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OfflineAbstractGray
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Psychedelics and selves
    #3125813 - 09/12/04 01:46 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Has anyone here, while on a psychedelic (my experience was with DXM specifically), experienced themselves as a 'we': conversing with, and alternating control with, other entities? If so, did it persist after the drug wore off?

I ask because this happened to me on my first DXM trip. A year and a half later, I can still feel her presence: thoughts, emotions, and movements that are not mine. It is like the 'silent voice' in one's head that one talks to oneself in (subvocalization), only it is not mine. I have found two anecdotes of this sort of thing happening, on Erowid and elsewhere, but in neither case did it persist past the end of the DXM trip (whereas I haven't used any drugs at all for the last five months).


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Anonymous

Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: AbstractGray]
    #3125964 - 09/12/04 02:55 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

I used to use DXM quite frequently, but I never came in contact with other entities. However, I did experience plural self-reference many times. 'We' would just pop into my head in place of 'I,' without me really thinking about it. This never persisted past the timeframe of the trip, though.

I believe the dissociation gives you a wider, detached perspective of self, allowing you be in contact with all your 'I's, in the Gurdjieffian sense. Theoretically, you may also be in contact with selves from other dimensions or other timelines. Selves in other dimensions could very well be of a different gender and personality, and even a different species.

Are you implying that it's persisted for you after the trip? If so it could be anything from schizophrenia to a type of possession.


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Offlinedeff
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Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: AbstractGray]
    #3125987 - 09/12/04 03:06 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Yup. Communication between these 'selves' can reveal much about your true self :smile:

On one trip in particular, I split into multiple selves for a while and then merged back into one - which was a bizarre experience :cool:


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OfflineAbstractGray
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Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: ]
    #3126031 - 09/12/04 03:23 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Yeah, it persisted after the trip. It's been about sixteen months (and, like I said earlier, five months since I've used any drug at all). I've heard of people having this experience while tripping, but not of it lasting past the end of the trip (much less more than a year afterward!). Another way my experience differs from what I've read about is that, when people have contacted an 'entity', *they* might have doubts that the entity is an extradimensional alien or something, but the *entity* never does... She doesn't know what she is any more than I do, and she's always wavering between being depressed about not having a solid connection to a body (a male one at that), and ecstatically embracing the freedom of self-definition this gives...


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Offlineexclusive58
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Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: AbstractGray]
    #3126038 - 09/12/04 03:28 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

does she have a name?


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: AbstractGray]
    #3126160 - 09/12/04 04:20 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

yes,
the self movie, one mask after another,
normally produces an illusion of ego.

under psychedellic, everything may trail or persist longer as it fades.

so too the frames of self (masks) persist, even after the new self has formed, and the slowly fading self can react - a discussion can form.

sometimes I have 3 or 4 in the room.
if I move, some are in recent positions I have shared.


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Invisibletruekimbo2
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Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: redgreenvines]
    #3126870 - 09/12/04 09:20 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

very wierd. i don't know what that voice could be, but i do know you can get rid of it if you really want to.


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You can check the last post in my journal for contact info.


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InvisibleHELLA_TIGHT
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Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: AbstractGray]
    #3126939 - 09/12/04 09:35 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Once on a dose of mushrooms in my dark room I thought I was in a jungle area with a man named larry.. I thought he was trying to stalk me


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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: HELLA_TIGHT]
    #3127307 - 09/12/04 11:14 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Mushrooms definetly act on me as if they were an alien entity, something outside of myself that is communicating with me. The things they tell me and the wisdom they teach definetly seems to be beyond my own understanding. When i do shrooms i pray to myself 'welcome respected teacher, welcome old friend' .

However, as my understanding increases ive started to realize that nothing is truly (in the ultimate sense) outside of my Self. This is a heavy concept, but i subscribe to the belief that we contain within ourselves all of eternity, that we are all parts of god within which is contained the whole.

The reason, then, that mushrooms and other psychadelics appear to be 'alien' and outside of ourselves, is that they break down the illusory Ego 'self' and let us access parts of our own conciousness that are so totally blocked in day to day existance that it literally appears to be 'something other' when in fact it is within us.

Ive noticed on shrooms that the drug takes things, bits of information, things ive read, seen or heard, conversations ive had, and digs them out of my subconcious, then forms them into a coherent whole ("see the connection? See? See?") and then presents them to me as a package. It takes all the bits of ideas and half formed revelations, sticks them in a ball and shoves them in my face.
the results are mindblowing, and life changing...


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Everything I post is fiction. This poster is no longer active.


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InvisibleDark_Star
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Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: deff]
    #3127459 - 09/12/04 11:56 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Yeah that almost always happens to me, especially on acid.


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Offlinedeff
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Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: Dark_Star]
    #3127473 - 09/13/04 12:01 AM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Yup this was on acid too. Although I find pot surprisingly can have strange self splitting effects on me, although of course not nearly as intense.


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InvisibleDark_Star
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Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: deff]
    #3127486 - 09/13/04 12:04 AM (12 years, 2 months ago)

I've always found pot to be psychedelic, and now that I think about it, i've had the multiple self thing on shrooms twice, and on shrooms and X once, but other than that only on acid, and on almost every acid trip i've had. I think it's one of the most interesting/freaky/cool aspects to tripping.


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Offlinecleaner
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Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: AbstractGray]
    #3128911 - 09/13/04 12:20 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Well, if this thing bothers you? If yes then you've got some issues with that person un accounted for.

It can be tricky to make it go away.

