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OfflineDivided_Sky
Ten ThousandThings

Registered: 11/02/03
Posts: 3,171
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Last seen: 8 years, 6 months
Disturbing thing happened today
    #3248119 - 10/12/04 07:05 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

When I came home from school I found one of my housemate's fish half-dead and being eaten alive. The other fish had ganged up and torn his fins, paralyzed him and eaten out his eyes so he was floating upside down at the bottom of the tank slowly breathing as the others tried to tear off his lip. I had to use the net and take him out of the tank, hoping that suffocation would be easier than being eaten alive. I put him in a plastic bag where I could see he was still breathing. I made the difficult decision to try to break his spine. I tried but he was too flimsy. Fortunately it seems, he stopped breathing moments before.

When the fish's owner came home she paid very little attention. She said "Oh, another fish is dead." (while it was still alive) and continued to talk on her cell phone. She always treated those animals like furniture so this wasn't all that surprising, but it bothered me. She had no idea the fish was a living thing. After a few minutes as I was mulling on how to dispose of it, she said "I'm just about to leave. There is a dumpster nearby, I'll throw it away." I was a little bothered by the idea of "throwing away" dead animals but I said ok. I told her I would do it myself, but she said she was on her way out. She told me to leave the bag on the counter. I felt very strange about this, but I did it anyways. Went into my room for a while and when I came out 25 minutes later the dead fish was still sitting on the counter (in the middle of the kitchen) and she was on the phone again. There was a corpse on the counter and she had completely ignored it or forgotton. I think she disposed of it eventually. I don't want to go back out to check.

So it got me thinking about the brutality that living things are capable of. Those fish had no reason whatsoever to kill him. That fish had been in the same tank as them for months, maybe even a year or two, and yet they had no problem eating him alive.
This is what life is. Brutality, destroying other living beings to survive. In this case for fun. Sometimes we tend to think that the animal world is idyllic and Zen, but it is not. Animals are capable of even more horrible and brutal things than humans because of their ignorance and lack of intelligence. Life is a cycle of destruction, that is why there is so much pain and suffering, it is implicit in life's functioning.

And we humans remain willfully ignorant of the whole thing, as if nothing else exist or even matters except or own selves.


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1. "After an hour I wasn't feeling anything so I decided to take another..."
2. "We were feeling pretty good so we decided to smoke a few bowls..."
3. "I had to be real quiet because my parents were asleep upstairs..."


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Invisiblejux
I'm better thanan STD!

Registered: 04/06/04
Posts: 924
Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #3248147 - 10/12/04 07:10 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Does anything really matter except oneself?


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OfflineDivided_Sky
Ten ThousandThings

Registered: 11/02/03
Posts: 3,171
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Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: jux]
    #3248170 - 10/12/04 07:13 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Well if you take that a step further you can say that oneself also does not matter and thus selfish behavior is completely unrewarding. Therefore in a healthy mind everything, except the self, matters very strongly.


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1. "After an hour I wasn't feeling anything so I decided to take another..."
2. "We were feeling pretty good so we decided to smoke a few bowls..."
3. "I had to be real quiet because my parents were asleep upstairs..."


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Invisiblejux
I'm better thanan STD!

Registered: 04/06/04
Posts: 924
Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #3248198 - 10/12/04 07:17 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

nah, I'm pretty sure I'm the most important thing in my universe


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OfflineGomp
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Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: jux]
    #3248235 - 10/12/04 07:25 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

why is not eating salad, (living thing) compare to killing say a sheep for the meat? (hehe the thinking part blabalbl)
why did not eating a dead cow wrapped in bread at MC Donald's trigger the same "disturbed" feelings :P (not saying that i know anything)

"Animals are capable of even more horrible and brutal things than humans because of their ignorance and lack of intelligence. "

a animal; A human considered with respect to his or her physical, as opposed to spiritual, nature. man I'm lost.com :P


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Disclaimer!?


Edited by Gomp (10/12/04 07:29 PM)


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Anonymous

Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: Gomp]
    #3248369 - 10/12/04 07:54 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Divided, that is pretty disturbing. People like that are sleep-walking through life and don't realize the incredible intricacies of life around them.

Gomp, you have an excellent point. Plants are living beings too. Not too many holier-than-thou vegetarians realize this. Is it better to end of a life of a plant than the life of an animal so that we can eat? Are we in a position to say that the life of a plant is less important because it's not as complex as an animal?


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OfflineIamHungry
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Registered: 01/12/03
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Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #3248401 - 10/12/04 07:59 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

ewww did you ever see when killer whales throw their seal prey around while theyre still alive? sorry but you reminded me of it.
ive got a question, too. are animals affected by karma? are there animals who are just total assholes to each other and therefore have a shitty life, or is that just a human phenomenon?


