineDoctorJ
Male

Registered: 06/30/03
Posts: 8,846
Loc: space
Last seen: 1 year, 4 months
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: KnattyD] * 1
    #3289181 - 10/28/04 12:31 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

"Why should I join the army?  I'm already in a militia..." :evil:


:lol:

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Offlineagr8fulchick
Feed Your Head!

Registered: 08/19/04
Posts: 707
Loc: Stranded in Iowa
Last seen: 12 years, 2 months
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: KnattyD]
    #3289342 - 10/28/04 01:00 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Just politely say that you aren't interested in joining. Don't stop to talk or take time to argue, because you will never convice them.

I'm a girl, so they don't bother me too much :laugh: My boyfriend and I were walking through a mall yesterday and some recruiters were asking two girls if they were interested in the services. When my hippie boyfriend walked by one of the officers actually did a double take! Like his first  gut reaction was to ask if he was interested in more army info, but then the officer could obviously tell by his looks that my man wanted nothing to do with any armed service.

Just look like a hippie. Hippies don't join the army :wink:

:flowerchild:


--------------------
Life's a journey. Take the scenic route.

        :sun: :heart: :heart: :sun:

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Invisibleblink
eye of horus
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters *DELETED* [Re: KnattyD]
    #3289379 - 10/28/04 01:07 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Post deleted by blinkidiot

Reason for deletion: Im sorry



--------------------

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OfflineGr8fulJ420
strange but nota stranger
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: blink]
    #3289398 - 10/28/04 01:11 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

"That sounds sweeeet! Do I get to kill ________ <favorite racial/ethnic slur here>???"

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Offlineiluan
Keep your stickon the ice.
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: agr8fulchick]
    #3289408 - 10/28/04 01:12 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

hehe


--------------------
Remember..if the women don't find ya handsome,they should atleast find ya handy!


I do what i can with what i don't have!

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OfflineBigNerd
Sociable loner
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Registered: 10/31/03
Posts: 4,228
Loc: local elementary school
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: KnattyD]
    #3289448 - 10/28/04 01:18 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

"Have you ever thought about joining the <insert Armed Service division here>?"

"Nooo." <---- said as if he is an idiot for ever suggesting I would even for one microsecond consider such a thing.

Yeah, and just keep walking.

BigNerd


--------------------
Sometimes karma needs a little help.

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Invisiblebf6
Keep the highfive alive!

Registered: 01/29/04
Posts: 3,121
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: BigNerd]
    #3289478 - 10/28/04 01:24 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Person asking me: "Have you ever thought about joining the <insert Armed Service division here>?"

Me: :smile2:

Person asking: *walks away slowly*


--------------------
The only thing that burns in Hell is the part of you that won't let go of life, your memories, your attachments. They burn them all away. But they're not punishing you, they're freeing your soul. So, if you're frightened of dying and you're holding on, you'll see devils tearing your life away, but if you've made your peace, then the devils are really angels, freeing you from the earth...

bloodflower6

Yay for Pornography!

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OfflineSilven
Male

Registered: 08/30/04
Posts: 2,072
Loc: El Mexicano
Last seen: 8 months, 3 days
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: BigNerd]
    #3289481 - 10/28/04 01:24 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

If you've ever heard the F-U-C-K Y-O-U song by Bob and Tom, that pretty much sums up what you need to say to them.

Slam the phone in their ear for good measure, or if you are face to face with them spit on the ground at their feet and turn and walk away.

Military America makes me sick. I would never join the military, I don't believe in being offensive unless we need to be (In Iraq we don't need to be). I will join the army when we are attacked at home.

No country is stupid enough to invade our country. Regardless of who you are, if you are an American I will stand by your side along with 95% of the population and we will fight tooth and nail if someone were to try to conquer us. We don't need the protection of this bullshit government, the only thing they have over us is nuclear weapons.

*sing*

F - U - C - K Y - O - U

American Government
American Military
American President
American Greed
Corporate America

- Silven


--------------------
What do you bring to the table?

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Offlinevc77
incarnate
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Registered: 06/27/04
Posts: 1,302
Loc: PNW US
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: Silven]
    #3289489 - 10/28/04 01:26 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Just tell him you aren't man enough to fight for your country...

Why go through all the bullshit and lying?

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Invisiblebf6
Keep the highfive alive!

Registered: 01/29/04
Posts: 3,121
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: vc77]
    #3289497 - 10/28/04 01:28 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

vc77 said:
Just tell him you aren't man enough to fight for your country...

Why go through all the bullshit and lying?




Don't turn this into a flame fest.


--------------------
The only thing that burns in Hell is the part of you that won't let go of life, your memories, your attachments. They burn them all away. But they're not punishing you, they're freeing your soul. So, if you're frightened of dying and you're holding on, you'll see devils tearing your life away, but if you've made your peace, then the devils are really angels, freeing you from the earth...

bloodflower6

Yay for Pornography!

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OfflineSilven
Male

Registered: 08/30/04
Posts: 2,072
Loc: El Mexicano
Last seen: 8 months, 3 days
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: vc77]
    #3289500 - 10/28/04 01:29 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Ohhhh that's why we're in Iraq.. fighting for our country since they blew down the Twin Towers on 9/11.. err wait that was the Afghans.. why are we in Iraq again?

Oh, oil, money, and to prove to Daddy that he's a man.

Such an honorable reason to die for. Lining the rich's pockets.

Where do I sign up?

- Silven


--------------------
What do you bring to the table?

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Invisiblebf6
Keep the highfive alive!

Registered: 01/29/04
Posts: 3,121
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: Silven]
    #3289507 - 10/28/04 01:31 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

You either. This thread has a purpose. It will be locked if you two keep it up.


--------------------
The only thing that burns in Hell is the part of you that won't let go of life, your memories, your attachments. They burn them all away. But they're not punishing you, they're freeing your soul. So, if you're frightened of dying and you're holding on, you'll see devils tearing your life away, but if you've made your peace, then the devils are really angels, freeing you from the earth...

bloodflower6

Yay for Pornography!

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Offlinevc77
incarnate
 User Gallery

Registered: 06/27/04
Posts: 1,302
Loc: PNW US
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: bf6]
    #3289513 - 10/28/04 01:32 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Hey, shh... Check out the numerous threads above me flaming the military and country I am a member of. I have put in numerous hours of hard work to stand up for my country. I'm nost standing up for bush, fuck bush. Not the government, screw them. I'm working for my family and the people I love. Screw you guys, your flaming just as much as I am.

Why don't you just nicely tell them you aren't interested... Oh wait, thats too hard.

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Invisiblebf6
Keep the highfive alive!

Registered: 01/29/04
Posts: 3,121
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: vc77]
    #3289521 - 10/28/04 01:35 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

vc77 said:
Hey, shh... Check out the numerous threads above me flaming the military and country I am a member of. I have put in numerous hours of hard work to stand up for my country. I'm nost standing up for bush, fuck bush. Not the government, screw them. I'm working for my family and the people I love. Screw you guys, your flaming just as much as I am.

