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OfflinePhishgrrl
Walking in thetall trees...
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Registered: 05/03/04
Posts: 5,079
Last seen: 18 years, 8 months
Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions?
    #3186831 - 09/27/04 02:42 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)

What do you guys think? Good or bad........and I KNOW it totally depends. I guess I am really wanting to hear of others' personal experiences.


--------------------
Once in awhile you can get shown the light

In the strangest of places if you look at it right...


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InvisibleCorporal Kielbasa

Registered: 05/29/04
Posts: 17,235
Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Phishgrrl]
    #3186874 - 09/27/04 02:54 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)

I am friends with a few swinngers never new it was such a big thing till this past weekend. As far as I care as long as its done being safe and with respect towards the others and there partners feelings its all good.

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OfflineKidShelleen
watch thesensations
Registered: 09/20/04
Posts: 88
Last seen: 17 years, 1 month
Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Phishgrrl]
    #3187000 - 09/27/04 03:32 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)

Hi Phishgrrl,

I have not been in a polyamorous relationship, but have talked about it with my GF and thought alot about it. I think success would depend on having the participants be very secure, stable and loving. Any jealousy is going to blow up instantly. I guess that's pretty obvious.

As much as I like the fantasy of having two or more GFs at the same time, I think the reality is that the emotional work that would be required to make sure everyone feels loved and happy would be huge.

There are some decent websites about it.

I think the most difficult part would be getting over not being the one "special" person for your partner. If your partner has two partners (or more) you probably lose that feeling. I suppose it is an ego thing that you could get over if you really want to.

KS

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Anonymous #1

Post deleted by Anno [Re: Phishgrrl]
    #3187034 - 09/27/04 03:40 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)


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InvisibleCorporal Kielbasa

Registered: 05/29/04
Posts: 17,235
Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: ]
    #3187195 - 09/27/04 04:16 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)

It be nice to be able to not be binded down by a relationship. In my opion its to hard for me to stay grounded in one place to long. So I let my partners know that I travel I get around and that I take each day as it is. If I am immersed in someone elses aura and sparks are flying between us I will cherish the moment instead of condem my self to one love when I have much love for all. Im sure maybe one day when I am stable enough to provide the right enviroment for a single relationship Iwill do it. But untill then this bird is free. My relationships never go far though do to many not being able to cope with my free spirit and lack of " commitment" yet they fail to see that I still love em. Not saying I am a manwhore or a lusting fool. Nor do we go out and I ditch her. Yet I feel unable to be comfortable not being able to talk to ladies and meet people put extra burden on my shoulders when all I want to do is be happy and not feel restrained.

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Offlineagr8fulchick
Feed Your Head!

Registered: 08/19/04
Posts: 707
Loc: Stranded in Iowa
Last seen: 12 years, 2 months
Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: ]
    #3191026 - 09/28/04 10:18 AM (19 years, 5 months ago)

I'd have to agree with bf6. Humans are great at comparisons, and I'd hate to introduce an outsider in to my relationship just to have him think that she's better than me. That would suck, and there's nothing you can do about it! The opinion will be formed, and you'll all be stuck with the bad feelings.

It's hard enough for a couple to keep eachother happy. I can't imagine a guy trying to keep 8 wives happy! That has to be impossible! Personally, I think that brining other people into your relationship will only complicate things and introduce more pain.

I luv you Phishy! I hope that you find the answers that you need, and that all is going well :smile: :heart: :smile: :heart: :smile: :heart: :smile:


--------------------
Life's a journey. Take the scenic route.

        :sun: :heart: :heart: :sun:

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InvisibleKingOftheThing
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Phishgrrl]
    #3191600 - 09/28/04 01:24 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)

more than one partner is human nature i think...i doubt we were meant to be satisfied with one person for life....however our culure has conditioned us to believe 1 partner is the way to go. i read something once that when asked, swingers usually have better relationships than normal married people :shrug:

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OfflinePhishgrrl
Walking in thetall trees...
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Registered: 05/03/04
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: KingOftheThing]
    #3191885 - 09/28/04 02:37 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)

Yeah I think it is a totally natural thing for most people too. Most of us are at least serial monogamists. Anyway, it's a really interesting and revolutionary idea to me. I think it would be best for people that aren't too insecure and are pretty mature emotionally and mentally. Hmmm.


--------------------
Once in awhile you can get shown the light

In the strangest of places if you look at it right...


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InvisibleMOTH
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Posts: 23,431
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Phishgrrl]
    #3192005 - 09/28/04 03:06 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)

Back when I was a selfish person and before doing mushrooms, I would have (and was) aghast at the idea, completely opposed to it. 

Now that I am older, more mature and have some boundary-dissolving/amazing psychedelic experiences under my belt, I would say that my mind has completely changed about open relationships.  I think that they could totally work if both parties are selfless and have their egos in check.  This is easier said then done thougth...

Nonetheless, it *can* be done!!  I suggest a prescription of several mushroom sessions with everyone involved to loosen boundaries.  If I ever become a swinger with my husband, I'll probably do that. 

:heart:

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Offlinegnrm23
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Posts: 6,488
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Phishgrrl]
    #3194792 - 09/29/04 08:13 AM (19 years, 5 months ago)



--------------------
old enough to know better
not old enough to care

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Anonymous #1

Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Phishgrrl]
    #3195337 - 09/29/04 11:40 AM (19 years, 5 months ago)

it's ok as long as you don't love the person you plan on sharing.

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OfflineRed
spun

Registered: 05/12/04
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Last seen: 19 years, 4 months
Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: ]
    #3198896 - 09/30/04 03:28 AM (19 years, 5 months ago)

I think its more a matter of being secure with yourself, and your mate. The jealousy that could present itself comes from fear of losing your lover.. but if you know your husband or wife is the love of your life, then theres no reason you should get jealous over other people you bring into play.. since you know deep down, the connection you have with them comes before any sex anyone could bring. I don't think very many people actually have this sense of security, or strength in a relationship.. and so, successful open relationships and swingers will remain a select few that get to have more fun than most people. :grin:

Best of luck in whatever you're looking for, Phish.. You'll find it.  :sun:


--------------------
Pussy Thunderclap, snap my back. Chop me into peices, and serve me as a snack.

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InvisibleSam1912
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Registered: 09/23/04
Posts: 2,142
Loc: Cali
Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Red]
    #3199325 - 09/30/04 09:19 AM (19 years, 5 months ago)

Just so you guys know... don't talk bad about something you don't know, or make assumptions. It's like a drug experience. It's very often not like what you thought it'd be like. My wife and I used to swing and are still open to it. It's not all it's cracked up to be. It's like the mystery before your first time.

I've seen some break ups, but most couples find out early whether it's going to work for them or not. The level of involvement is also an issue with a lot of couples. Swing clubs are much more enjoyable than regular ones. Sex is... well, it's not that big of a mystery to swinging couples, but rather how you have sex(toys, group in tubs, games, contests, etc...) seems to drive the relationships. We become good friends with each other and hang out a lot more than having sex.

