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Offlinebignorm
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PFTEK-pinning
    #3159479 - 09/21/04 01:32 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Hello
The PFTEK clearly indicates that the best time to remove the cakes from the jars
is when the cakes begin to pin in the jar....however most if not all members of this
forum indicate that the jars should be removed when fully colonized before pinning
and allowed to start pinning outside the jars..

what gives???? and what advice should I follow...

thanks


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OfflineCornelius
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: bignorm]
    #3159534 - 09/21/04 01:52 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

I think it's best to remove the cakes before there is pinning occuring, however sometimes the timing may not be right and pins begin to form in the jar. This could be because the jars are 100% colonized, or it could be because the jars recieved too much light and are pinning prematurely.

The best rule of thumb is when the substrate within the jar is entirely covered with white mycelium, leave it another 4-5 days to ensure the centre of the cake is colonized and then birth. If pins hav started forming when that time comes, then it's no big deal. I think it's onlt an issue if you want to dunk before your first flush - in that case then you would have to remove the pins first. Personally, I only dunk/coldshock after the first flush.


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Offlinehyphae
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: bignorm]
    #3160304 - 09/21/04 04:35 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Once 100% is achieved that is the time to initiate pinning. #1 you are then using the 100% survival instinct trigger along with your pinning triggers all of which will kick it in the ass big time as far as pinning. #2 you are IME only wasting precious fruiting time by waiting for pins. When I did cakes I always dunked right off the bat which increased yields every single time, I also removed all pins/mycelium bits/matter with running water under the faucet before placing them into the dunk. I also fridge dunk too and it's never hurt a thing and has only helped IMHO. GL hope all goes well!


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Offlinebignorm
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: bignorm]
    #3164351 - 09/22/04 01:12 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

ok thanks for the tips.... I will birth 12 cakes today....


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Offlinehyphae
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: bignorm]
    #3165107 - 09/22/04 04:00 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Now 100% means about 4-5 days after the outside of the cake is colonized the only exception is if you do a center innoculation. GL


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Offlinemeanoldman
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: bignorm]
    #3165179 - 09/22/04 04:19 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Do like the instructions say:

Let them pin in the jars before birthing.

You will still get more pins than can grow into big fruits.

Nothing is gained by earliest possible birthing.

They will be stronger and more contamination resistant if you leave them in jar until pinning.

They will pin NO sooner if you take them out earlier, but you will give them extra time to either dry out a bit, or become saturated becasue you haven't got your humidifier setup dialed in right.


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Offlinehyphae
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: meanoldman]
    #3165284 - 09/22/04 04:47 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

"They will pin NO sooner if you take them out earlier"
I totally disagree as they certainly will pin sooner as long as they are 100% colonized. FACT!!! You definitely don't have let them pin invitro that was only suggested by the professor because it increases a newbies chance for success especially with the PFC strain. Experienced growers are enjoying a nice pinset while others are still waiting for knotting to happen. I learned this early in my mycology training. This especially goes for casing initiation :wink: GL guys!


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Offlinecandykid420
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: hyphae]
    #3165303 - 09/22/04 04:53 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

People say so many different things:

"they need light to begin pinning in the jars"
"dont expose them to light until after they colonize, the introduce it to initiate pinning"
"they will pin in the jar in complete darkness"

(not actual qoutes, but you get the idea)


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Invisiblegeorge castanzaM
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: hyphae]
    #3165460 - 09/22/04 05:30 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

hyphae said:
"They will pin NO sooner if you take them out earlier"
I totally disagree as they certainly will pin sooner as long as they are 100% colonized. FACT!!! You definitely don't have let them pin invitro that was only suggested by the professor because it increases a newbies chance for success especially with the PFC strain. Experienced growers are enjoying a nice pinset while others are still waiting for knotting to happen. I learned this early in my mycology training. This especially goes for casing initiation :wink: GL guys!



:thumbup:


--------------------



     
Quote:

pftek said:Impossible to clean everything right now. Maybe in a week.





ROTHBURY

:pm:


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Offlinemeanoldman
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: hyphae]
    #3169318 - 09/23/04 11:32 AM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

hyphae said:
"They will pin NO sooner if you take them out earlier"
I totally disagree as they certainly will pin sooner as long as they are 100% colonized. FACT!!! You definitely don't have let them pin invitro that was only suggested by the professor because it increases a newbies chance for success especially with the PFC strain. Experienced growers are enjoying a nice pinset while others are still waiting for knotting to happen. I learned this early in my mycology training. This especially goes for casing initiation :wink: GL guys!




Not in my experience, which is plenty. Just for shits and giggles, birth half as soon as they are all white, wait (for pins in jar) on the other half. I doubt there will be a significant difference between them as to the day you pick fruits. Unles you leave them in complete dark, which you should not do with PF cakes in jar.

this guy is obviously a newby, the biggest concern for him is being successful. Follow the instructions, it's that simple. After you have expereince, feel free to experiment and devaite from the formula.

"this especially goes for casings" how the F do you pin casings in a jar? If it's still in the jar, it ain't a casing yet is it dude?


