Home | Community | Message Board


Kratom Eye
Please support our sponsors.

General Interest >> Political Discussion

Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Amazon Shop for: Scales

Jump to first unread post. Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | Next >  [ show all ]
OfflineNorthernsoul
Your Reality

Registered: 11/17/01
Posts: 2,290
Loc: Inner Eye
Last seen: 5 years, 11 months
Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved.
    #3272008 - 10/24/04 05:38 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

I think that you can save alot of money if you decriminalise drugs, too much is spent on making people stay in jail, and they just go out and use again anyways. I belive in harm prevention, if you can prescribe, and give them the drugs they crave, and have gotten themselves addicted to, then the drug dealers make less money, or no money if its done on a huge scale. Its a lifestyle choice, and if you wanna put your life on hold, and become addicted, it would be way cheaper to just give the drugs to addicts, and monitor thier heath rather than having them do anything to get the drug, and letting the organised crime gangs get away with billions of dollars. So I say: Prescribe Cocaine, Heroin, Crack to those who decide to make that lifestyle choice. There would probably be a spike in useage because of this, but once the novelty wears off, people will realize that its not a good life to live, and word will spread how lame it is to be addicted. But I dont think legalizing them would do anything except create a whole new batch of problems. You see legalization in Europe, and decriminalization in alot of other countries, but there hasnt been any revolution because of it because as long as the drug lords make thier billions, and as long as the buddy down the street makes his 10k a month selling his smack, it will still be a problem. And yes, if teh goverment sold it, then they would make the money. But anyone in the political world who even thinks of this, commits political suicide. So good luck putting your hope into that.

You might say: "Prescibing? As if!" But then again: "Legalising? As if!"....Its just going to be the debate that never ends, and unless the subject becoems more important to the average american family, or of ULTIMATE importance to the majority of the population, we are going to see the same thing we have been seeing for the past 60 years, and it will probably continue for another 100 years. At least past my life-time.

Every view has a contradiction, and you cannot come up with any view without thier being a contradiction attatched to it. So the only truth is that no solution is perfect, and no solution is right or wrong, there is just us imagining something better, thats all we can do.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Invisiblesilversoul7
Chill the FuckOut!
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/10/02
Posts: 27,301
Loc: mndfreeze's puppet army
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: Northernsoul]
    #3272019 - 10/24/04 05:41 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Just to correct you, marijuana has not been legalized anywhere in Europe. Countries like the Netherlands have a tolerance policy, where it remains illegal, but they just look the other way, unless some organized criminal organization starts getting into the business, in which case they can still bust them for it.


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 6 months, 5 days
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: Northernsoul]
    #3272222 - 10/24/04 06:47 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Give them??????? Fuck that, they can buy them just like everybody else


--------------------


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Invisiblequestion_for_joo
i'm left. youall can bite me
Registered: 04/30/03
Posts: 1,591
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: Northernsoul]
    #3272223 - 10/24/04 06:48 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Addicts aren't addicts cause they aren't aware of how uncool it is. Most addicts remain addicts because they don't have enough willpower to quit, that's why these drugs are dangerous and why most people want them to still be illegal.


--------------------
youi was a pig informatnt so you can go fuckyoruselfs


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 6 months, 5 days
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: question_for_joo]
    #3272233 - 10/24/04 06:49 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

And fuck that too. I'm not their daddy and they can kill themselves any way they want. The sooner the better, hopefully before they reproduce.


--------------------


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
OfflineAaronEvil
The GuitarVillain
Male

Registered: 09/27/04
Posts: 1,706
Loc: California
Last seen: 5 years, 6 months
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: silversoul7]
    #3272240 - 10/24/04 06:52 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

silversoul7 said:
Just to correct you, marijuana has not been legalized anywhere in Europe. Countries like the Netherlands have a tolerance policy, where it remains illegal, but they just look the other way, unless some organized criminal organization starts getting into the business, in which case they can still bust them for it.




Isnt Amsterdam in Europe? Im pretty sure it is legal there.