I think the reason why it worked for us despite all the insecurities(there's no way we could've set aside all the jealousies and insecurities) was that we promised each other no regrets and be honest about all the feelings when we talk about it afterwards. After the first time, it was a big revelation that I was proud of my wife and I really didn't feel much jealousy but rather a joy for her enjoying what life has to offer. You can tell yourself that it's only physical and not emotional all day long. That'd be a lie. But being able to talk about it is what makes you feel secure.

Oh, btw, it's just a personal thing... It's EASY to share a bed with another couple, sharing a bathroom(i.e. living together) is something else.

There's a good site you can goto to meet some swingers in your area. They are REAL people, not some freaks. So, be respectful. Most of them will invite you out or to their houses for chat and answer your questions. Some will be more selective. All of them are very selective about who to engage in a relationship with. We had a couple invite us to come watch at a party they were throwing. Anyways, if any personal questions, PM me.
http://www.swinglifestyle.com


--------------------
Protect your civil rights!  End drug prohibition.  And if you don't care about your civil rights, protect mine!

If you want a rating from me, please PM me.  For those really newbies, don't expect an answer back, but you can try me anyways.

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InvisibleCorporal Kielbasa

Registered: 05/29/04
Posts: 17,235
Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Sam1912]
    #3199444 - 09/30/04 10:08 AM (19 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Sam1912 said:
Just so you guys know... don't talk bad about something you don't know, or make assumptions.




I dont think any one was speaking ill on the subject.

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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Registered: 10/10/02
Posts: 27,301
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Phishgrrl]
    #3199472 - 09/30/04 10:19 AM (19 years, 5 months ago)

I don't have any experience with it, but I've thought about it, and I think I could cope with something like that. I think if I had a girlfriend who loved me but didn't want to be tied down, and I loved her enough to care more about her feelings than my own, then I could see having an open relationship.


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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InvisibleFucknuckle
Dog Lover

Registered: 04/24/04
Posts: 6,762
Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Phishgrrl]
    #3200703 - 09/30/04 04:17 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)

Go for it
But only if you are willing to take risks


--------------------
What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.

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OfflinePhishgrrl
Walking in thetall trees...
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Registered: 05/03/04
Posts: 5,079
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Phishgrrl]
    #3203358 - 10/01/04 08:57 AM (19 years, 5 months ago)

I appreciate all of your responses.  My life is really crazy right now, but I think good things are bubbling up all around me and are going to continue to do so in the future.  I am going to just ride the tide and enjoy it.  I am going to keep my priorities straight, ans as long as love is the number one priority in my life, I don't think I can go wrong. Thank you all. You have given me lots of things to think about! :heart:


--------------------
Once in awhile you can get shown the light

In the strangest of places if you look at it right...


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Offlineagr8fulchick
Feed Your Head!

Registered: 08/19/04
Posts: 707
Loc: Stranded in Iowa
Last seen: 12 years, 2 months
Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Phishgrrl]
    #3203505 - 10/01/04 10:17 AM (19 years, 5 months ago)

You rule Phishy, and we all love you! You know that we'll all support you in making the right decisions and catching those happy bubbles all around you  :laugh: :heart: :laugh: :heart: :laugh:


--------------------
Life's a journey. Take the scenic route.

        :sun: :heart: :heart: :sun:

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InvisibleCorporal Kielbasa

Registered: 05/29/04
Posts: 17,235
Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Phishgrrl]
    #3203533 - 10/01/04 10:31 AM (19 years, 5 months ago)

Create that posetive space for yourself and keep that energy flowing.

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OfflineMagicHombre
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Registered: 01/04/10
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Anonymous #1]
    #11968101 - 02/05/10 10:47 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

In my experience it's not a good idea. Jealousy isn't something that you can just not do. I mean, try it. Try not to be jealous, eventually it'll catch up to you.

I've got a group of friends who are very into the polyamory lifestyle and for a while so was I. The reason I quit that nonsense is because there was always drama involved. ALWAYS. You think soap opera's are drama? Well imagine if each of the characters were polyamorous... Who slept with who, who wants to sleep with who, who fell in love after sleeping with who, who fell out of love after sleeping with who. And round and round it goes.
You can't escape the feelings of jealousy, cause eventually someone that you consider hotter and younger is going to capture the attention of your mate (open relationship or not, still your mate).

Then what? You or your mate will start sneaking around on the side. I'm not saying that this will definitely happen but from what I've seen, it usually does.

I don't recommend it.


--------------------
The only thing I'm sure of is that you can't be sure of anything!

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OfflineMushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs
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Registered: 12/02/05
Posts: 14,794
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: MagicHombre]
    #11969494 - 02/05/10 02:00 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MagicHombre said:
In my experience it's not a good idea. Jealousy isn't something that you can just not do. I mean, try it. Try not to be jealous, eventually it'll catch up to you.

I've got a group of friends who are very into the polyamory lifestyle and for a while so was I. The reason I quit that nonsense is because there was always drama involved. ALWAYS. You think soap opera's are drama? Well imagine if each of the characters were polyamorous... Who slept with who, who wants to sleep with who, who fell in love after sleeping with who, who fell out of love after sleeping with who. And round and round it goes.
You can't escape the feelings of jealousy, cause eventually someone that you consider hotter and younger is going to capture the attention of your mate (open relationship or not, still your mate).

Then what? You or your mate will start sneaking around on the side. I'm not saying that this will definitely happen but from what I've seen, it usually does.

I don't recommend it.



So basically you failed and you're trying to make yourself feel better by thinking that everyone else will fail.
:failboat:


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

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OfflineMagicHombre
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Registered: 01/04/10
Posts: 76
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #11970047 - 02/05/10 03:26 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MushroomTrip said:
Quote:

MagicHombre said:
In my experience it's not a good idea. Jealousy isn't something that you can just not do. I mean, try it. Try not to be jealous, eventually it'll catch up to you.

I've got a group of friends who are very into the polyamory lifestyle and for a while so was I. The reason I quit that nonsense is because there was always drama involved. ALWAYS. You think soap opera's are drama? Well imagine if each of the characters were polyamorous... Who slept with who, who wants to sleep with who, who fell in love after sleeping with who, who fell out of love after sleeping with who. And round and round it goes.
You can't escape the feelings of jealousy, cause eventually someone that you consider hotter and younger is going to capture the attention of your mate (open relationship or not, still your mate).

Then what? You or your mate will start sneaking around on the side. I'm not saying that this will definitely happen but from what I've seen, it usually does.

I don't recommend it.



So basically you failed and you're trying to make yourself feel better by thinking that everyone else will fail.
:failboat:




No, I just got tired of bullshit drama. In polyamory and swinging there's loads of it.
Just be single and fuck who you want.


--------------------
The only thing I'm sure of is that you can't be sure of anything!

