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Offlineunbeliever
Yo Daddy!
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Registered: 05/22/04
Posts: 5,158
Loc: Gallifrey
Last seen: 15 years, 20 days
Re: Non-debatable points about Bush's term [Re: hound]
    #3221384 - 10/06/04 12:27 AM (19 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

hound said:
Quote:

Swami said:


2. Oil prices at all-time high.






I don't know how you can blame that one on Bush. Worldwide demand for crude oil has increased dramaticaly, especialy in China. There has problems with the supply side with attacks on pipelines and the perception that these acts will happen again. And don't forget about the effects that Yukos (sic) the Russian company has had on the markets.




I think what people are forgetting is that what any president SHOULD have done in response to what you have just described is to put more money into alternative fuel research, instead of just giving more tax breaks and crap to the oil industry.


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Happiness is a warm gun...

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Offlinehound
newbie
Registered: 09/08/04
Posts: 154
Loc: NAPTOWN
Last seen: 19 years, 5 months
Re: Non-debatable points about Bush's term [Re: unbeliever]
    #3221423 - 10/06/04 12:49 AM (19 years, 5 months ago)

I'm totaly with you on that one. If fossil fuels are a finite resource then we need to start looking for alternative energy sources while we still have a chance.

Take Hydrogen for example. I hear the critics say that it will never be able to replace our dependence on oil. I'm always leary when I hear the word never, but I'll take them at their word and reply with so what. Even many of the critics will achnowledge that even in the short term it could replace 10-15% of our dependence on oil and that is a step in the right direction. And if solar energy can replace another 5 %, now we are 20% less dependent on oil then we would have been.

We need to do something about it now because one day the oil will all be gone.

I think that harnessing the earths own magnetic forces could show some real promise in the future.

I might be wrong; but wasn't the first internal combustion engine designed to run, and did so, on vegatable plant oil ?

Edited by hound (10/06/04 12:51 AM)

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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Non-debatable points about Bush's term [Re: hound]
    #3221964 - 10/06/04 09:17 AM (19 years, 5 months ago)

The first diesel engine developed by Rudolph Diesel in the late 1800s ran on vegetable oil. Supporting our farmers instead of the Saudis - that would be unpatriotic.


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The proof is in the pudding.

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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Non-debatable points about Bush's term [Re: hound]
    #3222280 - 10/06/04 11:02 AM (19 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

hound said:
Take Hydrogen for example. I hear the critics say that it will never be able to replace our dependence on oil.



You need a source of energy to get hydrogen from some compound(s) before it can be used as a fuel. What source of energy will be used? TANSTAFL.


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To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Non-debatable points about Bush's term [Re: Swami]
    #3222353 - 10/06/04 11:22 AM (19 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
The first diesel engine developed by Rudolph Diesel in the late 1800s ran on vegetable oil. Supporting our farmers instead of the Saudis - that would be unpatriotic.



Unfortunately, the cost incentives still work to the advantage of petroleum. But if the oil companies had to pay for the protection of their operations in foreign lands directly out of pocket and had to grease the palms of oil producing nations directly out of pocket so consumers were to see the TRUE cost of petroleum products, this might change. As long as we have a government which is corporatist and not supportive of a true free market, the average person will continue to be forced to pay for the benefits of the well connected with their taxes, diminished choices in energy sources, the degradation of the environment and the lives of their countrymen.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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