Why don't you just nicely tell them you aren't interested... Oh wait, thats too hard.




I didn't flame anyone. The people who did weren't flaming other members they were flaming institutions and lands.

Eevryone doesn't believe the same way, there are some who would call you a baby killer and a supporter of a facist regime, there are others that would call you a hero. I will do neither because I came to this thread to see what people would say to army recruiters. I didn't come to see you and silven flame each other.

:smile:


--------------------
The only thing that burns in Hell is the part of you that won't let go of life, your memories, your attachments. They burn them all away. But they're not punishing you, they're freeing your soul. So, if you're frightened of dying and you're holding on, you'll see devils tearing your life away, but if you've made your peace, then the devils are really angels, freeing you from the earth...

bloodflower6

Yay for Pornography!

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Offlineexclusive58
illegal alien

Registered: 04/16/04
Posts: 2,146
Last seen: 6 years, 11 days
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: Silven]
    #3289530 - 10/28/04 01:39 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Is there really guys dressed up in military suits that come up to you and ask you to join? Exactly like in fahrenheit 911?
That seems crazy to me, there's no such thing here in france. I'd get really mad if some dumb fool came up to me to ask me if i want to join. Especially if it happens alot.


--------------------

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Invisiblebf6
Keep the highfive alive!

Registered: 01/29/04
Posts: 3,121
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: exclusive58]
    #3289535 - 10/28/04 01:41 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

exclusive58 said:
Is there really guys dressed up in military suits that come up to you and ask you to join? Exactly like in fahrenheit 911?
That seems crazy to me, there's no such thing here in france. I'd get really mad if some dumb fool came up to me to ask me if i want to join. Especially if it happens alot.




Yes. And it happens alot.


--------------------
The only thing that burns in Hell is the part of you that won't let go of life, your memories, your attachments. They burn them all away. But they're not punishing you, they're freeing your soul. So, if you're frightened of dying and you're holding on, you'll see devils tearing your life away, but if you've made your peace, then the devils are really angels, freeing you from the earth...

bloodflower6

Yay for Pornography!

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Offlinevc77
incarnate
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Registered: 06/27/04
Posts: 1,302
Loc: PNW US
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: bf6]
    #3289541 - 10/28/04 01:43 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

SIlven, there are many other positions in the military than infantry and Iraq. Hundreds more... And do you think we want to be in Iraq? Hell no. Infact, most militants are against Bush and anything he has done in office.

To us, it's not about oil, it's not about money. Not at all. You have it all wrong man.

I completely agree with you disagreeing with the war. That is OK. But it's another thing to disagree with the teenagers and young men who fight the war that was placed upon them. If anything they need support, and thanks. These people don't want to slaughter Iraqis and get their grubby Texan hands on oil, they want nothing but the well being of you, and every other citizen in the United States. Its truly sad you view things the way you do.

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Invisiblesilversoul7
Chill the FuckOut!
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Registered: 10/10/02
Posts: 27,301
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: KnattyD] * 1
    #3289673 - 10/28/04 02:16 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Tell them you were thinking of joining, but Al Queda offered better benefits.


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Invisiblegoobler
Reanimated
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: silversoul7]
    #3289760 - 10/28/04 02:36 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Just ask them if they eat the babies they kill

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Invisibletrick

Registered: 10/22/04
Posts: 1,059
Loc: unknown
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: goobler]
    #3289826 - 10/28/04 02:54 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

they don't approach me at school, but if they did.....the skies will cry. i knwo alot of people who go to the army for finacial reasons, those who follow in family footsteps, and those who like war (yes, war mongers).....it doesn't matter your reason - you're still in THEIR army.

Edited by trick (10/28/04 02:56 PM)

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InvisibleVvellum
Stranger

Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 10,920
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: exclusive58]
    #3289995 - 10/28/04 03:31 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Is there really guys dressed up in military suits that come up to you and ask you to join? Exactly like in fahrenheit 911?
That seems crazy to me, there's no such thing here in france. I'd get really mad if some dumb fool came up to me to ask me if i want to join. Especially if it happens alot.




yes.
they'll come out of nowhere.
they'll visit you in school.
they'll call you at home.

see, we have this thing called the military-industrial complex & it needs young minds to be trained to suspend rational thought and kill on command.

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OfflineKnattyD
Starving Artist

Registered: 10/09/04
Posts: 54
Loc: Core of the Sun
Last seen: 8 years, 11 months
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: trick]
    #3290026 - 10/28/04 03:36 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

haha u guys are halarious...lol... better benefits lol.... its has nothing to do with being man enough to serve the country... it has to do with being brainwashed enough to stick more money in the rich whores pockets.... like i always say, the fatter ur pocket the louder ur voice. the louder ur voice the more matter ur choice. i been aproached in school, at my job, at stores, walking down the street... everywhere... and they always got that cheesey smile and say "U NEVER SEEN ME AT UR SCHOOL/JOB?

i am fighting a war. i am no coward. my plan is to go to school for audio technology. open up my own studio protest the gay ass fucken RIAA.


--------------------
_______________
Dreadlocks the time is now
Stand up fight for your rights
Or you ain't gonna get your culture man
Roots natty, don't give up - hold on
If I am wrong, be not afraid to say so
Is there any difference between the black and white?
We are all of one skin - same blood , same soul
But there are some who think dreadlocks don't count

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OfflineGenius
Shroomologist
Registered: 10/24/04
Posts: 168
Last seen: 19 years, 4 months
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: KnattyD]
    #3290037 - 10/28/04 03:38 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

I just tell them I tried to get in the navy but they turned me down because of all my sexually transmitted diseases :smirk:


--------------------
Rate me and god will love you.

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OfflineMushBus
CURVEBALL MASTER

Registered: 09/09/04
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: KnattyD]
    #3290071 - 10/28/04 03:43 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

man, fuck everything

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OfflinePhychotron
Crazy Mofo
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: Genius]
    #3290139 - 10/28/04 03:54 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

i would, strike up a long conversation with them, give them a friends name, and say your really interested, then give your friends number, and say to call me in about a week.

or, pretend to be intersted, and then be like "ah, man, sorry but my 3 brothers died in baghdad, and i'm the only 1 left, you wouldnt want another saving private ryan on your hands would ya? that was such a sad movie.... tom hanks is my favorite"

or, scratch your eye with your middle finger as you walk by with nothing.

or the gentler approach, as you continue walking, pass them right up and just say 'flat feet'


--------------------
On a mission to prove that the truth gets you no where.
They tried the truth, It didn't work. Then they wrote the bible. 

Only the foolish fear the inevitable.

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OfflineCiv
Pinning
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: silversoul7]
    #3290144 - 10/28/04 03:55 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

  Tell them you were thinking of joining, but Al Queda offered better benefits. 