--------------------


There is not a lot of difference between a fox hole and a grave; but knowing that you dug your ditch and climbed in anyway.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Invisiblesilversoul7
Chill the FuckOut!
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/10/02
Posts: 27,301
Loc: mndfreeze's puppet army
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: AaronEvil]
    #3272261 - 10/24/04 06:59 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

AaronEvil said:
Quote:

silversoul7 said:
Just to correct you, marijuana has not been legalized anywhere in Europe. Countries like the Netherlands have a tolerance policy, where it remains illegal, but they just look the other way, unless some organized criminal organization starts getting into the business, in which case they can still bust them for it.




Isnt Amsterdam in Europe? Im pretty sure it is legal there.



Nope. As I said, they have a tolerance policy, where it remains technically illegal, but they let coffee shops sell it anyway.


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisibleTenaciousFloyd
Stranger
Registered: 10/05/04
Posts: 76
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: Northernsoul]
    #3272313 - 10/24/04 07:13 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

It should be decriminalized just because using drugs shouldn't be considered a crime.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
OfflineNorthernsoul
Your Reality

Registered: 11/17/01
Posts: 2,290
Loc: Inner Eye
Last seen: 5 years, 11 months
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: question_for_joo]
    #3282144 - 10/27/04 12:46 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

question_for_joo said:
Addicts aren't addicts cause they aren't aware of how uncool it is. Most addicts remain addicts because they don't have enough willpower to quit, that's why these drugs are dangerous and why most people want them to still be illegal.




True, many get hooked. Not because its fun to still get high, but because the drugs are very powerfull psycologicly, physicaly, or both. But just because they made that choice, doesnt mean they should die in thier own Heppititis ridden, Aids infested, violence ravaged, drug addicted hell. Give it to them till they die (if thats thier choice). At the same time offer help to those who ask for it. Promote the help heavily. At the same time, addicts will not have to rob old ladies, no guy will have to sell his ass to men any more to pay for his habbit, no people will be shot for thier 14$ in thier wallet, or bribed into prostitution from a pimp to support her habbit, and billions would be saved in fighting drug lords in columbia because it will be better to grow bannanas.

Its mostly a dream though. Alot of shit makes sense on paper, and not in real life. But what we see now is just a great waste of resourses that can be used to help alot of other suffering people who just want a drink of water, never mind a shot of heroin.


--------------------


--------------------------------------------------------------

When it comes
I'll know, I know
Just take my clothes and leave
And I'll be gone




Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinerogue_pixie
faerydae
Female User Gallery

Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 3,826
Loc: UK
Last seen: 21 hours, 53 minutes
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: Northernsoul]
    #3283066 - 10/27/04 07:23 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Northernsoul said:
I think that you can save alot of money if you decriminalise drugs, too much is spent on making people stay in jail, and they just go out and use again anyways. I belive in harm prevention, if you can prescribe, and give them the drugs they crave, and have gotten themselves addicted to, then the drug dealers make less money, or no money if its done on a huge scale. Its a lifestyle choice, and if you wanna put your life on hold, and become addicted, it would be way cheaper to just give the drugs to addicts, and monitor thier heath rather than having them do anything to get the drug, and letting the organised crime gangs get away with billions of dollars. So I say: Prescribe Cocaine, Heroin, Crack to those who decide to make that lifestyle choice. There would probably be a spike in useage because of this, but once the novelty wears off, people will realize that its not a good life to live, and word will spread how lame it is to be addicted. But I dont think legalizing them would do anything except create a whole new batch of problems. You see legalization in Europe, and decriminalization in alot of other countries, but there hasnt been any revolution because of it because as long as the drug lords make thier billions, and as long as the buddy down the street makes his 10k a month selling his smack, it will still be a problem. And yes, if teh goverment sold it, then they would make the money. But anyone in the political world who even thinks of this, commits political suicide. So good luck putting your hope into that.

