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InvisibleCJay
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Registered: 02/02/04
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Free Saddam!
    #3246456 - 10/12/04 08:29 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Now that we all know Saddam is not-guilty of possessing WMD

And since the UN weapons inspectors were crawling all over Iraq in compliance with resolution 1441, progressing to the satisfaction of their leader at the time of the premature invasion.

An invasion that was obviously not necessary except to ensure the USAdmin and it's few grovelling allies got overall control and took the lion's share of Iraq's resources. An invasion that also managed to kill as many Iraqi's in a year, so as to challenge Saddam's whole notorious career. Saddam cannot be held as a killer unless GWB is too - for he has ordered mass killing galore.

On top of this, considering there were no links between Iraq and Al Quaeda...

Can we give him his country back? Or at least let him out of prison?


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InvisibleStein
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Re: Free Saddam! [Re: CJay]
    #3246465 - 10/12/04 08:33 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

He will be released. Released to the hands of the Iraqi people who will then try him and probably sentence him to death via beheading.


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OfflineAaronEvil
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Registered: 09/27/04
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Re: Free Saddam! [Re: Stein]
    #3246488 - 10/12/04 08:55 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

We should just kill him. I know that sounds harsh and goes against what our country stands for but it would be easier to kill him then to let him go.


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There is not a lot of difference between a fox hole and a grave; but knowing that you dug your ditch and climbed in anyway.


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InvisibleCJay
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Re: Free Saddam! [Re: AaronEvil]
    #3246579 - 10/12/04 10:11 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Hey everything Bush has commissioned goes against what your country stands for, so one more thing ain't gonna hurt.

Someone's gotta do God's work, making the world a better, safer place - and hey, it just happens to be good ole Georgie boy!

Off with his head!


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OfflineJesusChrist
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Registered: 02/19/04
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Re: Free Saddam! [Re: CJay]
    #3246666 - 10/12/04 11:11 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Let's give Iraq back to Sadaam. You are really bright. Keep em coming.

I can understand some of the malice and hatred directed at George Bush, but you are coo coo for cocopuffs. That is the worst idea that I have read on this board, and this board's specialty is really bad ideas.


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Tastes just like chicken


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InvisibleXlea321
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Registered: 02/26/01
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Re: Free Saddam! [Re: CJay]
    #3246699 - 10/12/04 11:48 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

:laugh:

It is a little ironic how most of the crimes Saddam has been charged come from the time when Reagan and Bush had their furry little tongues wedged up Saddams ass.


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Don't worry, B. Caapi


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InvisibleXlea321
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Re: Free Saddam! [Re: Stein]
    #3246722 - 10/12/04 12:04 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Released to the hands of the Iraqi people who will then try him and probably sentence him to death via beheading.

They tend to prefer beheading americans these days.


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi


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InvisibleCJay
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Re: Free Saddam! [Re: JesusChrist]
    #3246730 - 10/12/04 12:08 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Well considering not one reason for invading his nation bears up to scrutiny...it's not such a bad idea.


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Offlineunbeliever
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Re: Free Saddam! [Re: CJay]
    #3246782 - 10/12/04 12:29 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

While I do feel a certain detached kind of sympathy for Saddam, I don't think releasing him into the wild is the best of ideas. He's a bit like an abused animal that has turned mean. Not to say he's not responsible for his various bad deeds, but I think there is some pity to be had. Saddam Hussein is a charismatic, intelligent and strong willed person. It's unfortunate he has to be "evil", otherwise I imagine he could probably be a good leader of any country. Unfortunately he is not a good person and should remain in prison for the rest of his life.


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Happiness is a warm gun...


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OfflineLearyfan
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Re: Free Saddam! [Re: CJay]
    #3246952 - 10/12/04 01:21 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

I know what you're saying, but....fuck Saddam.

I agree with you that Bush should be tried for war crimes, but Saddam is not a good guy. Fuck him.





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--------------------------------


Mp3 of the month: The Dovers - The Third Eye



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Anonymous

Re: Free Saddam! [Re: CJay]
    #3247002 - 10/12/04 01:35 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

An invasion that also managed to kill as many Iraqi's in a year, so as to challenge Saddam's whole notorious career.

whoever gave you that idea?

