Home | Community | Message Board

Cannabis Seeds - Original Sensible Seeds
This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: North Spore Boomr Bag   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Extract   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   MagicBag.co All-In-One Bags That Don't Suck   Mushroom-Hut Mono Tub Substrate   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   PhytoExtractum Maeng Da Thai Kratom Leaf Powder   Myyco.com Golden Teacher Liquid Culture For Sale

Jump to first unread post Pages: < Back | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | Next >  [ show all ]
Some of these posts are very old and might contain outdated information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
InvisibleCJay
Dark Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 02/02/04
Posts: 931
Loc: Riding a bassline
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: Tag_Number]
    #3313353 - 11/03/04 08:38 AM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Entirely - they could form some huge intergalactic network that holds faster than light and unbounded communications access all areas, as well as forming a hyper information storage system for the galactic web of life.

A kind of library and phone booth rolled into one with access to the DNA master (memory) storage banks as well as that of each individual being - and possibly further into 'non-organic' memory and 'spirit'.

Certainly a well of experience and insight beyond measure.

The psiloc(yb)in might have been 'injected' into our local ecosystem and the comms ariel it produces might have been relaying back to the galactic hub of life since its beginning here - so that tabs can be kept on the progress of another newly evolving world.

Spores may have slowly drifted on the solar winds to our world where the radar sent back 'images' of another child ecosystem and species coming into being.

Or perhaps a probe or some such brought it, (perhaps along with the seeds of life themselves)......and now the senders await our coming of age and the fusing/opening of consciousness that will lead us into galactic society membership.

Then again - maybe it's all a crazy fluke and we are (unlikely as it seems one of) the only planet(s) in the entire galaxy with biology - maybe we are the first, and luckily we have this little fungal friend to help us know ourselves.

Maybe we will be the ones who end up seeding other fledgling ecosystems around the galaxy in some future when we have mastered space.

Maybe both - in the sense of a cycle of the spreading of conscious life.

Certainly no matter what the story is, this species provides an access to higher and broader consciousness.

And whatever the: how, when, and why - a true friend to us this species has become, without doubt. :sun:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineTag_Number
Experience
Registered: 10/06/04
Posts: 154
Loc: Soma dreaming itself
Last seen: 19 years, 4 months
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: CJay]
    #3315791 - 11/03/04 04:02 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Eating of the Hyperfungi is some way to unveil things as they are.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePinback
Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 07/20/02
Posts: 836
Loc: Europe
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: shirley knott]
    #3319491 - 11/04/04 11:28 AM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

shirley knott said:
or psilocybin may be a natural growth hormone (auxin)




This is quite interesting. Psilocin is similar to auxin in structure, and is found of the highest concentrations in the fruit bodies, meaning it could be a signal to start reproductive growth. One can of course make many objections to this (structural similarity is probably coincidental because fungi and plants are very different, why there is a high conc. of psilocin/psilocybin in sclerotia, most fungi don't have it, etc), but still, it is an interesting thought.

Some other posters in this thread should probably use less drugs and/or post their thoughts in the philosophy forum.  :wink:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineTripster
200+ trips wise

Registered: 10/10/04
Posts: 275
Last seen: 17 years, 6 months
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: Pinback]
    #3330896 - 11/07/04 06:57 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

I think it's a deterent. The defense mechanism isn't set up to save that mushroom in particular, it's set up to save the species in the future. That's why it works even though it takes so long to kick in. No animal short of humans would have the mental capacity to take a "trip" and therefore it would not be a pleasant experience they would want to repeat.


--------------------
You've raped! I feel dirty
It hurt! As a child
Tied down! That's a good boy
And fucked! Your own child
I scream! No one hears me
It hurt! I'm not a liar
My God! Saw you watching
Mommy why?! Your own child -Korn

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinedanlennon3
LivingIsEasyWithEyesClosed.....
Male User Gallery

Registered: 10/29/02
Posts: 19,246
Loc: usa Flag
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: Tripster]
    #3331787 - 11/07/04 11:25 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

one night we blew endless amounts of hits to this big spider as it was making the web but the thc did not effect its webmaking abilities


--------------------
"Psychedelics should be used not to escape reality, but to embrace it"


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinepshawny
Mycobian
Male

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 09/11/04
Posts: 1,332
Loc: Shroomery
Last seen: 15 years, 1 month
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: danlennon3]
    #3344502 - 11/10/04 11:21 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Psilocybin could have been used by an ancient animal/insect/amphibian. Say it, whatever it might have been, ate the mushrooms and converted or stored the poison to use for it's own defense.


