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Re: For doubters of the DMT substrate method. [Re: wenowknow]
    #320711 -

I couldn't have said it better myself. I don't feel like I'm on trial from anyone else, Dirtmaster. I have nothing to prove, just information to share. You're absolutely right, by the way, I'd never extract DMT, 'cos it's against the law :)
But I have dreamed of it many times. I have dreamed also that DMT does not produce the desired effect in me, possibly because of high serotonin levels necessetating a psilocin pre-dose, but this remains to be seen. So, in my dreams, it is not worth extracting DMT or making Ayahuasca. But then I come across the passage in Tihkal which refers to Gartz's work. Now I know that the DMT that I have dreamed so much about has another use enhancing a sacrement that I know works on me. Work out why I'm interested. I'm not claiming invention or discovery of this mathod. If people try it and it works (which it will) then great. If they choose not to try it, then fine.

What sort of people are you used to talking too, Dirtmaster? Liars and cheats? Do you think everyone is like that?

If you doubt my long term interest in this issue, and would like to know some of the background to what I'm discussing, then I suggest you check out the board at dmt.lycaeum.org. You will see my name fairly often. Then come and talk to me, OK?

For interested parties I have found others who are doing the same thing, using Gartz as an exemplar:

http://spiritplants.yack.org/ubb/Forum5/HTML/000147.html

OK, and this one is a link to the earlier work done by Gartz on adding tryptamine in solution. I'm still having trouble getting hold of the later paper, but I think the DMT work was later than this. One of the last statement validates this method.

http://www.shroomery.org/findorgrowthem.php?View=docs&doc=72

The papers we want are:
Gartz, J. "Biotransformation of tryptamine derivatives in mycelial cultures of Psilocybe." Journal of Basic Microbiology 29(6): 347-352 (1989).
Gartz, J. "Biotransformation of tryptamine in fruiting mycelia of Psilocybe cubensis."
Planta Medica 55(3): 249-250 (1989).

I'll keep looking...


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Re: For doubters of the DMT substrate method. [Re: Explorer]
    #320842 -

I dont see why it is neccecary to get a purecrystal from of dmt.
Really once you go throuht all that trouble just smoke it.
I think you could just do a basic extraction what alchol or other organic solvent to get a crude from of dmt and add this to your sustrate. There is no need to acidify defat and basify. This cude form does have cotaminates but these are not the ones we care about. Obviously since you used alchol, or butane for the extraction every thing was killed.
The only problem is working with this crude cuz it will probably be sticky and difficult to estimated how much dmt you are actully adding. but hey your going to add it all anyway.



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Re: For doubters of the DMT substrate method. [Re: gusb232]
    #321077 -

This is true. To get the DMT part of an Ayahuasca brew an accepted method is to simply boil the root bark in acidified water, adding a pint or so at a time, keeping it at a rolliing boil for 30 minutes, then draining off the water and adding more until the water stops taking on the coloration of the root bark. All the extracts are then combined and simmered down until there is only 100mls left then put in an oven at 150<pi> degrees F in an oven dish. You are left with a waxy orange or brown material, which when used as Ayahuasca is reconstituted with water and drunk after syrian rue, or whatever, has kicked in. This waxy stuff could simply be added to the substrate, and should be pretty free of contams. It just means guesswork in the amounts, but, like you say, you're just going to spread out what you've got.


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Re: For doubters of the DMT substrate method. [Re: Explorer]
    #321212 -

yo dudes no need to get all defensive and shit we're just having a friendly animated discussion here, right?

i dream that the reason your dream-dmt doesn't work is that you haven't succeeded in an extraction. i dream that a sufficiently large dose real dmt will fuck up anyone. you're smoking some goo, in your dreams, but it's not dmt.


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Re: For doubters of the DMT substrate method. [Re: Dirtmaster]
    #321242 -

Well dreaming is all nice and stuff, but if you know some Dreams are real then you know your smoking DMT and not a Goo. Maybe you should dream about it a time or two, then share your Dreams with us. Love to hear it! Use QT's DMT Extraction Guide at http://digilander.iol.it/irimias/dmt_guide.html
Try it, you might suprise yourself. I'd say get some 5MeO-DMT before you go with DMT, As for dreams of smoking go. You can also learn how to smoke it right with the 5MeO-DMT, Before watseing Pure DMT.