You might say: "Prescibing? As if!" But then again: "Legalising? As if!"....Its just going to be the debate that never ends, and unless the subject becoems more important to the average american family, or of ULTIMATE importance to the majority of the population, we are going to see the same thing we have been seeing for the past 60 years, and it will probably continue for another 100 years. At least past my life-time.

Every view has a contradiction, and you cannot come up with any view without thier being a contradiction attatched to it. So the only truth is that no solution is perfect, and no solution is right or wrong, there is just us imagining something better, thats all we can do.




Amen to that. Politicians have been debating the idea for a long time now. It's time it was put into action.


--------------------
'It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.' ~ J. Krishnamurti


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
OfflineBillytheKid
Forgeddaboudit!

Registered: 10/18/04
Posts: 149
Loc: Connecticut
Last seen: 11 years, 11 months
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: Northernsoul]
    #3283244 - 10/27/04 09:34 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

While i agree that legalizing drugs would cut out the drug dealers i do not subscribe to the notion that it would be 100% beneficial.. IMO we NEED to legalize low level drugs, mushrooms, weed, hash, things of this nature. Things though like Coke, heroine and crack, etc need not be legalized because theyre highly addictive and expensive. And most of the muggings that occur in urban areas typically are being done by people desperatefor drug money to ge tthier fix because of the habit. I think if we legalized weed and mushrooms there would be LESS people trying heroine and crack because they can get thier high already. Also who would pay for a costly presecription for coke or heroin? the government wouldnt and shouldnt because its not medicinal, I wouldnt want the government giving out prescriptions to be icluded in health care costs for alcohol or weed either. They should just decriminalize weed etc and allow people to grow certain amounts of it in thier own homes.


--------------------
Bingo!


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisibleAntiMeme
yankee doodledandy
Registered: 08/11/04
Posts: 208
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: BillytheKid]
    #3283298 - 10/27/04 09:55 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Coke, heroine and crack, etc need not be legalized because theyre highly addictive and expensive

Why do you think they're expensive? Those who become hard addicts are people with psychological problems. They're sick. Without proper treatment, they will succeed in destroying their lives one way or another. A recent survey where I live showed that almost eighty percent of addicts had psychological problems before they started with drugs. There is no need to force these poor souls to commit crimes for supporting their habit. They need our help, and not only to quit the drugs which is how they're handled now.


--------------------


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: BillytheKid]
    #3283314 - 10/27/04 10:02 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)


Things though like Coke, heroine and crack, etc need not be
legalized because theyre highly addictive and expensive.

And most of the muggings that occur in urban areas typically are
being done by people desperatefor drug money to ge tthier fix
because of the habit.


As far as addictiveness goes, there are many legal substances
that are addictive(alcohol and caffiene for example). Have you ever
heard of anybody being killed in a "beer deal gone bad" lately?

Anything that can be mass-produced(cocaine and heroin can be
mass-produced)and that is legal and easily available, will be cheap.
For example, alcohol is easy to produce and widely available.
Because it so easy to get, it is cheap. And because
it is cheap, people don't need to commmit crimes to pay high prices
for it.


I think if we legalized weed and mushrooms there would be LESS
people trying heroine and crack because they can get thier high
already.

I disagree. I am one of the few anti-prohibitionists who accepts
the simple fact that people who are curious about altering their
mental state usually try everything. They usually don't stop with
weed. People are curious. In that sense I think weed is a gateway
drug.

A common mistake with the whole drug debate is that people
on both sides(anti-prohibitionists and prohibitionists) seem to lump
all illicit drugs together. I think this is stupid. All of these
substances are completely individual and different and deserve to
be examined individually and without bias.

I vacilate back and forth when it comes to legalization of "hard"
drugs". I think people should be allowed to put whatever they
want into their bodies, yet I don't want kids trying heroin or
cocaine(and they will get their hands on it more if it was legal).


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisibleAntiMeme
yankee doodledandy
Registered: 08/11/04
Posts: 208
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3283343 - 10/27/04 10:13 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

A common mistake with the whole drug debate is that people on both sides(anti-prohibitionists and prohibitionists) seem to lump all illicit drugs together.

