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 Joops
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Registered: 09/26/04
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 Need ideas for internal lighting 
#3241973 - 10/11/04 04:26 AM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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I am going to start doing a little growing. I have some mycobags to be delivered any time now and I will be casing a few bags in to a single case when they are ready to be done so.
I am going to try to keep this as concealed as possible within a large rubbermade container - I want to keep the lid on at all times except for fanning. I plan to fruit with the lid on as well.
I need ideas for lighting to put inside. I will be getting a 6 gallon or so container and want to run a light through the side, and then tape/glue the light to a side inside, so that they can get light without having to take off the lid.
My dilema is what lighting fixture? I thought christmas lights would be best but they are way too long strings for my container! What types of lighting have you all used to provide light in the sealed environment?
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 Sam1912
journeyman
Registered: 09/23/04
Posts: 2,142
Loc: Cali
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: Joops]
#3241979 - 10/11/04 04:35 AM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Here's a off the wall idea. Get a concave mirror like the one you put on your side mirrors of your car. stick it on the bottom of the lid. Get a $10 LED flash light(will last a long long time on each set of batteries.) anchor the flashlight under the mirror. Just make sure the water doesn't seep inside the flashlight. I don't think anyone talked about this before so you can search for other ideas, too.
Good luck
Sam
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discman1
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: Joops]
#3241997 - 10/11/04 04:51 AM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Here is my thread on the subject.
Link
I am finding that I do not need to vent the 10W light at all, it seems to keep my temperatures at 70 - 71?F all by itself. So I'm glad I didn't go cutting holes in my lid beforehand.
I'm going to be sticking my cakes in there later today.
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Sam1912
journeyman
Registered: 09/23/04
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: discman1]
#3242001 - 10/11/04 04:53 AM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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I remember that thread. I think everyone was telling you not to worry about the heat. I'm glad it worked out for ya.
Many Many Monster Mushie Wishies to you.
Sam
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Protect your civil rights! End drug prohibition. And if you don't care about your civil rights, protect mine!
If you want a rating from me, please PM me. For those really newbies, don't expect an answer back, but you can try me anyways.
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scatmanrav
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: Sam1912]
#3242523 - 10/11/04 10:45 AM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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I'm glad it worked out disc, I wasn't sure how it would.
I know you for sure can use LED's. Get the super bright blue ones..1-4 should be all thats needed depending on the side of your rubbermaid but generally 1 should work for a small one that fits like 6-8 cakes or a couple casings.
Nothing reflective would be needed but if you were to put up something reflective a mirror wouldn't be what I'd suggest. I'd put up tin foil (use the dull side) if anything. Mirrors waste energy by absorbing only a small fraction of the light that falls on them. When light, which, like radio waves, is a form of electromagnetic radiation, strikes a metallic mirror the electrons in the metal move just as they do when a radio signal strikes an antenna. Pushing electrons around takes energy, which dims the reflected image. Metallic mirrors reflect infrared light (heat) which could cause hots spots though it shouldn't be an issue with lighting this small (usually only is in plants with heavy duty lighting). I don't know if blue LEDs even have infrared light though... Well if so, it wouldn't be the right spectrum to reflect (oppisite side then mushies like).
That theory combines a little of plant and hot light information so might not be exactly right with blue LEDs and mushrooms but from what I know about them, tin foil would make a better reflector. Though I don't think one would be needed at all..superbright LED's are in fact, super AND bright..
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Sam1912
journeyman
Registered: 09/23/04
Posts: 2,142
Loc: Cali
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: scatmanrav]
#3242552 - 10/11/04 10:56 AM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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not to mention they last forever on a set of batteries and have very very low thermal effect. Long lasting=low power=low heat.
I just threw the concave mirror in there because it would be nice to make the mushroom point up instead of inward towards the light. You can actually drown the LED light and have it work after you dry out the inside. Just worried about corrosion of metals inside.
Whatever you choose, good luck.
Sam
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Protect your civil rights! End drug prohibition. And if you don't care about your civil rights, protect mine!