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OfflineMushroomTrip
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: MagicHombre]
    #11970315 - 02/05/10 04:09 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

What if you want to be with someone, fucking other people?
How does that turn into drama? :strokebeard:


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

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Invisiblelukeboots
fresh futuristic
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #11970515 - 02/05/10 04:42 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Eh, I think MagicHombre has a point. It would take a really mature group of people to be polyamorous  (is that the word I want here?) and still be able to keep their rising emotions out of it. Some people can probably do it and do it well, but they'd need a really excellent grasp on their emotions to pull it off.  If even one person in the group starts to get jealous, it seems like drama would escalate.


Ps - this thread is 5 years old. :lol:


--------------------

funky ass music: Planet of Dinosaurs // Rich Whiskey

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OfflineMagicHombre
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #11970521 - 02/05/10 04:44 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MushroomTrip said:
What if you want to be with someone, fucking other people?
How does that turn into drama? :strokebeard:



LOL!
Lie to me and say that women aren't generally crazy...

You're right, it wouldn't turn into drama!


--------------------
The only thing I'm sure of is that you can't be sure of anything!

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OfflineMagicHombre
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: lukeboots]
    #11970647 - 02/05/10 05:04 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

lukeboots said:
Eh, I think MagicHombre has a point. It would take a really mature group of people to be polyamorous  (is that the word I want here?) and still be able to keep their rising emotions out of it. Some people can probably do it and do it well, but they'd need a really excellent grasp on their emotions to pull it off.  If even one person in the group starts to get jealous, it seems like drama would escalate.


Ps - this thread is 5 years old. :lol:




Yeah, very true... I've never known a group of people to be THAT mature, let alone agree on a pizza.


--------------------
The only thing I'm sure of is that you can't be sure of anything!

Edited by MagicHombre (02/05/10 05:04 PM)

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OfflineMushroomTrip
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: MagicHombre]
    #11970804 - 02/05/10 05:28 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MagicHombre said:
Quote:

MushroomTrip said:
What if you want to be with someone, fucking other people?
How does that turn into drama? :strokebeard:



LOL!
Lie to me and say that women aren't generally crazy...

You're right, it wouldn't turn into drama!



I don't know all women, so I can't tell you how they are, generally. Can you, or are you just using a small limited experience and over-generalizing it?
All I know is that, once when I experimented with an open relationship, it was the man that went completely hysterical and in crisis of his masculinity. Of course, this is my own limited experience too. Besides, I met a few couples in an open relationship that were more than happy and completely in love with each other.
Not all is drama.


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

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OfflineMagicHombre
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Registered: 01/04/10
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #11971028 - 02/05/10 05:57 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MushroomTrip said:
I don't know all women, so I can't tell you how they are, generally. Can you, or are you just using a small limited experience and over-generalizing it?



Well, my "small limited experience" isn't exactly small or limited.
Unlike you I haven't been in just "one" open relationship. And you're right, it's not always the women's fault.

Quote:

MushroomTrip said:
All I know is that, once when I experimented with an open relationship, it was the man that went completely hysterical and in crisis of his masculinity. Of course, this is my own limited experience too.



So, you were projecting earlier when you said that "I failed," you meant that YOU failed.
So, The man (YOU) went crazy, which they do, I know I have.
Let me rephrase and try and explain this better...
PEOPLE are crazy.
You just made my point.

Quote:

MushroomTrip said:
Besides, I met a few couples in an open relationship that were more than happy and completely in love with each other.

Not all is drama.



Met a few couples, eh? Have you ever LIVED with them for a matter of months or did you just have a few drinks with them?
Ya know, you really don't know people until you've lived with them...
I can tell you from my extended experience that things are not always what they seem.
My point is... eventually it all turns to drama sooner or later.


--------------------
The only thing I'm sure of is that you can't be sure of anything!

Edited by MagicHombre (02/05/10 06:37 PM)

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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Posts: 95,368
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Phishgrrl]
    #11971052 - 02/05/10 06:00 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Phishgrrl said:
What do you guys think? Good or bad........and I KNOW it totally depends. I guess I am really wanting to hear of others' personal experiences.




I think it's a great idea and I think that almost nobody is emotionally equipped to handle it without making a mess out of it. I couldn't and I've never met anyone who can. But I'm sure there are some out there.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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OfflineMushroomTrip
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: MagicHombre]
    #11973626 - 02/06/10 03:43 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MagicHombre said:
Quote:

MushroomTrip said:
I don't know all women, so I can't tell you how they are, generally. Can you, or are you just using a small limited experience and over-generalizing it?



Well, my "small limited experience" isn't exactly small or limited.
Unlike you I haven't been in just "one" open relationship. And you're right, it's not always the women's fault.

Quote:

MushroomTrip said:
All I know is that, once when I experimented with an open relationship, it was the man that went completely hysterical and in crisis of his masculinity. Of course, this is my own limited experience too.



So, you were projecting earlier when you said that "I failed," you meant that YOU failed.
So, The man (YOU) went crazy, which they do, I know I have.
Let me rephrase and try and explain this better...
PEOPLE are crazy.
You just made my point.

Quote:

MushroomTrip said:
Besides, I met a few couples in an open relationship that were more than happy and completely in love with each other.

Not all is drama.



Met a few couples, eh? Have you ever LIVED with them for a matter of months or did you just have a few drinks with them?
Ya know, you really don't know people until you've lived with them...
I can tell you from my extended experience that things are not always what they seem.
My point is... eventually it all turns to drama sooner or later.



Seek help little buddy. :lol:


--------------------
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #11974975 - 02/06/10 12:10 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

*Calls Ghostbusters* :stonedjerk:


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #11975145 - 02/06/10 12:43 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

That was pretty condescending, MT. :thumbdown:


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: lukeboots]
    #11975285 - 02/06/10 01:06 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

What exactly was condescending? For you people, it's fully understandable to get all whiny and pissy, but god forbid someone makes a joke, that's just crossing the line.  :wow: Luckily enough, I really don't give a crap about all this. :wink:


--------------------
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All this time I've loved you
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #11975344 - 02/06/10 01:16 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Whiny and pissy, hah. Give it a rest.


If you can't understand how "seek help little guy, LOL" came across as condescending, there might be something wrong with your ability to understand written tone. At least I can finally understand why so many people on this site think you're a terrible debater that resorts to personal attacks to justify your arguments.


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: lukeboots]
    #11976969 - 02/06/10 05:45 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

She's right.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Icelander]
    #11977162 - 02/06/10 06:17 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

I didn't say she was wrong...?


But for the sake of the discussion- right about what?


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: lukeboots]
    #11977266 - 02/06/10 06:32 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Did I say you said it?:wink:

She's right about everything. (ever see a pic of her?:jennajameson:)


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Icelander]
    #11977288 - 02/06/10 06:36 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Yeah, I have, quite a few of them.


And no, you didn't say that. But I refuse to let someone else be right about everything - that's a trait that MT and I share. :yesnod:


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: lukeboots]
    #11977894 - 02/06/10 08:00 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

You're right of course, she's just right about you.:grin:


--------------------
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" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Icelander]
    #11980810 - 02/07/10 10:25 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Yeah, yeah yeah. :lol:

I stand by the things I've said in this thread!