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinelesstutrey
All Weather Associate
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/24/04
Posts: 495
Loc: Chicagoland
Last seen: 9 years, 6 months
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: pshawny]
    #3350096 - 11/12/04 03:09 AM (19 years, 4 months ago)

we forget that billions of years ago the earth was much different. Even the make up the soil, etc. It seems to me that psilocybin could of at one point been used as a method of defense against environment(or possibly a way to bind to nutrients its needs), and as it did little harm to the organism mearly stayed with us for milllions of years. Perhaps at one time all mushrooms produced psilocybin and the cubes and various other speices are mearly behind the tide of evolution like a cockroach, horseshoe crab or cockroach..

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineCap_tianG
Stranger
Registered: 11/12/04
Posts: 1
Last seen: 19 years, 1 month
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: lesstutrey]
    #3351095 - 11/12/04 10:52 AM (19 years, 4 months ago)

It is not obvious to assume its a def fence system for the mushroom. It is more likely in my opinion to be developed as a predecessor of more complex function of the reproductive traits of this species. It was recently learned that Fungi is more closely linked to animals than it is to plants as previously thought. Is it possible that if given enough time a fungi would develop more of a sentient? And when i mean enough time i mean BILLIONS of years? as stated it is near the same chemicals used in brain functions in many animal species. It has to be a bi-product of some other function... to create this, you need this, and this is a result an unused chemical? with no way to expel it, maybe the fruit of the mycelium is doing more than simply reproducing.

OR>>> could it be a positive function for survival? Humans have developed a nurturing relationship with psycho active fungi. They have been referred too as God's Flesh by some cultures. All of us here know its very powerful tool when used correctly. Some research has shown it to be connected with first speech patterns in humans, causing the brain to function more openly, or like a TURBO for a growing evolution. Who knows but a great question!!

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineTag_Number
Experience
Registered: 10/06/04
Posts: 154
Loc: Soma dreaming itself
Last seen: 19 years, 4 months
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: Cap_tianG]
    #3362806 - 11/15/04 03:43 AM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Cap_tianG said:
Some research has shown it to be connected with first speech patterns in humans, causing the brain to function more openly, or like a TURBO for a growing evolution. Who knows but a great question!!




I think psiloc(by)in can alter human evolution as these compounds effect by reacting with DNA, generation after generation.

As serotonin (5-HT) makes that neurotransmitter more frequently firing, if such chemical is high enough ratios in the blood and neurotransmitter sites can create more data input (feed).

As the senses dilate. The aperture of the pupil dilates.
More light (photons) is translated within the brain producing the sense of depth, color and shape.

You are creating a full-blown experience by rising such neurotransmitter sites via senses. This is done with psiloc(yb)in.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblemrnobody998877
Stranger
Registered: 09/01/04
Posts: 8
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: Tag_Number]
    #3364795 - 11/15/04 03:44 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

>I think psiloc(by)in can alter human evolution as these compounds >effect by reacting with DNA, generation after generation.

hmm...

which DNA you mean,
i think you dont mean the DNA in the "normal" body cells, cause this wont be given to the next generation and chemicals which force mutations in this cells lead (in most cases)to cancer, when there is too much contact.....

so you mean the DNA in the special cells wich divide to be given to the next generation.....
so dont forget that the most mutations will follow in missbuilding including early death or other main body/mind complications....

so do you see this in the groups of psylocibinusing groups ? i believe not, cause the should have cancer and / or missbuilded childs....and maybe one out of billions which have a mutation maybe be cleverer or have some other "advantages", but there should also be a lot of missbuilded childs.....

or do you see something special in the chemical structure which would force "intelligent" mutations ? i would not say that it is 100% impossible that some day maybe we find out there is one molecule which can do it,
but do you really believe in ?

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleshroomydan
exshroomerite
 User Gallery

Registered: 07/04/04
Posts: 4,126
Loc: In the woods
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: absolute zero]
    #3366509 - 11/15/04 09:23 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Someone said that psilocybin has existed in mushrooms for millions of years, and therefore is not a co-evolutionary factor aimed at man. Do we know this to be true?

No doubt the mushrooms existed, but how could we possibly know that they were active? Have some of them been found frozen in a glacier and tested for psilocybin?