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Offlinehyphae
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: meanoldman]
    #3169657 - 09/23/04 01:21 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

I'm talking initiation timing meanoldman. Also YOU do not want to birth IMO as soon as your cakes are totally covered on the outside, you should wait a few more days for 100% colonization and utilize the survival trigger. And I'll tell you another thing incubating in the dark is a good thing reguardless if it is suggested by the professor or not, this helps by giving you your light trigger for pinning and some strains really love it. It's all relative meanoldman it doesn't take long to grow shroom in optimum conditions so a day or two saved is just that a day or two. You need to focus on what I'm saying not on discrediting someone dude! GL meanoldman


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Invisiblegeorge castanzaM
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: hyphae]
    #3169725 - 09/23/04 01:47 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

hyphae said:
I'm talking initiation timing meanoldman. Also YOU do not want to birth IMO as soon as your cakes are totally covered on the outside, you should wait a few more days for 100% colonization and utilize the survival trigger. And I'll tell you another thing incubating in the dark is a good thing reguardless if it is suggested by the professor or not, this helps by giving you your light trigger for pinning and some strains really love it. It's all relative meanoldman it doesn't take long to grow shroom in optimum conditions so a day or two saved is just that a day or two. You need to focus on what I'm saying not on discrediting someone dude! GL meanoldman



:thumbup:

could not agree more :shocked:




:rockon: :rockon: :rockon: :rockon: :rockon: :rockon: :rockon: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :zoom: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :scrambled: :sinister: :tongue2:


--------------------



     
Quote:

pftek said:Impossible to clean everything right now. Maybe in a week.





ROTHBURY

:pm:


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Offlinemeanoldman
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: george castanza]
    #3169926 - 09/23/04 02:35 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

There is no initiation timing with PF cakes. They colonize, when they have run out of new food, they pin.

Application of casing techniques is not necessary, that is why the PF tek is so great for newbies. They don't need darkness, they don't need pinning triggers.

For a total newbie, the best advise is to follow the instructions to the letter. Telling them to "change this, don't do that, modify this" can get them into trouble really quick. Just do it by the book, later on when they have learned a thing or two, modify to your heart's content.


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Invisiblegeorge castanzaM
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: meanoldman]
    #3169989 - 09/23/04 02:50 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

meanoldman said:

For a total newbie, the best advise is to follow the instructions to the letter. Telling them to "change this, don't do that, modify this" can get them into trouble really quick. Just do it by the book, later on when they have learned a thing or two, modify to your heart's content.




point well taken...

sound advice :thumbup:


--------------------



     
Quote:

pftek said:Impossible to clean everything right now. Maybe in a week.





ROTHBURY

:pm:


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Offlinehyphae
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: meanoldman]
    #3170010 - 09/23/04 02:58 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Whether myc is in a tray or log or jar it doesn't matter It's the myc we're triggering not the jar and it does help! LOL Also the newbie teks since 1991 have changed slighty meanoldman and I'll be the first to say changed for the better. We're not changing anything that a newbie cannot easily handle, Over time things have way of being improved upon just like not leaving your holes taped or flipping the jars or double end casing or dunking or......


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Invisiblegeorge castanzaM
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: meanoldman]
    #3170047 - 09/23/04 03:08 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

meanoldman said:
There is no initiation timing with PF cakes. They colonize, when they have run out of new food, they pin. 

Application of casing techniques is not necessary, that is why the PF tek is so great for newbies. They don't need darkness, they don't need pinning triggers.





1) not true
2)not true

kramer just finished an experiment on invitro...and harvesting of birthed dunked and rolled cakes over(lucky for us 1 left over)came before the jar even pinned

to note:
1:all cakes were incubated in total darkness
2:light was  :sun:
3:10 temp drop was used
4:cakes were rolled and sprayed
5:i could probably think of all the variables but i won't :tongue2:

try it you'll like it! :thumbup:


--------------------



     
Quote:

pftek said:Impossible to clean everything right now. Maybe in a week.





ROTHBURY

:pm:


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InvisibleSam1912
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: meanoldman]
    #3246726 - 10/12/04 12:06 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Sorry for bringing on old subject, but I had to say something on Hyphae's behalf.

1. Don't tell other people to not give sound advice. Hyphae is generous with advice unlike you, meanoldman. If you want to control the available information or promote false propaganda, go work for the DEA or NIDA.

2. You don't know shit about newbies. Just because you were a piece of shit newbie in the past, that doesn't mean we are too. So go F88K yourself!

3. Pictures speak thousand words(sorry.. wife took my camera, had to use my webcam)





That's 12 days from inoculation(MSI) on first grow using Hyphae's and others' advices. That's right, 12 days from inoculation, not birthing!

How do you like them apples!! It'll pin in a day or two so you can stick your stuck up, crazy, DEA wannabe comments to yourself!

There.. I said my piece.

Sam


--------------------
Protect your civil rights!  End drug prohibition.  And if you don't care about your civil rights, protect mine!

If you want a rating from me, please PM me.  For those really newbies, don't expect an answer back, but you can try me anyways.


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Invisiblewoodzmun
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: Sam1912]
    #3246771 - 10/12/04 12:24 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Yeah I would have to agree with Hyphae, improvements are made over time. If not, just one example we would still be riding around in model T Fords. I have learned from reading these posts that vast improvements have been made on the original PF tek and if any of the vets offer suggestions I take them gratefully. As should anyone who values experienced insight. Good job there Sam looks like you will be having some fun in a week or two.  :thumbup:


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InvisibleSam1912
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: woodzmun]
    #3246841 - 10/12/04 12:51 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Just wanted to add that Hyphae has the best pinning strategies. Thanx, dude!

Sam


--------------------
Protect your civil rights!  End drug prohibition.  And if you don't care about your civil rights, protect mine!

If you want a rating from me, please PM me.  For those really newbies, don't expect an answer back, but you can try me anyways.


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OfflineTheChiaPetFarmer
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Re: PFTEK-pinning [Re: Sam1912]
    #3246932 - 10/12/04 01:18 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Amen. Listen to hyphae.


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