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: lukeboots]
    #11984251 - 02/07/10 07:53 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

My experience with swinging can be summed up as this:

*Best friend's girlfriend was into swinging
*I slept with my friend's girlfriend
*Best friend and I feel awkward around eachother
*I end up sleeping with my friend's girlfriend regularly
*I lose my best friend
*On her birthday, I sleep with her and her best friend
*Next day, she tells me that she has feelings for me and wants to know if I feel the same way

When this finally comes to an end, I lost my best friend and end up dating his girlfriend. All of a sudden she is opposed to the idea of me sleeping with someone else.

I know if I was a child and I saw my parents sleeping around with other people it would have done a number on me psychologically. I think as people we have certain sexual instincts that cannot be ignored no matter how much you may try to chalk up jealousy to petty insecurities.

Edited by appleorange (02/07/10 07:54 PM)

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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: appleorange]
    #11989566 - 02/08/10 05:17 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

appleorange said:
I know if I was a child and I saw my parents sleeping around with other people it would have done a number on me psychologically.




Elaborate on what "a number on me psychologically" actually means, if you wish. :wink:

Quote:


I think as people we have certain sexual instincts that cannot be ignored no matter how much you may try to chalk up jealousy to petty insecurities.




You've identified these certain sexual instincts in people in general? Through which methods?


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #11991329 - 02/08/10 08:51 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

You've identified these certain sexual instincts in people in general? Through which methods?




Common sense and life experience mostly.

Psychology Today had an article about Oxytocin a few years back though and a lot of things about sex and relationships made more sense.

Oxytocin is the chemical responsible for feelings of trust, connection, and social bonding. Women release the most amount of this chemical during orgasm and labor. Its the reason why women like to cuddle after sex.

Sex makes babies and babies need someone to raise them. The fact that nature has a chemical like this produced seems like its there to ensure our children have someone to take care of them.

We're not seaturtles who lay our eggs on a beach and dump them. Our children are completely helpless without us. Sex and bonding seem to go hand and hand.

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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: appleorange]
    #11993228 - 02/09/10 02:52 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Interesting stuff, but I'm not sure how it relates to open relationships, jealousy, and insecurity. Want to bridge the gap? :grin:


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Phishgrrl]
    #11999135 - 02/09/10 10:47 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

I was in an open relationship this summer and let me tell you, it was bull-fucking-shit.  If your current relationship is boiling down to that point, just end it.

You may be thinking to yourself having more than one girlfriend would be swell, but boy let me tell you one girl is enough trouble.

My $.02


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #12002117 - 02/10/10 12:42 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

fireworks_god said:
Interesting stuff, but I'm not sure how it relates to open relationships, jealousy, and insecurity. Want to bridge the gap? :grin:





For the most part, I think jealousy or being upset when a partner sleeps with someone else is probably a healthy and normal response.

If children were in the picture, I think anyone would have a hard time making an argument for swinging. Children are the outcome of sex and it's all tied together.

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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: appleorange]
    #12002289 - 02/10/10 01:06 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

I might be normal but I don't see how ultimately it's healthy.


--------------------
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" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Icelander]
    #12002398 - 02/10/10 01:21 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
I might be normal but I don't see how ultimately it's healthy.




I have hard time seeing vikings sitting around the campfire saying this:

-So Bill, I hear Mitch is dickin your wife? Is that so?
-Me and the honey we're raiding England last month and we learned about this new thing called "Swinging" which is all the rage in Europe.
-Swinging? Is that what they call dickin another man's jewels?
-It may seem strange to you, but that's just because your insecure with another man's dick in your woman. We're vikings goddamnit, show some balls!
-Bill, when Mitch is done dickin your wife, can I her dick her too?
-Why the fuck not!

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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: appleorange]
    #12002489 - 02/10/10 01:34 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

appleorange said:
If children were in the picture, I think anyone would have a hard time making an argument for swinging. Children are the outcome of sex and it's all tied together.




It's all tied together on what? Yeah, kids are the result of two people having sex, so what? How does that make an argument against swinging?


--------------------
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All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
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Here is true peace
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Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: appleorange]
    #12002504 - 02/10/10 01:36 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

:lol: Yeah they were emotionally dysfunctional for sure.

But just imagine humans who didn't care about that? Look at all the pain and suffering not to mention violence that would be removed from this world. I'm not saying we're up to it cause generally we're not.:shrug:


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" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: appleorange]
    #12002880 - 02/10/10 02:34 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

appleorange said:
For the most part, I think jealousy or being upset when a partner sleeps with someone else is probably a healthy and normal response.




I don't find much utility in using a concept like "normal" personally, but I'm not certain how you are determining that it would be a "healthy" response. How is a suffering experience of resentment and displeasure healthy to the organism?

I personally think that how justified or sensible the response is, is a matter of the specific context in which the sex is occurring and the nature of the relationship, as established by the individuals involved.
You're alluding to an instinctual/chemical basis for the justification of these types of responses, dismissing ways of characterizing them such as "its only a result of insecurity".
I personally think that there are more instinctual levels of influence upon our feelings, cognition, and decision-making, most certainly, but its not everything, definitely not enough to disregard the much more influential role thinking has on our experience and our conducting of our lives, definitely not enough to say something as vague as "as people we have certain sexual instincts that cannot be ignored".
Which is to say that its entirely possible to decide for ourselves how something makes us feel and why.
Not everyone feels resentment and jealousy when someone else fucks their partner, so why use a universal phrase like "as people"?


Quote:


If children were in the picture, I think anyone would have a hard time making an argument for swinging.




I don't see how this is in the slightest true. So a couple has children, somehow its therefore difficult to make an "argument" for said couple to have sex with other people?
Its as simple as the couple deciding together the dynamics and nature of their relationship.
The only reason anyone would conclude that it would be a hard argument to make for a couple having sex with other people while children are in the equation is if they held the opinion that said couple having sex with other people was in some way inherently damaging to the children.
I cannot find any basis for such an opinion being true, unless you want to indicate one or otherwise illuminate as to why its a hard argument to make. :wink:


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Icelander]
    #12002894 - 02/10/10 02:37 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

It's all tied together on what? Yeah, kids are the result of two people having sex, so what? How does that make an argument against swinging?




I'm not saying that people can't swing, but jealousy, regret, or tempers will eventually flare at some point. You can't seperate the physical aspect of sex from the biology behind it.

Ever heard of a man yelling rape?

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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: appleorange]
    #12002922 - 02/10/10 02:41 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Fireworks_God,

If you had children, would you still be a swinger?

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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: appleorange]
    #12003238 - 02/10/10 03:27 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

I don't see what difference having children would make.
I also don't see how it would be a hard argument to make to have sex with other people in a relationship in which there are children involved. :shrug:
Is there something inherently damaging to children when their parents also have sex with other people? :strokebeard:


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: appleorange]
    #12003518 - 02/10/10 04:07 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

appleorange said:
Quote:

It's all tied together on what? Yeah, kids are the result of two people having sex, so what? How does that make an argument against swinging?