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblemrnobody998877
Stranger
Registered: 09/01/04
Posts: 8
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: shroomydan]
    #3369611 - 11/16/04 03:56 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

as i said its really really rare (i dont even know one) in nature that a chemical compound develops convergently, which means not at two places or two times, so i think, because some really different shrooms from different familys have this compound means their "motherspeci" must have had it, i dont know how old cubensis is thought to be, but i would bet its a lot older than human maybe even than the Mammalia class itself (Mammals), cause the class basidomycetes ("higher shrooms") are ca. as old as the first other "land plants" .....

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinebigslick
science fictionwriter

Registered: 02/16/02
Posts: 186
Loc: just behind you
Last seen: 11 years, 6 months
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: mrnobody998877]
    #3373015 - 11/17/04 07:08 AM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Me thinks the shrooms produce the magic as a deterrent to certain animals...

Ever since I started growing shrooms my wifes little yorki luved the smell of the mushrooms. If I was sitting on the couch with a bag of shrooms in my pocket she would try to get them. I thought it was kinda funny but no way would I puposely feed the dog shrooms. One night while enjoying a movie on a mild trip my wife comes downstairs and asks if she can have some shrooms. So I go upstairs get some shrooms to weigh out a dose for my wife. After I give my wife the shrooms she requested I go to put the remaining shrooms back in a big ziplock and suddenly one big hawaiin cap breaks off a stem and falls to the floor. Quicker than shit that yorki grabs that cap runs under the bed and eats it. Whithin an hour the dog goes nuts my wife is worried sick the dog might die and I'm kinda pissed cause this is not my fault (and I know the dog won't die). My wife holds her freaked out dog for a couple of hours then I take over and hold it. Its wigged out, but I think my much less worried demeanor calms the dog. The dog starts breathiing more normaly while I watch T.V. The dog fully recovered and seems good as new but she aint crazy over the smell of shrooms anymore. I'm sorry the dog went through this and I have taken steps to insure it won't happen again.

Feeding canines cubies:

chance that dog will die = very low

chance dog won't enjoy effects = very high


--------------------


Everything I write is a total work of fiction

Edited by bigslick (11/17/04 07:16 AM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineIndiaShroomer
Stranger
Registered: 08/27/04
Posts: 5
Last seen: 19 years, 2 months
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: shroomydan]
    #3377167 - 11/17/04 11:31 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Well then, though this is a one of case; mammalian deterrant sounds good to me.

got me thinking...why have a chemical that affects the brain? why not one that just kills the damn mammal? some fungi did come up with that!

basidomycetes evolved before mammals
so basidomycetes were around, then the first mammals turned up, they nibbled the fungi, fungi responded, how?

what is now psilo bearing fungi evovles response:
as organochemical response.
The mammal around that time are pretty basic, with basic (primitive brains), so the fungi came up with a chemical to act on it.
http://www.healing-arts.org/n-r-limbic.htm
http://www.channel4.com/science/microsites/B/bodystory/brave_primative.html

what chemical to act on?
fungi chooses to directly act on the neurotransmitter. (why, i have no clue? :smile:

why neurotransmitters?
neurotransmitters are older than the brain
http://www.nyu.edu/classes/azmitia/lectures/lecture07/transmitters.html

The brain at that time was probably only a basic mammalian brain, so the neurotransmitter might have been serotonin)
neurotransmitter = serotonin
psilocybin = serotonin anologue (kind of :smile:

serotonin = action on hypothalamus (in addition to several others, but we are looking at the deterrance aspect only)

"psilo-alkaloids inhibit serotonin production by the hypothalamus"
http://www.hoboes.com/html/Politics/Prohibition/Notes/Mushroom_Cultivation.html

we know, hypothalamus controls instincts, emotions, drives, keeping body conditions constant

explore the brain:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/humanbody/body/interactives/organs/brainmap/index.shtml

any mammal consumes fungi = screws the hypothalamus, gets a very uncomforable experience.
no mammal would want that again.
The other effects, the psychedelic effects would only be enjoyable to a human (some anyway)

slightly off track, if the neurotransmitter 'serotonin' has remained unchanged over mammalian evolution, psilocybin might well be that old, if not older.

funny thing, though the fungi and the mammals evolved, this chemical deterrant need not change.
Why? to eat this fungi succesfully (withot uncomfortable experiences) the mammal would have to evolve a completely new neurotransmitter type, one that is unlike serotonin. would evolution allow that?

The fungi just came up with one chemical that addresses a chemical component in the mammalian brain that the mammal cant just do without. and since the neurotransmitter isnt changing ever, psilocybin/psilocin never need change either.

