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Offlinedeff
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #3148968 - 09/17/04 05:41 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Playing guitar to thrill others and in turn boost self recognition = the ego

Playing guitar to communicate within yourself; a form of self expression onto itself, whether or not anyone hears it = the ego to a much lesser degree.

The reason you feel that this isn't worth giving up is because the part of you responsible for that behaviour pattern wants to extend it's lifespan, the moment, to reach infinity - which is the internal desire of the infinite parts of the universe, to themselves become the cause of there own existence, to become formless. I realize you may not appreciate me group us all into one category here in this example of words, but that is because the ego holds to individuality, that we are seperate, which is the very thing preventing use from becoming whole within ourselves and dissolved among the infinity.

Sorry, words cannot adequately describe my thoughts of this matter. But let go and hold on to the void until you are the void, and you will never be more blissful.


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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #3149007 - 09/17/04 05:49 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Excellent post Jiggy! ^^

"I understand droz
I guess I missed the history in which it became fun not to understand"

yeah its alot of fun...  :confused:

i really dont get it man, but im glad you do.

Specifically i dont know how attacking the 'ego' as a generality can be 'personal' by definition (as the EGO is not a person)
and additionally i dont know what 'schemes' people are furthering by discussing the ego.
Nor do i understand the phrase "the ego can never need's to be touched"

lastly i dont understand why Droz wants us to end this discussion?

if anyone can clarify these things id apreciate it.

I never misunderstand for fun. (conciously)

:crazy:


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Everything I post is fiction.


Edited by Moonshoe (09/17/04 05:51 PM)


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OfflineElfWizard
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: Moonshoe]
    #3149050 - 09/17/04 05:59 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

ok Evil is just a prospective but I must say Keep ego under control but do not do away with it. I know we are what and who we are for a reason we might not understand why at the moment but I once again say The universe knows more then we do and removing something only lessens ourselves understanding and moderation are the key to most everything


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"Fear is the Mind Killer"
Frank Herbert's Dune

"Shoot straight, conserve ammo and never cut a deal with a dragon"
Shadowrun street Proverb

To announce there must be no critisism of the president or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong is not only unpatriotic and servile but is morally treasonous to the american public
Pres. Theodore Roosevelt


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
jiggy
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: deff]
    #3149058 - 09/17/04 06:01 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

appearantly words are not decribing my thoughts either. LOL

I didn't say why you play the guitar is an ego thing. I said making the statment of being a guitar player is a sefl defining thisg to do. See the difference.

You talk like you gave up the ego, self definitions. I see the name deff on your posts. I bet it has personal meaning to you to. Of course, that's not related to the ego. (playful sarcasm.)

You use def to function in this society, and this is a point I am making.

I've said this before and I will say it again because it is good. people tend to confuse individuation with separation. I don't.

When you take a drop of water from the ocean, you have an individual piece of the ocean water but it is still made up of the same exact stuff. We are the one individuated not separate from the one.

You can be an individuation of the one and unique via experience simply because of focussed perception and by experiencing a fragment reflection of yourself from your creations as you create bit by bit and retaining memory of it.

Its not that giving up my individuation is not worth it. I would have to beleive that I was truly separate from the whole of one to even have something to give up in exhange for oneness.

I can be an individuation of the one and experience oneness. There is nothing to give up at this point. Before it, what you give up is the belief in separation. I've already done that.

What is reaching infinity? If you compare yourself with an idea of the infinite and your finiteness then you are coming from an egoic place. I am not spiritually finite. i consider myself to be spiritually infinite and in choice of experiencing myself in finite capacities, bodies, realms, and percpetions.

Hue Hue said this one and I agreed. it seem everyone is trying to bust out of here and we are trying to break in. I must be coming from a backwards perspective. LOL

I have to learn to avoid getting involved in posts on the ego. LOL


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Offlinerecalcitrant
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: deff]
    #3149077 - 09/17/04 06:06 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Thats trash. "let go, let go"

"be nirvana"

Do you write self help books?