I have not yet witnessed any 'serious' debate about drugs where this is not true. It's extremely frustrating since 'drugs' is just a legal term describing those substances excplicitly outlawed by the government. Yet, most people seem convinced that all outlawed substances share most of the same physiological and chemical properties. It's a deep rooted selective ignorance that ruins every attempt at serious debate.

And yes, even most anti-prohibitionist seem to take this for granted, and it's a damned shame.


--------------------


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
OfflineBillytheKid
Forgeddaboudit!

Registered: 10/18/04
Posts: 149
Loc: Connecticut
Last seen: 11 years, 11 months
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: AntiMeme]
    #3283451 - 10/27/04 10:59 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

The claim it seems to me that youre making is that these drugs are not physically addictive and the addiction lies in the persons mentality.. for this i would agree with you on alcohol, weed and mushrooms since they have no addictive properties PHYSICALLY. However hings like crack and heroin are addictive physically, and mentally. Like ciggerettes. Cigs however do not killyou as quickly as those drugs. The reason the drugs are expensive is because theyre MUCH harder to come by than weed or shroomies. Most heroin comes from overseas, as does cocain. Crack is made of a mix of coke and other chemicals. Its also expensive because you build tolerance quickly to those drugs and require more and more... which is coincidently the thing thatkills most hardcore addicts... They are using a huge amount a day for so long then they rehab and detox, relapse and try to use the same amount they used to not kowing thier bodies tolerances went down, which OD's them.

I agree with you though, they do not need jail time, they need help. People addicted to serious drugs like heroin and crack are no longer able to make cognant decisions and need to detox. Weneed more funding for detoxification programs and support programs for these people, which is ALSO why I think we need to legalize weed, you cant force someone to go 100% cold turkey off of crack or heroin, or cheeba, you need to bring them back with a substitute. (Methadone) but if we let them smoke weed the edge will be duller than if it was illegal. At least thats been my experience. I grew up in a ghetto in the 80s ive met a LOT of crack addicts in my life. And the only successful way ive seen people come off of it really well was when people locked them in a room with nothing but a bed and gave them weed and food and water every day for a month or two.


--------------------
Bingo!


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
OfflineBillytheKid
Forgeddaboudit!

Registered: 10/18/04
Posts: 149
Loc: Connecticut
Last seen: 11 years, 11 months
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3283467 - 10/27/04 11:08 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

**As far as addictiveness goes, there are many legal substances
that are addictive(alcohol and caffiene for example). Have you ever
heard of anybody being killed in a "beer deal gone bad" lately?**

you have to remember the difference between physsical and mental addictions. Alcohol is NOT physically addictive. Niether is caffine. But if youre personality is predisposed to addictive patterns you CAN be addicted to them, just like people with the same personality flaws can get addictions to sex, masterbation, overeating and other things that are pleasureable. I havent seen anyone killed in a beer gone bad deal lately but 500,000 people die every year from alcohol related accidents (mostly with cars.) thats a football stadium. However Alcohol isnt at the root of these problems, its the person, whereas when a person is addicted to heroin or crack if they DONT get thier fix, they literally feel like theyre dying and they get sick and hurt very badly, its because the chemicals from the drugs have influenced thier brains chemically for so long that an absence of said chemicals will force thier brain to malfunction which in turn makes them very ill.

**Anything that can be mass-produced(cocaine and heroin can be
mass-produced)and that is legal and easily available, will be cheap.
For example, alcohol is easy to produce and widely available.
Because it so easy to get, it is cheap. And because
it is cheap, people don't need to commmit crimes to pay high prices
for it. **