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Here comes the sun, do n do do,
Here comes the sun, and I say,
It's alright...


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OfflineDivided_Sky
Ten ThousandThings

Registered: 11/02/03
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Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: ]
    #3248411 - 10/12/04 08:01 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

I don't eat meat, but I do understand that plants might not appreciate being eaten as well. But, there is nothing I can do about it. I have the choice not to eat more complex and conscious beings, but I have to eat something.


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1. "After an hour I wasn't feeling anything so I decided to take another..."
2. "We were feeling pretty good so we decided to smoke a few bowls..."
3. "I had to be real quiet because my parents were asleep upstairs..."


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OfflineGomp
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Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: IamHungry]
    #3248476 - 10/12/04 08:17 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

what makes us not animals? i just don't get that part..

"I have to eat something" then just wait for the apple to die :P (fall from the tree) the again, that is killing potential life, the-again, then sperm would be potential life as well? and masturbating is mass murder? :P

and..
"I once thought of becoming a vegetarian, not because i love animals, but i just hate those vegetables"
-unknown :P


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Disclaimer!?


Edited by Gomp (10/12/04 08:20 PM)


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
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Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: ]
    #3248582 - 10/12/04 08:40 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Divided, that is pretty disturbing. People like that are sleep-walking through life and don't realize the incredible intricacies of life around them.

Yeah, she should have wept deeply and taken time off from work and maybe visited her therapist after the fish funeral...

*Swam takes some Gordon's fishsticks from the freezer and pops them in the microwave*


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The proof is in the pudding.


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Offlinedeff
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Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: Gomp]
    #3248587 - 10/12/04 08:41 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

A lot of energy is lost between the first level (plant) life and the higher consumers, due to motion, actions, staying alive and whatnot. So, eating a cow's diet has more energy associated with it than eating the cow itself. For this reason, coupled with the fact that plant life is not sentient atleast to our observations, eating vegetation over animals (when we can survive on either) seems like the 'smarter' thing to do.

Morals are a sloppy thing though, and people seldomly stop to apply their illusionary morals of one kind (ie- killing living animals is wrong) to that of a similar, yet less obvious situation (eating animals supports the killing of animals, so this too must be 'wrong') Swami made a good post about moral inconsistencies awhile back :smile:


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OfflineGomp
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Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: deff]
    #3248652 - 10/12/04 08:53 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

"to motion, actions, staying alive"
is that the plant or the animals or both?



"So, eating a cow's diet has more energy associated with it than eating the cow itself."

if that was the case, and you took a tiger instead of a cow (who of-course eats other animals like us), what then?

haha, maybe i should go to bed now :smile: good night :P


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Disclaimer!?


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Anonymous

Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: Swami]
    #3248662 - 10/12/04 08:54 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Mmm that made me hungry.

*Takes some humansticks from the freezer and pops them in the microwave*


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Offlinedeff
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Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: ]
    #3248672 - 10/12/04 08:57 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

A tiger would be even less efficient as an energy source than the consumers it consumed, and those likewise to the plants they consumed.

So really, vegetarianism (if that is a word) makes a lot a sense. Something I'm considering for myself :/


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: deff]
    #3248681 - 10/12/04 08:59 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Fruitarianism is considered by some to be the "highest" diet as the fruit is freely offered by the plant as food to spread it's seeds and is not killed in the process.

*whips out a banana*


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The proof is in the pudding.


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InvisibleAntiMeme
yankee doodledandy
Registered: 08/11/04
Posts: 208
Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #3248699 - 10/12/04 09:03 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Is that an example of compassionate conservatism? Mourning fishes while assraping the poor and disenfranchised?


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Offlinedeff
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Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: Swami]
    #3248700 - 10/12/04 09:03 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Yeah I was thinking about that. Not just fruits, but harvesting any vegetation from plants without killing it seems to be the best way to go. Of course, fruit can be considered the best of this class for the seed spreading reason you mentioned :smile:


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OfflineMushmonkey
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Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: ]
    #3248717 - 10/12/04 09:06 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Fish just do that.
Goldfish and guppies can die pretty quick for little reason.
It just happens.
Animals eat animals.

You may not like it, but they're certainly not going to stop or even give a damn just because of someone's delicate sensibilities.

You don't have to like it, but you have to accept it.


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i finally got around to making a sig
revel in its glory and quake in fear at its might
grar.


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OfflineGomp
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Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: Mushmonkey]
    #3248740 - 10/12/04 09:10 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

what is the best tasting thing you find in the nature? :P

do not eat food, the shrooms are here to help uss, mushrooms is people food :P (and somewhat equal to the fruit (as it is)) :wink:


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Disclaimer!?


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InvisibleAntiMeme
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Re: Disturbing thing happened today [Re: Gomp]
    #3248747 - 10/12/04 09:13 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

soylent green is people food


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