Sorry to be indignant but common.

We aren't the borg over here. We cannot access the collective unconsious and enjoy thematic opulence. We're just people. If you, as ONE person, can meditate or do any sort of activity to prostration and recieve a flood of endorphines, GREAT. As I said in another post relating the physical universe to spiritual counterparts, that might even be the scientific explanation of your access to the divine.

But if you think that telling people to "let go" and "be at peace" is going to further the cause that is the human race, you're full of shit. We need more evil, controlling, conspiratory organizations like the freemasons, hells angels, Fox Mulders US gov't. Because without them we'd be frolicking in grassy fields wearing toga's and fucking all day.

Personally I'd rather see us humans achieve something. Something like the creation of AI in our own image, capable of creating better AI, endowed with the spirit of exploration and discovery that our infinite universe begs to have witnessed. We need to make that imprint on the universe.

Sure the ego is making it hard for us. Sure those dumbasses in the middle east, with their selfish problems are delaying our progress. Same can be said of those dumbasses in Africa with their selfish fuck fest. Unforunatly, Hitler didn't win WW2, we didn't get to establish a society with common history and goals. We're forced to use the American way to further our endeavors, and its a hell of a lot better than sitting around meditating to endorphic pleasureville.


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We have to answer our own prayers


Edited by recalcitrant (09/17/04 06:09 PM)


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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: recalcitrant]
    #3149133 - 09/17/04 06:22 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

^^^^^

:crazy:



Hehehe

well ya know, we gotta respect human diversity eh? to each their own

personally im not even gonna touch the above case, a job like that you gotta be paid to do. (kinda like being an outhouse cleaner)

i Gotta advise deff and whoever else hes talking about not to feel offended or take this guy seriously.


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Everything I post is fiction.


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Offlinedeff
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: recalcitrant]
    #3149144 - 09/17/04 06:24 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

With that attitude you are :smile:

Sorry if it sounds corny, as it probably does to many here, but that is because you attatched that meaning. These are merely words, do with them what you wish :smile:

Sorry I misunderstood you post jiggy, thought you were implying something else, that functioning in this society (even playing a guitar) is purely for ego gratification.

Ego is a word. This is often forgotten. It has a unique meaning based on the individual, however I urge everyone to examine themselves, their actions, and the precursors for them, to get the the true intersection of external and internal, the self. Results will vary.

I do not try to sound like a self help book, or imply I'm "egoless". I've attatched the word ego to the false traits of self that I have consciously become aware of and let go of, although obviously I am still an individual. I am just saying, striving for individuality, atleast in my view, is a falsitude of my definition of ego. The whole point of examining one's ego is for self improvement, not on a physical level so much as removing that which hinders your true self from shining through. It is completely dependant on the person, as it is their own subconscious manifestation, their own maze to naviagte through. However, although it probably offers little to many, I will say that through my experiences with this sort of self analyzation, I have to say that only positive has come from it, or rather, the illusions of negativity have faded to emerge the perfect state that is the here and now, unchanging, forever and never. Do whatever you wish, as this is your experience, you are your own God.

I'm just trying to help, not to raise myself above others as some seem to get the impression, but rather because I care, seriously. I see so many identical personas in our society, people worrying needlessly, illusional suffering, when really - these are distractions from the grand show.

You guys exist inside me, as I exist inside you. The veil cannot be broken, only dissolved. One day we will all return and realize we were a single entity eexperiencing itself parallel to itself, that all is perfect. But, who wants to give up a name for that...


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OfflineGomp
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: deff]
    #3149232 - 09/17/04 06:48 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

?But, who wants to give up a name for that... ?
What if it's not about giving up your name, but accepting all the others? :P
A way to see it, is may be the way to see it?