:inlove: :inlove: :inlove:


--------------------
"...Gal's seem to hate the thought of blending chicken shit in a blender.
So, wash it well afterwards & DON'T tell them..."  -Agar

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OfflinePhychotron
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: Phychotron]
    #3290148 - 10/28/04 03:55 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

oh, or tell them you got a 5 on the asvab test


--------------------
On a mission to prove that the truth gets you no where.
They tried the truth, It didn't work. Then they wrote the bible. 

Only the foolish fear the inevitable.

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InvisibleLe_Canard
The Duk Abides

Registered: 05/16/03
Posts: 94,392
Loc: Earthfarm 1 Flag
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: KnattyD]
    #3290188 - 10/28/04 04:00 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Tell them you're a post-op transexual.... :tongue:

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Invisiblelooner2
ABBA fan

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Posts: 3,849
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: KnattyD]
    #3290196 - 10/28/04 04:03 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

i am fighting a war. i am no coward. my plan is to go to school for audio technology. open up my own studio protest the gay ass fucken RIAA.




Takes serious balls dude. Mad respect.

There is nothing more honorable than a disfigured disk jockey who stood up against the RIAA for what he believed in!


--------------------
I am in love with Acidic_Sloth


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InvisibleOJK
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: Le_Canard]
    #3290230 - 10/28/04 04:11 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

I completely agree with you disagreeing with the war. That is OK. But it's another thing to disagree with the teenagers and young men who fight the war that was placed upon them. If anything they need support, and thanks. These people don't want to slaughter Iraqis and get their grubby Texan hands on oil, they want nothing but the well being of you, and every other citizen in the United States. Its truly sad you view things the way you do.




I don't understand how people can do the whole "I support the troops but I'm against the war" thing.

Anyone stupid enough to enlist in the military and then complain that they are fighting a war they don't want to fight deserves no respect. If you enlist in an instituion that is primarily designed to kill people as effectively as possible, and has a history of controversial conflict, what right do you have to "support, and thanks" by your peers? Just because you believe that you're somehow acting in the interests of your country even though you're engaged in a conflict you may not even support, you somehow expect to be thanked ? Even though you're saying the soldiers don't want to fight in Iraq? To me, fighting in a conflict you don't believe in is abhorrent. Surely a soldier fighting in Iraq who believed he was fighting a just cause would deserve huge amounts of respect more than a soldier who disagreed with the war but fought anyway, out of some mis-placed sense of loyalty?

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OfflineKnattyD
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Registered: 10/09/04
Posts: 54
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: looner2]
    #3290235 - 10/28/04 04:11 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

looner2 said:
Quote:

i am fighting a war. i am no coward. my plan is to go to school for audio technology. open up my own studio protest the gay ass fucken RIAA. 




Takes serious balls dude. Mad respect.

There is nothing more honorable than a disfigured disk jockey who stood up against the RIAA for what he believed in!




:rotfl:  :whack:  :lol:


--------------------
_______________
Dreadlocks the time is now
Stand up fight for your rights
Or you ain't gonna get your culture man
Roots natty, don't give up - hold on
If I am wrong, be not afraid to say so
Is there any difference between the black and white?
We are all of one skin - same blood , same soul
But there are some who think dreadlocks don't count

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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Registered: 10/10/02
Posts: 27,301
Loc: mndfreeze's puppet army
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: KnattyD]
    #3290251 - 10/28/04 04:14 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Also, you could say that you'd have to check with your boyfriend to see if it's ok with him.


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Invisiblevivid
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: silversoul7]
    #3290358 - 10/28/04 04:41 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

I ask them if they're still giving out free acid for testing on troops.

heh, seriously you just have to be blunt, dont get into a conversation.. say "I'm not interrested, I have to go". and leave it at that.. hang up the phone or keep walking.

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Offlinevc77
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: OJK]
    #3291027 - 10/28/04 07:15 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Odiumjunkie said:
I don't understand how people can do the whole "I support the troops but I'm against the war" thing.

Anyone stupid enough to enlist in the military and then complain that they are fighting a war they don't want to fight deserves no respect.




Some people aren't fortunate enough to leech off of mommy and daddys trust fund for college and a place to live. Moving out at 18 with a part time job and going to a community college was hell, and with the employment status here in Oregon, I was stuck. I needed money. I needed a home. I don't want your respect, I just want to be on my own two feet.

Quote:

If you enlist in an instituion that is primarily designed to kill people as effectively as possible, and has a history of controversial conflict, what right do you have to "support, and thanks" by your peers?




Highly incorrect. HIGHLY incorrect. The army is not designed to kill people effectively, that is just an asset that makes defending and attacking executable and as proficient as possible. What do you expect them to teach, how to dodge bullets and win a war with super-human mind powers. No, you've got it all wrong. Every country has an army, and every army is tought how to fight as effectively as possible. It's been done since the dawn of time, in every part of the world.

Support and thanks is not a right, it is usually earned, from people who have enough heart to understand things from a soldiers point of view. We do not want to kill people, that is a last resort for us. You think every soldier in Iraq is bloodhungry and agrees with the war? Wrong. Most of them were looking for a college scholarship and ended up overseas, only to find themselves counting the days until they go home. It's a job, you do what you are ordered, whether you agree or not. Your personal opinion is your personal opinion, and your job is your job. Whether your a drug dealer, a stripper, or a disgruntled middle age state worker, your never going to make money by complaining about what you are assinged to do. Period.

Quote:

Just because you believe that you're somehow acting in the interests of your country even though you're engaged in a conflict you may not even support, you somehow expect to be thanked ?




Once again, I don't expect thanks from anyone. It is appriciated, but I don't expect shit from you. I'm a human being like you, who would be willing to sacrifice my life for YOUR American citizenship. Thank me or not, thats how it is.

Quote:

Even though you're saying the soldiers don't want to fight in Iraq? To me, fighting in a conflict you don't believe in is abhorrent. Surely a soldier fighting in Iraq who believed he was fighting a just cause would deserve huge amounts of respect more than a soldier who disagreed with the war but fought anyway, out of some mis-placed sense of loyalty?




Once again, you've got the idea that everyone who joins the army is all about war. War this, war that. For us, it's creating a life, and as long as I have my own car to drive, my own place to sleep, and money in my bank account. I'm satisfied. If I am called to Iraq, I'll go, because I HAVE to, not because I'm bloodthirsty for some killing. To me, someone like that deserves more respect, because anyone can want to do something and do it, but someone who doesn't want to, and still does, is overcoming more.

It saddens me that people are against people in the army. We are just like you, human beings, trying to make a living. I did not wish to attack you one bit in this thread, and I hope you understand where I am coming from...

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InvisibleFucknuckle
Dog Lover

Registered: 04/24/04
Posts: 6,762
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: vc77]
    #3291049 - 10/28/04 07:25 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:


Highly incorrect. HIGHLY incorrect. The army is not designed to kill people effectively, that is just an asset that makes defending and attacking executable and as proficient as possible. What do you expect them to teach, how to dodge bullets and win a war with super-human mind powers. No, you've got it all wrong. Every country has an army, and every army is tought how to fight as effectively as possible. It's been done since the dawn of time, in every part of the world





I didn't really read this entire thread but, I did serve for 3 years and yes they do train a very effective KILLING MACHINE

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Offlinevc77
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #3291080 - 10/28/04 07:37 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Fucknuckle... I know this.