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Re: For doubters of the DMT substrate method. [Re: Explorer]
    #321254 -

Maybe someone should try growing mycelium on phalaris grass, maybe even mix it with some dung for better fruiting.  Many people already use straw or dung/straw i assume that dried and pasturized phalaris grass would work out pretty well for a substrate and it has slightly more than modest amounts of DMT already packaged for the fungus.
I plan on trying this in a few, but others might try it as well to supplement results,
if you need some phalaris grass, for your cow to eat, I might be able to arrange that. (a stream near my home is lined with it)

I can see a world where this is no poverty and no war, I can also see us attacking that world because they would never expect it. :wink:


--------------------
Vote Jonnyshaggs in the next election for GOD...Its the responsible choice

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Re: For doubters of the DMT substrate method. [Re: jonnyshaggs420]
    #321526 -

What would happen if 200mg of DMT were added? Would you get more of the goods in the mushies?


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Re: For doubters of the DMT substrate method. [Re: Explorer]
    #321531 -

take a look at this ,you all madScientists.

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=Forum4&Number=90436&page=&view=&sb=&part=all&vc=1
ps. some links are broken


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Re: For doubters of the DMT substrate method. [Re: Hermes_br]
    #322227 -

OK. When I used the word dream it was to fit in with this board's legality policy.

In my country Ayahuasca is ssemi-legal, so that's OK. Let me know if anybody else has cooked up one Ayahuasca brew (my third) with 75 grams of Mimosa root bark for one dose. I have it on good authority that if DMT was going to work, that would have done the trick. The norm is 15 grams for a strong dose. Possibly due to naturally high serotonin levels, or low levels of serotonin receptors, in my brain, DMT does not work. DMT will not displace serotonin from receptor sites (Psilocin will), but it will displace psilocin - hence my idea to predose on shrroms.

I'm not bigging myself up, Dirtmaster, I do actually know what I'm talking about vis DMT extraction. Fine crystals smelling like a burnt tyre indiicate its presence pretty undeniably. If I smoked 180mgs in a freebase pipe and got nothing more than the initial rush, and others have used my product to great effect, I would say that's conclusive. AND theres documented evidence (Rick Strassman - DMT The Spirit Molecule) of people in studies given IV injections and not feeling an effect. "Some people are just wired like that" Is what he says.

My ability or inability to feel the effects of exogenous DMT do not affect my ability to read, and as I have so often said - I did not try this and find it works, I found others talking about it (Shulgin, Gartz etc.) saying it would work and describing how it works. I thought I'd share this prior to trying it, which in hindsight was probably a mistake. Mind you, would Dirtmaster have believed me anyway?


Sorry, Hermes, i just read that link. Nuff said. I knew we weren't the first. I do like the post that says "As most of you may know, DMT is converted to psilocin alot quicker than tryptamine..." Its all in there.

Take a look Dirtmaster. IO think there's little need for further talk about this except to discuss results. We know for a fact that it works, right?

Edited by Explorer on 05/21/01 06:06 AM.


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Re: For doubters of the DMT substrate method. [Re: Explorer]
    #323112 -

yo, where the fuck is the proof in that thread that adding dmt to substrate would increase potency? huh?

it's a long thread, i might have missed it, but i think you misread some of the stuff about tryptamine and det.

you understand so little of chemistry you can't evaluate these texts.

we do not know for a fact adding dmt to substrate will increase potency. post a link here to a scientific study proving it and i will admit it. until then this is all just speculation.


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Re: For doubters of the DMT substrate method. [Re: Dirtmaster]
    #323186 -

bad news:
according to this research that analyzed the incorporation of radiolabeled intermediates, while is indeed an intermediate and the presence of DMT in vivo could possibly increase psilocybin/psilocin production, the fact is that it is not incorporated into the organism very well.

how do attach a pdf file?i think this board will this only accept gifs and jpegs
until then, you'll have to take my word for it.

more specifically:
a biosynthetic sequence from tryptophan to psilocybin
departments of pharmacognosy and chemistry, royal pharmaceutical institute, sweden 1967
"tryptamine, whcih is readily formed from tryptophan by P. cubensis, serves as a better precursor of psilocybin than tryptophan. N-methyltryptamine is a still better progenitor of psilocybin, but n, n dimethyltryptamine is rather poorly incorporated as judged from the dilution factors, however, if the poor absorbtion of this compound by the fungus, less than 5%, is taken into account, the high dilution factor does not make it an unlikely intermediate."

if you want, i can email the article to anyone via a pdf attachment



c12h16n24ohdmt

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