I say that like i.e. im Geir, and you are Nils and he is Trond
Then geir is geir but also nils and trond
and trond is trond but also nils and geir
and nils would be nils but also geir and trond.

now this is an example as if it only were 3 persons/entities/?whateveryoucalit? in the entire galaxy. but if you see the big picture of this, it might even explain the subconscious thought you may get at times ;P


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
jiggy
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: deff]
    #3149256 - 09/17/04 06:56 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Wow,

Looks like a lot of consufion lies just around our intrpetation of the word ego. Damn! I see it as a self defining tool with a specialized purpose for self creation and realization very useful in these realms of self exploration all the while all the while you guys were wrapped up in exploring the emotional attachment, gratification, separation side of it.

I just don't understand this journey to source when we already are source becoming instead of being. I don't understand what you meant by struggling to become an individual. Whats the struggle if you allready are?

Even if you could have your consciousness, mental and emotional, experience itself as being within the whole of existance all at the same time, YOU would still be an individual in that experience.

You can't separate the macro from the micro. they are one indivduated.

With all of this said, I have to agree with recal on something ( i relate to the "I am my own god" avatar too. Lookey here, there are planets where everyone is all blissed out and slugg like just drooling all over themselves in their one love sublimity.

To each his own. Planet earth is all about what we can accomplish as co-creative beings to further the cause of self realisation via accomplishments and the fullfillment it brings.

Here, It's not about I AM or even just being the am of the one. It's about I CAN. At least to me. What can i become, what can I create, what can I do, what can know and feel in this density? It's about creating limits and pushing them.

Like recal said, if the world got together to realise what it can do collectively as individuals, that would be a powerful experience. Yes, I want hang around to experience that for sure. eternity can wait.


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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OfflineGreat Scott
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: Scarfmeister]
    #3149354 - 09/17/04 07:21 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Looks like a lot of long answers here
So I'll keep this short

The only time i wont be needing my ego is when my body is dead. Untill then, I'll just keep it in my "awareness" that the ego is not the true self, all sepparation is illusion, and all is ONE.
But personally, for me, in my day to day life, i cannot abandon my ego entirely, or else i loose all perspective and point of view, and start to go nuts. I mean, really really FUCKIN NUTS.

And this isnt to say that a well trained buddhist monk shouldnt try to be ego-less. By all means, if he can handle it, then he should DEFINITELY do it.
But i am too weak minded and young (18 yrs old) to dissasociate myself with the ego.


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:thumbup: :thumbdown:


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InvisibleSkorpivoMusterion
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: Scarfmeister]
    #3149596 - 09/17/04 08:35 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

And now.. The SkorpivoMusterion's turn:

First of all, the mind is an instrument, a tool. It is there to be used for a specific task, and when the task is completed, you lay it down. As it is, I would say about 80 to 90 percent of most people?s thinking is not only repetitive and useless, but because of its dysfunctional and often negative nature, much of it is also harmful. Observe your mind and you will find this to be true. It causes a serious leakage of vital energy.

This kind of compulsive thinking is actually an addiction. What characterizes an addiction? Quite simply this: you no longer feel that you have the choice to stop. It seems stronger than you. It also gives you a false sense of pleasure, pleasure than invariably turns into pain.

Chorus: Why should we be addicted to thinking?

Because you are identified with it, which means you derive your sense of self from the content and activity of your mind. Because you believe that you would cease to be if you stopped thinking. As you grow up, you form a mental image of who you are, based on your personal and cultural conditioning. We may call this phantom self the ego. It consists of mind activity and can only be kept going through constant thinking. The term ego means different things to different people, but when I use it here it means a false self, created by unconscious identification with the mind.