Quote:

The army is not designed to kill people effectively, that is just an asset that makes defending and attacking executable and as proficient as possible.




They do train how to kill effectively, but correct me if I am wrong, that is not the sole purpose of the army, which Odium junkie stated.

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InvisibleOJK
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: vc77]
    #3293337 - 10/29/04 10:37 AM (19 years, 4 months ago)

vc77 said:

Quote:

Some people aren't fortunate enough to leech off of mommy and daddys trust fund for college and a place to live. Moving out at 18 with a part time job and going to a community college was hell, and with the employment status here in Oregon, I was stuck. I needed money. I needed a home. I don't want your respect, I just want to be on my own two feet.




Ok, so you accept that soldiers are a hired killers, committing acts that you accept they don't want to for no more motive that getting a decent wage for it. You think you're the only person with financial troubles? Hell, most people who struggle through college don't enlist in the army, they get a normal job that doesn't involve killing people.



Quote:

Quote:

If you enlist in an instituion that is primarily designed to kill people as effectively as possible, and has a history of controversial conflict, what right do you have to "support, and thanks" by your peers?




Highly incorrect. HIGHLY incorrect. The army is not designed to kill people effectively, that is just an asset that makes defending and attacking executable and as proficient as possible. What do you expect them to teach, how to dodge bullets and win a war with super-human mind powers. No, you've got it all wrong. Every country has an army, and every army is tought how to fight as effectively as possible. It's been done since the dawn of time, in every part of the world.




The army is not designed to kill people, but is designed for "defending and attacking" ? How exactly do you "defend and attack" without killing people? I accept that the long term aims of the army are not simply to kill people, but the vast majority of the army's tasks are accomplished by killing people and most training recruits recieve is to promote, either directly or indirectly, the effective killing of other people. The fact that every country has an army doesn't change the fact that every army is primariliy designed to kill people.

Quote:

Support and thanks is not a right, it is usually earned, from people who have enough heart to understand things from a soldiers point of view. We do not want to kill people, that is a last resort for us. You think every soldier in Iraq is bloodhungry and agrees with the war? Wrong. Most of them were looking for a college scholarship and ended up overseas, only to find themselves counting the days until they go home. It's a job, you do what you are ordered, whether you agree or not. Your personal opinion is your personal opinion, and your job is your job. Whether your a drug dealer, a stripper, or a disgruntled middle age state worker, your never going to make money by complaining about what you are assinged to do. Period.




What the hell? Did you just compare being a soldier to being a drug-dealer? I guess that means you accept that soldiers are nothing more than hired killers who enlist and obey orders not because they have to but because they want the money. Until American reintroduces conscription, no-one has the right to claim that they have no choice but to obey orders, you always have a choice. As I've said before, the fact that soldiers in Iraq don't agree with the conflict makes their moral predicament worse, because then blatantly thier only motive is financial.

Quote:

Quote:

Just because you believe that you're somehow acting in the interests of your country even though you're engaged in a conflict you may not even support, you somehow expect to be thanked ?




Once again, I don't expect thanks from anyone. It is appriciated, but I don't expect shit from you. I'm a human being like you, who would be willing to sacrifice my life for YOUR American citizenship. Thank me or not, thats how it is.




IN WHAT WAY ARE SOLDIERS SACRIFICING ANYTHING FOR ANYONE'S AMERICAN CITIZENSHIP? Iraq poses no threat to America, soldiers are doing nothing for anyone's "citizenship". They should stop pretending they're being patriotic, the fact that you are willing to sacrifice your life for a war you yourself don't believe in is mystifying, not laudible.

Quote:

Quote:

Even though you're saying the soldiers don't want to fight in Iraq? To me, fighting in a conflict you don't believe in is abhorrent. Surely a soldier fighting in Iraq who believed he was fighting a just cause would deserve huge amounts of respect more than a soldier who disagreed with the war but fought anyway, out of some mis-placed sense of loyalty?

Quote:

Once again, you've got the idea that everyone who joins the army is all about war. War this, war that. For us, it's creating a life, and as long as I have my own car to drive, my own place to sleep, and money in my bank account. I'm satisfied. If I am called to Iraq, I'll go, because I HAVE to, not because I'm bloodthirsty for some killing. To me, someone like that deserves more respect, because anyone can want to do something and do it, but someone who doesn't want to, and still does, is overcoming more.




YOU DON'T HAVE TO! No-one is forcing you, no-one is holding a gun to your head. The army is about "creating a life"? What the hell? You think the fact you have your own car and house justifies killing people? How on earth can you believe that? If all you want is money, get another job . Millions of other people do.

Quote:

It saddens me that people are against people in the army. We are just like you, human beings, trying to make a living. I did not wish to attack you one bit in this thread, and I hope you understand where I am coming from...




Yes, you are human beings trying to make a living, but it saddens me deeply that you can't see that that is not any kind of justification for being a soldier. Assassins and hired thugs are trying to make a living, that doesn't justify thier careers.

I agree with your point about not making this personal, I hope you realise that this isn't a personal attack on you at all, merely a questioning of the motives of American soldiers generally, something I am very interested in.

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Invisiblemuse_sick
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: KnattyD]
    #3293499 - 10/29/04 11:34 AM (19 years, 4 months ago)

i say
"don't ask don't tell would never work for me if all the guys look as hot as you in their uniforms"
that usually scares em away


--------------------
:beakedwhale:

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Offlinevc77
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: OJK]
    #3294117 - 10/29/04 02:35 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Odiumjunkie said:

Ok, so you accept that soldiers are a hired killers, committing acts that you accept they don't want to for no more motive that getting a decent wage for it. You think you're the only person with financial troubles? Hell, most people who struggle through college don't enlist in the army, they get a normal job that doesn't involve killing people.




My job doesn't involve killing people. I'm a visual imforation operator, basically your average cable guy, but for the army.

Like I said, Oregon has the highest rate of unemployment in the nation, and the chances of finding anything other than a fast food job for a person with my credentials was slim to none. I'll say it again, I was hungry, housebroken, and couldn't handle it.

Quote:

Quote:


Highly incorrect. HIGHLY incorrect. The army is not designed to kill people effectively, that is just an asset that makes defending and attacking executable and as proficient as possible. What do you expect them to teach, how to dodge bullets and win a war with super-human mind powers. No, you've got it all wrong. Every country has an army, and every army is tought how to fight as effectively as possible. It's been done since the dawn of time, in every part of the world.




The army is not designed to kill people, but is designed for "defending and attacking" ?