This is simply not true, the majority of those drugs come from overseas, I think something like 90% of heroin in the USA comes form the Middle east and South America alone. They will always be expensive, especially since the laws regarding them will end at our shores, we cannot force South America to legalize the same drugs and allow free trade of them. Nor of the middle east. Also as you become addicted to these substances your doasge increases until 2 things happen. A. you die. B. you quit. These drugs are not only tremendously addictive, but they are very damaging to the body.. yes alcohol and cigs are too but so much less... have you ever met someone who was "strung out"? that is someone who has a full blown addiction to crack or heroin? I have guess what happens somewhere after a year? thier hair and teeth start to fall out... Thier skin turns yellow, thier eyes sink in, they lose lots of weight and think of NOTHING but thier next fix. It would be a huge mistake to legalize this kind of behavior and send these people to thier doom with prescriptions of it... by the way if it is prescribed, where is the money going to come from for it? lets say legalizeing it cuts the price in half... so now i only got a 2500 a day addiction instead of a 5000 dollar a day? Who will pay for such aprescription? the government? Why not make them pay for everyones alcohol and cigs to?


--------------------
Bingo!


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
OfflineBillytheKid
Forgeddaboudit!

Registered: 10/18/04
Posts: 149
Loc: Connecticut
Last seen: 11 years, 11 months
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: AntiMeme]
    #3283477 - 10/27/04 11:10 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Im not sure who youre talking about, but my case is clear, im not anti or pro... i think SOME drugs need to be legalized because they are harmless while other ones that are deadly, and highly addictive need to remain illegal.


--------------------
Bingo!


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinedeafpanda
Stranger
Registered: 05/07/04
Posts: 984
Loc: Inguland
Last seen: 5 years, 1 month
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: BillytheKid]
    #3283587 - 10/27/04 11:44 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

All drugs should be legal. Not just because we have a fundamental right to stick whatever substance we want in whatever orifice so long as it doesn't hurt others, but also because the harm done by drugs is greatly outweighed by the harm done by prohibiting drugs. Even crack and heroin.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
OfflineBillytheKid
Forgeddaboudit!

Registered: 10/18/04
Posts: 149
Loc: Connecticut
Last seen: 11 years, 11 months
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: deafpanda]
    #3283620 - 10/27/04 11:56 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

highly disagree, no man is an island whole of himself we are all part of a society, if you lived in the woods by yourself i would say do what you will, but when you live in a society you adhere to society, in this case you cannot legally be running around addicted to crack or heroin because you become a danger to those around you.


--------------------
Bingo!


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: Give addicts thier drugs, and alot of problems would be solved. [Re: Northernsoul]
    #3283645 - 10/27/04 12:03 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Its mostly a dream though

It's not that big a stretch tho. In 1968 when heroin could be legally prescribed by doctors in the UK there were fewer than 500 heroin addicts. After 30 years of rabid law enforcement there are 500,000.

All the arguments are summed up in this article "Make Heroin Legal":

http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,,506507,00.html


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Jump to top. Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | Next >  [ show all ]

Amazon Shop for: Scales

General Interest >> Political Discussion

Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* The economic side of the war on drugs RedHarvest 796 3 10/07/01 11:47 PM
by ElPrimo
* Milton Friedman on the Drug War
( 1 2 all )
JesusChrist 1,900 32 12/15/04 09:48 PM
by EonTan
* A preacher's view on The War on Drugs Phred 913 2 07/20/01 12:52 AM
by fuzzysquirelnuts
* Why It Is Time To Decriminalize Drug Use RonoS 1,483 19 10/02/02 06:12 PM
by LSAuser
* Drug testing for welfare recipients
( 1 2 all )
TheOneYouKnow 2,326 29 01/19/04 09:44 PM
by TheOneYouKnow
* Will drugs ever be legal in Cananda? USA?(ha)
( 1 2 all )
LSAuser 1,763 23 10/12/02 03:53 AM
by trendal
* The War on Drugs is Lost wingnutx 1,360 19 08/25/02 08:51 PM
by Murex
* The Drug War Arena OneMoreRobot3021 969 16 05/07/07 04:54 PM
by zappaisgod

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Prisoner#1, Enlil
2,489 topic views. 0 members, 1 guests and 3 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Toggle Favorite | Print Topic | Stats ]
Search this thread:
Zamnesia.com
Please support our sponsors.

Copyright 1997-2016 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.028 seconds spending 0.004 seconds on 16 queries.