As I?ve pointed out before; to the ego, the present moment hardly exists. Only past and future are considered important. This total reversal of the truth accounts for the fact that in the ego mode the mind is so dysfunctional. It is always concerned with keeping the past alive, because without it ? who are you? It constantly projects itself into the future to ensure its continued survival and to seek some kind of release or fulfillment there. It says: ?One day, when this, that, or the other happens, I am going to be okay, happy, at peace.? Even when the ego seems to be concerned with the present, it is not the present that it sees: It misperceives it completely because it looks at it through the eyes of the past. Or it reduces the present as a means to an end, an end that always lies in the mind-projected future. Observe your mind and you?ll see that this is how it works.

Someone asked: What would happen to our creativity?


Creativity, love, inner peace and joy arise from beyond the mind. They are the natural states of Being, which is your very innermost essential essence. You will feel a subtle emanation of joy arising from deep within in your most internally peaceful and enlightened state: the joy of Being.
When you do use your mind, and particularly when a creative solution is needed, you oscillate every few minutes or so between thought and stillness, between mind and no-mind. No-mind is consciousness without thought. Only in that way is it possible to think creatively, because only in that way does thought have any real power. Thought alone, when it is no longer connected with the much vaster realm of consciousness, quickly becomes barren, insane, destructive.

The mind is essentially a survival machine. Attack and defense against other minds, gathering, storing, and analyzing information ? this is what it is good at, but it is not at all creative. All true artists, whether they know it or not, create from a place of no-mind, from inner stillness. The mind then gives form to the creative impulse or insight. Even the great scientists have reported that their creative breakthroughs came at a time of mental quietude. The surprising result of a nation-wide inquiry among America?s most eminent mathematicians, including Einstein, to find out their working methods, was that thinking ?plays only a subordinate part in the brief, decisive phase of the creative act of itself.? So I would say that the simple reason why the majority of scientists are not creative is not because they don?t know how to think but because they don?t know how to stop thinking!



Someone said: If you are going to go as far as to look at what is wrong and bad with ego, you will limit yourself if you do not also look at what is good and right with ego.


When it comes to the ego, there is an inescapable dualism.
Whereas with love, joy and peace are deep states of Being or rather three aspects of the state of inner connectedness with Being. As such, they have no opposite. This is because they arise from beyond the mind.
Emotions, [From Latin emovere, ?to disturb?] on the other hand, being part of the dualistic mind, are subject to the law of opposites. This simply means that you cannot have good without bad. So in the unenlightened, mind-identified condition, what is sometimes wrongly called joy is the usually short-lived pleasure side of the continuously alternating pain/pleasure cycle. Pleasure is always derived from something outside you, whereas joy arises from within. The very thing that gives you pleasure today will give you pain tomorrow, or it will leave you, so its absence will give you pain. And what is often referred to as love may be pleasurable and exciting for a while, but it is an addictive clinging, an extremely needy condition that can turn into its opposite at the flick of a switch. Many ?love? relationships, after the initial euphoria has passed, actually oscillate between ?love? and hate, attraction and attack.
Real love doesn?t make you suffer. How could it? It doesn?t suddenly turn into hate, nor does real joy turn into pain. As I said, even before you are enlightened ? before you have freed yourself from your mind ? you may get glimpses of true joy, true love, or of a deep inner peace, still but vibrantly alive. These are aspects of your true nature, which is usually obscured by the mind. Even within a ?normal? addictive relationship, there can be moments when the presence of something more genuine, something incorruptible, can be felt. But they will only be glimpses, soon to be covered up again through mind interference. It may then seem that you had something very precious and lost it, or your mind may convince you that it was all an illusion anyway. The truth is that it wasn?t an illusion, and you cannot lose it. It is a part of your natural state, which can be obscured but can never be destroyed by the mind. Even when the sky is heavily overcast, the sun hasn?t disappeared. It?s still there on the other side of the clouds.

