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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Changing one's mind
    #3280027 - 10/26/04 05:00 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

A wothy question was put to me today. An individual I work with noted that in the present race for the office of president that the current president had noted the fact that John Kerry originally supported the war in Iraq, but had now changed his mind. The term flip-flopped was used I believe, and the implication was that once an individual makes up their mind, that changing it was a sign of weakness as well as a demonstration of moral uncertainty and a lack of integrity. This point was pushed quite strongly by the republicans through the press. I, myself have found that while I did originally support the war, the events of recent months have given me reason to change my opinion. So, I pose this question to the forum. When a person changes their mind on an important issue is it a sign of weakness or an inducation of flexibility or neither? Remember this is a philosophical view of a political situation and not political in itself.


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Offlinedeff
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Re: Changing one's mind [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3280069 - 10/26/04 05:10 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

It's a sign of detachment from one's past views

Not a bad thing at all :smile:

Being stubborn in your views, even when you realize they aren't correct, can be dangerous *cough*


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Changing one's mind [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3280108 - 10/26/04 05:22 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I think the ability to change your mind as experience and new information comes along is a great strength. It allows for you to readept, refocus and come at life with a more efficient and productive approach.

People have used the same argument against BUSH, saying that his stubbnorness to hold steady to his course, to stay "right" will lead to his destruction as being a man of integrity and potential dire consequences blah blah.

He says he changes strategy to adapt but I havn't seen it out of him yet.

You can change your mind and be right again if new info and hindsight from experience shows a reason where it would be wise to change your mind about something. I will always maintain that this ability is a strength and gives one the endurance to go the distance with the most efficient productivity.

I think Bush has become dangerous because of his inability to change his mind.

Life changes and we have to change with it or else the pressure will collapse in on us. Changing your mind when given cause to is like recalibrating from time to time to keep inner and outter pressure equalized.


It's healthy too!


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Offlinefelix
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Re: Changing one's mind [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3280183 - 10/26/04 05:34 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

i think it is an adaptation to perceived knowledge; almost a strength of character.

i think constant change of mind, views and opinions shows uncertainty and hesitation....more of a weakness. it's all subjective though.


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Real botanists laugh at HPS systems, we do however use high pressure sodium in the parking lot. - artthug


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Changing one's mind [Re: felix]
    #3280262 - 10/26/04 06:00 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

felix said:
i think it is an adaptation to perceived knowledge; almost a strength of character.

i think constant change of mind, views and opinions shows uncertainty and hesitation....more of a weakness. it's all subjective though.




The first sentence says how it is a strength says it perfectly. Consider this. What if ones personal reality is changing quickly. This can be the result of having a continuem of new information and jammed packed new experiences coming your way that call for change of mind adeptations.

How can some who is observing someones frequenct change of mind, know what is going on in that persons personal reality to call for it or not?

Back and forth flim flamming is another story with nothing new going on or coming in is another story. That just shows an inability to make a decision and take a stand. It shows a lack of self trust. I think Kerry doesn't trust his own self and does flim flam out of indescision based on a lack of self trust.

It's like walking down a New York City side walk. You keep pace with movement of the walkers to stay stable in your environment. If you stop often and walk forward and backward, you'll be bumped around a lot, like Kerry.

If you cement your feet into the side walk, you'll get bumped by the movement and then plowwed over and walked over eventually like BUSH is setting his self up for.


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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OfflineTodcasil
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Re: Changing one's mind [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #3280309 - 10/26/04 06:13 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

im for the changing of ones mind.

changing your mind means you have given the situation extra thought, instead of just relying on a past conclusion.


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Men look at themselves and they see flawed humans, we look at women and we see perfect
GODDESSES
Women look at themselves and they seem utterly human, when looking at men they see proud
GODS.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Changing one's mind [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #3280336 - 10/26/04 06:22 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

gettinjiggywithit said:
I think the ability to change your mind as experience and new information comes along is a great strength. It allows for you to readept, refocus and come at life with a more efficient and productive approach.

People have used the same argument against BUSH, saying that his stubbnorness to hold steady to his course, to stay "right" will lead to his destruction as being a man of integrity and potential dire consequences blah blah.

He says he changes strategy to adapt but I havn't seen it out of him yet.

You can change your mind and be right again if new info and hindsight from experience shows a reason where it would be wise to change your mind about something. I will always maintain that this ability is a strength and gives one the endurance to go the distance with the most efficient productivity.

I think Bush has become dangerous because of his inability to change his mind.

Life changes and we have to change with it or else the pressure will collapse in on us. Changing your mind when given cause to is like recalibrating from time to time to keep inner and outter pressure equalized.


It's healthy too!



could not have said that better.


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OfflineJacquesCousteau
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Re: Changing one's mind [Re: redgreenvines]
    #3280662 - 10/26/04 07:32 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

yup. My response would have been similar as well.


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OfflineGomp
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Re: Changing one's mind [Re: JacquesCousteau]
    #3280671 - 10/26/04 07:37 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

yet, i do not see how NOT changing of ones mind is possieble?
if i say icecream is good one day, and the neks day it is good, is it not good in a new way?