I'm not saying that people can't swing, but jealousy, regret, or tempers will eventually flare at some point. You can't seperate the physical aspect of sex from the biology behind it.

Ever heard of a man yelling rape?





First off that's not my quote.

You are correct in that most people can't handle swinging emotionally. That however doesn't mean swinging is unhealthy. It's the people who are unhealthy.


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" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #12003537 - 02/10/10 04:09 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

fireworks, I probably just have a very traditional outlook on family life.

I think it's extremely important for both a mother and a father to be present in a child's life. Marriage is hard enough as it is and anything that jeopardizes that is out of the question in my book.

If you want to say, "how does swinging jeopardize a relationship?" Then you haven't met or known enough swingers.

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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #12006411 - 02/10/10 11:51 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

appleorange said:
If you want to say, "how does swinging jeopardize a relationship?" Then you haven't met or known enough swingers.



Exactly.
A swinging relationship is Jeopardy.
"I'll take selfish for $300, Alex!"
"An alternative to polygamy; Cheating on your significant other without becoming a mormon"
"What is Swinging/Polyamory?"
"Correct!"

Quote:

fireworks_god said:
I don't see what difference having children would make.
I also don't see how it would be a hard argument to make to have sex with other people in a relationship in which there are children involved. :shrug:
Is there something inherently damaging to children when their parents also have sex with other people? :strokebeard:



Yes. Kids are smart and will recognize affection that is diverted from their biological mother to their father's new girlfriend or vice-versa.
I would be as bold to say this would affect children in a similar way that divorce affects them.


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: appleorange]
    #12006427 - 02/10/10 11:55 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

appleorange said:
I think it's extremely important for both a mother and a father to be present in a child's life. Marriage is hard enough as it is and anything that jeopardizes that is out of the question in my book.




Whether or not it actually jeopardizes anything is a question of the individuals involved and the nature of their relationship.
If they enjoy having sex with other people and they conduct themselves in their relationship in a certain way that does not create problems, then there is no jeopardy in terms of the child.
That is really what it boils down to, that it isn't an issue with having sex with other people in and of itself, but simply a matter of how each person is and how they act as a result.
Unless you're ready to state that no couple can have sex with other people without having major problems, of course. :grin:

Quote:


If you want to say, "how does swinging jeopardize a relationship?" Then you haven't met or known enough swingers.




I recognize all sorts of ways in which how a couple handles having sex with other people can jeopardize a relationship.
Hell, I even recognize all sorts of possibilities in which not having sex with other people can jeopardize a relationship. I can even allude to biology as a basis insomuch that you did earlier. :lol:
It doesn't mean a couple is jeopardizing a relationship by having sex with other people, not to mention that anything can jeopardize a relationship.
What determines a relationship is what everything means to each individual and how they interact with each other as a result.


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Icelander]
    #12006468 - 02/11/10 12:03 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:You are correct in that most people can't handle swinging emotionally. That however doesn't mean swinging is unhealthy. It's the people who are unhealthy.




PEOPLE are unhealthy.

"Minds differ still more than faces" - Voltaire

Just in this thread alone there are multiple view points on this subject.
If I asked everyone what's the best toppings for a pizza, how many different responses do you think we'd get?

This is why I think polyamorous/swinging relationships eventually fall apart; people are unhealthy.


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: MagicHombre]
    #12006672 - 02/11/10 12:57 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MagicHombre said:
This is why I think polyamorous/swinging relationships eventually fall apart




As opposed to which successful relationships? :sherlock:


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #12007492 - 02/11/10 07:42 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

People generally can only handle relationships with pet rocks.


--------------------
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Icelander]
    #12007887 - 02/11/10 09:33 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)



My name is Skeeter.

I'm the kind of guy who can be responsible throughout the week, but still manage to "rock" out on the weekends.

Anyone in SoCal, hit me up at skeeterpumps@gmail.com

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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: appleorange]
    #12008000 - 02/11/10 09:57 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Don't forget to feed him.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #12012727 - 02/11/10 09:58 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

fireworks_god said:
Quote:

MagicHombre said:
This is why I think polyamorous/swinging relationships eventually fall apart




As opposed to which successful relationships? :sherlock:



Exactly!
Relationships begin and end, some sooner than others depending on the variables. The more variables, the more complex and harder to keep together.
It's elementary my dear Watson!


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Icelander]
    #12012752 - 02/11/10 10:01 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
Don't forget to feed him.



Oh no! I didn't know I was suppose to feed 'em!
I left mine at home for the weekend... :confused:


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: MagicHombre]
    #12014088 - 02/12/10 04:13 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MagicHombre said:
The more variables, the more complex and harder to keep together.





I don't buy that. Are you proposing that the relationships with the most chances are the ones in which the couple do absolutely nothing, ever? Just sit, don't work, don't talk... talking amongst themselves is a variable, after all... :smirk:

Quote:


Yes. Kids are smart and will recognize affection that is diverted from their biological mother to their father's new girlfriend or vice-versa.





Definitely. What that actually means to a kid, however, is determined by the nature of the relationship between their mother and father, how they each feel and think about it, and the way they act as result.
Are you trying to propose that one of a child's parents sharing affection with someone else is inherently damaging to the child? Sorry, don't see how it's the case.
Kids adapt to whatever environment they find themselves in, and how they feel about it emotionally is taken from cues from those which they share bonds.
If a child's parents have sex with other people, either together or as separate relationships, and both of their parents are emotionally mature, then the only question in terms of any of it serving as a detriment to the child is simply a question of how much time is spent raising the child as opposed to being away from them, the same going for any kind of occupation, hobby, or interest.
The only way I could see it being the same as a divorce is if the parents act as if they are divorced - if they have all sorts of negative emotions and reactions towards each other, if they barely spend any time together, if the child is neglected, not assured of mutual love, is left with uncertainty as to what might happen....
Since that isn't inherent to a couple having sex with other people in and of itself, then we might as well stop blaming it. :lol:


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #12014535 - 02/12/10 08:42 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

fireworks_god said:
Quote:

MagicHombre said:
Yes. Kids are smart and will recognize affection that is diverted from their biological mother to their father's new girlfriend or vice-versa.





Definitely. What that actually means to a kid, however, is determined by the nature of the relationship between their mother and father, how they each feel and think about it, and the way they act as result.