All cravings are the mind seeking salvation or fulfillment in external things and in the future as a substitute for the joy of Being. As long as I am in my mind, I am those cravings, those needs, wants, attachments, and aversions, and apart from them there is no ?I? except as a mere possibility, an unfulfilled potential, a seed that has not yet sprouted. In that state, even my desire to become free or enlightened is just another craving for fulfillment or completion in the future. So don?t seek to become free of desire or ?achieve? enlightenment. Become present. Be there as the observer of the mind. Instead of quoting the Buddha, be the Buddha, be ?the awakened one,? which is what the word buddha means.

As Fireworks pointed out, suffering and pain is inevitable as long as you are identified with your mind, which is to say as long as you are unconscious, spiritually speaking. I am talking here primarily of emotional pain, which is also the main cause of physical pain and physical disease. Resentment, hatred, self-pity, guilt, anger, depression, jealousy, and so on, even the slightest irritation, are all forms of pain. And every pleasure or emotional high contains within itself the seed of pain: its inseparable opposite, which will manifest in time, which in itself is an illusion, [time] which creates detrimental illusions.
Anybody who has ever taken drugs to get ?high? will know that the high eventually turns into a low, that the pleasure turns into some form of pain. Many people also know from their own experience how easily and quickly an intimate relationship can turn from a source of pleasure to a source of pain. Seen from a higher perspective, both the negative and the positive polarities are faces of the same coin, are both part of the underlying pain that is inseparable from the mind-identified egoic state of consciousness.



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Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.


Edited by SkorpivoMusterion (09/17/04 09:50 PM)


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
jiggy
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: SkorpivoMusterion]
    #3149922 - 09/17/04 10:20 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

To Skorpio and fireworks,

This has almost come full circle. Work with me here, please because you botrh understand up to this point and anyone else who does for that matter.

Okay, when the ego is removed from play, you are most intune with your creative essense-I agree with that and everything everyone has said to this point.

What is it that motivates one to become creative, to create experiences, and what not without the ego seeking self gratification?

I want to hear from as many who have ideas, what is the motivation for doing anything, if not, to satisfy or gratify the ego , sense of self in some way?

I have my own theories and understanding, and i feel it is important that people question this for themselves, if they understand this far.

It has to do with what motivates creation in the non polar fields of consciousness which is merging with ours.


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #3150015 - 09/17/04 10:52 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Okay, when the ego is removed from play, you are most intune with your creative essense-I agree with that and everything everyone has said to this point.
who said removed, the surf keeps breaking on the beach - the ego keeps operating - it is integral, one merely attunes to what is happenning beyond the scope of ego, between the frames of the movie

What is it that motivates one to become creative, to create experiences, and what not without the ego seeking self gratification?
so we look at a more gratifying gratification, such as having some discipline, like yoga for instance - or styudying something difficult

I want to hear from as many who have ideas, what is the motivation for doing anything, if not, to satisfy or gratify the ego , sense of self in some way?

true, but in cultivating self one comes full circle, and remains as a guide for more pruning, steering etc. ego continues to operate but with better culture - more connected - this elemet becomes part of the ego itself

I have my own theories and understanding, and i feel it is important that people question this for themselves, if they understand this far.

It has to do with what motivates creation in the non polar fields of consciousness which is merging with ours.

there is always much more in between the frames of ego play than inside the frames, so let them be part of life then it is richer


Edited by redgreenvines (09/17/04 10:55 PM)


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #3150173 - 09/17/04 11:51 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

who said removed? tons of people here are out to become egoless. That would be the removal of it wouldn't it?

I was just agreeing with the possible varience of this subject to keep it moving.

I liked your take on this, so true to your style!  :thumbup:

It's hard to explain to people how we are flash framing between ego awareness and oneness awareness, but are only conscious in the ego one. We never lost it or left it, it is still there serving us on this journey.

There is something called meta reality, the betwixt and in between, where this flash flaming begins to open up and you get the glimpses as you said red.

I didn't mean to put anyone on the spot. I wonder if people who are striving for egoless understand what they are actually talking about. Sure, you can remove beleifs of duality and separation from it, but the full on removal of it????????