If you use some grammatical comprehension, you will easily concur that I clearly stated that the KILLING is an asset to defend and attack, and is not the sole purpose of the Army. Here, let me break it down for you:

"The army is not designed to kill people effectively, that is just an asset that makes defending and attacking executable and as proficient as possible."

In other words, thats like saying your local police force is designed for putting people in jail. Even though thats how it may seem to you, it's not. They DO put people in jail, but that is the what it's designed for, they are simply there to enforce the law and protect the community. Your rushing to conclusions.

Quote:

How exactly do you "defend and attack" without killing people?




Once again, you read wrong. I said that KILLING PEOPLE was a way to make defending and attacking as proficient as possible. Read it again, if it still doesn't make sense, read it again.

Quote:

I accept that the long term aims of the army are not simply to kill people, but the vast majority of the army's tasks are accomplished by killing people




Wrong, around 10% of the army is overseas fighting in a war, and less than 10% of them have actually killed people. Thats a little shy of the "vast majority" The rest are people working NORMAL jobs state-side. Let me help you out on this one:

Multimedia Illustrator(25M)
Cable Systems Installer-Maintainer(25L)
Military Intelligence (MI) Systems Maintainer/Integrator(33W)
Microwave Systems Operator/Maintainer(25P)
Multi-channel Transmission Systems Operator(25Q)
Network Switching Systems Operator(25F)
Telecommunication Operator/Maintainer(25D)
Cryptologic Linguist(98G)
Counterintelligence Agent(97B)
Imagery Analyst(96D)
Intelligence Analyst(96B)
Signals Intelligence Analyst(98C)
Information Systems Operator/Analyst(25B)
Multi-Sensor Operator(98P)
Satellite Communication Systems Operator/Maintainer(25S)
Signal Support Systems Specialist(25U)
Signals Collector/Analyst(98Y)
Signal Officer(25A)
Warrant Officer Corps()
Journalist(46Q)
Visual Information Equipment Operator/Maintainer(25R)
Multimedia Illustrator(25M)
Euphonium Player(02C)
Bassoon Player(02K)
Broadcast Journalist(46R)
Clarinet Player(02J)
Cornet or Trumpet Player(02B)
Electric Bass Guitar Player(02U)
Flute or Piccolo Player(02G)
French Horn Player(02D)
Guitar Player(02T)
Lithographer(21L)
Oboe Player(02H)
Percussion Player(02M)
Keyboard Player(02N)
Saxophone Player(02L)
Trombone Player(02E)
Tuba Player(02F)
Army Bandsperson(42R)
Civil Affairs Specialist(38A)
Animal Care Specialist(91T)
Firefighter(21M)
Pharmacy Specialist(91Q)
Dental Specialist(91E)
Health Care Specialist(91W)
Hospital Food Service Specialist(91M)
Medical Laboratory Specialist(91K)
Medical Supply Specialist(91J)
Mental Health Specialist(91X)
Mortuary Affairs Specialist(92M)
Operating Room Specialist(91D)
Optical Laboratory Specialist(91H)
Patient Administration Specialist(91G)
Preventive Medicine Specialist(91S)
Radiology Specialist(91P)
Veterinary Food Inspection Specialist(91R)
Dental Corps Officer(63)
Medical Corps Officer(62)
Medical Service Corps Officer(67)
Medical Specialist Corps Officer(65)
Nurse Corps Officer(66)
Veterinary Corps Officer(64A)
M1 ABRAMS Tank System Maintainer(63A)
Aircraft Electrician(15F)
Aircraft Pneudraulics Repairer(15H)
Aircraft Powerplant Repairer(15B)
Aircraft Powertrain Repairer(15D)
Aircraft Structural Repairer(15G)
AH-64A Armament/Electrical Systems Repairer(15X)
AH-64D Armament/Electrical/Avionic Systems Repairer(15Y)
Bradley Fighting Vehicle System Maintainer(63M)
Machinist(44E)
Observation/Scout Helicopter Repairer(15V)
OH-58D Armament/Electrical/Avionics Systems Repairer(15J)
OH-58D Helicopter Repairer(15S)
UH-1 Helicopter Repairer(15M)
UH-60 Helicopter Repairer(15T)
Utilities Equipment Repairer(52C)
Aviation Operations Specialist(15P)
Cargo Specialist(88H)
Motor Transport Operator(88M)
Parachute Rigger(92R)
Railway Operations Crewmember(88U)
Motor Transportation Coordinator(88N)
Watercraft Operator(88K)
APACHE Attack Heliocopter Systems Repairer(35K)
Transmission and Distribution Specialist(21Q)
Aviation Officer(15)
Transportation Officer(88A)
Radio Operator/Maintainer(25C)
Construction Equipment Repairer(62B)
Armament Repairer(45K)
Artillery Mechanic(63D)
Fire Control Repairer(45G)
M1 ABRAMS Tank System Maintainer(63A)
Quartermaster and Chemical Equipment Repairer(63J)
Small Arms/Artillery Repairer(45B)
Track Vehicle Repairer(63H)
AH-64 Attack Helicopter Repairer(15R)
Bradley Fighting Vehicle System Maintainer(63M)
CH-47 Helicopter Repairer(15U)
Railway Equipment Repairer(88P)
Railway Section Repairer(88T)
Watercraft Engineer(88L)
Land Combat Electronic Missile System Repairer(35A)
Light-Wheel Vehicle Mechanic(63B)
Multiple Launch Rocket System Repairer(35P)
PATRIOT System Repairer(35S)

None of those jobs include killing people, and thats not all of them. Do some research man.

Quote:

and most training recruits recieve is to promote, either directly or indirectly, the effective killing of other people.




Indirectly, I learned to kill people. I learned how to work as a team. I learned alot about myself. Does that mean I am a bloodthirsty trigger-happy rambo-motherfucker? Not at all, I'm your average, passive, friendly stoner, making something out of my life.

Quote:

The fact that every country has an army doesn't change the fact that every army is primariliy designed to kill people.




Thanks for saying exactly what I said: "Every country has an army, and every army is tought how to fight as effectively as possible."

Quote:

What the hell? Did you just compare being a soldier to being a drug-dealer?




No, I was pointing out to you that the only way to make cash is to do your job. And thats exactly what being a drug dealer is, a JOB. Thats what being in the army is, a JOB. What's so incorrect about saying that?

Quote:

I guess that means you accept that soldiers are nothing more than hired killers who enlist and obey orders not because they have to but because they want the money.




I'm alot more than a hired killer, and so are the thousands of other soldeirs. There is always that bunch of people who want to fight. I would say about 1 in 50 are like that. Everyone else just wants to get paid.

Are you saying that doing your job because you want the money is wrong? Not everyone likes their job man, if money wasn't an issue on earth, I don't think very many people would work. Think about it.

Quote:

Until American reintroduces conscription, no-one has the right to claim that they have no choice but to obey orders, you always have a choice.




Its called violation of contract, and will land you in jail, and make it hard for you to find a good-paying job for the next 7 years of you life.