Are you trying to propose that one of a child's parents sharing affection with someone else is inherently damaging to the child? Sorry, don't see how it's the case.
Kids adapt to whatever environment they find themselves in, and how they feel about it emotionally is taken from cues from those which they share bonds.
If a child's parents have sex with other people, either together or as separate relationships, and both of their parents are emotionally mature, then the only question in terms of any of it serving as a detriment to the child is simply a question of how much time is spent raising the child as opposed to being away from them, the same going for any kind of occupation, hobby, or interest.
The only way I could see it being the same as a divorce is if the parents act as if they are divorced - if they have all sorts of negative emotions and reactions towards each other, if they barely spend any time together, if the child is neglected, not assured of mutual love, is left with uncertainty as to what might happen....
Since that isn't inherent to a couple having sex with other people in and of itself, then we might as well stop blaming it. :lol:





I completely disagree.  A child will see the relationships the parents of others have, and compare it to his or her own family.  I grew up in a home with just my mom , and she dated people throughout my childhood.  I never had any ill feelings towards my biological father (didn't ever hear much about him, and didn't think much of it until adolescence) or my mother - in fact I have a very loving relationship with her, and have made peace with my deceased father - but regardless, I certainly noticed the differences in my mom's relationships compared to those of my friends' parents. It was confusing to me, and instead of feeling ill will towards my own father, I began to feel negative about each of these new men, some of whom I really didn't like, and most of which were a passing phase in my mother's life.  I don't blame any of them for my feelings, but the rules I learned about relationships growing up were very different from standard monogamy, or polyamory, and I am still making heads and tails of what short-term relationships mean to me. To argue that "the only thing that could be a detriment to the child" is the "[reduced] time spent raising them" is really not true. I hope you have the ability to challenge this point with your own opinion, as oppsed to a series of pointed questions about my experience.  Sexual relationships, married or not, polyamorous or not, really can affect children in profound ways. Nearly everything a parent does can affect a child in a profound way.


I am not sure I even see an a clear argument in your side besides "it is possible that it might work," which is of course true (there are always exceptions to social rules), but it's really not saying much.  Polyamory is difficult for most people to do in a respectable manner, more difficult than a monogamous relationship, primarily because more people's emotions are involved. That is my experience (now speaking of personal relationships, not my parents), and that is my opinion.


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: lukeboots]
    #12014568 - 02/12/10 08:52 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

I think a big factor is how well the parent communicates with the child on these issues. My gf has two kids and so I get to see this for myself. However there is no problems for them as we talk with them as adults about almost all aspects of what goes on. I don't act like a father to them and they don't expect it but we do interact and don't try and pretend each other doesn't exist. Communicating is key.


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Icelander]
    #12014633 - 02/12/10 09:10 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Agreed, communication is super important!  I am glad to hear you are being open about things with your GFs kids.  The role you are playing (not acting like a father, but explaining the situation calmly and lovingly [i imagine]) is similar to what my eventual step-dad did, and I think it is a good role for a non-biological father figure to take on.

but.. you know, every situation will have those different "variables" that can change the participants perceptions pretty drastically (the age of the kid, the ability of the parents to communicate, a whole giant list of other things, including tiny details like what one classmate may say about the situation when they come to visit, or what a grandfather says about the situation that the kid might overhear, etcetc) 


Your girlfriends children are, I imagine, still affected by the situation, even if they are not showing it now.  I didn't begin to realize what my childhood had done to my image of father figures and men in general until I was probably 18-19 years old.  Relationships are very delicate things, especially when they involve children, and the moral/psychological implications in a childs mind can last a really long time.


I mean, as adults we can only spend so much time worrying about these sorts of things, or every step we take will be seen as the most important thing in the kids life - and that's just a giant headache for everyone involved.


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: lukeboots]
    #12015447 - 02/12/10 12:29 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

I hear ya.:thumbup:


Very thing effects everything and there is one thing that must be faced imo. Life is never going to be a fairy tale and we have to work with what actually happens and make the best of it. And we can.


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: lukeboots]
    #12017177 - 02/12/10 05:08 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

lukeboots said:
I completely disagree.....
I certainly noticed the differences in my mom's relationships compared to those of my friends' parents. It was confusing to me, and instead of feeling ill will towards my own father, I began to feel negative about each of these new men, some of whom I really didn't like, and most of which were a passing phase in my mother's life.




This doesn't contradict what I said. What you describe isn't the result of the nature of her relationships with other men.
Your negative feelings resulted from observing differences in her life as compared to the life of others.
The detriment didn't arise from her relationships with others any more than it would make sense to blame a friend's parents' perfect, monogamous relationship for the detriment.
My statement makes perfect sense, as I was only speaking of detriment which would arise from the dynamics of relationship itself and how it was conducted.

Quote:


I am not sure I even see an a clear argument in your side besides "it is possible that it might work," which is of course true (there are always exceptions to social rules), but it's really not saying much.




I'm not saying "its possible that it might work", although that's definitely true.
I'm saying that there isn't anything inherently at fault with a couple having sex with other people, nor anything inherently damaging to children relevant to such a relationship.
You can determine that it "really isn't saying much", but it certainly is saying something in response to those who alluded to these ideas as being the case but wouldn't then actually affirm them as being the case when pressed on the matter.


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #12017847 - 02/12/10 06:51 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

fireworks_god said:
Quote:

MagicHombre said:
The more variables, the more complex and harder to keep together.





I don't buy that. Are you proposing that the relationships with the most chances are the ones in which the couple do absolutely nothing, ever? Just sit, don't work, don't talk... talking amongst themselves is a variable, after all... :smirk:




Talking to and sleeping with other people is also a variable.
It's not something you have to buy. It's purely mathematical.
The more variables you add, the more complex the equation becomes. One would think that the amount of variables created by two human beings would be sufficient, but you never can tell what a human will do. Variables don't lie.

If A is man and B is woman.
EX:
A+B
AA+B
A+BB
AAA+B
AA+BB
A+BBB

And so on and so forth...


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: MagicHombre]
    #12020335 - 02/13/10 07:21 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

How can something so subjective as human emotions be "purely mathematical"?
Is it inherit for people to be troubled in their infancy if their parents are having sex vith various people? Is it inherit for people to feel offended when being told they're fat?


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #12020386 - 02/13/10 07:43 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

IMO Polyamory is much harder than just plain swinging.  In poly you actually develop emotional connections with the others, many times intimate and that's why it's a much lower population group. 

Swingers on the other hand are everywhere and pretty much any major city will have more than one private swinger club.  The wife and I have been to one before and it was fucking wild to say the least. 

As for humans being monogamous, it's cultural imo as well.  Anyone heard of the Coolidge effect?  :lol:


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: MagicHombre]
    #12020450 - 02/13/10 08:05 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MagicHombre said:
It's not something you have to buy. It's purely mathematical.
The more variables you add, the more complex the equation becomes.




Yes, it is a matter of buying. Its a question of whether or not your "purely mathemtatical equation of variables" actually has any relevance, whether or not your conclusion regarding these variables is actually accurate.
You specifically stated that "the more variables, the more complex and difficult the relationship will be to stay together".

Again, if your description of the dynamics of the matter was accurate, the couple that always sat at home, not working, not doing anything, not even communicating together, would have the best chance of having a successful relationship, because things like jobs, activities, and expressing opinions and thoughts are variables.
Clearly, this doesn't make sense. Nowhere in reality is it implied that a relationship becomes increasingly complex and difficult with the more "variables" there are. What determines the actuality of the complexity and the difficulty is the motivations these individuals have for being together, their motivations for why they engage in these "variables", how they feel and what they think as a result, and how they manage all of this together with their partner(s).