I would like to hear a description of what would motivate creation without it? I can't come up with one answer, even one as divine as serving others, where the motivation is still not related to being gratified by serving others.

Sure, you could say it's the spirit or soul self that is experiencing that gratification, but it is the ego that is realising it, driving you to it.

I will answer my own question. I have pondered often what it is that will motivate us creatively when we are fully beyond separation duality perception. The only thing that I came up with is appreciation for creation itself.

I think relation or relating falls into here as well. We can relate to others through their creations and we can relate ourselves to others through ours. The motivation in this case is the desire to feel at one ment while individuated.

There is this "new" idea that we are actually moving into multiplicity and not oneness. I think it is meant to mean that as we move into multi percpetable abilities, the desire for oneness will cease as it will be realised to be as it always was.


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #3150860 - 09/18/04 04:31 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

gettinjiggywithit said:
Looks like a lot of consufion lies just around our intrpetation of the word ego. Damn! I see it as a self defining tool with a specialized purpose for self creation and realization very useful in these realms of self exploration all the while all the while you guys were wrapped up in exploring the emotional attachment, gratification, separation side of it. 




Indeed, I mentioned this a couple of times, including my own definitions for what I use the word ego as, and even asking everyone else to define their usage of it. What I have said regarding ego only applies to my defintion of the word, and it cannot be understood when someone has an all-together different definition that they are allowing to play a part in their analyzing of my words.

To attempt to define what I consider to be the ego once again, in the context that I have been referring to it, the ego is essentially a computer program: an unconscious complex that exists to force us to act instinctively when we are presented with an immediate threat to our survival. The ego is not the self, it is merely a program that is to aid in the survival of the self.

The ego is involved with interpreting signals coming in from our inputs, which it then analyzes to identify any threats to us. It also decides which signals require our focus and attention, and to what degree.

Also, I do suposse that the ego is involved with defining signals and making distinctions between everything, including distinctions between self and the external world (as if such a thing actually exists, all is one :grin:). Perhaps it is this function that you think is being referred to when one talks of working past the ego into higher consciousness... and perhaps some people actually do refer to this function when they mention it, but I assure you that I am not reffering to this, although it is true that the more someone ascends into higher consciousness, the more this function will shut down, as one is effectively merging into the universe.

However, personally, it is my interest to get to a point where I am free of the constrains of ego, but still being able to lead my own life as I prefer, and distinguishing objects from each other is still a necessity. Of course, of any of the ego's functions, this one is by far the least harmful anyways, as long as it isn't implying more meaning or seperation than is actually necessary (for example, say someone sees a black person and starts judging this person based on their race - their ego is obviously out of control :wink:)

Anyways, what I am mostly referring to is the first two functions I referred to, when the ego forces us to take certain actions because it is misinterpreting situations as actual, immediate, life or death situations (as it does all the time), and when it filters out incoming signals that further seperate us from the moment and the experience.

I am not going to completely go into my position again, as I have clearly done so repeatedly up there, so I will ask that you consider how I am using the word ego, and what specifically it is about the ego that I am referring to, and then re-read (or actually read for the first time :lol:) what I have said, taking care to not let other defintions of the word ego I am not referring to cloud your perspective...


I must say that is an excellent post, Skorpivo, you have said everything I've tried to say so much more effectively and efficently, including some stuff I didn't think of or didn't get to. :thumbup:

Quote:

gettinjiggywithit said:
What is it that motivates one to become creative, to create experiences, and what not without the ego seeking self gratification?




Well, I think it is entirely possible to act without the motivation of the ego seeking self gratification. Gratification itself seems to imply that one has a need and then it is fufilled, that it is satisfied... If someone doesn't put any condition on their satisfaction, if they do not require reality to match up a certain way with their expectations, then they will not be motivated to act by a need to fufill an addiction in order to be satisfied.