Kind of like the ultimate deterrant, you poor mammals can evolve anyway you like... you will never be eating me!

I can now also directly relate to the uncomfortable body feelings when I trip. it's just the fungus telling me, you stupid mammal... dont try me again.
but we humans never listen do we!?

now, some questions:
why did only some species of basidomycetes develop effective deterants?
what would the exact mechanism of the development of psilocybin/psilocin in the fungus from an evolutionary standpoint?
would there have been other types of chemical deterrants that fungi adopted? did only a few that address neurotransmitters survive?
were there species way back in time that tried deterrants based on maybe Acetylcholine, Dopamine or epinephrine... (since these are just as old as serotonin)?

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineIndiaShroomer
Stranger
Registered: 08/27/04
Posts: 5
Last seen: 19 years, 2 months
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: IndiaShroomer]
    #3401527 - 11/24/04 12:12 AM (19 years, 4 months ago)

bumped... curious about opinions on the board

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDarkie
Bitches n hoes dont mean a thing
 User Gallery

Registered: 01/22/05
Posts: 216
Last seen: 11 years, 7 months
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: IndiaShroomer]
    #3817271 - 02/22/05 02:41 PM (19 years, 1 month ago)

Personally i think they came from another planet because they do not much look like anything from this one. Are there any other....like molds....or something, that produce cacphores like mushrooms do? I mean, they aren't plants (right? or am i wrong?) and they arent animal...they are from another planet then. So however they got here, they were evolved(made?) on another planet so there is a good chance we can't even explain or imagen why they produce the Magic.

A lil bit more down to earth explaination is it is a biproduct of some kind of metabolism in the mushroom because it just attaches the 4-ho to the tryptamine...or something like that.

It could even be happening by accident! Maybe just because of how mushrooms are they absorb what they do from the soil and then maybe what happens just happens....ok that makes me sound dumb
THINK OF IT THIS WAY. If there is a lil sugar in your gastank it turns to carbon (or caramel) in your engine. Now imagen that the carbon is psilocybin. Although it has nothing to do with your car, it just happens cause it is in the food(gas/soil/cow dung). Ok, THAT is my final answer....or maybe it was aliens


--------------------
You gotta wake up to get faded but you gotta get up to get paided.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDarkie
Bitches n hoes dont mean a thing
 User Gallery

Registered: 01/22/05
Posts: 216
Last seen: 11 years, 7 months
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: Darkie]
    #3817290 - 02/22/05 02:44 PM (19 years, 1 month ago)

OH another thought (sorry double post). If animals eating them may or may NOT be adverse to the dispersal of the species, then there should not be any deterant at all to animals eating them. Infact, some have already argued that it may be an attractant. So if there is no real problem caused by animals munching on them, then a deterant of any kind is not evolutionaryily logical.


--------------------
You gotta wake up to get faded but you gotta get up to get paided.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineCerebro
Spawnmaster C
Male User Gallery

Registered: 09/13/06
Posts: 192
Loc: Cocytus
Last seen: 16 years, 4 months
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: absolute zero]
    #6304670 - 11/21/06 12:17 AM (17 years, 4 months ago)

I think Psilocybin functions as a type of auxin. The photoactive property of psilocybin could signal a response in the mushroom perhaps to grow towards a light source(phototropism). I also believe it may play a role in mushroom cell energy. It could control turgor pressure. It could be involved in vascular system of the mushroom. I also agree that it is an attractant in mammals but a repellent in certain insects and their larvae(maybe beetles or even trypanosomes). Psilocybin resembles certain organophosphate neurotoxins. I've seen beetles hiding under ragged mushroom caps. I would think the dispersal of spores could be caused by flies. As Flies are phototactic.

Edited by Cerebro (01/14/07 02:34 PM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMr_Spliff
Dreamer
Male User Gallery

Registered: 12/01/05
Posts: 224
Loc: Undesclosed Location (its...
Last seen: 15 years, 9 months
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: Cerebro]
    #6318514 - 11/29/06 11:21 AM (17 years, 4 months ago)

Dude I don't know nor care, I like shrooms, and so does my dog, I have to keep my tubs up high or else he will try and digg threw the pollyfill. Deterant, I think not. I do know that me and my dog have something in common tho. Wed both do almost anything to get some shrooms, like play with shit with our bare hands :smile:

Blah blah blah I know everyone says that you shouldn't give your pets drugs, well i'm a dumb ass, I got curious, so I gave my dog shrooms one time. Now he's always lookin for em, I give him what he wants once in a while tho, like once a month, I have his dose worked out and everything based on his weight and a dose for my weight being 3.5 grams dry just figure out the ratio and you got your dose, I always shoot low tho just in case. Its fun, I take him to the park, to the woods, where ever, and he just runs around with the biggest pupils ever. I know I cant know for sure if he's enjoying himself, but his tail wagging usually will let me know he is happy. And as for animals haveing the capacity to trip, I'm sure they do. Its halarious to watch Peetrie bark at the air, or bounce on the ground as if he was attacking a cockroach or something. I doubt he get anything but a good time out of it tho, and if terrence is right about all that mumbo jumbo, then maybe one day in the future well have artistc chiuahuas.