If you want a rating from me, please PM me. For those really newbies, don't expect an answer back, but you can try me anyways.
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Heffy
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: Sam1912]
#3242563 - 10/11/04 10:59 AM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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I used a bettery bowered reading light with rechargeable batteries. I ran it at night and recharged the batteries during the day.
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scatmanrav
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: Heffy]
#3242692 - 10/11/04 11:39 AM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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I actually didnt get what you meant Sam, I thought you were saying put a mirror on top and hang the light against the mirror to reflect the light more (they do this with plants, points more of the light and heat down..but not using mirrors). I thought you said LED too, didn't see the flashlight part...
What I meant was just attach the LED to the top of the chamber on the lid..the shrooms would grow up that way..
I also remembered them tap lights. Battery powered which kinda sucks because batteries (there are rechargable though a pain to change them still) and because you can't put them on a timer.
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discman1
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: scatmanrav]
#3242704 - 10/11/04 11:42 AM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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I was working on the LED idea in my head. I think it's a good idea.
But remember that all blue LEDs aren't the same. Also remember that pin initiation has distinct peaks at 370, 440 and 460nm.
I was thinking that if you bought a blank LED circuit board, you could buy a bunch of 370, 440 and 460nm LEDs and mount them in an array on the board and use that.
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Sam1912
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Posts: 2,142
Loc: Cali
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: discman1]
#3242732 - 10/11/04 11:55 AM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Most White light LEDs cover very wide range of colors. White means there has to be blue in it anyways...
If you want build one, you might as well just get and led to an hollowed out eraser just glue the sucker on the lid. You can use silicon to seal the spaces so it'd not be exposed to high humidity. Without the that concern, you can rig it to a DC adapter and timer it. You can probably get away with 10 leds on a large eraser. You can probably attach a small board to control blinking, if you want.(for those trippy nights)
I think LEDs are good. Too bad you can't use indiglo. Those work on few miliamps. Longer lasting batteries, you know...
Sam
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Protect your civil rights! End drug prohibition. And if you don't care about your civil rights, protect mine!
If you want a rating from me, please PM me. For those really newbies, don't expect an answer back, but you can try me anyways.
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scatmanrav
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: Sam1912]
#3242757 - 10/11/04 12:04 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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The super bright blues that my buddy recommends peak around the 420nm range giving them good light around that peak. White would most likly work but most blue LED's I've seen show them to be good in the correct range (I can't recall a blue one I would think wouldnt work so good).
If you mean those lights that are long tube lights that bend, I saw a grow on here where they worked (the blue one). I forgot about that too..they had it wrapped around the lid and attached..
What are these indiglos? Neon? Does neon (or these indiglos) put out UV's or something? If not I would imagine they could be used without a problem. If they have UV's they wouldn't be the best to use.
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Sam1912
journeyman
Registered: 09/23/04
Posts: 2,142
Loc: Cali
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: scatmanrav]
#3242774 - 10/11/04 12:09 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Neon would be terribly dangerous. It requires very high voltage. It's no good. Indiglo is the stuff on most watches now. Some night lights too. Very very slim profile and ultra low current and voltage. It's not really bright, but it's not that dark either. About the brightness of a 5w incandescent light bulb. It also comes in many colors.
Sam
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Protect your civil rights! End drug prohibition. And if you don't care about your civil rights, protect mine!
If you want a rating from me, please PM me. For those really newbies, don't expect an answer back, but you can try me anyways.
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Joops
Stranger
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: Joops]
#3242786 - 10/11/04 12:13 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Thanks for the ideas all. With the LED's, it sounds a little complicated. If I go to radio shack, what do I need to actually construct my own LED board?
If not too big I could put some on two ends of the casing which might help them grow more even
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Sam1912
journeyman
Registered: 09/23/04
Posts: 2,142
Loc: Cali
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: Joops]
#3242903 - 10/11/04 12:41 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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don't use a board. use an eraser. get some LEDs(white or blue) that works on 3 volts or less. get 2 slip couplers(just metal pieces where you can crimp wire on 1 side and then they mate with each other) crimp 2" wire(doesn't matter on guage, speaker wires will work just as well) on to the female of the coupler.