If someone has found complete happiness and fufillment from within, in every moment, no matter what the external situation is, then wouldn't they be completely free to act however they choose to act? One does not have to seek any amount of fufillment from external actions and results in order to act.

I would think one can act completely because they prefer to act that way, without any amount of attachment on the results of their action or the fact that they acted. Action and movement can flow through us without any thought at all. :grin:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
jiggy
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #3151126 - 09/18/04 01:39 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

That was cool Fireworks!

So many variences huh? LOL For sure, living for the experience itself and not being attached to specified outcomes or results is a wonderful form of freedom.

Then I look at the flip side, of what happens when one is not goal oriented. Thats one of the things I am seeing that would cause creative stifle and stagnation.


To set out to create an experience, you sort of need inspiration, a goal or sense of direction. I question, what drives this? I question, what role the ego plays in this.

I don't want to beat this subject to a bloody pulp. these are just things I wonder about and was curious of how others see this.

Thanks for replying. It was cool you focussed on "The down side of the ego 101". You took the low road and I took the high road as the views are so different from each other. But together, they create a bigger picture.

Ego attachments can lead to great, mental and emotional suffering and sense of loss to be sure. Separation beleifs programmed in to the ego also cause suffering as does right and wrong duality programming. Once that reprogramming is done, the ego to me is a supportive tool for spirit to create in density and matter.


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #3153011 - 09/19/04 03:15 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

gettinjiggywithit said:
who said removed? tons of people here are out to become egoless. That would be the removal of it wouldn't it?





yeah I know.
it is a bit of an error.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #3153904 - 09/19/04 10:33 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Okay, so how do you explain that to someone? I think these beleifs may come from what ancid was writing about in the chakra tuned into post, about religions telling people to close down the first chakra to get rid of the ego.

Mind you, no one yet has been able to answer my question about any sort of action taken in this life, not being underlined by some form of gratification, be it in serving others or the self in higher pursuits.

If it is not the ego desiring this gratification, then what is?

I considered the soul and even spirit to be capable of desiring gratification which I equate with a sense of self fullfillment.

With all of that under consideration, why is it so bad for the ego to act in a self gratifying way through service to others and in self service of divine self realisation but not for the soul or spirit to? I mean, loving and appreciating others and yourself is gratifying. I truly think some people bought into some lofty ideas without thinking them through in all directions.

This is unless there beleif of becoming egoless coincides with giving up the physical body. Even then, soul memory is still active and maintains a collective personality all its own. Only the spirit level is without personality, but it still seeks self fullfillment through self realisation through us here in the physical because it feels gratifying to know the self.

Desiring giving up the body is not helping the cause, IMHO. rejecting the self is a discusting idea to me because where does one draw the line between the false ego self and the divine spirit self.
There is nothing cool about self rejection, especially rejecting the divine gift of life here. I also touched on that in the "What Chakra are you tuned into" post in my last reply there.

I respect other peoples beleifs on this. I just like posing more questions for others to consider.


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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InvisibleJellric
altered statesman

Registered: 11/08/98
Posts: 2,261
Loc: non-local
Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: Scarfmeister]
    #3153941 - 09/19/04 10:40 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Nothing is wrong with the ego.
The false ego is another story entirely.


--------------------
I AM what Willis was talkin' bout.


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Offlinedeff
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Re: Whats wrong with ego? [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #3153958 - 09/19/04 10:43 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

"Mind you, no one yet has been able to answer my question about any sort of action taken in this life, not being underlined by some form of gratification, be it in serving others or the self in higher pursuits."

To be. Let go and be. Submit in totality your experience to the all that is now. I guess this isn't an action though, so much as a lack of action :cool:

Your view of the ego is that of a Jungian nature, and yet the ego presented by those who wish to see behind it is a little less all encompassing. There is nothing wrong with the ego, any interpretation of ego. Just observe and do not judge and see the difference between your true self and the present, the difference, in my view, being the ego.


--------------------



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