One time tho I gave him too much, everytime I touched him he would pee. It was like having a supersoaker 2000. And he would walk up to other dogs face to face to check em out then he would run away in pure terror. He wouldn't stop whineing. So I had to rub his belly for like 3 hours to keep him calm ( he still kept peeing tho, so I had to possition him just right). It seemed as if he passed out on me while I was petting him, I got worried, but as soon as it I would get a little too worried hed open his eyes to peek around and then cose them again. He didnt eat shrooms for awhile after that, but after I found him with his head in my mono-tub I knew his fear was gone. :crazy2:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineBlek
Stranger
Male

Registered: 08/17/05
Posts: 983
Loc: The universe
Last seen: 14 years, 4 months
Re: Psilocybin as an evolutionary bi-product? [Re: Mr_Spliff]
    #6319906 - 11/29/06 10:40 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)

Haha that's funny MrSpliff!

My theory is as follows.

As mentioned earlier, something to consider is that Earth's climate, soil, and atmosphere are ever changing and were much different millions/billions of years ago. Also mentioned earlier, "psychadellic" compounds could have had a much different purpose and could have been very "non-psychadellic" millions of years ago. Consider the fact that fungi are some of the oldest beings on the planet and therefore are a common ancestry for a large amount of today's biosphere.

Okay. Where do you find magic mushrooms growing today? Deep in the forest in a well balanced ecosystem? No.

You find them in the human path of destruction. I.e. grazing land (animal dung & decomposed animal dung), devastated woodlands, landscaped areas, suburban housing developments, etc etc etc.

This leads me to believe that humans have been a major contributing factor to the survival of psychadellic mushrooms.

I think psychadellic mushrooms were much less common, possibly even nearing extinction prior to the human population explosion and environmental devastation. On top of that, and on a more recent note... humans have drastically increased the amount spore mass on this planet (and possibly others) simply through cultivation of magic mushrooms.

Is it by coincidence that magic mushrooms, which arguably spread environmental awareness only grow in places where there is environmental devastation? I think not. Mother Earth's way of sending a message perhaps? The same laws that govern the Universe govern our planet, Earth as well.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: < Back | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | Next >  [ show all ]

Shop: North Spore Boomr Bag   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Extract   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   MagicBag.co All-In-One Bags That Don't Suck   Mushroom-Hut Mono Tub Substrate   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   PhytoExtractum Maeng Da Thai Kratom Leaf Powder   Myyco.com Golden Teacher Liquid Culture For Sale


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* What happened to my post? adoseofparn0z 999 5 10/20/04 03:36 PM
by Joshua
* psilocybin/psilocin biosynthesis
( 1 2 3 all )
gray1 20,643 59 11/28/14 06:50 AM
by filamentous
* Sublingual usage of psilocybin extraction precipitates
( 1 2 all )
wiggles 14,448 36 04/14/20 10:30 AM
by SpaceDrooze
* Methanol extraction of psilocybin Tien 17,382 3 03/24/06 07:00 PM
by redshadow
* Shroomery Science Project: a Jungle Extraction of Psilocybin, need verification
( 1 2 3 4 ... 13 14 )
Asante 77,952 264 01/25/20 12:11 AM
by Nephedryn
* Questions on "The Psilocybin Producer's Guide" tibberous 1,970 4 01/16/07 07:13 AM
by pscyanescens
* Psilocin oxidation product?
( 1 2 all )
fastfred 22,218 29 01/15/17 11:03 AM
by Psilosophy328
* Psilocybin Extraction with A/B yielding crystals...
( 1 2 3 all )
retread 36,787 40 07/25/20 02:02 PM
by iconicdave

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: RogerRabbit, Pastywhyte, bodhisatta
45,816 topic views. 2 members, 2 guests and 13 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.036 seconds spending 0.01 seconds on 15 queries.