Solution? Total Spiritual Awakening.
Don't loose a minute, practise yoga 2 hours every day, 3 hours meditation, read 1 spiritual book every week. With a bit of luck and constant practise you should awaken Kundalini and clear all karmic residue in less than 25 years.

Good luck. Let us know how it works out! :smile:


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Offlinecleaner
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Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: AbstractGray]
    #3128920 - 09/13/04 12:24 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Honestly, you need to look into your self why you feel attached to that person.


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OfflineAbstractGray
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Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: AbstractGray]
    #3131167 - 09/13/04 09:13 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Well, I have to say that the responses were pretty much along the lines of what I expected - that the experience would be, if not common, at least not unheard of while under the influence of a psychedelic, but that it would be rare for it to persist for any significant length of time afterward.

To clear up a couple of remaining questions: yes, she has a name; she generally calls herself Sophie these days.  No, I'm not trying to get rid of her - as we have no evidence that she has any existence outside of this brain, there are ethical issues involved.  Besides, I enjoy the company. :wink:


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Offlinedeff
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Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: AbstractGray]
    #3131182 - 09/13/04 09:16 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

As long as she doesn't bother you, I don't see a problem :smile:


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OfflineTodcasil
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Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: AbstractGray]
    #3132381 - 09/14/04 12:56 AM (12 years, 2 months ago)

ive had contact with sprits, and also with other "entities" that may or may not be new buds on my ego.

however, they have always been peaceful experiences, and the duration was no longer than the "trip" itself, although occaionally ill have musings with these spirits in LD and OBEs. just fun figments.

peace


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Men look at themselves and they see flawed humans, we look at women and we see perfect
GODDESSES
Women look at themselves and they seem utterly human, when looking at men they see proud
GODS.


~Casil



:cactus:


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Offlineexclusive58
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Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: AbstractGray]
    #3138985 - 09/15/04 04:03 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

i don't know if this can help you AbstractGray, but i have heard of rituals that consist of contacting your subconscious. In this ritual, you're supposed to invoke your subconscious, which they call your Messenger, by calling its name.
The purpose of this ritual is to get some help when you encounter problems in your life.
Try to discuss with Sophie, and if you feel its not her real name, insist on knowing it before discussing with it.
The best way to know your messenger is to become friends with it. Listen to its advices, but don't ever let it dictate the rules. Know what you are searching for before invoking your messenger.
since the subconscious is part of you, you can give it the necessary orders that will aid you through your problems.

i know this sounds a bit occult, but you can always try it out.
peace


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OfflineMAGnum
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Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: deff]
    #3207849 - 10/02/04 09:29 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

deff said:
Yup. Communication between these 'selves' can reveal much about your true self :smile:

On one trip in particular, I split into multiple selves for a while and then merged back into one - which was a bizarre experience :cool:




Be careful because your own conscious substreams may be filled with crap that is normally shielded from yourself so you can maintain an organized mind and thus an organized, structured life.  You really aren't aware of most of the things your mind thinks anyways (thankfully).  Once you uncap certain aspects of the mind you can go nuts from fighting a war of inner dissodance, especially if the inner voices don't go away.

Basically, if you want to pick up a cup and drink it, you might think it first.  Under that thought stream are undercurrents (conscious substreams) that are usually filterred from normal conscious experiance such as:

Pick up the cup (surface thought),
don't pick up the cup (opposition thought),
the cup is on a table (obvious subthought that is normally filterred),
The cup is green (annother subthought, you usually don't even think  loudly about these ones)
You might grab the cup too softly/hard,(limmitting subthought)
pour the cup on suzie's head who's next to you (one of those crazy urges, they are usually louder and closer to the surface)

I think most of you will understand this.  I have had experiances where I have had direct contact with my conscious substreams and this is some of what they turned up.

If these voices become permanantly audible, they can distract you and make an obstical in your life if they are bad.  I know from experiance.  One such experiance was so horrible and lasted so long I made a suicide attempt because certain parts of my inner self were just discusting to the outer conscious stream (me, or the normally audable thought).

Once some things are uncapped, you'll have to clean the mess that you have made with acceptance.  One must be pretty clear of a guilty consciousness because guilt divides and torments the true self.
As you said Deff, hearing those inner voices reveals much about the true self. 

If you don't like what you see, you might be in for a bad experiance depending on immaginaion and guilt.  Hell, if you believe the voice is God, you hear god, if you believe it's an alien, it can become an alien, if you think it's a demon, you might scare yourself.

The thing is that your conscious mind turned in on itself experiances itself like an outer force.  Your sub-conscious mind will provide itself a voice and a shape, you give it that.  In fact, it can become animated and actually think.  One must learn to tell the differance between outer stimulation and created stimulation. 

BTW, If you ever hear thoughts of others, you can usually tell very keenly that it is not your own thought because it will confound your mind at first being alien and having no origin in your conscious or sub conscious streams.  Also, it IME, a thought which is heard originating from annother human usually sounds like it is comming from the person as if it is spoken.  It's as if the thought bumps into your mind.

I think that's all I have to say besides to please be careful when experimenting with your consciousness; especially on psychadelics.


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Agent 727
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OfflineMAGnum
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Re: Psychedelics and selves [Re: AbstractGray]
    #3207897 - 10/02/04 09:39 PM (12 years, 2 months ago)

I think you should try controlling her voice when she talks. If you can take control of what you are hearing, then it is you. You can ignore it into oblivion.

If the voice doesn't conform to your control and ESPECIALLY if it is audible like it's being spoken, it is really some sort of entity.


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Agent 727
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General Interest >> Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology

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