Quote:

As I've said before, the fact that soldiers in Iraq don't agree with the conflict makes their moral predicament worse, because then blatantly thier only motive is financial.




I think SURVIVAL is a pretty strong motivater.

Quote:

IN WHAT WAY ARE SOLDIERS SACRIFICING ANYTHING FOR ANYONE'S AMERICAN CITIZENSHIP?




You have a problem with reading. I said I would sacrifice my life for your freedom.

Quote:

Iraq poses no threat to America, soldiers are doing nothing for anyone's "citizenship". They should stop pretending they're being patriotic, the fact that you are willing to sacrifice your life for a war you yourself don't believe in is mystifying, not laudible.




I wasn't even talking about Iraq dude. I've said before, I do not agree with with the war, so all you are doing is agreeing with me. And the fact that I am willing to sacrifice my life in a war I don't believe in is not "mistifying", it is your mis-comprehension of my words. Read carefully before you reply man.

Quote:


YOU DON'T HAVE TO! No-one is forcing you, no-one is holding a gun to your head.




Of course no one is holding a gun to my head. You obviously do not know how serious a breech of contract is in the military. You can't just say "Nahh, I'll pass this time, but good luck anyway!"

Quote:

The army is about "creating a life"? What the hell? You think the fact you have your own car and house justifies killing people?




You have manifested this idea in your head that every single job in the army consists of COMBAT and KILLING. Once again, do some research.

And to me, it is creating my life. I can finally go to a good college and get the degree I need. I can finally feed myself well. I have job which is going to give me valuble experience when I get out. That justifies itself enough for me. I want nothing more than stability in my life.

Quote:

How on earth can you believe that? If all you want is money, get another job . Millions of other people do.




Oh okay! Let me just pull a company name out of a hat and I'll start next Monday.

Quote:

Yes, you are human beings trying to make a living, but it saddens me deeply that you can't see that that is not any kind of justification for being a soldier.




Whats with you and justification. Your basically telling me that being a soldier is evil. You really have no clue what responsability rests upon us.

Quote:

Assassins and hired thugs are trying to make a living, that doesn't justify thier careers.




True. But assasination is taking the life of an unprovoked person. I'm starting to get the Idea that you have never looked into any of the jobs in the military. Your saying all of this as if everyone of us goes to Iraq, and kills women and children for money. Wrong. Some of us fix your cars. Some of us make webpages. Some of us look at satellite images. Some of us are docters. Some of us drive buses. Some of us play instruments for a band. Get your facts straight man.

Quote:

I agree with your point about not making this personal, I hope you realise that this isn't a personal attack on you at all, merely a questioning of the motives of American soldiers generally, something I am very interested in.




Thank you for not making this into a flame war. I'll be waiting for your reply.

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OfflineDoctorJ
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Posts: 8,846
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: OJK]
    #3294183 - 10/29/04 02:50 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

I'm with you, man. Fuck the military.

this reminds me of an old post I made in PA&L:

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat...rue#Post2454319

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Offlinekadakuda
The Great"Green".......East
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: KnattyD]
    #3294237 - 10/29/04 03:02 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

im shocked they actually do this. i thought the 911 movie was jsut a gross exageration of what happened. i never have even considered that could be real. so are they really THAT bad?

if all else fails tell them your canadian. that would stop all discussion ASAP.


--------------------
The seeds you won't sow are the plants you dont grow.

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OfflineKidShelleen
watch thesensations
Registered: 09/20/04
Posts: 88
Last seen: 17 years, 1 month
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: vc77]
    #3294660 - 10/29/04 05:02 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

The military does not deploy itself. If you don't like what the military does, change the government. It is senseless and unfair to blame the soldiers for the invasion of Iraq. Did they volunteer? Sure. But is it really voluntary when the government fucks up the economy so badly that the only way you can feed yourself is by "volunteering"? Or how about the volunteers who bought into the government propaganda and lies and truly believe that American freedom is at stake in Iraq? Should they be insulted and spit on because they are gullible? I don't think so.

ALL of the blame belongs on the government who deployed the troops. We should not rely on soldiers to make foreign policy decisions. That is the job of the meatheads in DC and they are screwing it up royally, and have been for decades. Show them the door.

KS


--------------------
"Who would be free themselves must strike the blow" -Lord Byron

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InvisibleTenaciousFloyd
Stranger
Registered: 10/05/04
Posts: 76
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: KnattyD]
    #3294691 - 10/29/04 05:18 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

I have no friends and no one to talk to. If a recruiter starts talking to me, it would probably be the highlight of my day.

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OfflineBillytheKid
Forgeddaboudit!

Registered: 10/18/04
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: KnattyD]
    #3294776 - 10/29/04 05:55 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

KnatTyDLoC said:
ahhh.. its getting sickening. no matter where i go there are people trying to get me into the services. i usually end up in this huge philosophhical and political conversation with them... HOW DO U GUYS DEAL WITH THEM????its alwasy the same

HAVE U EVER CONSIDERED THE SERVICES?

NO I AM AGAINST IT ALL

OH I GUESS U NEVER LOST ANYONE IN 911

IRAQ HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH 911 ITS FUCKING IMPERIALISM USA DONT GIVE A FUCK BOUT THOSE PEOPLE, PROPS TO THE SANE SOLDIERS HELPING THOSE PEOPLE BUT ITS NOT WHY THEY ARE THERE ITS NOT THEIR FAULT BUT I AM NOT GONNA SERVE A FACIST, CORPORATE, BULLSHIT GOVERNEMTN...

WHY ARE U HERE IF U DONT LIKE IT

FUCK THE INTERNATIONAL BOUNDS. I AM WHERE I WANNA BE I AM A MAN OF THE EARTH NO ONE OWNS THIS PLOT OF LAND SO ITS NOT YOURS THEIRS OR MINES. U EXPECT ME TO LEAVE BECUASE A COUPLE COCK SUCKER RUIN IT?

then it switches over to him asking about my hobbies and i say my band and my music and then just like in the movie 911 he goes and starts talking about shaggy... ah! mother fucker quit trying to sell me this shit. i aint gonna buy it. i cant stand people trying to sell shit i dont pick up my house phone anymore because its always corporations and people trying to sell shit. i swear i must get 30 phone calls a day from bullshit...

just venting....

:heart:RALPH NADER FOR PRESIDENT:heart:
fuck bush more then fuck kerry but fuck kerry look at his fucking smile it remninds me of a sleezeball car salesman trying to sell u a worthless piece of shit for mad loot

how do u deal with those cock suckers?




Hilarity, you hate Bush and the way the system is going but you vote for Nader, good job.


--------------------
Bingo!

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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: BillytheKid]
    #3294783 - 10/29/04 05:57 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

BillytheKid said:
Hilarity, you hate Bush and the way the system is going but you vote for Nader, good job.



What's so hilarious about it? Do you really believe Kerry is not part of the system?


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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InvisibleOJK
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: vc77]
    #3296804 - 10/30/04 09:25 AM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

My job doesn't involve killing people. I'm a visual imforation operator, basically your average cable guy, but for the army.