15,000-20,000 is a rather liberal estimate of the number of civilians killed as a result of the invasion.

saddam hussein himself killed several hundred thousand.

he was ordering summary executions of hundreds of political prisoners at late as 2001.

he supported international terrorist organizations such as abu nidal and was offering $25,000 compensation for the families of suicide bombers in israel.

Can we give him his country back? Or at least let him out of prison?

come on now. check out hussein's human rights record from organizations like amnesty international or human rights watch before making such absurd statements.


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Offlinebarfightlard
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Re: Free Saddam! [Re: ]
    #3247046 - 10/12/04 01:48 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Killing is killing, who gives a fuck about numbers. If Saddam is exicuted he deserves it no more than George Dubya, or anyone else who kills innocent people.


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"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks


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Anonymous

Re: Free Saddam! [Re: barfightlard]
    #3247166 - 10/12/04 02:19 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Killing is killing, who gives a fuck about numbers.

the statement was false, i corrected him.

If Saddam is exicuted he deserves it no more than George Dubya, or anyone else who kills innocent people.

think about that. innocent people are killed in war. even a completely justified war of self defense will result in innocent deaths. by this line of reasoning the leaders of any state that engages in warfare, even a defensive war, deserves the same fate as a leader who meticulously and intentionally executes his own countrymen. absurd.


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InvisibleXlea321
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Registered: 02/26/01
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Re: Free Saddam! [Re: ]
    #3247189 - 10/12/04 02:25 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

15,000-20,000 is a rather liberal estimate of the number of civilians killed as a result of the invasion.

Rather conservative. Groups on the ground have estimated far higher figures than that.

saddam hussein himself killed several hundred thousand

But the bulk of those during the 1980's and 1991.

he was ordering summary executions of hundreds of political prisoners at late as 2001.

Source?

he supported international terrorist organizations such as abu nidal

Bullshit. He may have supported him in the 70's but expelled him from Iraq in 1983, then killed him in 2002 for working with exiles to overthrow Saddam.

I suppose he did let Nidal live in the country for a while but is that really "supporting" a terrorist group? Countless convicted terrorists and horrendous ex-dictators have set up residence in the US - does that mean the US is "supporting" them?

and was offering $25,000 compensation for the families of suicide bombers in israel.

This is a hoary old tale. He was actually offering 25000 to palestinians who had their homes destroyed by the Isrealis. It was Tariq Ali who said he was going to do it when Saddam was looking for a little arab support. How much, if any, money he actually gave is open to question. To me it sounds like a good propaganda story.

check out hussein's human rights record from organizations like amnesty international or human rights watch before making such absurd statements.

But we all knew he was a scumbag when he was at the height of his killing spree back in the 80's. So why don't we put Bush on trial for supporting Saddam too?


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi


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InvisibleXlea321
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Re: Free Saddam! [Re: ]
    #3247206 - 10/12/04 02:31 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

the statement was false, i corrected him

Lets take your estimate then. You think Saddam killed more than 20,000 people in the last 10 years? Source?

by this line of reasoning the leaders of any state that engages in warfare, even a defensive war

But this wasn't a defensive war. There was no need whatsoever to slaughter those thousands of innocent people.


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi


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Anonymous

Re: Free Saddam! [Re: Xlea321]
    #3247266 - 10/12/04 02:48 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Rather conservative. Groups on the ground have estimated far higher figures than that.

i got the number from http://www.iraqbodycount.net/ a website which opposes the war and exists to publicize civilian deaths. they set the number of deaths as between 13,182 and 15,248. what are the numbers you've seen? do you believe that the death toll of the invasion is higher than the number of iraqis killed by the ba'ath regime?

But the bulk of those during the 1980's and 1991.

CJay said, "An invasion that also managed to kill as many Iraqi's in a year, so as to challenge Saddam's whole notorious career."

he didn't say anything about what happened before and after 1991. he sad "whole notorious career".

This is a hoary old tale.

no, it's quite well documented. from an article in one of your very own favorite papers:

"Sheik Yassim Jamasi said he was grateful for the $25,000 cheque he received from Saddam Hussein, but it did not change his attitude towards the Iraqi president.

Along with the money, the old man yesterday received a certificate from President Saddam in recognition of his son's futile suicide attack on an Israeli gunboat."

