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OfflineTao
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Japan: A model for foreign policy?
    #3199093 - 09/30/04 09:04 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I recently learned that Japan actually has it in their constitution that they are not allowed to deploy troops overseas. This made me start thinking about the similarities between Japan and the U.S.: A pervasive culture both economically with exports and culturally; certainly Japan has its share of heathen society (Asian porn and bukake anyone?) like the U.S.; it also has plenty of freedom and democracy which I've been told by our President is the reason terrorists want to attack us. Also, of course, they are not an islamic culture. Yet unlike the U.S., Japan has not been the target of foreign terrorists (the poison gas attacks in the subway tunnels a few years back were carried out by a Japanese cult if memory serves correctly). So the question is this: Is Japan a model of what we should do in the U.S., and if so, would it be a wise idea to go so far as to add something to this effect to our own Constitution? I see it as the opposite route of Mutually Assured Destruction, assuring other countries that we will not attack them--we would need a Constitutional amendment to do so, so do not attack us.

[as a side note, Japan has interpreted this part of their constitution to exclude tactics of self-defense to the point where they actually sent their first group into a foreign land since WWII, into Iraq--a whopping 30 troops if the source I read was accurate].


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: Tao]
    #3199161 - 09/30/04 09:55 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Japan can do this because they have a superpower that will protect them if any other country tries to mess with them.


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OfflineRonoS
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Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: Seuss]
    #3199351 - 09/30/04 11:34 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Is this the same super-power that can't seem to protect itself?


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"Life has never been weird enough for my liking"


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: Rono]
    #3199479 - 09/30/04 12:22 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

> Is this the same super-power that can't seem to protect itself?

Yeah... 'cause they are too damn busy policing their moral neo-con policies in other countries...


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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: Tao]
    #3199507 - 09/30/04 12:33 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

I recently learned that Japan actually has it in their constitution that they are not allowed to deploy troops overseas.




a 1 million dollar prize to anyone who can guess WHY they have this in their constitution. Hint: had something to do with a particular world war.


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America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


Edited by Innvertigo (09/30/04 03:27 PM)


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Invisibleafoaf
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Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: Innvertigo]
    #3199551 - 09/30/04 12:47 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

arigato ms enola gay.


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Anonymous

Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: Tao]
    #3199567 - 09/30/04 12:50 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

So the question is this: Is Japan a model of what we should do in the U.S., and if so, would it be a wise idea to go so far as to add something to this effect to our own Constitution?

most of what you seem to be opposed to here is already unconstitutional.

:shrug:


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: ]
    #3199654 - 09/30/04 01:10 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

> most of what you seem to be opposed to here is already unconstitutional.

*laugh* Give the man a prize! (I agree 100% with you, not trying to be an ass here...)


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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: afoaf]
    #3200135 - 09/30/04 03:43 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

arigato ms enola gay.




Correctomundo!!!

Since memory is very short noeadays, Japan invaded china killing tens of thousands in cold blood and many more within the asian community all the way down to Papua New Guinea and accross to Hawaii. They didn't put this into their constitution because they tahought it was always the right thing to do, rather they figured since two big ass bombs were dropped on them for these crimes it would probably make sense to outlaw it since they got their asses handed to them for it. Also I believe much of what is in that constituition stems from the surrender agreements they signed (limited military etc).

AFOAF wins the million dollars and he will recieve it like promissed:



--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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Offlined33p
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Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: Tao]
    #3200246 - 09/30/04 04:09 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Who wrote the japanese constitution? I was under the impression that it was written by Americans after WWII.


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OfflineTao
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Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: Innvertigo]
    #3201223 - 09/30/04 08:58 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

No shit sherlock, obviously it was from WWII (do you really think knowing this is a sign of high intelligence--i figured it was implicit and didnt need to be explicitly pointed out). my point wasn't that Japan is some hallowed nation whose noble and benevolent policies should be admired and copied, my point was that this policy which they happened to come into due to stupid facist actions on their part, has appeared to turn into a sound policy judging from their lack of terrorist attacks. my question is therefore, is it smart to go so far as to not only make this a general policy but an actual part of one's constitution.


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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: Tao]
    #3203055 - 10/01/04 07:23 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

No shit sherlock, obviously it was from WWII (do you really think knowing this is a sign of high intelligence--i




it's common knowledge that they did it because they got their ass kicked, they didn't do it because they were the bastion of good will. I was stating the obvious since many here don't get it.

Quote:

my question is therefore, is it smart to go so far as to not only make this a general policy but an actual part of one's constitution.




no, not at all. As people have said already that they can do this because we will protect them. It may work for Japan but who will protect the US from attack if they were to implement this? The UN?


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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Invisibleafoaf
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Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: Innvertigo]
    #3203474 - 10/01/04 12:05 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

they didn't just get hit by 2 A bombs...

we had already fire bombed every major city
in japan.

temples make good tinder


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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: afoaf]
    #3203491 - 10/01/04 12:11 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I was cutting to the chase.

The implication that this was inserted into their constitution because they are a model society is humorous.


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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OfflineTao
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Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: Innvertigo]
    #3203536 - 10/01/04 12:32 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

The implication that this was inserted into their constitution because they are a model society is humorous.





who the fuck made this assertion??


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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: Tao]
    #3203553 - 10/01/04 12:37 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Perhaps i'm mistaken but that's what I got out of your original post. If I am then I apologize. With that said I don't want that in my constitution. It is rather cerimonial since it has a HUGE loophole in it. Define self defense?


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America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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OfflineTao
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Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: Innvertigo]
    #3203578 - 10/01/04 12:47 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

My point isn't that Japan had noble intentions when they made this part of their constitution, but rather that they fell into such a policy by chance but it seems to have worked out well for them and perhaps it is a policy that others should consider implementing.

International relations theories hold pretty steady that for a variety of reasons, democracies don't attack democracies, thus the only people we are worried about are 3rd world nations. now why would a 3rd world nation attack us? They aren't going to actually beat us and steal land or posessions from us, the only point in attacking us would be to strike back for something we've done to them like a bee sacrificing its life just to sting someone. thus i believe such a policy would be an effective way to avoid more attacks from the 3rd world. we've seen how easy it is to convince ourselves that we need to deploy troops to defend ourselves against a threat that has not yet actually attacked us (vietnam, korea, iraq).


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OfflineSkikid16
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Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: afoaf]
    #3203579 - 10/01/04 12:48 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

temples make good tinder


Wooden homes and paper walls don't seem like such a good idea now, eh????


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InvisibleEvolving
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Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: Tao]
    #3203645 - 10/01/04 01:06 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

If people have a problem with the Japanese model, let's consider the Swiss model.


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To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.


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Invisibleafoaf
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Re: Japan: A model for foreign policy? [Re: Skikid16]
    #3203657 - 10/01/04 01:09 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I'm developing a shoji screen made entirely out of asbestos.


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