Like I said, Oregon has the highest rate of unemployment in the nation, and the chances of finding anything other than a fast food job for a person with my credentials was slim to none. I'll say it again, I was hungry, housebroken, and couldn't handle it.
Wrong, around 10% of the army is overseas fighting in a war, and less than 10% of them have actually killed people. Thats a little shy of the "vast majority" The rest are people working NORMAL jobs state-side. Let me help you out on this one:

Multimedia Illustrator(25M)
Cable Systems Installer-Maintainer(25L)
Military Intelligence (MI) Systems Maintainer/Integrator(33W)
Microwave Systems Operator/Maintainer(25P)
Multi-channel Transmission Systems Operator(25Q)
Network Switching Systems Operator(25F)
Telecommunication Operator/Maintainer(25D)
Cryptologic Linguist(98G)
Counterintelligence Agent(97B)
Imagery Analyst(96D)
Intelligence Analyst(96B)
Signals Intelligence Analyst(98C)
Information Systems Operator/Analyst(25B)
Multi-Sensor Operator(98P)
Satellite Communication Systems Operator/Maintainer(25S)
Signal Support Systems Specialist(25U)
Signals Collector/Analyst(98Y)
Signal Officer(25A)
Warrant Officer Corps()
Journalist(46Q)
Visual Information Equipment Operator/Maintainer(25R)
Multimedia Illustrator(25M)
Euphonium Player(02C)
Bassoon Player(02K)
Broadcast Journalist(46R)
Clarinet Player(02J)
Cornet or Trumpet Player(02B)
Electric Bass Guitar Player(02U)
Flute or Piccolo Player(02G)
French Horn Player(02D)
Guitar Player(02T)
Lithographer(21L)
Oboe Player(02H)
Percussion Player(02M)
Keyboard Player(02N)
Saxophone Player(02L)
Trombone Player(02E)
Tuba Player(02F)
Army Bandsperson(42R)
Civil Affairs Specialist(38A)
Animal Care Specialist(91T)
Firefighter(21M)
Pharmacy Specialist(91Q)
Dental Specialist(91E)
Health Care Specialist(91W)
Hospital Food Service Specialist(91M)
Medical Laboratory Specialist(91K)
Medical Supply Specialist(91J)
Mental Health Specialist(91X)
Mortuary Affairs Specialist(92M)
Operating Room Specialist(91D)
Optical Laboratory Specialist(91H)
Patient Administration Specialist(91G)
Preventive Medicine Specialist(91S)
Radiology Specialist(91P)
Veterinary Food Inspection Specialist(91R)
Dental Corps Officer(63)
Medical Corps Officer(62)
Medical Service Corps Officer(67)
Medical Specialist Corps Officer(65)
Nurse Corps Officer(66)
Veterinary Corps Officer(64A)
M1 ABRAMS Tank System Maintainer(63A)
Aircraft Electrician(15F)
Aircraft Pneudraulics Repairer(15H)
Aircraft Powerplant Repairer(15B)
Aircraft Powertrain Repairer(15D)
Aircraft Structural Repairer(15G)
AH-64A Armament/Electrical Systems Repairer(15X)
AH-64D Armament/Electrical/Avionic Systems Repairer(15Y)
Bradley Fighting Vehicle System Maintainer(63M)
Machinist(44E)
Observation/Scout Helicopter Repairer(15V)
OH-58D Armament/Electrical/Avionics Systems Repairer(15J)
OH-58D Helicopter Repairer(15S)
UH-1 Helicopter Repairer(15M)
UH-60 Helicopter Repairer(15T)
Utilities Equipment Repairer(52C)
Aviation Operations Specialist(15P)
Cargo Specialist(88H)
Motor Transport Operator(88M)
Parachute Rigger(92R)
Railway Operations Crewmember(88U)
Motor Transportation Coordinator(88N)
Watercraft Operator(88K)
APACHE Attack Heliocopter Systems Repairer(35K)
Transmission and Distribution Specialist(21Q)
Aviation Officer(15)
Transportation Officer(88A)
Radio Operator/Maintainer(25C)
Construction Equipment Repairer(62B)
Armament Repairer(45K)
Artillery Mechanic(63D)
Fire Control Repairer(45G)
M1 ABRAMS Tank System Maintainer(63A)
Quartermaster and Chemical Equipment Repairer(63J)
Small Arms/Artillery Repairer(45B)
Track Vehicle Repairer(63H)
AH-64 Attack Helicopter Repairer(15R)
Bradley Fighting Vehicle System Maintainer(63M)
CH-47 Helicopter Repairer(15U)
Railway Equipment Repairer(88P)
Railway Section Repairer(88T)
Watercraft Engineer(88L)
Land Combat Electronic Missile System Repairer(35A)
Light-Wheel Vehicle Mechanic(63B)
Multiple Launch Rocket System Repairer(35P)
PATRIOT System Repairer(35S)

None of those jobs include killing people, and thats not all of them. Do some research man.




I can see how it?s easy to assume that those jobs don?t involve killing people, but if you examine them, you see how facile an argument that is;
Artillery Mechanic
PATRIOT System Repairer
Multiple Launch Rocket System Repairer
Bradley Fighting Vehicle System Maintainer
These kind of jobs do not involve directly killing people, but clearly they facilitate the killing of people: the vast majority of jobs in the army to contribute the army?s ability to kill people, whether it?s refueling fighter jets, analyzing satellite photos, maintaining communications or one of any of thousands of tertiary army positions; without them, the army would be unable to operate. Repairing missile systems is quite patently contributing to the army?s ability to kill people, i.e. the pilots and crew of enemy aircraft. The army is a machine geared up to killing people, and almost every job in the army contributes to this ability.


Quote:

If you use some grammatical comprehension, you will easily concur that I clearly stated that the KILLING is an asset to defend and attack, and is not the sole purpose of the Army. Here, let me break it down for you:

"The army is not designed to kill people effectively, that is just an asset that makes defending and attacking executable and as proficient as possible."

In other words, thats like saying your local police force is designed for putting people in jail. Even though thats how it may seem to you, it's not. They DO put people in jail, but that is the what it's designed for, they are simply there to enforce the law and protect the community. Your rushing to conclusions.




That?s like saying ?a car engine isn?t designed to drive the wheels, that?s just an asset that makes moving the car as proficient as possible?.
The police force is designed to put people in jail; yes, it?s designed to enforce law and order, but in order to accomplish that, it must be able to arrest people, so it must be designed to be able to arrest people:

de?sign
v. de?signed, de?sign?ing, de?signs
v. intr.
1. To make or execute plans.
2. To have a goal or purpose in mind.
3. To create designs.

Clearly, if the army is, as you say, designed to defend and attack, and you accept that killing people is an intrinsic part of what constitutes defending and attacking, then the army must, in order to accomplish the goal of defending or attacking, pursue the goal of killing people, so must be designed to kill people in an effective manner.