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #12020695 - 02/13/10 09:30 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

fireworks_god said:
I'm not saying "its possible that it might work", although that's definitely true.
I'm saying that there isn't anything inherently at fault with a couple having sex with other people, nor anything inherently damaging to children relevant to such a relationship.





Of course there is nothing "inherently" wrong with having sex with more than one person. Again, I don't think you're saying much here besides "sex is natural," which cannot be argued (but here we are anyway).


Quote:

You can determine that it "really isn't saying much", but it certainly is saying something in response to those who alluded to these ideas as being the case but wouldn't then actually affirm them as being the case when pressed on the matter.






Perhaps arguing with people who have "alluded to ideas" in a thread about personal experiences and opinions is not the wisest course of action.


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: lukeboots]
    #12020743 - 02/13/10 09:44 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

lukeboots said:
Of course there is nothing "inherently" wrong with having sex with more than one person. Again, I don't think you're saying much here besides "sex is natural," which cannot be argued (but here we are anyway).




No, here we aren't, as I'm not simply saying "sex is natural".


Quote:


Perhaps arguing with people who have "alluded to ideas" in a thread about personal experiences and opinions is not the wisest course of action.




Why?


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #12020767 - 02/13/10 09:51 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

What do you mean by "nothing inherently wrong" then?  Nothing is inherently wrong. 



As for the second quote, if you don't get it, that's ok.


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: lukeboots]
    #12023943 - 02/13/10 08:25 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

lukeboots said:
What do you mean by "nothing inherently wrong" then?  Nothing is inherently wrong.




I never said "nothing inherently wrong".
I stated that there was nothing inherently at fault with a couple having sex with other people in regards to having problems with a relationship, and also that there is nothing inherently damaging to children for their parents to have sex with other people.
That's my point, very specifically-expressed, just as specifically-expressed as it had been since I first mentioned it.
Absolutely no basis for concluding that I'm merely saying "sex is natural" or "nothing is inherently 'wrong'".

I thought you already knew I was specifically stating that I find it perfectly reasonable that a couple having sex with other people is not inherently damaging to a child, considering that you attempted to cite your personal experience in disagreement.
Remember? I pointed out that the relationships themselves were not at fault for your emotional detriment, but the difference you observed between her relationships and that of other families, a difference which isn't the fault of the relationships themselves.
I guess I had been right after all. :smile:

Quote:


As for the second quote, if you don't get it, that's ok.




Ahh, mystical ancient wisdom that dare not be spoke, then. :hypno: Spooky! :hypnotic:


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #12024649 - 02/13/10 10:36 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MushroomTrip said:
How can something so subjective as human emotions be "purely mathematical"?
Is it inherit for people to be troubled in their infancy if their parents are having sex vith various people? Is it inherit for people to feel offended when being told they're fat?



It's not emotions that are "purely mathematical." It's there obvious affects on a relationship. The more emotions, the more complex.
I never said they were "troubled" or "inherit."
All I said was that it's more complex. Feelings after all, are.

Quote:

fireworks_god said:
Quote:

MagicHombre said:
It's not something you have to buy. It's purely mathematical.
The more variables you add, the more complex the equation becomes.




Yes, it is a matter of buying. Its a question of whether or not your "purely mathemtatical equation of variables" actually has any relevance, whether or not your conclusion regarding these variables is actually accurate.
You specifically stated that "the more variables, the more complex and difficult the relationship will be to stay together".

Again, if your description of the dynamics of the matter was accurate, the couple that always sat at home, not working, not doing anything, not even communicating together, would have the best chance of having a successful relationship, because things like jobs, activities, and expressing opinions and thoughts are variables.
Clearly, this doesn't make sense. Nowhere in reality is it implied that a relationship becomes increasingly complex and difficult with the more "variables" there are.



I believe you are misunderstanding...
My description of the "dynamics" is not a matter of "sitting at home, not working, not doing anything." It's a matter of adding more "dynamics" to an existing relationship in the form of other people and the multitude of emotions that come with people.
Quote:

What determines the actuality of the complexity and the difficulty is the motivations these individuals have for being together, their motivations for why they engage in these "variables", how they feel and what they think as a result, and how they manage all of this together with their partner(s).




And the more individuals, the more differences in motivations, the more difficult and complex the situation becomes.

Feel free to play the odds, but the house always wins.


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #12025728 - 02/14/10 04:31 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

fireworks_god said:
Quote:

lukeboots said:
What do you mean by "nothing inherently wrong" then?  Nothing is inherently wrong.




I never said "nothing inherently wrong".
I stated that there was nothing inherently at fault






Hair splitting.  I agree, I guess?


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: lukeboots]
    #12026366 - 02/14/10 09:45 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

lukeboots said:
Hair splitting.  I agree, I guess?




Not hairsplitting, but you deliberately chopping my post in half in ignorance of what I actually said.
The word "with" is a conjunction. This means I did not say simply "There is nothing inherently at fault".
This indicates that the meaning of that phrase is specifically conjoined and dependent upon that which is expressed through the conjunction.
The phrase doesn't mean anything, on its own, regarding the idea that I am expressing.

Even if I had said only that, the word "fault" has an entirely different meaning than the word "wrong" in the first place. :lol:
Reading comprehension certainly helps make the difference in terms of understanding. Trying to say that my argument is only that "it isn't wrong" or that "sex is natural" only demonstrates a fundamental lack of understanding on your part, especially evidenced by your insistence to not acknowledge what I actually said and augmented by your mistake in thinking the word "fault" has a similar meaning to the word "wrong".


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: MagicHombre]
    #12026398 - 02/14/10 09:56 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MagicHombre said:
I believe you are misunderstanding...
My description of the "dynamics" is not a matter of "sitting at home, not working, not doing anything." It's a matter of adding more "dynamics" to an existing relationship in the form of other people and the multitude of emotions that come with people.




Your description of dynamics, though, is exactly the same thing, as I simply don't see a quantitative difference between one member of a couple having a relationship with another person and that member having a job, in terms of how each can potentially effect the relationship.
Each is a variable representing a time commitment, an influence outside the relationship itself that nonetheless effects the relationship, etc. etc. etc.
My point is that adding a different person to the equation, in terms of how a relationship actually functions, is not necessarily any different than adding a job, a hobby, a tendency in behavior.
It is still a question of how the relationship is orientated - how it is that the people relate.
A relationship exists as the manifestation of how individuals relate to each other. Whether or not other variables actually make the relationship more difficult is determined by that, and not by any inherent quality of the variable itself.


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #12026399 - 02/14/10 09:56 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Picky picky.:satansmoking:


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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #12026743 - 02/14/10 11:10 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

fireworks_god said:
Quote:

MagicHombre said:
I believe you are misunderstanding...
My description of the "dynamics" is not a matter of "sitting at home, not working, not doing anything." It's a matter of adding more "dynamics" to an existing relationship in the form of other people and the multitude of emotions that come with people.