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Offlinelovelight
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Re: Changing one's mind [Re: Gomp]
    #3280823 - 10/26/04 08:21 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

haha true too! :thumbup: :grin:

being able to change your mind can also mean admitting you were wrong initially. this is real strength of character, it shows honesty within yourself, open-mindedness and adaptability to changes in a situation or in light of new knowledge. as we are always in a state of change, and in midst of experience, we need to be perceptible to it.


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Turn on your lovelight, let it shine on me


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OfflineJacquesCousteau
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Re: Changing one's mind [Re: lovelight]
    #3280865 - 10/26/04 08:32 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

lovelight said:
haha true too! :thumbup: :grin:

being able to change your mind can also mean admitting you were wrong initially. this is real strength of character, it shows honesty within yourself, open-mindedness and adaptability to changes in a situation or in light of new knowledge. as we are always in a state of change, and in midst of experience, we need to be perceptible to it.




:thumbup: Exactly.

The only thing we can count on in life is that change will inevitably occur.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Changing one's mind [Re: lovelight]
    #3280893 - 10/26/04 08:38 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I want to add that we should be careful when dealing with enforcing others to admit they were wrong. In most cases, if not ALL, people always believe themselves to be right at the time, based on the information and experience they have available to them.

No one tries to be wrong or means to be or wishes to be wrong or beleives they are in wrong. By enforcing someone to admit something which can lead to guilt and self punishment, I often think its healthier that we just help ourselves and each other to realise, we came to the best decisions and actions we could at the time based on what we knew.

If mistakes were made, it's more important to put emphasis on what was learned from them, versus dumping the wieght of wrongness and guilt on to ourselves and each other.

I think what you are saying lovelight is how healthy it is to be able to say, "oooh I didn't know that" and be able to have a change of mind or heart once you come to new info or realisations, then ignore the new light because you are afraid of being "wrong" and need to stay right.

You can go from being right to right to right. We need more forgiveness and less guilt and punishment in this world I think. Wanting to rub others noses in it is sadistic really. LOL


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Offlinelovelight
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Re: Changing one's mind [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #3281012 - 10/26/04 09:03 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

gettinjiggywithit said:
I think what you are saying lovelight is how healthy it is to be able to say, "oooh I didn't know that" and be able to have a change of mind or heart once you come to new info or realisations, then ignore the new light because you are afraid of being "wrong" and need to stay right.

You can go from being right to right to right. We need more forgiveness and less guilt and punishment in this world I think. Wanting to rub others noses in it is sadistic really. LOL




yes, I completely agree with you. Compassion and empathy  :heart:

However, I think that there is certain behaviour expressed that IS wrong and sadistic itself. It's dependant on how much it influences and affects people and surroundings. The reasons behind it (the individual's experience and context) have to be considered, but they are not necessarily enough to revoke the act. Until there is understanding and change in perception that is.


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Edited by lovelight (10/26/04 09:34 PM)


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Offlinedaba
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Re: Changing one's mind [Re: lovelight]
    #3281029 - 10/26/04 09:05 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Hmm I'm not going to read through all these posts; however, I thought this post was dedicated to changing the way you think, i.e. your cognition. That is a lot harder to do than changing one's views.


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Offlinelovelight
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Re: Changing one's mind [Re: daba]
    #3281194 - 10/26/04 09:34 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

:thumbup: yep, thanks!


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Changing one's mind [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3283098 - 10/27/04 07:59 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

When one changes their mind on an important issue, it isn't necessarily a sign of weakness or flexibility, or neither - it entirely depends on all of the factors of the issue and why the change was made. There is no general answer. :grin:

Politics is all about responding considering how different groups are going to perceive the response. It's a touchy-feely game, and a lot of times, changing one's mind is a dangerous thing to do because people like to grasp (sometimes violently) onto what they know - change is feared because it doesn't fit in with their previous model. These different people and groups feel they know their politician and where he stands, and suddenly he changes his mind on an issue (and they probably supported him because of his previous stance on that issue). It can seperate the candidate from that group of people....

Its the same reason that musicians sometimes are met with trouble when they make artistic changes, depending on who their audience is (and how they change :wink:). There was a reason the fans supported the group in the first place - to change could threaten to alienate those fans.

So, in politics, to change ones mind is a very hard thing to do because of all the different groups involved. One has to convince everyone why he is making the change, and get them to think that making the change was the right thing to do - they have to bring the groups to support the change. This is more difficult than catering to the groups, who already have an idea of what they want and where they want their politician to stand on issues.

So anyways, ja, politics sucks, the entire political system is about catering to others to get what one wants themself. :lol: Of course, if the topic of changing ones mind in this thread wasn't merely focused on political situations, I would, of course, think that changing one's mind is the best thing one can do - everything else changes, and we must change as well. Be like water. :grin:

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Peace. :mushroom2:


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I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Changing one's mind [Re: fireworks_god]
    #3287208 - 10/27/04 11:52 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

When I was working as a firefighter I had to learn a system called "Incident Command". When one arrives on the scene of an emergency and assumes charge of the incident you do a size up of the situation. You then make a plan based on that. If the situation changes at any time or your plan is failing you pull back and do another size up and formulate another plan. This is a dynamic, continuous process with no room for personality to intrude on it. So, to me, changing one's mind is pure practical necessity for survival.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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