<led prep wiring>
1. Use pliers to crimp the female side to 1 of LED prongs. put little electrical tape(you only need to put tape on 1 of 2 prongs) over the connection.
2. Do the same with another wire then to other prong on LED.
3. Crimp the male ends to the wires.
<battery compartment>
5. Drill along heightwise on 1 eraser half way using 1/2" bit.
6. Drill a second indentation the same way right next to the first.
7. cut the portion containing the indentation to keep the rectangular form.
8. repeat to make a second rectangular eraser block the same way.
9. place the male ends in the first block 1 in each indentation.
10. carefully use a knife to cut out of the indentation so you can put the wires through the cut out of the eraser.
11. on the second eraser, place a small piece of paper through the middle so it lays along the middle of the 2 indentations. You can secure it to the eraser by using staple or just bend the clips on the ends and pressing in.
<led construction>
12. Drill a hole straight through the second eraser lengthwise.
13. Put the LED through the eraser until it pokes out. Use some silicon sealant(I'd use glue gun) to seal both sides of the hole.
<cosmetics>
14. Glue the wired part of the battery eraser to the LED eraser.
15. Put some batteries in, then cap them with the paper clipped eraser. If light doesn't come on, you need to flip the batteries.
16. Mark polarity with + and - on the wired eraser.
17. Use sharpie markers to make drawing on the erasers
18. You can put some velcro on the led eraser and the lid so you can stick it.
how to operate- to turn off, pull the paper clipped eraser off just a tad. to turn on, squeeze the erasers.
If you decide to use the circuit board, you'll need to solder and will need switches, separate battery compartment and all that ugliness. It won't look much better either, unless you can mold a plastic casing for the rig.
My 2 cents
Sam
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Protect your civil rights! End drug prohibition. And if you don't care about your civil rights, protect mine!
If you want a rating from me, please PM me. For those really newbies, don't expect an answer back, but you can try me anyways.
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zerozero
Stranger
Registered: 08/31/04
Posts: 782
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: Sam1912]
#3243104 - 10/11/04 01:18 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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yo sm1912 neon is not terribly dangerous!
ive worked with neon for years and it is as safe as anything hooked up to electricity.
in fact you can submerge neon tubing( not the electrodes of course) under water to give your fish tank a totally cool look, the fish dont mind either. my boss had a tank like this for over ten years,
also next time you are at a fast food place or a bar check out the neon on the outside of the building, its exposed!!
not dangerous unless you grab both of the electrodes, or stand in water and touch, but that goes for all electronic devices.
you were correct they use a higher power than most things and you can get a nasty burn/shock from the transformer, but only if you arent being careful.
i also agree that your led idea is best, but if the led board fell into the tub it would be as dangerous as neon.
neon tube comes in different wavelenghts, and it can be bent to fit very custom grow chambers, a small neon tube could be bought ( custom made ) for just 25 or so, and a transformer is about that.
local sign shops would be happy to help you make or even troubleshoot little custom jobs like that (led or neon), and if someone tells you that a six inch neon tube isnt worth their effort then you dont want them doing it anyway.
the reason on should use leds are they are a hell of a lot cheaper than neon, and take less power, and i think a bit cooler in temp., im just oldschool, guess thats why i still use/like neon so much. 
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scatmanrav
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: Sam1912]
#3243114 - 10/11/04 01:20 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Edit:
I am refering to indiglo here in the following paragraph, not neons.
----
Hmmm if its what I'm thinking about it works ok. I picked up a few nite lights that don't have bulbs to replace and just have a small flat blue panel that glows blue from home depot. I threw two of them over a PMP I had running before that was under my bed. They worked. It's possible light squeezed in just from the room (its not pitch black under a bed of course, but pretty black) but the pod produced mushrooms with this light. I can't say it worked well because the pod was only used for mini casings and possible contamed casings, never large healthy casings so I don't know if it would be enough to give you a nice pinset but it was enough to iniate pinning and make the shrooms grow up. I'm not positive if they were indiglo or not and the setup is no longer here.