Quote:

Indirectly, I learned to kill people. I learned how to work as a team. I learned alot about myself. Does that mean I am a bloodthirsty trigger-happy rambo-motherfucker? Not at all, I'm your average, passive, friendly stoner, making something out of my life.



I?m confused:
Quote:

I learned to kill people? ? I'm your average, passive, friendly stoner



To me, those things are more or less mutually exclusive. Of course, most soldiers are not bloodthirsty: In my opinion, most are confused young men who are trained in a fashion as to overcome their basic moral conscience. They are programmed to kill without thinking when instructed.


Quote:

No, I was pointing out to you that the only way to make cash is to do your job. And thats exactly what being a drug dealer is, a JOB. Thats what being in the army is, a JOB. What's so incorrect about saying that?




The comparison seems to completely ignore the issue: of course being in the army is a job, but that doesn?t somehow justify the actions of soldiers. Executing jews in Nazi Germany was also a job, that doesn?t make it right.

Quote:

I'm alot more than a hired killer, and so are the thousands of other soldeirs. There is always that bunch of people who want to fight. I would say about 1 in 50 are like that. Everyone else just wants to get paid.



I don?t for a minute imagine that most soldiers want to kill people, but that doesn?t address the fact that they do.

Quote:

Are you saying that doing your job because you want the money is wrong? Not everyone likes their job man, if money wasn't an issue on earth, I don't think very many people would work. Think about it.



There is a world of difference between not liking a job, and disagreeing with the ethics of the actions a job demands. There is clearly nothing morally wrong with doing a job you don?t enjoy for money, but there is something wrong with doing a job you disagree with morally for money.



Quote:

Its called violation of contract, and will land you in jail, and make it hard for you to find a good-paying job for the next 7 years of you life.



Soldiers sign up for the army volountarily and know as they do that that that might legally require them to do things such as killing people. They have a choice.

Quote:

I think SURVIVAL is a pretty strong motivater.



Using the ?survival? argument to justify soldiers in Iraq shooting people is like saying if a burglar breaks into someone?s house, the owner of the house threatens that burglar with a gun so the burglar shoots the owner of the house, the act of the burglar shooting the owner was moral and just, when clearly it is not.

Quote:

You have a problem with reading. I said I would sacrifice my life for your freedom. [/quote[
That?s very admirable, but conviently ignores the fact that at the moment the army is doing nothing to protect the freedom of America.

Quote:

I wasn't even talking about Iraq dude. I've said before, I do not agree with with the war, so all you are doing is agreeing with me. And the fact that I am willing to sacrifice my life in a war I don't believe in is not "mistifying", it is your mis-comprehension of my words. Read carefully before you reply man.



Once again: if a soldier in Iraq, or an army worker supporting soldiers, disagrees personally with the war, as you yourself do, then that individual?s actions are not moral. You?ve stated time and again that in the army you obey orders, so if you were ordered to Iraq, even in the role of ?visual imforation operator? you would be risking and potentially

Quote:

Of course no one is holding a gun to my head. You obviously do not know how serious a breech of contract is in the military. You can't just say "Nahh, I'll pass this time, but good luck anyway!"



I guess this comes down to personal choice; if I was somehow in the army, and ordered to, say, execute civilians, or commit some act I disagreed with, I would chose not to obey, even if that did mean going to jail. If I was ordered to Iraq, I would not go.

Quote:

You have manifested this idea in your head that every single job in the army consists of COMBAT and KILLING. Once again, do some research.

And to me, it is creating my life. I can finally go to a good college and get the degree I need. I can finally feed myself well. I have job which is going to give me valuble experience when I get out. That justifies itself enough for me. I want nothing more than stability in my life.



Once again: the army, as an institution, works to, in part, kill people. Personal gain to members of the army cannot be used to justify being involved with an organization that commits acts you fundamentally agree with.

Quote:

Whats with you and justification. Your basically telling me that being a soldier is evil. You really have no clue what responsability rests upon us.



Tell me. Explain to me in what way the army has improved life for Americans in, say, the last thirty years.


Quote:

True. But assasination is taking the life of an unprovoked person. I'm starting to get the Idea that you have never looked into any of the jobs in the military. Your saying all of this as if everyone of us goes to Iraq, and kills women and children for money. Wrong. Some of us fix your cars. Some of us make webpages. Some of us look at satellite images. Some of us are docters. Some of us drive buses. Some of us play instruments for a band. Get your facts straight man.



As I said, the army is a vast machine that is geared up to kill people. Saying that not everyone involved actually kills people no more vindicates them than saying Adolf Hiter wasn?t a bad man, because he never actually physically killed anyone. Someone looking at satellite images might be co-ordinating air strikes or searching for enemy bases, or doing any one of a hundred things that at some point will bring about the death of other people.


Write back soon,

xxx

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Offlinevc77
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: OJK]
    #3297829 - 10/30/04 03:00 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

This conversation isn't going anywhere, and for the both of us it probobly seems like trying to describe color to a blind person.

I haven't been in your shoes, and you haven't been in my shoes.

To me, in my shoes, the military was a great choice, and has done nothing but benefit me so far. I do not feel like I am doing wrong, infact, I feel like I am doing good with my life. I feel that I am moving in a positive direction. To you that direction is nothing but slaughtering people, but to me, it is getting an education, holding a job, traveling then US, and making my own money.

When I go to work every day and preform maintenance on television receivers/moniters and cameras, I do not feel regret, and I do not feel like I am killing people. When I work with synchronous generators, distribution equipment and amplifying equipment, I do not feel regret, and I do not feel like I am killing people. When I plan and design production scenery, graphics and special effects, I do not feel regret, and I do not feel like I am killing people. When I follow script and instructions of film or television directors to move cameras, zoom, pan or adjust focus, I do not feel regret, and I do not feel like I am killing people.

To you, I should feel regret, and I am killing people. I am pretty sure you feel when I goto my college classes every week I am killing people as well. I do not feel that way. I feel great about my self, and I have worked very hard to get where I am.

I am proud of myself, and even if no one else is, I'm still satisfied. Thanks you for the debate, it was fun.

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Offlineumpatan
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: Infrared]
    #15088045 - 09/16/11 03:43 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

That is against the USMJ and insubordination an offence to do that to those who are above you in rank.

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Invisiblenooneman
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Registered: 04/24/09
Posts: 14,664
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: umpatan]
    #15088085 - 09/16/11 03:51 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

umpatan said:
That is against the USMJ and insubordination an offence to do that to those who are above you in rank.



This thread is SIX YEARS OLD.
:gameover:

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InvisibleSpiritualSnorkel
Registered: 06/18/06
Posts: 1,545
Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: nooneman]
    #15088121 - 09/16/11 03:59 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

ahahaha, i love it

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OfflineVisionary Tools
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Posts: 7,953
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Re: what do u say to army/marines recruiters [Re: SpiritualSnorkel]
    #15088429 - 09/16/11 04:55 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

What the shit? :lahey:


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