"The money is allocated on a sliding scale: $25,000 to the families of suicide bombers; $10,000 to fighters killed resisting the Israelis; $1,000 for a battle injury and $5,000 in compensation for a demolished home.

Yesterday, there were 23 families on hand to take President Saddam's money. Those honoured included a Palestinian policeman and a host of young men who sought glory in a largely futile death."

"With each cheque, drawn on the Cairo Amman bank, came a large certificate decorated with the Iraqi and Palestinian flags. "A gift from President Saddam Hussein to the family of a martyr in the al-Aqsa intifada," the inscription read. "To those who irrigate the land with their blood. You deserve the honour you will receive from God and you will defeat all who bow before your will.""

http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,2763,912938,00.html

Source?

amnesty international


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InvisibleXlea321
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Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: Free Saddam! [Re: ]
    #3247306 - 10/12/04 02:57 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

do you believe that the death toll of the invasion is higher than the number of iraqis killed by the ba'ath regime?

No, but higher than the number Saddam was killing in recent years.

he didn't say anything about what happened before and after 1991. he sad "whole notorious career".

I thought he meant did Saddam ever kill more than 10-20,000 civilians in a single year?

no, it's quite well documented.

Christ mush, you had to pick and choose lines very carefully out of that article to back up your point didn't you.

No wonder you somehow managed to avoid including this paragraph:

Still, the Hamas fighter was the absent star of yesterday's gathering at the Gaza YMCA as the only suicide bomber to be honoured by President Saddam's envoys, who handed out $245,000 (?152,000) to the relatives of those who died recently in the intifada, or suffered other losses such as having their homes destroyed by Israeli forces.  

And:

But Sheik Jamasi, quietly spoken and mournful, withheld praise for his son's actions, and for President Saddam. He said his support was for the Iraqi people because he knows first-hand what they are suffering.

"I support the Iraqi people who stand against aggression," he said. "Everyone who is conscious should support the Iraqi people no matter who is their leader because it is the Iraqi people who are suffering. We honour principles; we don't worship individuals."

Yesterday, there were 23 families on hand to take President Saddam's money

Well done, you cleverly managed to avoid pointing out only one of those families had anything to do with a suicide bomber. Was it just carelessness mush?  :smirk:


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Don't worry, B. Caapi


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Anonymous

Re: Free Saddam! [Re: Xlea321]
    #3247403 - 10/12/04 03:17 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

I thought he meant did Saddam ever kill more than 10-20,000 civilians in a single year?

i'm pretty sure he actually meant "whole notorious career", not just one year of it. maybe he can clear it up.

to answer your question, yes.

"By our estimate, in Anfal at least 50,000 and possibly as many as 100,000 persons, many of them women and children, were killed out of hand between February and September 1988. Their deaths did not come in the heat of battle -- "collateral damage" in the military euphemism. Nor were they acts of aberration by individual commanders whose excesses passed unnoticed, or unpunished, by their superiors. Rather, these Kurds were systematically put to death in large numbers on the orders of the central government in Baghdad -- days, sometimes weeks, after being rounded-up in villages marked for destruction or else while fleeing from army assaults in "prohibited areas"."

Human Rights Watch

Christ mush, you had to pick and choose lines very carefully out of that article to back up your point didn't you.

i picked out that which was relevent. do the parts i left out contradict my claim? there is a link there for anyone who wishes to read the whole story. even after one reads every word of the full story from beginning to end, it still supports the fact that hussein was supplying compensation for terrorist attacks.


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Offlined33p
Welcome to Violence

Registered: 07/12/03
Posts: 5,381
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Re: Free Saddam! [Re: Xlea321]
    #3247643 - 10/12/04 04:49 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

First i would just like to express my great distaste for the british educational system. I really have no idea how your reading comprehension skills can be so terrible alex. Either that or you skip things and you purposely distort the meanings of what people say. Also you lie too damn much.

But anyway on topic i think saddam should be given the same treatment benito mussolini recieved from his countrymen.


--------------------
I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


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InvisibleVvellum
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Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 10,920
Re: Free Saddam! [Re: d33p]
    #3247665 - 10/12/04 04:59 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

what exactly is wrong with what alex is saying?


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