Edited by scatmanrav (10/11/04 01:38 PM)
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Sam1912
journeyman
Registered: 09/23/04
Posts: 2,142
Loc: Cali
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: zerozero]
#3243160 - 10/11/04 01:28 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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I stand corrected. I'm just worried about high voltage when it comes to using in high humidity environment where condensation is a norm. Sealing up 2 batteries would be so much safer than dealing with 300+ volts. Even if they drop in the water, 1 it's pretty well sealed, 2 the batteries won't have you getting an EKG done the next day. And I agree with you, if you can get a custom job done by a pro, that'll be great. But IMO none of us would ask for advice on going out and hiring a pro for.
Oh, there are some really nice cathod lights you can get that runs on lower voltage. Still... transformers=high voltage. But it can be done safely.
Sam
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Protect your civil rights! End drug prohibition. And if you don't care about your civil rights, protect mine!
If you want a rating from me, please PM me. For those really newbies, don't expect an answer back, but you can try me anyways.
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zerozero
Stranger
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: Sam1912]
#3243748 - 10/11/04 03:28 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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i figured id tell people that they could go to a shop and ask for help, people might not have realized that. i meant that a neon/led sign shop could be a great resource, not just buying things, but info on how things work or where to by cheap materials locally. also sign shop sometimes have sales on old stuff and you can pick up little tubes and old signs cheap, sometimes free. sorry dude i thought you were talking about a led that was plugged in, i must have skipped your line about batteries, duh. i will try to find a pic of the aquarium with the neon tube submerged in it.
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seatrip
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: zerozero]
#3243821 - 10/11/04 03:45 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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i like those round tube florescent that have a little wire that plugs in to a screw in fixture "sold separately" the ballast is on the screw in thing ,lenghten the 2 little wires or have them normal coming through the lid and plugged in so all you have in the tub is the bulb.they come in big square shapes and others too.
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morian
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: seatrip]
#3244659 - 10/11/04 07:22 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Blue LEDS work great and they aren't too complicated
Johnny made his own but he didn't use PCB board because it doesn't come in long enough pieces so here's what to do:
1. Buy this really cool slug repellant copper tape from a garden store (Its about 2 inches wide and slugs apparently won't cross copper. Google "Snail Copper Barrier Tape" if you don't believe me)
2.Get some 1/8" MDF from the hardware store
3. Use the copper tape to make traces on the MDF (Johnny did 5 LEDs in parallel and used a single 100 Ohm resistor to limit current and then a couple leads)
4. Drill holes for all of the components using a very very small drill bit (just big enough for the leads to pass through
5. Push the components through from the MDF side and solder them on the copper side.
6. Put the whole strip of LEDs into a square plastic tube and suspend from the top of the Rubbermaid (or whatever)
7. Hook the light up to one of those DC transformers from some piece of expired electronics (or buy one at a thrift store for 1$ or use a battery, your choice)
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Super_Blunt
Candyman
Registered: 10/25/04
Posts: 3,140
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: morian]
#3318089 - 11/04/04 12:07 AM (19 years, 5 months ago) |
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using mirrors to reflect light is not effective everyone.
it eats most of the light doesnt reflect very well.
Mylar is the most effective reflecting material with 90-95% reflectivity I believe. Although expensive, your best bet.
2ndly you can coat your grow room / box walls with shiny latex white paint which is very reflective as well.
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scatmanrav
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: Super_Blunt]
#3318398 - 11/04/04 02:04 AM (19 years, 5 months ago) |
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Had you read the posts you would have seen that I have already addressed this and said that unlike with plants, shrooms should not have reflective sides. Shrooms arent photosynthetic and only need it to tell them to pin and to tell them which way is up. If you put foil on the sides they won't know which way is up (light comming from all around). Even foil behind the light is unneeded as mushrooms only need a small amount of light (like 15 watts).