Your description of dynamics, though, is exactly the same thing, as I simply don't see a quantitative difference between one member of a couple having a relationship with another person and that member having a job, in terms of how each can potentially effect the relationship.




Wrong, it's not the same thing. If you don't see the difference between adding a job versus adding a person to a relationship, then I don't know what more I can say.  :shrug:

Quote:

Each is a variable representing a time commitment, an influence outside the relationship itself that nonetheless effects the relationship, etc. etc. etc.
My point is that adding a different person to the equation, in terms of how a relationship actually functions, is not necessarily any different than adding a job, a hobby, a tendency in behavior.
It is still a question of how the relationship is orientated - how it is that the people relate.
A relationship exists as the manifestation of how individuals relate to each other. Whether or not other variables actually make the relationship more difficult is determined by that, and not by any inherent quality of the variable itself.




Once again...

Quote:

MagicHombre said:
I believe you are misunderstanding...
My description of the "dynamics" is not a matter of "sitting at home, not working, not doing anything." It's a matter of adding more "dynamics" to an existing relationship in the form of other people and the multitude of emotions that come with people.




You may think that adding another person to a relationship is like adding a hobby, but you're wrong. A person is not a hobby. I'm not claiming that it can't be done. All I'm saying is that more people creates an invitation for more problems.

Take the pizza argument for example:
It is easier to come to an agreeable set of toppings with less people.
Less people have less suggestions.
The quantity of the equation makes it less complex.

Edited by MagicHombre (02/14/10 04:24 PM)

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Invisiblelukeboots
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #12026935 - 02/14/10 11:52 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

it's kinda hard to have a decent conversation with you when you expect everyone to have the exact same definitions of words with multiple definitions as you do, fg. i may have taken something you said slightly out of context, but that's usually how quoting works - and i certainly didn't do it to make your point convoluted. sorry i'm not so intellectually equipped as to have an opinion on human relationships.


regardless of your semantic nitpicking, I still think you're way off the mark. but i can't argue with you without my dictionary, so i'll save it for another time. :smile2:


Quote:

Icelander said:
Picky picky.:satansmoking:




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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: lukeboots]
    #12027608 - 02/14/10 01:50 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

While in theory I have noting against swinging, I've never once see it work out. Maybe I just hang out with the wrong people.:shrug:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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OfflineMagicHombre
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: Icelander]
    #12027620 - 02/14/10 01:52 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
While in theory I have noting against swinging, I've never once see it work out. Maybe I just hang out with the wrong people.:shrug:



Well said.


--------------------
The only thing I'm sure of is that you can't be sure of anything!

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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: lukeboots]
    #12029720 - 02/14/10 07:11 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

lukeboots said:
it's kinda hard to have a decent conversation with you when you expect everyone to have the exact same definitions of words with multiple definitions as you do, fg.




I don't recall expecting anything from anyone. What I do recall doing is pointing out a problem with your reading comprehension.
Both "wrong" and "fault" each do have multiple definitions, yet none of these definitions of the two words are overlapping. :shocked:
"Fault" denotes responsibility for a flaw, an error, a failing. "Wrong" indicates incorrectness or falsity.
Further, the word "fault" was modified in usage, so that we're instead speaking of "at fault", which distinguishes to a greater degree the fact that I'm referring to something being responsible or to blame.
Responsible or to blame for what? The discussion is directly concerning the question of whether or not such relationships function. My statement was within this context, and I even explicitly stated this before you proclaimed that it was only hair splitting and that what you were asserting I was saying was the same as what I was actually saying.

Obviously, there's no grounds for imagining I'm expecting everyone to have the exact same definitions of words with multiple definitions when the fact that these words have multiple definitions is completely irrelevant to your mix-up of the words and still irrelevant to the fact that the failure on your part to understand what I wrote has nothing to do with an exactitude of definition of one word, but rather how multiple words, modifiers and conjunctions, delineated precisely my intended meaning.

Quote:


i may have taken something you said slightly out of context




Ending a quote in mid-sentence to make it seem as if there was no difference between what you asserted that I said and what I was actually saying isn't taking something slightly out of context. Its not like you didn't realize that the conjunction which directly followed the part of the same sentence you did quote was specifically indicating that I was talking about something further than where you left off.



Quote:


sorry i'm not so intellectually equipped as to have an opinion on human relationships.




Why are you apologizing for a non-issue? This isn't regarding having an opinion on human relationships; this is specifically regarding the veracity of your opinion of what I said.

Quote:


regardless of your semantic nitpicking




Someone who doesn't understand what was said due to blurry comprehension would regard being unwavering in face of your blurriness as "semantic nitpicking". :wink:

Quote:


, I still think you're way off the mark.




I'm not surprised. :lol:

MagicHombre, I'll reply to you tomorrow. :grin:


--------------------
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If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
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Loving every breath of you

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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: MagicHombre]
    #12034996 - 02/15/10 04:05 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MagicHombre said:
Wrong, it's not the same thing. If you don't see the difference between adding a job versus adding a person to a relationship, then I don't know what more I can say.  :shrug:




I didn't say there wasn't a difference between these two things in general, but rather that they are exactly the same thing in terms of how each can potentially effect the relationship.
How the influence of a career can effect the actions and feelings of those involved in a relationship can potentially be equally devastating. Maybe even more sometimes.
Time demands and schedule conflicts, stress, insecurity regarding the other's co-workers, money issues....
What determines how difficult adding a certain variable will make the relationship? The specifics of the variable and what it means to those involved, due to their individual nature.

Quote:


You may think that adding another person to a relationship is like adding a hobby, but you're wrong. A person is not a hobby.




Obviously a person isn't a hobby, but I wasn't saying that a person was a hobby, and I didn't say that it was necessarily as easy to add another person to a relationship as it is to add as a simple hobby.
I'm simply saying that your description of the mechanics of the matter as one of pure mathematics, that adding another person inherently makes it more difficult for the relationship to function isn't in tune with the actuality of the matter.
The actuality of the matter is that how difficult it will be is only determined by the nature of those involved and how they feel regarding the relationship.
Adding another person isn't necessarily any more difficult than adding Saturday night bowling if the nature of those involved doesn't pose a problem.

Quote:


Take the pizza argument for example:
It is easier to come to an agreeable set of toppings with less people.
Less people have less suggestions.
The quantity of the equation makes it less complex.




And if someone else comes over for pizza and it just so happens that all of them have pretty much the same favorite toppings?
Well then, that'd prove my point that how difficult and how much harder it is for the relationship to function isn't determined by a simle mathematical equation of how many people, but rather the actual nature of those people involved and how that determines how the relationship will function. :cool:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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OfflineMagicHombre
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Re: Polyamory/ open Relationships? Any experience? Opinions? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #12035774 - 02/15/10 06:25 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

I can see your point, but I don't understand how you can't see mine, as simple as it is. :shrug:


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The only thing I'm sure of is that you can't be sure of anything!

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