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Sam1912
journeyman
Registered: 09/23/04
Posts: 2,142
Loc: Cali
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: scatmanrav]
#3318458 - 11/04/04 02:26 AM (19 years, 5 months ago) |
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sorry.. just to have to set this straight. Mirror is the best reflective item you'll find anywhere. Silver clad mirrors are used for high power lasers all the time, because of low attenuation. "Absorbed light means heat and heat means a damage in laser world. Most light attenuation is not from the reflection, but refraction. Keep your glass clean and angle high.
On.. on another note... You don't need a lot of lights for mushrooms, so if you find a need for a mirror(as Scatmanrav said, no need for mirrors in mushroom grow), you don't need to pay premium for fancy stuff. I can think of 1 use for it, but I'll keep that to myself. 
Sam
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Protect your civil rights! End drug prohibition. And if you don't care about your civil rights, protect mine!
If you want a rating from me, please PM me. For those really newbies, don't expect an answer back, but you can try me anyways.
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scatmanrav
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: Sam1912]
#3319068 - 11/04/04 09:23 AM (19 years, 5 months ago) |
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Nothing I have ever found has said that mirrors are the best reflective surface for light for growing things. The person above obviously has at least a little basics in plant growing and thats where the info was comming from. Theres a reason EVERYONE in plants will tell you not to use mirrors that tin foil is better and even better is mylar or flat white paint.
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call_me_kido
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: scatmanrav]
#3319310 - 11/04/04 10:26 AM (19 years, 5 months ago) |
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Is it possible for me to simply use a fishtank light, the kind thats long and come in a hooded casing and construct it into my fruiting chamber?
Kido
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"If we knew what it was we were doing, it would not be called research, would it?"
- Albert Einstein (1875-1955)
"A is A" -Aristotle
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george castanza
Lord Of The Idiots!
Registered: 10/21/02
Posts: 8,759
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: call_me_kido]
#3319360 - 11/04/04 10:48 AM (19 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
call_me_kido said:
Is it possible for me to simply use a fishtank light, the kind thats long and come in a hooded casing and construct it into my fruiting chamber?
Kido
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KRAMER CAKES
  
 
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Bundo
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: Joops]
#3319572 - 11/04/04 11:53 AM (19 years, 5 months ago) |
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I got a closet fluorescent lamp at wal-mart for like $6 plus another $6 for a special replacement 15W tube, it's GE Sunshine full spectrum light, and it says it simulates a noonday summer sun. It's been working well inside there, and it also takes the fishtank marine spectrum tubes if you choose, but the sunshine works fine and I think it was cheaper (though really I bought the sunshine because I didn't want to walk all the way back to the pet section). Oh yeah, it plugs into a wall outlet with the included cord and has a slider switch so you can leave it on and control with the outlet. It comes with a normal tube which would probably work, but I figured more natural would be even better.
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discman1
journeyman
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Re: Need ideas for internal lighting [Re: Bundo]
#3319629 - 11/04/04 12:08 PM (19 years, 5 months ago) |
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I've posted it lots before, but I may as well do it again..
I pondered the light question for a very long time also, and this is what I finally arrived at. I'm really into optimums, so when searching for a light source I was always keeping the response to 360, 440 and 460nm wavelengths in mind.
10 Watts. Compact. 5$ at Wal-Mart. High spectral energy output between 350 and 500nm.
It also has an excellent Color Rendering Index, so you get to see your babies in their truest colors! 
What more could you possibly ask for?!  
Oh, as for the internal part of it, I have the bulb in this fixture...
...which is mounted in my tub. Which I don't have any pictures of and my camera's batteries are charging..  This is how I had it for the first several weeks until I got un-lazy and mounted it.. Just sitting on an old bowl.. lol.
I'll update this post/thread this evening at work(Graveyard). Bedtime!
Edited by discman1 (11/04/04 12:22 PM)
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